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mind the walrus posted:This makes sense and makes me feel like my common sense is lacking for not realizing it sooner. Like when I found out that statues and sculptures of idealized body forms would often be found with semen on them. Ladies... 
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Jan 4, 2014 23:14
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There are Greek and Roman statues where the breasts have been worn down from so many hands touching them over time 
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Jan 4, 2014 23:15
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mind the walrus posted:This makes sense and makes me feel like my common sense is lacking for not realizing it sooner. Like when I found out that statues and sculptures of idealized body forms would often be found with semen on them. That and a lot of old works of art are basically porn or "instruction manuals" for young couples. I remember my art history professor talking about the Venus of Urbino by Titian was supposed to portray the subject basically masturbating because it was a common belief back then that a woman had to orgasm in order to conceive (which is one of those beliefs people conveniently forget about). Crow Jane posted:There are Greek and Roman statues where the breasts have been worn down from so many hands touching them over time No surprise there, everyone appreciates good titties. 
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Jan 4, 2014 23:16
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Crow Jane posted:I've never actually read Discworld, where's a good place to start? I have Small Gods on hand, but don't know where it fits in Small Gods is really good and doesn't fit into any of the mini-storylines going on, so it's a decent standalone, and while there is continuity you can pick up any book and enjoy it on its own as VendaGoat says I actually wouldn't reccommend starting from the very beginning though, I find The Colour of Magic and The Light Fantastic to be some of the weakest in the series
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Jan 4, 2014 23:16
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Crow Jane posted:There are Greek and Roman statues where the breasts have been worn down from so many hands touching them over time Victor Noir's bronze sculpture has been rubbed so hard the penis is always shiny. 
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Jan 4, 2014 23:20
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I don't know why, but that sort of thing is like insanely comforting to me. Humans are a ridiculous species
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Jan 4, 2014 23:22
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Pick posted:Victor Noir's bronze sculpture has been rubbed so hard the penis is always shiny. Spent way too long staring at a statue's trouser meat.
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Jan 4, 2014 23:25
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Looks like people give him a little kiss as well. The mouth looks to have the same, "weathering". Nothing like a kiss after a Hand Beezy.
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Jan 4, 2014 23:26
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that penis is well cared for edit: yeah people rub the wang and kiss the mouth cause it's good luck for fertility or something i get all my info from cracked dot com
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Jan 4, 2014 23:27
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buy the cracked de-textbook please nobody else will
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Jan 4, 2014 23:28
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Putty posted:that penis is well cared for
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Jan 4, 2014 23:29
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vaguely posted:Small Gods is really good and doesn't fit into any of the mini-storylines going on, so it's a decent standalone, and while there is continuity you can pick up any book and enjoy it on its own as VendaGoat says iawtp pyramids is also a pretty good standalone to start off with I also like basically every single one that focuses on sam vimes, he's my favorite character e: my favorite discworld book is night watch, although it's probably not nearly as impactful if you read it without having read any of the previous books
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Jan 4, 2014 23:30
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Still sick but at least I have lots of chances to play with my loose tea herbs. Right now I have a pot of half chamomile, half peppermint, with some lemongrass mixed it. It's delicious, but is also the exact color of pee.
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Jan 4, 2014 23:30
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Hope you feel better soon! I'm in constant fear of getting sick, everywhere I go people are coughing and sneezing like crazy and it's freaking me out. Where do you get your tea from? We've been ordering from Adagio, and everything we've tried has been delicious
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Jan 4, 2014 23:32
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Crow Jane posted:I've never actually read Discworld, where's a good place to start? I have Small Gods on hand, but don't know where it fits in just read that it doesnt really fit "anywhere" and it doenst have to because its a loving fantastic god damned book if you like that try the guards books (guards! guards! is the first) or going postal
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Jan 4, 2014 23:38
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the tiffany aching books are also fantastic, but for younger readers. they are basically pratchett going "harry potter is bad im gunna do everything the opposite of how harry potter does it and its gunna be good books" and they are
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Jan 4, 2014 23:40
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Crow Jane posted:Hope you feel better soon! I'm in constant fear of getting sick, everywhere I go people are coughing and sneezing like crazy and it's freaking me out. I get mine from Adagio! I got a lot of their tea for people for Christmas/New Year's. Apple spice chai is my favorite right now, but I'm mixing stuff from the herbal sampler set and it's great. Lemongrass on its own tastes like Lysol, though.
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Jan 4, 2014 23:41
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Their chais are really, really good. The Thai one is my favorite so far, it's got a slight hint of coconut. Try throwing a few pinches in rice while it's cooking, then make rice pudding out of it. Have yourself a fat and happy winter night
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Jan 4, 2014 23:50
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Crow Jane posted:Their chais are really, really good. The Thai one is my favorite so far, it's got a slight hint of coconut. I've been wanting to try that one, but couldn't justify anymore tea. I get so much mileage out of just a sampler from them. I'll have to try that, although I've never made rice pudding. I'm about to make scalloped sweet potatoes as a side for leftover quiche/pizza. Class starts up the week after next, so I'm also trying to get into the habit of cooking and freezing food for the week on Sundays. I also got a very pretty Dutch oven for Christmas so I'm making no-knead bread. I hope this works well because omg prep was like 1 minute including cleanup and now it's just sitting on a shelf until tomorrow night.
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Jan 4, 2014 23:55
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Wildlife Analysis posted:i don't see why you would tolerate this in genre fiction, though. 99% of it is entirely without literary merit, there's very little reason to look beyond the shittiness in the writing Wildlife Analysis posted:yeah, it's why i tend to not read much of it. there is a predisposition to being a terrible human being in a lot of that genre. You've read 99% of fantasy and sci-fi works? That's pretty impressive. Enfys fucked around with this message at 00:05 on Apr 5, 2014 |
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Jan 4, 2014 23:59
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Lay some examples on us then, other than Prachett, Mieville, or Abercrombie.
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Jan 5, 2014 00:02
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Addendum to previous post about cooking Sunday: groceries for the week (including my freak fasts and lunches, husband gets his on his own) were $50. I'll probably have to re-up on spinach and tomatoes In a few days, though. But still, woohoo. That leaves extra for Scullipstick.
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Jan 5, 2014 00:02
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Pick posted:Lay some examples on us then, other than Prachett, Mieville, or Abercrombie. Not that I particularly feel like fighting this dude's battles nor feel compelled to defend genre fiction, but I really enjoy Roger Zelanzy and Jack Vance and--at least in the stuff I've read by them--I don't recall anything homophobic or misogynist or sexist.
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Jan 5, 2014 00:05
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saying that 99% of [genre] is terrible isn't that controversial; 99% of absolutely everything is terrible
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Jan 5, 2014 00:05
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iain m banks was pretty good for sci-fi as far as that goes, he died recently though
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Jan 5, 2014 00:08
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mind the walrus posted:Not that I particularly feel like fighting this dude's battles nor feel compelled to defend genre fiction, but I really enjoy Roger Zelanzy and Jack Vance and--at least in the stuff I've read by them--I don't recall anything homophobic or misogynist or sexist. I think a distinction needs to be drawn between rah-rah-kill-liberals Goodkind (which Wildlife Analysis seems more focused on) and then just books where the women/minority characters are unintentionally but profoundly superficially written, pointless, or only exist in the context of the male characters, which is indeed a staggering proportion. You can have something that's not Gor-level sexist that is still dismissive of anyone who isn't straight white male lead. The Hobbit isn't sexist, in my mind, but it doesn't have female or gay characters of significance and depth like Iron Council. Pick fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Jan 5, 2014 |
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Jan 5, 2014 00:11
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hey i know a piece of very well written "genre" fiction that isn't pratchett, mieville, or abercrombie and it contains very well written and important female characters
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Jan 5, 2014 00:14
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NecroMonster posted:hey i know a piece of very well written "genre" fiction that isn't pratchett, mieville, or abercrombie and it contains very well written and important female characters oh you
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Jan 5, 2014 00:16
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i was one of the ones railing against fantasy and i have no problem with sci-fi. there's a lot of poo poo sci-fi but there's a lot of poo poo everything. and unlike fantasy, there is plenty of sci-fi set in egalitarian societies. i like iain m banks and am reading one of his books right now - against a dark background. strangely it's reminding me a bit of perdido street station which i didn't like, but that's just the setting really. the characters in this one are a lot more likeable and it's basically a quest novel which is generally an entertaining type of book. it's not literary masterpiece but it's entertaining. i liked most of the culture books a lot too, except matter which i couldn't get through because it was basically fantasy in a sci fi setting. i disliked dune for this same reason.
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Jan 5, 2014 00:18
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tbh i'm through the first book of the first law trilogy (abercrombie) and not hot on his female characters either yet but it might get better and at least he has them sexy smart and sassy lady who is 2 progressive 4 this bad world former (sex?) slave who has a bow and is hardcore whedon walks by and nods approvingly
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Jan 5, 2014 00:18
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at this point i dont even need to say the name of it i think ive got it properly lodged into peoples minds
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Jan 5, 2014 00:19
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i actually think there's more good scifi than fantasy, proportionally, though a lot of both is bad o course
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Jan 5, 2014 00:19
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Enfys posted:You've read 99% of fantasy and sci-fi works? That's pretty impressive. You know why I say this? Because genre fiction as a descriptor is almost always used as a counterpoint to literary fiction, i.e. fiction that has some measure of literary merit. There is fiction within certain genres that qualify as literary fiction, but when you're calling something "genre fiction" you're saying that its primary reason for existing is to fit into and fill the tropes of a particular genre. quote:I'm going to guess that you have actually read very little since you hate it so much and think that OSC is a useful and defining example of sci-fi and fantasy writers in general rather than some extreme terrible person who happens to write books of a particular type. He's become mainstream and controversial, so of course it's easy to make an example out of him, just like it's easy to make examples out of various terrible extreme people in any kind of group. I never said he was a defining example of all sci-fi fiction. I was saying that he was a great example of the weird hang-ups and terrible authors that exist in genre fiction. quote:There is good genre fiction out there, and there are good genre writers as well, and a lot of quality women authors. Yeah, there is a lot of crap, but you are making incredibly extreme claims with seemingly little basis and what sounds like very superficial reading of the genres. There's nothing wrong with hating sci-fi or fantasy or not wanting to read it, but trying to justify it with incredibly elaborate hyperbole about how 99% of it is entirely without merit, lovely writing, and involves a predisposition to being a terrible human being is pretty absurd. So yeah, way to not actually read my posts. If you'd done this you wouldn't have had to waste a giant effortpost on me.
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Jan 5, 2014 00:19
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Pick posted:I think a distinction needs to be drawn between rah-rah-kill-liberals Goodkind (which Wildlife Analysis seems more focused on) and then just books where the women/minority characters are unintentionally but profoundly superficially written, pointless, or only exist in the context of the male characters, which is indeed a staggering proportion. You can have something that's not Gor-level sexist that is still dismissive of anyone who isn't straight white male lead. True that. I'll even agree that your grievances apply to the authors I listed based on what I've read. They still should be read anyway because they're genuinely kind-of loving awesome. Lord of Light is the best "white dude appropriating another culture's mythology" story I've ever read, and Vance's Dying Earth books have some of the wonkiest prose (in a good way) I've read in fantasy coupled with a rocking imagination and good sense of humor.
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Jan 5, 2014 00:20
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abercrombies lady characters really arent great i didnt find them offensive (but im a guy so maybe i wouldn't) but they arent really anything to talk about
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Jan 5, 2014 00:20
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NecroMonster posted:at this point i dont even need to say the name of it i think ive got it properly lodged into peoples minds is it redwall
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Jan 5, 2014 00:21
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i should really probably read some mieville
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Jan 5, 2014 00:22
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toe knee hand posted:is it redwall ahaha you have fallen into my trap its a (finished) web-serial called Worm that features super heroes (and super villains) of massive length and despite all of those words I just typed its really really loving good
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Jan 5, 2014 00:23
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NecroMonster posted:abercrombies lady characters really arent great they seem to be very cliche and not that important whatever, there are worse sins but [words words] iron council [words]
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Jan 5, 2014 00:23
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Wildlife Analysis posted:You know why I say this? Because genre fiction as a descriptor is almost always used as a counterpoint to literary fiction, i.e. fiction that has some measure of literary merit. There is fiction within certain genres that qualify as literary fiction, but when you're calling something "genre fiction" you're saying that its primary reason for existing is to fit into and fill the tropes of a particular genre. To be totally and 100% fair "genre fiction" is often also used as a pejorative and idiots conflate the genre trappings with the capacity for literary merit, forgetting at the very least Sturgeon's Law and at most that content and form are two different things. Pick posted:sexy smart and sassy lady who is 2 progressive 4 this bad world I genuinely like Whedon but still 
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Jan 5, 2014 00:24
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