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Dibujante posted:What is that weird-rear end tumor growing out of <lovely german minor>? Pretty sure that's the mod logo, and the mod is technically called "Poland-Lithuania Ball". It's a terrible joke that makes me feel uncomfortable just looking at it.
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Oct 24, 2015 00:08
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Woo, Qing. I have 452 land units in service.
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Oct 24, 2015 00:15
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Its kind of cool the balls facial expressions change depending on your relationship. I just realized today that the personify of a ruler (aggressive, diplomatic, administrator, explorer) affect their willingness to form alliances. Militaristic rulers desire your provinces and will not ally you but diplomatic people are more willing to be your friend, wow, cool.
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Oct 24, 2015 00:19
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VerdantSquire posted:Oh my god, that stupid Polandball mod just took a loving terrifying turn. b-b-but I paid $50 for unit sprites!
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Oct 24, 2015 00:32
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Is there any way to get a colonial nation to change religions? I got to 5 provinces in Canada before converting to Protestantism and now the Canadians make sure to convert any new provinces to Catholic as soon as possible.
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Oct 24, 2015 00:38
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Until my units start saying Zug Zug and Eetog, EU4 still has a ways to go.
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Oct 24, 2015 01:00
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420 Gank Mid posted:Even with some really bad luck I had secured everything except the Papal State, Milan, and Savoy at their starting date borders by 1550. It's totally doable but I had an early crisis where I was attacked by an ascendant Mamluks and a still dangerous Ottomans at the same time and France, Austria, and Poland all declined call to arms (by some miracle all 3 were bogged down in wars and left with <5% manpower and 1k+ ducat debt) Good thing dip tech doesn't matter at all! @Interest/loans people: You take .1 inflation every time you take or extend a loan and inflation is bullshit so you should never ever take a loan Pellisworth posted:I guess my issue there is those are not "smallish" countries, Milan Florence Genoa and Savoy will all field 15-20 stacks and northern Italy is a mess of alliances. You also run into AE problems quickly expanding into all that rich same-culture and religion territory. The AE is based on the culture of the stuff you take compared to the culture of the country receiving the AE, so the other Italians get really mad and will coalition you, but the southern Germans only get a little upset. Fortunately you will be fighting all of the Italians all the time so they won't have time to form a coalition. Unfortunately Austria is right there and likes to rival you so I find it ideal to take a vassal Styria out of them before getting really involved in Italy.
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Oct 24, 2015 01:06
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Loans can win you games yo.
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Oct 24, 2015 01:46
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Yashichi posted:The AE is based on the culture of the stuff you take compared to the culture of the country receiving the AE, so the other Italians get really mad and will coalition you, but the southern Germans only get a little upset. Fortunately you will be fighting all of the Italians all the time so they won't have time to form a coalition. Unfortunately Austria is right there and likes to rival you so I find it ideal to take a vassal Styria out of them before getting really involved in Italy. I'm certainly willing to concede I could've done a lot better job conquering Italy early on, I've done two starts as Venice -> Byz and both times went after the Mamluks to get Red Sea access and colonize. The takeaway is you probably need to choose between going Influence and expanding hard into Europe (Italy, Hungary, etc) vs. Exploration and attacking Mamluks. I've done the latter twice on Ironman past 1600, and was aggressive, constantly taking loans and relying on mercs as I was most always below 10k manpower. No way in hell I could have handled colonizing, conquering Egypt and Ottomans while also having enough cash and manpower to dominate Italy. Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 02:14 on Oct 24, 2015 |
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Oct 24, 2015 01:48
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It's been a long time since I've played so whats a good strategy for starting as Muscovy? Also is taking humanism still worth it or should I take something else?
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Oct 24, 2015 02:56
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mornhaven posted:It's been a long time since I've played so whats a good strategy for starting as Muscovy? Also is taking humanism still worth it or should I take something else? Nah, take Religious as your first idea for Muscovy. Enjoy your free CB on basically everybody and your cheap 35% reduction in stability costs, along with lots of stability events.
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Oct 24, 2015 02:59
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Humanist > Religious Don't be swayed by promises of good random events and free CBs, stay true to humanism and enjoy your peaceful society and low revolt risk.
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Oct 24, 2015 03:06
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Shayu posted:Humanist > Religious Unless you are Orthodox. Edit: but most of the time Administrative is better than Humanist or Religious.
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Oct 24, 2015 03:21
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Shayu posted:Humanist > Religious Religious is just too strong to ignore as an Orthodox country. All of them start bordering Sunnis and all of them except Byzantium are in a pretty good position to beat up on the muslims for easy land. Once you convert something to Orthodox, between keeping high patriarch authority and the + tolerance of the true faith modifiers you can get culture is irrelevant and nothing will ever revolt. The bonuses from having 100% patriarch authority even make up the manpower penalty for non-accepted cultures at the cost of some ducats. Muscovy especially has dozens of provinces they can swipe from Hordes that are only competitive for 20-50 years (At least the AI hordes are) before being totally eclipsed by even the humblest of Muscovys. Also since most AI orthodox countries end up off the map or vassal to Muslims within a few decades of the start you will have a CB against literally every single one of your neighbors whenever and it also happens to be one of the best CB in the game for taking land (75% Warscore Cost, 125% Prestige gained, 100% dip point cost)
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Oct 24, 2015 03:24
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What's the pro-strat for Poland these days? I should probably play a poland game while they still have easy Westernization.
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Oct 24, 2015 03:50
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LLSix posted:What's the pro-strat for Poland these days? I should probably play a poland game while they still have easy Westernization. Press the "Form Union with Lithuania" button. e: Also, I think something really needs to be done about the "Form X Nation Diplomatically" because it does something that makes the game outrageously easy: Gives you free cores. Poland is in the best position to do this out of the countries that can. It's not rocket science to get access to Muscovy/Novgorod in the first 10 years to fabricate claims, and by the time you're Admin tech 10 and can press the button to automatically devour Lithuania you can have the entire Russian region, a blob of horde territory, and a nice big bite out of Scandinavia or the Balkans without ever having to personally core a province. I recently failed to do a Poland WC run, and feeding the poo poo out of Lithuania was an insane advantage. My only mistake was pressing the Commonwealth button before I'd fed them twice as much as I already had. Lori fucked around with this message at 04:05 on Oct 24, 2015 |
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Oct 24, 2015 03:51
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Shayu posted:Humanist > Religious Have you played a Muscovy game? Muscovy and Religious is a match made in... well, you know.
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Oct 24, 2015 04:03
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Yashichi posted:@Interest/loans people: You take .1 inflation every time you take or extend a loan and inflation is bullshit so you should never ever take a loan This is the worst advice ever.
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Oct 24, 2015 04:18
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Node posted:Have you played a Muscovy game? Muscovy and Religious is a match made in... well, you know. You already get 3+ conversion speed from full patriarchy and you're just bordering a bunch of crappy horde provinces, you don't need the extra conversion. Humanist is just better because religious doesn't add as much you don't already have. Besides, later in the game you get conversion speed for free anyways, but Humanist is good forever, especially if you're going to blob. Religious is just redundant and not as useful as really anything else, it's not terrible, but it doesn't give you much you don't already have.
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Oct 24, 2015 04:25
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It's possible to get close to 0 interest on loans if you have the right idea sets. So if you haven't invested into it, then stay away I guess, but people like The Netherlands and England have ridiculously powerful loan-related events that let them have access to huge cash reserves at little downside. I used to use them with old buildings to upgrade all 20 of my Dutch provinces with new buildings as soon as I unlocked them.
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Oct 24, 2015 04:27
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I've had a bunch of failed-but-increasingly-close runs at Venice to Byzantium (I have yet to get Austria to successfully come to my aid at either an offensive or defensive war against the Ottomans) and just had my closest attempt yet--won two wars against the Ottomans, even grabbed all of the Greek land and Constantinople (which I could've sniped off the Byzantines earlier but the power of +6 basetax before Common Sense still has me hypnotized). Then I forgot that converting to Orthodox breaks all of my alliances 
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Oct 24, 2015 05:33
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Shayu posted:You already get 3+ conversion speed from full patriarchy and you're just bordering a bunch of crappy horde provinces, you don't need the extra conversion. Humanist is just better because religious doesn't add as much you don't already have. Besides, later in the game you get conversion speed for free anyways, but Humanist is good forever, especially if you're going to blob. Religious is just redundant and not as useful as really anything else, it's not terrible, but it doesn't give you much you don't already have. I really think this is bad advice 1) Patriarch Authority takes a good century or more to max out assuming you always choose to increase it when given the option. 2) When maxed, Patriarch Authority gives missionary strength bonuses in addition to completely negating off-culture manpower and RR penalties in exchange for tax income. Tax income is poo poo. It's not really an issue of being able to convert provinces or not, you're absolutely right you are able to convert pretty much every province in the game without touching Religious ideas. The important thing is how fast you can convert. Patriarch Authority takes many decades to build to full, and the various missionary strength decisions also take 100-150 years to grab all of them. Even then you're operating with 1-2 missionaries (if you are DotF). Religious is good as Orthodox because you get huge bonuses toward having all your provinces Orthodox, moreso than any other religion. Orthodox nations also start neighboring Sunni and other different religions, which makes the CB very valuable. Take Religious, convert provinces as fast as you can core them, don't give a gently caress. For most of the big Orthodox nations, conversion speed will be a major limiting factor on your expansion and you want to convert everything anyway.
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Oct 24, 2015 05:34
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Also pretty wrongheaded to say that the religious CB isn't adding much that you don't already have What, like a free CB against any non-orthodox neighbor (basically all of them) that you unlock really early on? Also, the one extra missionary from religious is way more useful than the conversion strength (given you only start with one, two as dotf), at least until you start grabbing holy sites. Twice as many conversions is the big deal compared to somewhat faster conversions, especially since like that guy pointed out you get more missionary strength later on anyway. And it's the second idea in the group!
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Oct 24, 2015 06:06
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gently caress the Pol-Lit commonwealth. I'm at 1720 now in what looks like a failed Brandenburg->Prussia->Germany run, my first time playing as the God Soldiers everyone goes on about. Everything was going well early on: I rivalled the TO, Pomerania and Hansa and beat up on them in succession with Poland as an ally, and formed Prussia around 1550. Win the league war, become emperor of Protestant HRE, hell yeah... Then it all starts going wrong. gently caress the commonwealth. gently caress the commonwealth because without my noticing, they've PUd Tuscany, which now owns all of northern Italy, and allied to Austria and France. They then wardec me. An alliance with Scandinavia and russia holds them off enough for me to wear down their manpower and peace out without being annihilated, but they still nab everything east of Neumark. It looks like there is a chance to hurt them in 1600 so I jump them with Scandinavia and Russia again, 3 on 1. No dice. They have 150k soldiers against my 50k, stackwipe Russia and Scandinavia separately and proceed to annihilate me. My attempt to defeat them in detail (by this point l have 115% discipline, 6+ morale and equal tech) collapses when I see they have apparently been training an army of witchers: 6+ morale and 112.5% discipline. And a lot more arty than me. I peace out giving them Neumark which promptly gets a shiny new polish name. By 1659 they have swallowed the Balkans and the Ottomans. By 1720 they're back in a stable alliance with France and Spain. Austria has the last 3 provinces I need to form Germany. It's allied with GB, Scandi and Russia eg all of my allies. Time for a restart. Any suggestions on getting the Fredrick II pain train right after the initial eat Pom/Mec/TO stage? What should you be doing after the League War? Incidentally my ideas were Diplomatic-Admnistrative-Offensive. And in conclusion, I say: gently caress the Commonwealth.
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Oct 24, 2015 06:19
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mornhaven posted:It's been a long time since I've played so whats a good strategy for starting as Muscovy? Also is taking humanism still worth it or should I take something else? The idea pro-strat is Explo-Religious-Military Idea, and then it doesn't really matter. Don't take Humanism. If you don't want to waste a bunch of diplo points on colonists, you can definitely colonize Siberia without it, but this way is just faster, which means your overall gains are higher. You can definitely get away with picking up only the first idea for a free colonist and then ignoring it too, but that means delaying your national ideas, which is a drawback. Religious is going to be either your first or second pick. To start, take any mission that will give you monarch points for building alliances, because that's free, instant points. Once you cycle through the one or two you can get, take the Conquest of Novgorod mission. Build up a few more units, split your army, start moving your the stacks to your province that borders Novgorod from the south. Recombine when they both get there, put Shemyaka in charge, declare war, and roll their stack in Novgorod. Then spend the way smashing Novgorod armies while your vassals do all the sieging for you. Eat as much as Novgorod as you can, but don't take Novgorod; prioritize cutting them off from their neighbors so nobody else can conquer them. Start coring all the provinces, then cancel the Conquer Novgorod mission. You can pick it back up when the truce expires. For the next couple years, bash any Hordes that look weak. If Poland-Lit gets into trouble, jump on them, because Lithuania has a bunch of same-culture, same-religion provinces. But they're stronger than you, so don't do it unless they've been softened up a bit. Shayu posted:You already get 3+ conversion speed from full patriarchy and you're just bordering a bunch of crappy horde provinces, you don't need the extra conversion. Humanist is just better because religious doesn't add as much you don't already have. Besides, later in the game you get conversion speed for free anyways, but Humanist is good forever, especially if you're going to blob. Religious is just redundant and not as useful as really anything else, it's not terrible, but it doesn't give you much you don't already have. Awful advice. Religious lets you get the conversions done faster, and get your Orthodox bonuses kicking in sooner. You'll miss the separatism reduction from Humanist, but since you're Russia and have no shortage of manpower anyway, you just let the missionaries kick up a shitstorm of unrest, crush the rebellion once, and move on. Religious also gives you the sweet, sweet CB on all of your non-Orthodox neighbors (all of them).
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Oct 24, 2015 06:24
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Not trying to dogpile you here, but another reason Humanist doesn't really fit for most Orthodox and especially Muscovy is you're never going to have Heretics/Heathens fully accepted, which means you need to convert them eventually anyway. Yes you gain missionary strength by decisions, but a lot of those also reduce Heretic Tolerance and Advancement of Religion gives +1 RR. It just doesn't make sense to me why you'd take Humanist but then you're going to get all the conversion bonuses by decision which reduce your heretic tolerance and maybe increase RR... kind of negating some of your Humanist bonuses. Humanist is a great idea group, don't get me wrong. I just think it fits better with nations that have cultural and Heathen/Heretic tolerance in their NIs and/or are more looking to get medium to large sized rather than massive. France, Poland, Sweden, Ottomans, tons of Indian and SE Asian nations.
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Oct 24, 2015 06:49
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So i'm trying to be a loan shark since im swimming in trade money, but no country wants to bite, even if its some super long term loan at 1%. What gives?
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Oct 24, 2015 07:52
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I think loans are for multiplayer use.
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Oct 24, 2015 07:54
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Yashichi posted:Good thing dip tech doesn't matter at all! This is pretty much all wrong: Diplo tech actually does matter (especially if you're generating income from trade or have vassals) Losing territory is even more bullshit than .1 inflation per loan (one of the MP guys had over 20% inflation as Muscovy/Russia, and he easily eclipsed other players at the end due to sheer mass) Eventually the French and german minors will get pissed at your AE and also coalition you, and 20 German and Italian minors pouncing on you is no joke.
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Oct 24, 2015 07:57
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Don't ever pass Advancement of Religion. Ever. It's just awful. +1 RR is all kinds of bad and +1% Missionary Strength is not a worthwhile exchange. Maybe back when you'd need all the missionary strength you could get, it might have been worthwhile, but now, it is most assuredly not. It'll help you for the first 50 or so years of the game and then it'll suck for 400.
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Oct 24, 2015 07:57
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Yeah I generally avoid any decision that gives +RR or +stability cost. The provincial government system for the Ottomans is another such trap. +10% tax rate isn't worth the RR, and it also gives you bad events down the line.
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Oct 24, 2015 08:08
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GreyPowerVan posted:I think loans are for multiplayer use. They're necessary for select countries to survive. Byzantium is the big one. If you don't take out a shitload of loans and build lots of galleys, you cannot win.
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Oct 24, 2015 08:19
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I think he's talking about offering loans to AI countries.
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Oct 24, 2015 08:22
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Oh. Someone was making GBS threads on loans earlier and I am still riled up about it.
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Oct 24, 2015 08:29
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Node posted:Oh. Someone was making GBS threads on loans earlier and I am still riled up about it. Yeah, i know loans are good. Someone was trying to offer loans to the AI and that doesn't work, i think.
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Oct 24, 2015 08:39
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GreyPowerVan posted:Yeah, i know loans are good. It used to be a very nice way to get easy CB's against non-adjacent nations, but Wiz hates fun 
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Oct 24, 2015 08:59
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Loans are even semi-useless in MP because there's a minimum interest rate, which is the same as the minimum for normal loans so if you have any -interest ideas there's no point in ever seeking a loan from a player. If you could manually set the interest rate then maybe they'd get used more.
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Oct 24, 2015 09:51
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Cynic Jester posted:Don't ever pass Advancement of Religion. Ever. It's just awful. +1 RR is all kinds of bad and +1% Missionary Strength is not a worthwhile exchange. Maybe back when you'd need all the missionary strength you could get, it might have been worthwhile, but now, it is most assuredly not. It'll help you for the first 50 or so years of the game and then it'll suck for 400. The irreconcilability of those decisions means that I almost never use them, and I doubt that I'm alone.
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Oct 24, 2015 09:53
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Potooweet posted:The irreconcilability of those decisions means that I almost never use them, and I doubt that I'm alone. I pass all of them, all the time, and drat the consequences. I like to get a modifier page as huge and ridiculous as possible. Sometimes I delay them for a few years but I never don't take them.
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Oct 24, 2015 10:02
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Larry Parrish posted:I pass all of them, all the time, and drat the consequences. I like to get a modifier page as huge and ridiculous as possible. Sometimes I delay them for a few years but I never don't take them. This is the correct and good way to play.
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Oct 24, 2015 10:08
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