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Jaxyon posted:Except, Obama is a calm normal dude, and Trump is fundamentally unable to be wrong or lose at anything If he loses in 2020 I fully expect him to refuse to concede and throw a giant hissy fit
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Jun 13, 2017 22:54
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Raskolnikov38 posted:your adjunct professor is a dick That's a good thing. I'd be incredibly dishonest for a tenured professor to encourage going into a field with very little prospects. Nothing like talking to former lawyers turned Political Science professors about how Law School is a bad idea nowadays.
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Jun 13, 2017 23:11
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teaching is a prospect, just not a very good one
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Jun 13, 2017 23:55
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The Central Valley is looking at a week (or more) of 100-plus degree temperatures starting Friday. I know you can't point at any single weather event and call it climate change, but...goddamn.
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Jun 14, 2017 02:57
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Raskolnikov38 posted:teaching is a prospect, just not a very good one As someone who is looking to go into the education field, you're telling me. 
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Jun 14, 2017 03:16
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Better than retail
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Jun 14, 2017 03:52
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Forceholy posted:That's a good thing. I'd be incredibly dishonest for a tenured professor to encourage going into a field with very little prospects. That was the thing. He was an adjunct who was eking out a living teaching at four different campuses including community colleges. He was living the struggle.
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Jun 14, 2017 04:02
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Mister Mind posted:The Central Valley is looking at a week (or more) of 100-plus degree temperatures starting Friday. I know you can't point at any single weather event and call it climate change, but...goddamn. I believe in climate change as much as anyone, but that sounds like a typical Central Valley summer to me.
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Jun 14, 2017 04:02
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Cup Runneth Over posted:People said this exact thing about Obama guys guys what if both sides same 
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Jun 14, 2017 04:25
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Ron Jeremy posted:That was the thing. He was an adjunct who was eking out a living teaching at four different campuses including community colleges. He was living the struggle. One of my professors in college was incredibly accomplished. Peace Corp, PhD from Princeton, used to be an advisor on foreign policy for the Reagan Administration. Guy had to teach aerobics classes on top of teaching at various colleges to make ends meet. Even now, when he has tenure, he still teaches at two different universities. Education doesn't mean a drat thing in this country unless it's "useful".
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Jun 14, 2017 04:43
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stone cold posted:guys guys what if both sides same What if it's an absurd hypothetical that's on par with Godwin's Law?
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Jun 14, 2017 07:08
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BannedNewbie posted:I believe in climate change as much as anyone, but that sounds like a typical Central Valley summer to me. This. Central Valley being hotter than satans rear end in a top hat? yeah that's exactly normal and expected. It's important not to fall into the pitfall "oh my god it's so hot right now in spring, climate change!!" or "its so cold right now in summer, so much for global warming huh lieberals???" or various permutations of it and recognizing climate vs local weather.
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Jun 14, 2017 07:21
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dont be mean to me posted:Or he tells us to lay down and die and we get the second civil war. well he wants to pull federal funding for the earthquake early warning network for no real reason beyond the state not voting for him, so he kind of already did this
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Jun 14, 2017 08:26
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Panfilo posted:I dunno, I used to think that, but lately I've been seeing the darker side of it, like the whole gimmick of 'Disruption' and the encouragement of a gig economy and many of the labor-unfriendly practices of the tech sector. Its one thing to get excited about piecework when it is augmenting an $80,000 wage, its another thing when the only available jobs to an unemployed person are 'piecework' that never gets them decent health benefits or steady hours. quote:I had thought software engineers were more on the libertarian side; if you are a workaholic and feel like you are being directly rewarded your your talent/skill/effort, it becomes really easy to blame other people for 'not trying hard enough'. Upthread someone mentioned overhearing technbros whining that the Muni bus drivers make about what they make, as if that was somehow unreasonable. quote:If they were so liberal, why would they care what someone else makes, vs maybe asking for a raise if they really think they deserve more?
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Jun 14, 2017 13:39
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Cicero posted:Being a bus driver is a fairly low-skilled job Not really, it's just that the skills aren't respected or compensated well. I can look down on codemonkies as well but society gives them a lot of money and they'll start whining in the thread.
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Jun 14, 2017 17:59
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Jaxyon posted:Not really, it's just that the skills aren't respected or compensated well. Yeah, getting one of those accordion buses through clogged streets without constantly hitting cars feels like a freaking miracle some times
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Jun 14, 2017 18:13
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The Glumslinger posted:Yeah, getting one of those accordion buses through clogged streets without constantly hitting cars feels like a freaking miracle some times There aren't many unskilled jobs. There's just skills that society looks down on.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:20
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If robots aren't already doing your job, either you have great skills or are underpaid. Hell even if robots took your job you most likely still have great skills, but the value of the skill happened to crash. For example laying down a flawless weld by hand takes skill that takes years master.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:43
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I learned how to drive a bus with about 2 weeks of training. I learned double-decks with another 3 days or so. Really not much knowledge or skill development compared to learning a trade or getting a 4 year degree. Even with rear end in a top hat passengers, it didn't require any analytical skill or physical labor. Still doesn't mean they shouldn't make a living wage tho
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Jun 14, 2017 18:50
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Pay in our society is commensurate with supply and demand, not skill or difficulty. If you want to change that you need a union.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:52
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I think the bus drivers in San Luis Obispo must get a bonus for every second they spend over the center line while there's traffic coming the other way. Like, I get it, the streets are narrow and you don't want to hit the parked cars, but get the gently caress outta my lane!
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Jun 14, 2017 18:55
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Your bus driving skill is built on top of years of regular driving experience. Sure it isn't considered valuable, but can you imagine starting from nothing? I learned how to write a program that says 'hello world' in an afternoon, a good understanding of variables, and Boolean logic in a few more days and how do do object oriented programming in a few more weeks. That doesn't make me a competent developer.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:56
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Leperflesh posted:Pay in our society is commensurate with supply and demand, not skill or difficulty. If you want to change that you need a union. Pay is strongly correlated with labor power. Surprise, I know.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:58
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The Wiggly Wizard posted:I learned how to drive a bus with about 2 weeks of training. I learned double-decks with another 3 days or so. Really not much knowledge or skill development compared to learning a trade or getting a 4 year degree. Even with rear end in a top hat passengers, it didn't require any analytical skill or physical labor. What county transit agency is going to let you on the road with 2 weeks of training? Most, if not all County Transit Agencies in the Bay Area require 9 to 11 weeks of training. That's upwards of 3 months they might discover you are a burnout, horrible with passengers, jump every curb and island, don't know how to listen to directions from trainers who have been doing this poo poo for 20+years, start to run over the guy who is just trying to get his bicycle off the bike rack because you're not paying attention, or had a DUI 9.5 years ago because you had one too many 4lokos and didn't fess up when it might be relevant. Then again, for someone applying for Loop or Veolia, I'm sure 2 weeks of Honest Jim's Buz-drivvin Classes is probably sufficient.
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Jun 14, 2017 19:19
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That drivers for Uber and Lyft don't need training is all the proof I need that driving is simple, easy, and without risk. I very much enjoy putting my life in the hands of strangers for minimum wage and poo poo benefits, thank you very much, because that's what I'm worth.
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Jun 14, 2017 19:26
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CopperHound posted:Your bus driving skill is built on top of years of regular driving experience. Sure it isn't considered valuable, but can you imagine starting from nothing? Fair point but there is an obvious upper limit to experience making one a better driver. There are plenty of people out there that have been driving daily for most of their lives, and yet they still are out to kill me on my bike. Panfilo posted:What county transit agency is going to let you on the road with 2 weeks of training? Most, if not all County Transit Agencies in the Bay Area require 9 to 11 weeks of training. That's upwards of 3 months they might discover you are a burnout, horrible with passengers, jump every curb and island, don't know how to listen to directions from trainers who have been doing this poo poo for 20+years, start to run over the guy who is just trying to get his bicycle off the bike rack because you're not paying attention, or had a DUI 9.5 years ago because you had one too many 4lokos and didn't fess up when it might be relevant. Yolo County/City of Davis, apparently. It's weird that you assume I'm lying or received inadequate training. I managed not to maim anyone or destroy property over 3 years. Admiral Ray posted:That drivers for Uber and Lyft don't need training is all the proof I need that driving is simple, easy, and without risk. I very much enjoy putting my life in the hands of strangers for minimum wage and poo poo benefits, thank you very much, because that's what I'm worth. Don't they make less than min wage after depreciation value, gas, other expenses?
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Jun 14, 2017 19:31
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I make a pile of money doing a white collar job you could pick up in 2 weeks. Your job not being automated yet doesn't mean you have high skills.
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Jun 14, 2017 19:34
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At some level it's tautological: every time a job proves resistant to automation, it will rise in our collective esteem, and every time one proves vulnerable, it will drop.
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Jun 14, 2017 19:52
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Doc Hawkins posted:At some level it's tautological: every time a job proves resistant to automation, it will rise in our collective esteem, and every time one proves vulnerable, it will drop. Sometimes it depends on who's doing it. Computer programming didn't become a prestige job until men took it from women.
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Jun 14, 2017 19:56
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Doc Hawkins posted:At some level it's tautological: every time a job proves resistant to automation, it will rise in our collective esteem, and every time one proves vulnerable, it will drop.
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Jun 14, 2017 20:21
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The Wiggly Wizard posted:Fair point but there is an obvious upper limit to experience making one a better driver. There are plenty of people out there that have been driving daily for most of their lives, and yet they still are out to kill me on my bike. This is a really bad argument. "Bus drivers are a low skill job because random people don't bother to learn how to not kill people when they drive."
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Jun 14, 2017 20:28
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The Wiggly Wizard posted:It's weird that you assume I'm lying or received inadequate training. I managed not to maim anyone or destroy property over 3 years. Ahem, a slight correction: seriously maim anyone
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Jun 14, 2017 20:42
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The Wiggly Wizard posted:Yolo County/City of Davis, apparently.
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Jun 14, 2017 21:31
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Jaxyon posted:Sometimes it depends on who's doing it. Computer programming didn't become a prestige job until men took it from women. CopperHound posted:I'm sure people in the service industry are reassured by your statement. I'm not saying status is determined by inautomatability, just that it might be influenced by it. When radiation technicians become an endangered species, I believe people will tend to say that they should have known, or that they weren't doing anything that great if software can do it so much better. e: I remember where I got this from. A guy called Richard Hamming used to say that he avoided arguments by defining "thinking" as everything we can't program a computer to do. I think people tended to accept that because once we understand how a computer can do some task, we more easily dismiss it as "just following orders" or "just pattern recognition" or "just calculation." So as a result, all else being equal, the more everyone accepts that computers can do some skill, the more that skill would drop in their esteem. Doc Hawkins fucked around with this message at 22:10 on Jun 14, 2017 |
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Jun 14, 2017 22:02
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I look forward to everyone feeling like the pieces of poo poo that they are when AI becomes self aware.
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Jun 14, 2017 22:48
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People will be fine with murdering or enslaving AI for profit.
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Jun 14, 2017 23:01
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ChaseSP posted:People will be fine with murdering or enslaving AI for profit. Certainly no less fine than they are with doing it to other people already.
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Jun 14, 2017 23:23
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snyprmag posted:Driving a bus in Davis seems at least 5x easier than the Bay Area, let alone SF proper. The majority of the fleet drivers are students so there is probably greater turn over than your standard city. I drove charters in Sacramento too, but I guess I'm just No True Busman LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:This is a really bad argument. "Bus drivers are a low skill job because random people don't bother to learn how to not kill people when they drive." That's not my argument. I'm saying that my previous 3 years of Honda Civic experience isn't the same as apprenticing as an electrician for the same amount of time.
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Jun 15, 2017 00:54
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I literally couldn't give a poo poo how long their training is. My job training was 2 weeks too, and I'm a techbro, so it's just assumed that I have a valuable skill that deserves loads of money. Bus driving is an unpleasant, unrewarding job that most people do not want to do and it deserves comfortable pay and good benefits -- not just a living wage.
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Jun 15, 2017 02:17
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Cup Runneth Over posted:I literally couldn't give a poo poo how long their training is. My job training was 2 weeks too, and I'm a techbro, so it's just assumed that I have a valuable skill that deserves loads of money. Bus driving is an unpleasant, unrewarding job that most people do not want to do and it deserves comfortable pay and good benefits -- not just a living wage. 100% this. I am not doing a fraction of the good to society that a decent bus driver is.
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Jun 15, 2017 02:20
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