The XCOM Thread: HOW DOES SNEK KICK DOOR?!

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > The XCOM Thread: HOW DOES SNEK KICK DOOR?!

Lowen SoDium: Jun 5, 2003; Highen Fiber; Clapping Larry

Soho Joe posted:

Yahtzee complained about mission timers and RNG and why "More XCOM" is "A Bad Thing"

ZuljinRaynor posted:

So basically what every negative Steam review is?

Not quite that bad, but he really does brush it off as being cheap repackaged sequel, ignoring that classes have been completely redone, all enemies were either new or remade, and dismisses most of the new game elements. He also wasn't that hard on turn limits, but was saying that he didn't think they made sense narratively on some missions.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:06

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 04:57

RBA Starblade: Apr 28, 2008; Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Lowen SoDium posted:

He also wasn't that hard on turn limits, but was saying that he didn't think they made sense narratively on some missions.

Did he say which ones? Most missions with timers are "X turns until the Advent UFOs get to the Skyranger".

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:08

PoizenJam: Dec 2, 2006; Damn!!!
It's PoizenJam!!!

Jigoku San posted:

The game is pretty well set for a XCOM Apocalypse-ish mode. XCOM has control of a few Advent-topia zones, Advent has a few and the rest are contested. Defend and take back city zones preventing Advent's new nefarious plans. While cosmic horrors and elder gods come pouring through the rift from the ending. Final missions would send the Avenger through the rift.

I dig this idea- so XCOM 2 ends with the avatar project halted but a strong alien presence remains, leading to a more traditional 2 sided war in XCOM 3. And with any luck both sides could be playable. Though I'm wondering how soldier recruitment would work for the aliens? Could you recruit mutons? Snaketits? Would they have progression trees of their own?

And now it's dawning on me how huge of a task multi-faction XCom could be.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:13

Mazz: Dec 12, 2012; Orion, this is Sperglord Actual.
Come on home.

So about that adding a vest slot to armor mod:

I think it should be doable by trying to find and repackage the grenadier extra nade (basically the syntax of a item class-limited slot) stuff along with the code that one mod that adds a utility slot back to light/heavy armors. Only problems I see right now are that idk how the UI will handle 4 utility slots in the places that would apply, and I don't think vests have a neat item category like grenades do, so really you'd get an extra utility slot but you can probably tailor it to block out grenades and such at least.

I'm slowly looking into it, but I haven't really touched this game's files at all before, so it probably won't be fast nor am I 100% I can even do it yet. That being said, it doesn't seem like it would overly difficult once I find/figure out the different pieces.

Mazz fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Feb 24, 2016

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:13

Lowen SoDium: Jun 5, 2003; Highen Fiber; Clapping Larry

RBA Starblade posted:

Did he say which ones? Most missions with timers are "X turns until the Advent UFOs get to the Skyranger".

Specifically, he was talking about the self destructing boxes you have to retrieve a McGuffin from.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:15

Mystic Stylez: Dec 19, 2009

What are the proving grounds projects that you should research with priority? There's so much poo poo to do and so little supplies that I've been mostly neglecting it

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:18

idonotlikepeas: May 29, 2010; This reasoning is possible for forums user idonotlikepeas!

On how Dark Events work: each one, when it pops, has a hidden number of activation days which depends on the particular project and is randomly rolled between a max and min value. When that number of days passes, the project completes and the enemy gets whatever benefit. Periodically you get a guerilla event that lets you counter one of your choosing. If you counter the project before the activation days elapse, it goes away. Things are balanced so that you can't counter every event, although you can counter a lot of them.

The dark events all have functions that decide when they can run, so it's definitely possible to put things in that depend on the alien escalation level or the actual date. It might be easier to make them as separate events than to modify the existing ones over time, and to either mod the existing ones so they stop appearing, or adjust the probability weight on the new ones to be higher. (One of the template values is the weighted probability of this particular event popping.)

Hmm.

Edit: Hilariously, the function that activates when the breakthrough events finish is called "AddDoomToRandomFacility".

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:19

Exposure: Apr 4, 2014

idonotlikepeas posted:

On how Dark Events work: each one, when it pops, has a hidden number of activation days which depends on the particular project and is randomly rolled between a max and min value. When that number of days passes, the project completes and the enemy gets whatever benefit. Periodically you get a guerilla event that lets you counter one of your choosing. If you counter the project before the activation days elapse, it goes away. Things are balanced so that you can't counter every event, although you can counter a lot of them.

The dark events all have functions that decide when they can run, so it's definitely possible to put things in that depend on the alien escalation level or the actual date. It might be easier to make them as separate events than to modify the existing ones over time, and to either mod the existing ones so they stop appearing, or adjust the probability weight on the new ones to be higher. (One of the template values is the weighted probability of this particular event popping.)

Hmm.

Edit: Hilariously, the function that activates when the breakthrough events finish is called "AddDoomToRandomFacility".

Yeah separate events seems like it would be the best way to go, since you should be able to alter the existing events to have the additional condition of only activating if the higher tier dark events can't.

Granted IIRC, the game auto-rejects dark events of same name unless a class override is in effect, so it could get a bit messy in terms of compatibility with other dark event mods, unless you just stick with the higher tier/permanent ones being conditional on say, the final doom clock state having been reached.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:29

Pumpkinreaper: Jan 19, 2010

Give the aliens blaster bomb launchers late game.

Difficulty problems solved.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:30

Speedball: Apr 15, 2008

Mystic Stylez posted:

What are the proving grounds projects that you should research with priority? There's so much poo poo to do and so little supplies that I've been mostly neglecting it

Try to get yourself at least one fresh new grenade (it'll be random) because experimental grenades are awesome. Skulljack is of course the first thing they ASK you to make but there are other good ones. The Bluescreen Protocol you can research there lets you manually purchase the all-important bluescreen rounds and EMP grenades, too.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:31

Magnus Venator: Jul 17, 2006; Trekker p� 1/5 sek. Svak for kvinner og hasard. Nerv�s, innesluttet, med psykopatiske trekk.

JVNO posted:

And now it's dawning on me how huge of a task multi-faction XCom could be.

I imagine it could be done as a mod. Same missions with switched sides. Kill ten humans on a terror mission. Prevent the XCOM scum from evacuating. Protect the VIP. Fill out the doom ticker by building bases and researching advances with Dr. Ayygan. Upgrade and buy units from the cloning vats of Mistress Vahlen. Completing the doom ticker lets you assault the Avenger.

The biggest challenge would be coding XCOM behavior on the tactical level, I think.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:33

RBA Starblade: Apr 28, 2008; Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Magnus Venator posted:

The biggest challenge would be coding XCOM behavior on the tactical level, I think.

If (XcomSoldier.GrenadeCount != 0)
{ThrowGrenade();}
ElseIf (XcomSoldier.IsPsiOp)
{Dominate();}
else()
{ShootGun();}

:v:

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:37

idonotlikepeas: May 29, 2010; This reasoning is possible for forums user idonotlikepeas!

Exposure posted:

Yeah separate events seems like it would be the best way to go, since you should be able to alter the existing events to have the additional condition of only activating if the higher tier dark events can't.

Granted IIRC, the game auto-rejects dark events of same name unless a class override is in effect, so it could get a bit messy in terms of compatibility with other dark event mods, unless you just stick with the higher tier/permanent ones being conditional on say, the final doom clock state having been reached.

There's both an internal name and a mutual exclusion list that can used for this, yeah.

Basically, when a supply drop happens, the game creates a deck of dark event cards (referred to as such in the code). For each event type, it puts one card into the deck per "weight" that the event currently has. When an event is drawn from the deck, it goes through and removes any other copies of that event card (anything with the exact same internal identifier) from the deck, and any other event whose name is part of the MutuallyExlusiveEvents list for that event. Then it draws again. When the event is played (appears in your list on the screen), it adds the WeightDeltaPerPlay value to the weight - this is always zero or negative. When it is activated (you fail to counter it), it adds the WeightDeltaPerActivate value to the weight - this is also always zero or negative. (The negative numbers are usually -2, except the alien hunt event, which gets -4 if you ever let it happen.) The result is then clamped to be between the min and max value for that event, so it can never get more or less likely than a certain amount. The effect of this is that you're biased towards seeing events you haven't seen yet, but eventually everything goes back to being a set probability (once you hit the minimum for each event).

FraudulentEconomics, let me know if you want any help with that mod. The project looks interesting.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:39

Davealicious: May 8, 2007

Danaru posted:

I figured, that's why I mentioned my favourite strategy to counter the bastards Phantom Ranger can also sneak people out of the hot zone without getting shot at.

Something else I learned today, while retaliation missions are the subject, civilians can't get rescued by mind controlled units, they just flee in terror. I'm not sure why I thought it would work, but it was still funny

From a few pages ago. Yesterday I was able to save civilians on a retaliation mission with a hacked MEC!

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:40

Synthbuttrange: May 6, 2007

RBA Starblade posted:

If (XcomSoldier.GrenadeCount != 0)
{ThrowGrenade();}
ElseIf (XcomSoldier.IsPsiOp)
{Dominate();}
else()
{ShootGun();}

If Soldierstatus != alive {Reload();}

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:42

Fangz: Jul 5, 2007; Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

SynthOrange posted:

If Soldierstatus != alive {Reload();}

Whine_about_rng();

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:47

Segmentation Fault: Jun 7, 2012

idonotlikepeas posted:

There's both an internal name and a mutual exclusion list that can used for this, yeah.

Basically, when a supply drop happens, the game creates a deck of dark event cards (referred to as such in the code). For each event type, it puts one card into the deck per "weight" that the event currently has. When an event is drawn from the deck, it goes through and removes any other copies of that event card (anything with the exact same internal identifier) from the deck, and any other event whose name is part of the MutuallyExlusiveEvents list for that event. Then it draws again. When the event is played (appears in your list on the screen), it adds the WeightDeltaPerPlay value to the weight - this is always zero or negative. When it is activated (you fail to counter it), it adds the WeightDeltaPerActivate value to the weight - this is also always zero or negative. (The negative numbers are usually -2, except the alien hunt event, which gets -4 if you ever let it happen.) The result is then clamped to be between the min and max value for that event, so it can never get more or less likely than a certain amount. The effect of this is that you're biased towards seeing events you haven't seen yet, but eventually everything goes back to being a set probability (once you hit the minimum for each event).

FraudulentEconomics, let me know if you want any help with that mod. The project looks interesting.

This actually totally makes sense. The dark event elements in the game UI even look like cards (the "hidden event" could be what the back of the card looks like), and it's no secret that Firaxis prototypes game ideas by making board games first (Sid Meier apparently does this all the time). The geoscape/strategic layer was probably developed as a stand-alone board game at Firaxis before being implemented into XCOM 2.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:49

RBA Starblade: Apr 28, 2008; Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Segmentation Fault posted:

This actually totally makes sense. The dark event elements in the game UI even look like cards (the "hidden event" could be what the back of the card looks like), and it's no secret that Firaxis prototypes game ideas by making board games first (Sid Meier apparently does this all the time). The geoscape/strategic layer was probably developed as a stand-alone board game at Firaxis before being implemented into XCOM 2.

Speaking of which if you guys don't have it, XCOM the board game is super fun. It plays in real time using a tablet too, so it's really tense as well you get a very limited amount of time to pause, and if you take too long on actions you get less time on others. Going over time or funding fucks you hard as well. Most rolls are against XCOM forces as well. You take multiple hits to kill an alien. One failure wipes the squad. :haw:

# ? Feb 24, 2016 21:51

Annointed: Mar 2, 2013

Lowen SoDium posted:

Not quite that bad, but he really does brush it off as being cheap repackaged sequel, ignoring that classes have been completely redone, all enemies were either new or remade, and dismisses most of the new game elements. He also wasn't that hard on turn limits, but was saying that he didn't think they made sense narratively on some missions.

So apparently people wouldn't get used to aliens when they literally were the occupying force for an entire generation and basically made things better for everyone.

Or how in the tutorial it's the characters saving the commander and Bradford telling the units what to do. Or how autopsies are needed for getting more info of a top secret conspiracy. Or how all the missions in some way are that cause the resistance fighters made those scenarios to warrant these mission types.

And wait, complaining about not using your moves that could gently caress you up? In XCOM?

This and his shoddy MGSV review where he complains about the optional voice clips and ~Wacky Kojima~ as dismissal of the game, really is showing a lack of effort and quality.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:01

malhavok: Jan 18, 2013

I added a bunch of appearance mods and now everything is screwed up even after disabling them. Mainly I can't select armor colors anymore, and every character in my pool is now poop green and brown. Anyone dealt with this before?

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:13

Brainamp: Sep 4, 2011; More Zen than Zenyatta

Affi posted:

My hope is they get a good expansion out and some quality dlc because why not.

Then prequels? I'd love to play a regular Joe schmuck during the invasion fps style if it can be good. Like conventional forces vs sectopods and cyberdiscs.

Have him recruited by xcom in the middle or something. Give him cooler weapons.

I dunno it could be made to be good.

I too want a remake of X-Com Enforcer.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:17

PoizenJam: Dec 2, 2006; Damn!!!
It's PoizenJam!!!

Annointed posted:

This and his shoddy MGSV review where he complains about the optional voice clips and ~Wacky Kojima~ as dismissal of the game, really is showing a lack of effort and quality.

Yet his criticism that MGSV gives you a million ways to do something stupidly simple is absolutely spot on and describes a grievance I have with many games- you never feel compelled to actually strategize or take advantage of your tools and resources when you can mash attack and huck health pots.

I'll have to check out his XCom 2 review but I don't feel his insight as a reviewer is lacking. I just think the 'overwrought disgusting/crass analogy' thing has been old for an exceptionally long time now. In much the same way as John Oliver's 'random weird analogy' gets old and out of place in an otherwise solid editorial. But that's their shticks I guess, and it still plays well for humour for them to keep it up.

I generally prefer GameTrailers for in depth, no bullshit reviews honestly.

PoizenJam fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Feb 24, 2016

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:23

FraudulentEconomics: Oct 14, 2007; Pst...

Mazz posted:

So about that adding a vest slot to armor mod:

I think it should be doable by trying to find and repackage the grenadier extra nade (basically the syntax of a item class-limited slot) stuff along with the code that one mod that adds a utility slot back to light/heavy armors. Only problems I see right now are that idk how the UI will handle 4 utility slots in the places that would apply, and I don't think vests have a neat item category like grenades do, so really you'd get an extra utility slot but you can probably tailor it to block out grenades and such at least.

I'm slowly looking into it, but I haven't really touched this game's files at all before, so it probably won't be fast nor am I 100% I can even do it yet. That being said, it doesn't seem like it would overly difficult once I find/figure out the different pieces.

Armor is it's own category, you can't have more than one vest at a time. That should at least make it easier to accomplish.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:32

DatonKallandor: Aug 21, 2009; "I can no longer sit back and allow nationalist shitposting, nationalist indoctrination, nationalist subversion, and the German nationalist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious game balance."

JVNO posted:

They kind of just straight up flipped the roles of 'invader' and 'defender', which is just about the coolest and straightforward idea for a sequel I've seen in a long time. I'm wondering where they go from here though? They've done a defense campaign and an offensive campaign- perhaps if we're lucky and Firaxis is ambitious enough we'll get a ridiculous, full scale, Star Craft esque game where you can play a campaign as either faction.

Because that would loving own. Perhaps the play style and objectives (both ground game and base building) differ slightly based on role. I initially considered this when I discovered 'XCom loses' is the canon ending for EU- even with multiply campaigns there could be a central 'canon'.

I haven't finished XCom 2, but I'm lead to believe the ending sets up for another, scarier alien faction?

The UFO series did the whole "canon ending is bad ending thing". It worked out really well there because in the first game (which starts off post-alien-triggered-apocalypse), at the point where the humans are starting to take back the planet and win, the aliens just pop up a dialog box and ask the player if you want to stop fighting and work together. The 2nd game assumes the player said yes and you play as collaborators trying to rebuild earth (with the help of both a Cyborg body part replacement faction and a psionic faction) after the aliens they allied with gently caress things up - from a mobile alien flying base that you move around the map to get your dropship into range of missions....

They even had the storyline of another alien faction coming in after the first one and being far more dangerous, which XCOM2 still hasn't gone for, despite teasing it as far back as XCOM1.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:40

MorsAnima: Nov 29, 2010; I just feel completely shit on. These changes won't make a cat in hell's difference.

I'm disappointed LW studios don't have time to do a LW-esque overhaul, and I'm also not expecting a masterpiece from them because well... New studio, lack of funds. Xenonauts is good, but it's no XCOM, and I'm expecting Terra Invicta to be closer to the former.

Unrelated mod talk, Codex' are so loving fun to dominate. Why has no-one modded 1) teleport 2) that "gently caress your weapons" ability and 3) CLONE onto psi ops already. Let's not kid ourselves, Psi is as overpowered as sin, so adding more poo poo isn't gonna break much.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:44

Pumpkinreaper: Jan 19, 2010

DatonKallandor posted:

The UFO series did the whole "canon ending is bad ending thing". It worked out really well there because in the first game (which starts off post-alien-triggered-apocalypse), at the point where the humans are starting to take back the planet and win, the aliens just pop up a dialog box and ask the player if you want to stop fighting and work together. The 2nd game assumes the player said yes and you play as collaborators trying to rebuild earth (with the help of both a Cyborg body part replacement faction and a psionic faction) after the aliens they allied with gently caress things up - from a mobile alien flying base that you move around the map to get your dropship into range of missions....

They even had the storyline of another alien faction coming in after the first one and being far more dangerous, which XCOM2 still hasn't gone for, despite teasing it as far back as XCOM1.

I'm really hoping that ends up being the focus of the third game (rebuilding the world, repopulating, etc. with a new alien menace infiltrating into human ranks) and that the teaser at the end of XCOM2 alludes to the expansion CRUISE SHIP TERROR :smigghh:

edit: No, Andromedons need to be koolaid men VV

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:50

necrobobsledder: Mar 21, 2005; Lay down your soul to the gods rock 'n roll; Nap Ghost

Wizard Styles posted:

I wasn't sure whether this was real or not and I'm glad that it is. Subscribed. Eagerly awaiting the Suave Faceless mod.

Suave, Sophisticated, Worldly Faceless can be accomplished just by putting a monocle and top hat on Faceless. After all, they can morph into anything more or less. Maybe it suits Chryssalids more since they're closer to xenomorphs and we can make Spaceballs jokes about them possibly.

After that:
Smug Archon (the ook on their face is irritating after they dodge a shotgun blast to their face)
Roidrage Andromedon (this guy needs the Randy the Macho Man Savage sound pack)
Max Headroom Codex

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:50

NuckmasterJ: Aug 9, 2008; Grimey Drawer

I think I just screwed up my first attempt at xcom 2. After getting my rear end kicked I used the goon advice to try to only use full cover, bring 2 Grenadiers for maximum boom booms which worked fantastic. I researched and bought mag weapons for everyone, I just got the first armour upgrade and I have a 6 man team, most of my A-Team are Majors.

The problem is I badly neglected building stuff in my ship and opted for purchasing upgrades to squad size and some of the bonuses. I built Guerrilla Tactics School and Advanced Warfare Center, then had no power for Resistance Comms. So I saved up and built a Power Relay and then got my Resistance Comms up but it seems to late. My Avatar project is at 9/10 pips and the only site I can get to is in Australia, which requires 90 Intel; I only have 30. I spent intel at the black market like an idiot. I guess Xcom strikes down another noob.

I need to not be a sissy and learn to fight with base equipment. I tried to turtle in my little corner of Asia and research all sorts of goodies and now the only person that can save earth is Will Smith, but I hear he is having a accident while testing some new planes and won't be available to save me.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:55

Soulfucker: Feb 15, 2012; i,m going to kill myself on friday #wow #whoa; Fun Shoe

The game isn't over even if the project hits 10/10 pips; you should get a grace period of around a month before the aliens win. Use this time to gather intel at your HQ and to prepare for a strike.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 22:58

Ravenfood: Nov 4, 2011

NuckmasterJ posted:

I think I just screwed up my first attempt at xcom 2. After getting my rear end kicked I used the goon advice to try to only use full cover, bring 2 Grenadiers for maximum boom booms which worked fantastic. I researched and bought mag weapons for everyone, I just got the first armour upgrade and I have a 6 man team, most of my A-Team are Majors.

The problem is I badly neglected building stuff in my ship and opted for purchasing upgrades to squad size and some of the bonuses. I built Guerrilla Tactics School and Advanced Warfare Center, then had no power for Resistance Comms. So I saved up and built a Power Relay and then got my Resistance Comms up but it seems to late. My Avatar project is at 9/10 pips and the only site I can get to is in Australia, which requires 90 Intel; I only have 30. I spent intel at the black market like an idiot. I guess Xcom strikes down another noob.

I need to not be a sissy and learn to fight with base equipment. I tried to turtle in my little corner of Asia and research all sorts of goodies and now the only person that can save earth is Will Smith, but I hear he is having a accident while testing some new planes and won't be available to save me.

You've got plenty of time. Build a radio tower in the area closest to Australia to reduce intel costs (you may need to research radios) and prioritize intel in missions rewards over basically everything else.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 23:01

Megasabin: Sep 9, 2003; I get half!!

Finished up my Iron Man/Commander run. I think this was a good game, that was ultimately disappointing because it didn't improve on the things that actually could have used the attention from the first game. The new additions they made to the game were fantastic, but they really should have focused their attention on the more overarching design flaws from the original.

The main issue with the first game was the lopsided difficulty curve, and this was not addressed in the slightest. The game still has the same problematic arc of 1. Very difficult early game that relies heavily on RNG --> 2. Amazing mid-game that is far too short --> 3. Too easy sort of boring late game victory march. In the early game your soldiers have no tactical versatility via lack of skills/items, so you need to rely on the RNG, as a few missed shots have devastating consequences. The mid game has a perfect level of tension/tactics with the amount of skill/items vs. the strength of the aliens. The only issue is that mid-game is very short, because it ends as soon you develop psionics or 3rd tier weapons/armor. Late game is just the boring victory lap as you easily 1 shot every pod. The 3 avatars at the end never got a single turn. I think this issue may have been exacerbated by me skipping proving ground and rushing psionics & plasma weapons. The mid-game probably would have been longer if I dedicated more time towards proving ground projects instead of rushing later tech. I'd like to see them address this in the next game.

There also a few overarching design decisions I don't really like, but I don't think I would count them as flaws. One being something I discussed previously, which is that this game does not simulate tactical combat in an organic way, but rather is a series of 1 off puzzles about using the correct skills to kill a pod in 1 turn without triggering another pod activation. The other being that the game is a bit too linear for me. I don't see any reason to replay this game. The general research arc is going to go the same way, the story missions are going to progress at the same rate, etc... I didn't play the original 90's Xcom, but I was under the impression it was the type of game people played over and over like Civilization, because it went so differently each time. I have 0 reason to replay this until an expansion comes out.

I think something that would be really cool to put in future games is having a Nemesis-like system. Have the bad guys have their own version of X-Com--persistent unique enemy troops that will fight you across multiple maps over the course of the campaign, and will level up as they do it. They gain nicknames based on victories they've had over you-- killing your troops, forcing a retreat, etc... You can make it difficult to kill them early game, by having them attempt to retreat via an evac zone if you wound them heavily. If you do manage to score a kill or capture one of them, you get some type of sizeable reward. The enemy AI controlling them could have their own base(s) with their own tech, and you would have to do a base assault to take it out. Maybe even have multiple competing factions with their own squads, who could not only fight you, but fight each other during missions, if more than one appears. Perhaps you could even form alliances/trade tech with some on the world map. Maybe I'm just hoping for some sort of weird amalgamation of Civ and X-Com...

# ? Feb 24, 2016 23:04

DMW45: Oct 29, 2011; Come into my parlor~
Said the spider to the fly~

Antti posted:

The game definitely needs a way to make the endgame more difficult, and escalating and compounding Dark Events would be a natural way to do it. You can make them nastier in general, lower the frequency early on and then start pressuring the player through them once they are supposed to have tier 3 poo poo and psykers.

I've seen some pretty nasty ones already, but only very rarely, like Show of Force, a dark event that makes more enemies per pod. They should start off weak, but gradually ramp up.

Have the chryssalid dark event directly replace the faceless one, etc.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 23:07

Away all Goats: Jul 5, 2005; Goose's rebellion

Soulfucker posted:

The game isn't over even if the project hits 10/10 pips; you should get a grace period of around a month before the aliens win. Use this time to gather intel at your HQ and to prepare for a strike.

I think this changes based on your difficulty level. I had 12 days on my countdown on Commander.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 23:17

Deutsch Nozzle: Mar 29, 2008; #1 Macklemore fan

Away all Goats posted:

I think this changes based on your difficulty level. I had 12 days on my countdown on Commander.

yea you get just under a month on legendary, but that's only because all of the strategy-layer durations are drastically scaled up

# ? Feb 24, 2016 23:33

Taffer: Oct 15, 2010

Megasabin posted:

Finished up my Iron Man/Commander run. I think this was a good game, that was ultimately disappointing because it didn't improve on the things that actually could have used the attention from the first game. The new additions they made to the game were fantastic, but they really should have focused their attention on the more overarching design flaws from the original.

The main issue with the first game was the lopsided difficulty curve, and this was not addressed in the slightest. The game still has the same problematic arc of 1. Very difficult early game that relies heavily on RNG --> 2. Amazing mid-game that is far too short --> 3. Too easy sort of boring late game victory march. In the early game your soldiers have no tactical versatility via lack of skills/items, so you need to rely on the RNG, as a few missed shots have devastating consequences. The mid game has a perfect level of tension/tactics with the amount of skill/items vs. the strength of the aliens. The only issue is that mid-game is very short, because it ends as soon you develop psionics or 3rd tier weapons/armor. Late game is just the boring victory lap as you easily 1 shot every pod. The 3 avatars at the end never got a single turn. I think this issue may have been exacerbated by me skipping proving ground and rushing psionics & plasma weapons. The mid-game probably would have been longer if I dedicated more time towards proving ground projects instead of rushing later tech. I'd like to see them address this in the next game.

There also a few overarching design decisions I don't really like, but I don't think I would count them as flaws. One being something I discussed previously, which is that this game does not simulate tactical combat in an organic way, but rather is a series of 1 off puzzles about using the correct skills to kill a pod in 1 turn without triggering another pod activation. The other being that the game is a bit too linear for me. I don't see any reason to replay this game. The general research arc is going to go the same way, the story missions are going to progress at the same rate, etc... I didn't play the original 90's Xcom, but I was under the impression it was the type of game people played over and over like Civilization, because it went so differently each time. I have 0 reason to replay this until an expansion comes out.

I think something that would be really cool to put in future games is having a Nemesis-like system. Have the bad guys have their own version of X-Com--persistent unique enemy troops that will fight you across multiple maps over the course of the campaign, and will level up as they do it. They gain nicknames based on victories they've had over you-- killing your troops, forcing a retreat, etc... You can make it difficult to kill them early game, by having them attempt to retreat via an evac zone if you wound them heavily. If you do manage to score a kill or capture one of them, you get some type of sizeable reward. The enemy AI controlling them could have their own base(s) with their own tech, and you would have to do a base assault to take it out. Maybe even have multiple competing factions with their own squads, who could not only fight you, but fight each other during missions, if more than one appears. Perhaps you could even form alliances/trade tech with some on the world map. Maybe I'm just hoping for some sort of weird amalgamation of Civ and X-Com...

I know it's a cliche, but mods can fix a lot of your complaints. I'm doing replays with an amalgamation of mods that's always changing, but even in this early state it smooths the power curve out a lot and retains the tension, buffing weak pointless parts of xcom while nerfing too-powerful ones, and trying to mitigate some of the more egregious strategic-layer RNG. The biggest part of this is increasing enemy pod size. Unmodded, you can usually take a gatekeeper with some minion companions, or a couple archons and a muton, etc, but big pods with multiple "boss" baddies make even the late game a huge challenge, especially when grenades are nerfed a little bit from being a "fix all problems" solution.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 23:39

Synthbuttrange: May 6, 2007

I went from barely scraping by on my first Veteran win (because I didnt complete the psi lab in a timely manner) to completely wrecking poo poo in my last Commander run. Knowing what to expect helps out a huge deal.

# ? Feb 24, 2016 23:42

NuckmasterJ: Aug 9, 2008; Grimey Drawer

Soulfucker posted:

The game isn't over even if the project hits 10/10 pips; you should get a grace period of around a month before the aliens win. Use this time to gather intel at your HQ and to prepare for a strike.

I picked the heal faster perk at HQ instead of intel because it was taking forever for my guys to heal before I got the AWC running. Is there a way to change it?

# ? Feb 25, 2016 00:25

Away all Goats: Jul 5, 2005; Goose's rebellion

NuckmasterJ posted:

I picked the heal faster perk at HQ instead of intel because it was taking forever for my guys to heal before I got the AWC running. Is there a way to change it?

Click on the left button at your HQ. It's a fist iirc

# ? Feb 25, 2016 00:28