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StandardVC10 posted:Street fighting is a bad thing but it's hard to get too upset when Nazis are involved. Legalized pot is officially on the November ballot.
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Jun 29, 2016 02:55
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Why don't we ask ER doctors about tackle football? And bike riding? I'm pretty sure from an actuarial standpoint bike riding is substantially worse than beating up Nazis. People being nimby-pimby about violence is why punk sucks nowadays. It's cool if you are a wuss. I get not wanting to get beat too, ain't no shame. But why bitch about people wanting to be awesome and embrace violence? We already do it all the time and if that is your beef, you've got bigger fish to fry. Unless you are a wuss and just want to try and crush a vulnerable form of expression under the heel of your red laced boots. We're animals. Violence has a place in the human experience. As humans have become more civilized, we've developed increasingly ritualized forms of violence. In a capitalist society, that ritualization becomes more and more expensive. I understand and agree with the objections to non ritualized violence. Disproportionate violence that could reasonably hurt those not involved or the proverbial "knife to a skin fight"/"gun to a knife fight". But in a country where watching gladiators give each other traumatic brain injury is the leading religious denomination, I find the concern trolling hella weak.
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Jun 29, 2016 04:25
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Leperflesh posted:It's not even theorizing. You can see it right there in the media coverage. Nazis seeming sympathetic because people physically assaulted them, even though they fought back and inflicted more casualties. 
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Jun 29, 2016 04:27
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Shbobdb posted:It's cool if you are a wuss. Gtfo with that poo poo. You want to fight? Join a gym.
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Jun 29, 2016 04:29
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Shbobdb posted:knives Whatever other point youre trying to make, you should drop the one where being stabbed is no big deal. If you think of "all knives" as a swiss army knife, sure everyone will probably be fine. If someone gets stabbed by a big knife, its not a trivial "stop being a wuss" thing for them.
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Jun 29, 2016 04:31
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Shbobdb posted:Why don't we ask ER doctors about tackle football? Hey, like....you okay? Are you trying to be tough on the internet or something? Life is rough out there. I get it...but hey like... I just want to live in a world where we don't stab eachother. I'm serious about that, that's my super edgy political agenda or whatever.... Like dude if you wanna commit violence on yourself, ok, but I just don't wanna get violenced upon. I hope that is ok with you.
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Jun 29, 2016 04:33
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Jun 29, 2016 04:34
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Space-Bird posted:Hey, like....you okay? Are you trying to be tough on the internet or something? Life is rough out there. I get it...but hey like... I just want to live in a world where we don't stab eachother. I'm serious about that, that's my super edgy political agenda or whatever.... Like dude if you wanna commit violence on yourself, ok, but I just don't wanna get violenced upon. I hope that is ok with you. I'm sorry, I've just checked my calendar, and there are no days free for kicking somebody into a coma. So sad to disappoint!
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Jun 29, 2016 04:42
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Space-Bird posted:Hey, like....you okay? Are you trying to be tough on the internet or something? Life is rough out there. I get it...but hey like... I just want to live in a world where we don't stab eachother. I'm serious about that, that's my super edgy political agenda or whatever.... Like dude if you wanna commit violence on yourself, ok, but I just don't wanna get violenced upon. I hope that is ok with you. Plus there's other ways of being tough, like climbing a mountain, working construction or just anything that takes a lot of physical or mental labour. I'd rather be tough in ways that are constructive. Bring on the wussy world of peace where we don't commit violence on each other. I've noticed lately a lot of oldsters complaining that kids aren't allowed to fight anymore and that has made us weak. These are the same people who post on Facebook videos of teenage "thugs" fighting so they can complain about black people. gently caress violence. It sucks and there's no place for it in a better world.
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Jun 29, 2016 04:44
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Shut up shbobdb.
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Jun 29, 2016 04:47
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FRINGE posted:Whatever other point youre trying to make, you should drop the one where being stabbed is no big deal. If you think of "all knives" as a swiss army knife, sure everyone will probably be fine. If someone gets stabbed by a big knife, its not a trivial "stop being a wuss" thing for them. Yeah, you don't know what you are talking about, do you? I was involved in macho man antifa poo poo. Granted, in Germany, I've always been open to the idea that Americans are uniquely bad at this poo poo. As an American, that's not an idea I like entertaining. In my experience, knife wounds are mostly slashing and what stabs happen are shallow, small and generally not serious (obviously some serious poo poo happened, it's violence) likewise bludgeoning was more broken arms/legs/ribs not heads (obviously some serious poo poo happened, it's violence). Like I was on the wussier side of things, but I've had my ribs broken (not fun!) and have some scars from slashings along with a lot of bruises.. It was hard but it made me a better man and I'd recommend it to anyone. I grew out of it at 20. The oldest person I knew in the scene who wasn't obviously super damaged was 25. People keep treating antifa as a real political movement. It's not, so what? Let the kids have their fun as we had our fun.
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Jun 29, 2016 04:59
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Bumming Your Scene posted:I thought ignoring them was working well. You were wrong I guess. I suppose the efficacy of this sort of confrontation is a fine thing to argue about. If people want to engage in strictly peaceful protest I encourage them to organize a group of people to protest when the Nazis show up. There were lots of people who did that at this action. The left is infamous for spending a great deal of time criticizing itself over tactics and ideology. I'm not interested in doing that. I think the only problem with what the antifa did is that they weren't sufficiently organized in the moment to stay safe from Nazis who came armed with knives spoiling for a fight. And they hosed with a reporter early on. I recommend a perusal of the piece from the Iowa City Press-Citizen, Giving fascists a platform makes them stronger. I think it gives a fairly good run-down of the problems with the reporting on the event and the general liberal stance of accommodation for all peoples and shouldn't we just engage in discourse with these people? Or at least ignore them? Also, here is a drawing that one of the people at the event did of what the day was like. 
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Jun 29, 2016 05:35
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ComradeCosmobot posted:Legalized pot is officially on the November ballot. Hooray! I don't smoke, but hooray!
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Jun 29, 2016 05:54
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Shbobdb posted:Yeah, you don't know what you are talking about, do you?  Can you take your weird psychological issues to another thread?
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Jun 29, 2016 06:55
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"My violence is just violence." What happens if fascists go away? Does your need for dumb violence go away or do you pick another group to attack?
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Jun 29, 2016 07:01
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The Aardvark posted:"My violence is just violence." How loving dumb are you? Can you read?
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Jun 29, 2016 07:21
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Violence is bad, yet I feel nothing but joy when anti-nazi violence occurs.
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Jun 29, 2016 07:50
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Shbobdb sounds bitter and old.
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Jun 29, 2016 09:58
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Shbobdb posted:Let the kids have their fun as we had our fun.
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Jun 29, 2016 15:33
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Buckwheat Sings posted:Shbobdb sounds bitter and old. punk is like 40 years old now so this czechs out
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Jun 29, 2016 16:49
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Fascist rallies should be greeted like Westboro Baptist Church protests. Relentlessly mocked when not actively ignored angel-wings style. That's been very effective here in the South when the klan tries making public appearances. Compare this news coverage to the reports from Anaheim: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThGR-7DbLEg
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Jun 29, 2016 18:11
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Just FYI, the nazis are now emboldened by the violence and heading to Cleveland:quote:Members of a prominent white nationalist group have pledged to provide some unsolicited protection to supporters of Donald Trump at next month’s Republican National Convention in Cleveland, Ohio. http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/white-nationalists-cleveland-convention-defend-trump-supporters
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Jun 29, 2016 18:17
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Man, property tax sucks. poo poo has gone up 300 dollars a month in the past two years and that has beyond eclipsed any raise wages I have gotten. I'm not rich, I live an hour + drive from work because living near work is not an option with the cost of living. I got this house when I did have a ton of money, now not so much. I re financed in 2012 when I almost lost it with only 40k left to pay. I took an additional 40k out. So it came to 500 odd dollars a month for 15 years, escrow brought it to 700. Today I'm nearly paying 1000 a month, which isn't bad. So it's cheaper than an apartment for my family, but you can see how this can slowly gently caress someone over. My point of all this poo poo is, wouldn't it be better to properly tax based on income rather than property? I'm just kind of making GBS threads myself because my wife's business hasn't been doing well lately.
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Jun 29, 2016 21:32
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Have you seen my apex seals? I seem to have lost them.
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Aeka 2.0 posted:Man, property tax sucks. poo poo has gone up 300 dollars a month in the past two years and that has beyond eclipsed any raise wages I have gotten. I'm not rich, I live an hour + drive from work because living near work is not an option with the cost of living. I got this house when I did have a ton of money, now not so much. I re financed in 2012 when I almost lost it with only 40k left to pay. I took an additional 40k out. So it came to 500 odd dollars a month for 15 years, escrow brought it to 700. Today I'm nearly paying 1000 a month, which isn't bad. So it's cheaper than an apartment for my family, but you can see how this can slowly gently caress someone over. My point of all this poo poo is, wouldn't it be better to properly tax based on income rather than property? I'm just kind of making GBS threads myself because my wife's business hasn't been doing well lately. You're paying a thousand dollars a month in property taxes? Is your house worth 1.5 million dollars? Is this actually a joke about rents?
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Jun 29, 2016 21:59
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Yeah, I'm confused, it it 1000 a month in tax alone, or is this your mortgage as well? Are there no prop 13 protections, or is that limited to houses of a certain age?
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Jun 29, 2016 22:02
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Aeka 2.0 posted:Man, property tax sucks. poo poo has gone up 300 dollars a month in the past two years and that has beyond eclipsed any raise wages I have gotten. I'm not rich, I live an hour + drive from work because living near work is not an option with the cost of living. I got this house when I did have a ton of money, now not so much. I re financed in 2012 when I almost lost it with only 40k left to pay. I took an additional 40k out. So it came to 500 odd dollars a month for 15 years, escrow brought it to 700. Today I'm nearly paying 1000 a month, which isn't bad. So it's cheaper than an apartment for my family, but you can see how this can slowly gently caress someone over. My point of all this poo poo is, wouldn't it be better to properly tax based on income rather than property? I'm just kind of making GBS threads myself because my wife's business hasn't been doing well lately. With prop 13, this is the exact opposite of how property taxes work. You property taxes cannot increase YoY (which is when they're assessed, not monthly) unless the title changes ot some major permits are pulled. You need to find out what is causing your mortgage to increase because it's not the property tax that's doing it, I guarantee it.
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Jun 29, 2016 22:06
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Aeka 2.0 posted:Man, property tax sucks. poo poo has gone up 300 dollars a month in the past two years and that has beyond eclipsed any raise wages I have gotten. I'm not rich, I live an hour + drive from work because living near work is not an option with the cost of living. I got this house when I did have a ton of money, now not so much. I re financed in 2012 when I almost lost it with only 40k left to pay. I took an additional 40k out. So it came to 500 odd dollars a month for 15 years, escrow brought it to 700. Today I'm nearly paying 1000 a month, which isn't bad. So it's cheaper than an apartment for my family, but you can see how this can slowly gently caress someone over. My point of all this poo poo is, wouldn't it be better to properly tax based on income rather than property? I'm just kind of making GBS threads myself because my wife's business hasn't been doing well lately. tl;dr people with 800k dollar bay area houses are paying property taxes on it like its worth a fraction of that. I don't think that is what is screwing you.
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Jun 29, 2016 23:53
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cheese posted:The reason Prop 13 is so toxic is that older homes are locked into their 1975 value and that assessed value cannot increase by more than 2% a year. This is a problem because housing has increased by a poo poo load more than that. There are also ways to get around the requirement that the value be reassessed when a property is sold, such as placing the property title in its own bullshit shell corporation and then selling the corporation. What did any of that have to do with his situation?
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Jun 30, 2016 00:43
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cheese posted:The reason Prop 13 is so toxic is that older homes are locked into their 1975 value and that assessed value cannot increase by more than 2% a year. This is a problem because housing has increased by a poo poo load more than that. There are also ways to get around the requirement that the value be reassessed when a property is sold, such as placing the property title in its own bullshit shell corporation and then selling the corporation. And it should be kept in mind that the commercial real estate side of things is even more exploitive then residential, commercial tends to be priced higher and it's much more likely to involve corporate shell game fuckery to evade millions of dollars in taxes a year. Multinational corporations with skyscraper headquarters are getting much more advantage out of prop 13 than any middle class home owner ever could.
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Jun 30, 2016 00:49
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FCKGW posted:With prop 13, this is the exact opposite of how property taxes work. You property taxes cannot increase YoY (which is when they're assessed, not monthly) unless the title changes ot some major permits are pulled. Proposition 13 sets a basis for the ad valorum tax rate assessed on private and commercial property in California. The basis is set at the original sale price, and every year the basis can be increased by up to 2%. However, most property in California is also subject to non-ad-valorum taxes. Special assessments such as sewer districts, for example, and then also usually a pile of bond measures by cities, counties, school districts, etc. can all add taxes which are not based on the property's value. My own property tax is almost half non-ad-valorum taxes. It's entirely possible that Aeka saw a special assessment or bond measure or something that added to the effective tax rate. Another thing that happened is the 2008 crisis and subsequent drop in property values. Many people saw their properties assessed at values below what they paid, and saw their property taxes fall. In my case, I bought my house in december 2009, and my property was then assessed a year later by the county - in January, at the absolute bottom of the market, and the county used comps based on mostly apartment sales nearby, further lowering their basis. The result was that my property taxes actually fell by a lot for 2011 and only went up modestly in 2012. But by 2013, my property had fully recovered its value and then some, and the county raised the value right back to its basis plus 2% in one year. So in 2013 my tax bill went up by a bunch. Anyway Aeka seems to be saying that their mortgage payment plus property taxes is up to a total of $1k a month, which includes $500 a month on the remainder of the 15 year mortgage (principle + interest) and another $500 a month into an escrow account (presumably for property tax but possibly also including homeowners insurance). That's a high tax bill, but we have no idea what the basis of the property actually is, because Aeka didn't say: only that the outstanding balance on the refinanced mortgage is around $80k. Given that this is California, it could easily be payments on $80k mortgage for a house valued at $400k, with escrow at $100 a month for insurance and another $400 a month in taxes. $400x12=$4800 a year, a totally reasonable tax bill for a California home, probably between 1.5 and 2% per year, which includes non-ad-valorum tax assessments. e. And I don't have a ton of sympathy, either. As a homeowner. If Aeka can't manage payments, selling is a lucrative option that, given what was already said, probably extracts at least a couple hundred thousand dollars in equity from the home. Aeka 2.0, if you can't make your $1k a month payments, you are probably not earning enough to own a home in California. That's renting-a-room level of income. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Jun 30, 2016 |
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Jun 30, 2016 00:51
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Leperflesh pretty much nailed all the numbers almost exactly, tax, escrow, insurance. The house was 400k when bought in 2004, it dropped to around 250k, was under water, still under water, its worth 380k now. We were cranking out a 4k+ payment a month and adding money on top of it when we could. The plan was to be done by 2015 or so. Hah. Lost my job and the wife had to carry the burden, then she got pregnant, with twins, on the pill mind you. Re finance happened in 2012. So I found out what the deal was with prop 13. Prop 13 means nothing since Prop 8 stepped in on lowering the tax assessment during the market crash, which means it can go up at any percentage under prop 8. Awesome. Me bitching about the tax is just one of many things that have been piling up. Its affordable, for now. Any dream of moving closer to work gets shattered as the rich guys out bid each other on 1200 square foot poo poo boxes. The steering wheel punching drive, the 1000 dollars a month for family insurance because nobody here wants UHC, paying for the kids school because schools are funded by property tax instead of equal distribution and our district is a poo poo hole. Raising a family is loving insane, so I think the extra 100 a month just had me go loving nuts, I guess it is no different than when the land lord decides to raise rent as I see friend's losing their poo poo over increasing rent. A poo poo apartment goes for 1500 dollars a month. This is the Inland Empire mind you. It was cheap, not so much any more. edit: Found this: https://parcelquest.wordpress.com/2013/03/15/why-did-my-property-tax-bill-increase-so-dramatically/ 
Aeka 2.0 fucked around with this message at 02:01 on Jun 30, 2016 |
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Jun 30, 2016 01:56
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Yeah pretty much your poo poo luck wasn't the taxes going up (and prop 8 isn't going to overrule prop 13, so once the taxes assessment gets back to being above your house's last sale, it should go back to no more than 2% increase per year). It was losing your job, having to pay out of pocket for health insurance premiums, paying for private school, and having twins. Inland empire (and all of southern california, really) sucks. You and your family should maybe seriously consider moving somewhere with a lower cost of living. Don't get hung up on getting back out of your house what you've paid - it sounds to me like you can walk away with at least a couple hundred thousand in cash, which can buy a house outright in some of the lower cost of living parts of the country. Imagine having no house payment, just insurance and taxes? That'd be dependent on your ability to move, of course, which has to do with jobs, extended family, support networks, etc. etc. And moving is always hard on kids, too, once they're school age. But you can't look at your house as being an $80k house just because that's the size of your mortgage. You've seen huge increases in your family costs, a big decline in your income, and you're living in a $400k house, which means taxes on a $400k property, and maintenance & insurance in a high cost of living area on an expensive property. You gotta take that into account. A big change might be in order.
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Jun 30, 2016 02:04
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My job is ridiculously specialized and I'm lucky to be paid what I'm being paid, I'm working on expanding my skill set so I can get paid more and be able to move more freely, but once I get paid more there really is no reason to move to a cheaper area. The wife's job is dependent on people able to pay a luxury (music lessons), we're actually trying to work into richer areas with the business, and if successful, will allow us to move to a better area. Given our situation, moving to a cheaper area would be counterproductive and would, to me, cause a downward spiral. So yes, I guess the tax isn't the problem, just that last little thing.
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Jun 30, 2016 02:12
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The good news is you can find homes in the 400k range in Compton now! And pretty much anywhere 30 minutes of Los Angeles unless you want to live in a 800sq/ft shack! 
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Jun 30, 2016 02:15
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Aeka 2.0 posted:My point of all this poo poo is, wouldn't it be better to properly tax based on income rather than property?
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Jun 30, 2016 20:32
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Thanks for the info, I had no idea about prop 8. We also live in the Inland Empire and it's still one of the fastest growing regions in the country due to people being priced out of LA and Orange county and moving inland. That means tons of new housing projects going on (the Ontario Ranch project by my house is adding 42,000 homes in the next 15 years.) but also rising housing costs if you're near the LA and OC county lines. Home prices are still rising and affordable housing is moving further inland to Hemet, Mennifee and Victorville.
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Jun 30, 2016 20:54
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Cicero posted:The problem with taxing income is that it's extremely swingy. Tons of revenue during boom times, little revenue during busts. Maybe that wouldn't be so bad if the state saved more money during boom times, but lol if you think that's gonna happen. The other side of this coin is that during those bust cycles you're pushing that down to the taxpayer, costing them disproportionately more in lean years.
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Jun 30, 2016 20:55
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You tax property to avoid building up a landed gentry. Prop 13 runs directly counter to that goal, encouraging families to maintain generational estates taxed at increasingly below-market assessments. It also encourages businesses to maintain a continuous ownership of commercial property which is just leased out to other businesses, even for 99-year leases etc, without ever being actually sold. You tax incomes and you tax property, and you try to do it in a progressive way, but instead what we've got right now is pretty hosed up.
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Jun 30, 2016 22:10
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FCKGW posted:prop 8 How did banning gay marriage affect real estate prices?  VVV EDIT: Ah, okay. A little confusing, especially when both are so well-known. VVV GenderSelectScreen fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jun 30, 2016 22:25
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Different Prop 8. The Prop 8 they're talking about was passed in 1978 at the same time as Prop 13 and meant that if a house lost a bunch of value in a market crash, the property tax value would drop with it until it's assessed value rose to match where it's Prop 13 value would have been when had the market not cratered. Regarding the ballot numberings: It used to be that the ballot numberings would start over from 1 every year. This got really confusing when certain initiatives like Prop 13 became really well known for various reasons. So in 1982 it was changed so that the numbers wouldn't repeat until it had been 10 years since a particular one had appeared on the ballot. in practice this meant that the numbering for ballot measures basically never repeated, to the point where by 1996 we were voting on ballot initiative that were number in the 200s. So starting in 1998 they changed it again to reset every 10 years. Instant Sunrise fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Aug 17, 2016 |
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Jun 30, 2016 22:52
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