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Sagebrush posted:What happens if a plane is coming in NORDO with a virtual control tower? It most likely wont get prior clearance.
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Oct 27, 2020 16:56
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| # ? Jun 8, 2024 06:24 |
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Sagebrush posted:What happens if a plane is coming in NORDO with a virtual control tower? Excellent question. A remote controlled light-post?
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Oct 27, 2020 18:31
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fknlo posted:They don’t shut down the airport, just the tower. The airport can still run without it. Sure but my point was that support for small airports in the US is very low.
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Oct 27, 2020 18:37
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Zero One posted:Sure but my point was that support for small airports in the US is very low. The FAA pays anyone who has an airport open to the public based on total traffic. On top of that, if you accept a FAA grant for runway maintenance or expansion, it comes tied to a 20-30 year commitment for the airport to remain public. If the owner or operator of an airport changes their mind and closes the airport, they have to repay the FAA for past grants. The combination of the two things makes it very hard for a town to close an airport unless public opinion is very strongly against it.
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Oct 27, 2020 18:43
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wzm posted:The FAA pays anyone who has an airport open to the public based on total traffic. On top of that, if you accept a FAA grant for runway maintenance or expansion, it comes tied to a 20-30 year commitment for the airport to remain public. If the owner or operator of an airport changes their mind and closes the airport, they have to repay the FAA for past grants. The combination of the two things makes it very hard for a town to close an airport unless public opinion is very strongly against it. ...Unless you drive a couple bulldozers through the runway in the middle of the night.
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Oct 27, 2020 19:08
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ImplicitAssembler posted:It most likely wont get prior clearance. okay but in an emergency. drop into the pattern and hope for the best? PT6A posted:Excellent question. A remote controlled light-post? come to think of it, maybe they could use something like the DC SFRA laser system, which I understand is fully automated https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wAhreg9qpo&t=67s MrYenko posted:...Unless you drive a couple bulldozers through the runway in the middle of the night. meigs field is back in FS2020  https://www.nexusmods.com/microsoftflightsimulator/mods/192 Sagebrush fucked around with this message at 19:28 on Oct 27, 2020 |
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Oct 27, 2020 19:23
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Can someone explain or point me to the direction of a primer on what this virtual tower stuff is?
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Oct 27, 2020 19:28
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Sagebrush posted:okay but in an emergency. drop into the pattern and hope for the best? In an emergency, the aircraft having an emergency is always the priority, and everyone else can make way. If you were above class D airspace with no radio, had an emergency, and came hauling down from above without calling anything out, the tower would be mad, but they don't have their necks on the line. I'd expect them to demand to talk to you afterwards, but emergencies take precedence over pretty much all other traffic. If you were near a bigger field (B or C airspace) and had an emergency when they didn't know you were there, the tower would have bigger questions about what you were doing in their airspace without a radio or a phone call ahead of time. slidebite posted:Can someone explain or point me to the direction of a primer on what this virtual tower stuff is? In the US, they put cameras on a tower and have the controllers sit in a trailer. Radio calls route through the tower, and the hope is to centralize all the tower operators in one or two locations down the road. The hope is that this will reduce operating costs. The ones I've heard about in the US have mostly been at airports that are on the verge of becoming class D airspace, and they've initially made the towers be opt-in, rather then a standard towered field. If the airspace ends up not seeing the traffic to justify becoming a towered field, it's easy to pack all the equipment up, and if it does, they will have already gotten everyone used to the remote tower, so no major construction needs to take place. I don't know how other countries are handling it, and all I know about the remote towers I picked up from a presentation a couple years ago at a local EAA chapter.
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Oct 27, 2020 19:51
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wzm posted:In an emergency, the aircraft having an emergency is always the priority, and everyone else can make way. If you were above class D airspace with no radio, had an emergency, and came hauling down from above without calling anything out, the tower would be mad, but they don't have their necks on the line. I'd expect them to demand to talk to you afterwards, but emergencies take precedence over pretty much all other traffic. If you were near a bigger field (B or C airspace) and had an emergency when they didn't know you were there, the tower would have bigger questions about what you were doing in their airspace without a radio or a phone call ahead of time. I've always been told that if your radio breaks in mid-air while you're IFR, you fly your clearance.
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Oct 27, 2020 19:58
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Safety Dance posted:I've always been told that if your radio breaks in mid-air while you're IFR, you fly your clearance. there’s a whole reg for this- 91.185. Also refer to AIM 6-4-1.
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Oct 27, 2020 20:07
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Safety Dance posted:I've always been told that if your radio breaks in mid-air while you're IFR, you fly your clearance. I think we're discussing different things. I assumed that by no radio we were talking about J3 Cubs and stuff like that. If you are sufficiently above a Class D in a J3, you are entitled to be there, and entitled to use the field for an emergency landing. If it isn't a real emergency, you can eat the punishment afterwards. If you are in a B or C without a radio, you really need to have arranged entrance ahead of time, and if you have an emergency while skulking about, you will still get in trouble for being where you don't belong after the fact. B and C airspace goes up higher then D, so it's less likely that you would be clear of the airspace but above the field.
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Oct 27, 2020 20:35
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Obviously if you're coming in with your engine on fire or a passenger having a heart attack you do whatever you need to get the plane on the ground and save lives, and sort out the regulations later. I was thinking more what happens if you're flying to your destination of a busy class D with a remote tower, and you discover 10 miles out that your radio has poo poo itself. There aren't any other less-controlled airports that you could get to without cutting significantly into your reserve, so diverting would be more dangerous than operating with a failed radio, even though entering the airspace NORDO is against the regulations. The safest decision is for you to land at your destination, but the tower has four planes in the pattern and regular GA arrivals and departures. Normally this is an obvious light gun scenario. Does this qualify as an emergency? What is the remote tower's plan to handle you? Sagebrush fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Oct 27, 2020 |
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Oct 27, 2020 20:53
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Sagebrush posted:Obviously if you're coming in with your engine on fire or a passenger having a heart attack you do whatever you need to get the plane on the ground and save lives, and sort out the regulations later. Joke answer: Call TRACON on your cell phone?
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Oct 27, 2020 21:06
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Isn’t there a transponder code for no radio?
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Oct 27, 2020 21:11
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`Nemesis posted:Isn’t there a transponder code for no radio? 7600. Not to be fatfingered with 7500. (hijack code)
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Oct 27, 2020 21:16
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beep-beep car is go posted:Joke answer: Call TRACON on your cell phone? Totally reasonable, but let's assume there is no way you can get voice communications with the tower. `Nemesis posted:Isn’t there a transponder code for no radio? So you've set 7600 and the tower knows you have no radio, but what do they do next? Hold everyone they can on the ground, extend everyone else into long downwinds or holding patterns, hope you have your eyes open, and wait for you to see the opening and land?
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Oct 27, 2020 21:24
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I went and pulled up the slides from the presentation I saw, they say the remote tower has a light signal mounted on it.
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Oct 27, 2020 21:26
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Oct 27, 2020 21:27
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beep-beep car is go posted:Joke answer: Call TRACON on your cell phone? Serious response: I've called tower multiple times to obtain a landing clearance yelling into my cellphone under one ear cup. (This was pre-Bose w/Bluetooth) Used to teach in a fleet of no-electrical-system planes with normal panel mount radios powered by a rechargeable brick battery, and backed up by a handheld. Sometimes both would fail. It was routine, they knew us.
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Oct 27, 2020 23:03
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beep-beep car is go posted:Joke answer: Call TRACON on your cell phone? I called PNE (Philadelphia's Northeast Airport, class D,E) to get clearance for a drone mission under their airspace when they didn't come up on AIRMAP. They were actually amused. I may have been their first drone pilot.
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Oct 28, 2020 00:10
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I've called ATC on my cell phone from the flight deck while holding short of a runway, to pick up a clearance when we couldn't get in touch with ATC or Flight Service via any of the frequencies we could find. Yay for Bluetooth headset connections!
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Oct 28, 2020 03:21
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azflyboy posted:I've called ATC on my cell phone from the flight deck while holding short of a runway, to pick up a clearance when we couldn't get in touch with ATC or Flight Service via any of the frequencies we could find. Yay for Bluetooth headset connections! The FBO at Saratoga, WY had the direct number to our low sector at some point. That got killed pretty quick. Every now and then we'll still get a call but it's rare enough that it doesn't matter.
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Oct 28, 2020 04:04
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fknlo posted:The FBO at Saratoga, WY had the direct number to our low sector at some point. That got killed pretty quick. Every now and then we'll still get a call but it's rare enough that it doesn't matter. I actually took a call for a clearance today for the first time in awhile. Someone posted our area number in every FBO briefing room all over the southern half of the state at one point. We were getting like two or three calls a day at one point. The guy today was a student IFR pilot, and I was CIC with my thumb firmly in by butt from boredom, so I took pity on him and just issued the clearance, but told him to call Flight Data in the future.
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Oct 28, 2020 04:24
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Not exactly the same thing, but we used to do HF phone patches to call fighter squadrons if we were out of UHF range/LOS.
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Oct 28, 2020 04:36
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azflyboy posted:I've called ATC on my cell phone from the flight deck while holding short of a runway, to pick up a clearance when we couldn't get in touch with ATC or Flight Service via any of the frequencies we could find. Yay for Bluetooth headset connections! I've also done this many times, specifically when at one of the half dozen airports under the Phoenix class B airspace when the towers were closed because gently caress blasting off into that Swiss cheese mess VFR at 2am. For some reason none of them had a GCO and flight service couldn't give out IFR clearances? Whatever Edit: anyone ever fly to an airport with an approach controller in a non radar environment? I used to go to Helena Montana a lot in the mid oughts and they always had you talk to an approach controller even though they didn't have a scope. Curious how common that was Arson Daily fucked around with this message at 06:49 on Oct 28, 2020 |
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Oct 28, 2020 06:41
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https://v.redd.it/nb34dux2pqv51/DASH_240.mp4
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Oct 28, 2020 12:48
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My heart is bursting
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Oct 28, 2020 15:00
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Welp. Not the year for 747s.
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Oct 28, 2020 15:02
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CHAPPPPYYYY!
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Oct 28, 2020 15:06
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MrYenko posted:Welp. On one hand,  at the fact that a super-rare SP model is probably irreparably damaged.On the other, gently caress Sheldon Adelson and everything that has his name on it.
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Oct 28, 2020 16:11
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fknlo posted:We had a person that didn't feel good before work yesterday go get tested. It was a quick test and came back positive. He notified work immediately. The clinic he got tested at closed after they told him he was positive and he couldn't get paperwork from them. The powers that be decided this meant he wasn't necessarily being truthful so they didn't do the deep cleaning that they're required to do. He was finally able to get the paperwork around 10 last night. Since no deep cleaning has been done they've shut down my area and sterilized our airspace for the day. They do contact trace people at work that were within 6 feet of this person for more than 15 or 30 minutes, but with how this poo poo spreads and with our work conditions that's not going to be enough. I don't usually work with this person but I'm 99% sure they weren't a fan of masks and only wear one when they have to. So they were absolutely all around our work area and the building without a mask on at some point over the past few days.
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Oct 28, 2020 16:17
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There is a low only area under most of that and they’ll be able to deal with a decent amount of the normal DEN departures and arrivals through the affected gates but it’s not going to be pretty. They aren’t set up for overflights and don’t work many and it’s always a complete poo poo show on days where bad rides push overflights down into them.
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Oct 28, 2020 16:33
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Oct 28, 2020 19:42
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"Meanwhile, at Edwards, 62 test pilots died during one nine-month stretch in 1952." oh no, how could that ha- 
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Oct 28, 2020 19:43
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Please tell me that's from a movie and it's not real.
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Oct 28, 2020 20:01
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atriptothebeach posted:"Meanwhile, at Edwards, 62 test pilots died during one nine-month stretch in 1952." Good God! A gasser airplane. I love it! I'm always surprised by the attrition in the weather service after WW2. Few planes, but they were B29s or B-50s with a dozen or more crew in each one.
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Oct 28, 2020 20:18
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atriptothebeach posted:"Meanwhile, at Edwards, 62 test pilots died during one nine-month stretch in 1952." That photo is of a Revell "Flap Jack" goof model kit
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Oct 28, 2020 20:22
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PainterofCrap posted:That photo is of a Revell "Flap Jack" goof model kit oh, ty I'm glad its not real
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Oct 28, 2020 20:31
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quote:The B1-RD in flight over Armitage Field, circa 1962. Photo from Rick Saiger... The B1-RD (aka Ens. eliminator) was NOTS first "smart" weapon replacing the BAT glide bomb. The weapon was designed to be delivered by the A-4 Skyhawk and was guided by flight school washouts who were unable to master the landing protocol.
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Oct 28, 2020 20:36
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otoh this XF-85 is real and actually flew  
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Oct 28, 2020 20:41
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