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Windy, I keep gushing over how cute that pic is that you posted. It also helps that that bunny is like a smoother brown version of my own. alucinor posted:http://www.rabbit.org/care/bibliography.html Thanks very much!  I've been needing something that isn't a "I read it somewhere on the internet". That's not usually very convincing. Melicious posted:Honestly, even if the cancer weren't an issue, the behavioral advantages when getting them spayed are unreal. When I adopted Bowser, she HATED being held, peed everywhere, and humped everything that moved (especially our ankles.) She's now a complete cuddleslut who does not hump. She does pee everywhere again, but we attribute her worsening litterbox habits to her age. Regardless, she had a pretty solid 6 or so years of peeing only where she was supposed to. Actually, 'unfortunately', this rabbit is the cutest cuddliest most affectionate living thing I've ever seen. I've been saying they turn into little monsters when they grow up but this one is proving me wrong. Still, she's only five and a half months old, there's still time to turn into a pee spraying antisocial little jerk.
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Nov 17, 2008 19:20
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DS at Night posted:Actually, 'unfortunately', this rabbit is the cutest cuddliest most affectionate living thing I've ever seen. I've been saying they turn into little monsters when they grow up but this one is proving me wrong. Still, she's only five and a half months old, there's still time to turn into a pee spraying antisocial little jerk. Even if she stays well-mannered, the risk of cancer should be reason enough for the owner to want to spay her. I've seen numerous rabbits die of metastasized uterine cancer, it's horrible. One bunny wasted from 6lbs down to 2. She would still eat, but her bowels were affected, and she didn't get nutritional value from her food. She was also incontinent and had to have her butt cleaned daily. One developed breathing problems after the cancer reached her lungs, and within a day or two was literally gasping for air. One had the cancer affect her spinal nerves, and her motor coordination went. One showed no signs upon intake, but had such massive pustulent uterine discharge that the vet opted to euthanize her immediately. Lily Rose, the angora I posted a page or so ago, was also spayed this past week - 5-7 cancerous growths were found in the uterus. She's thin as a rail and it's now believed to be because of the cancer instead of poor husbandry. She's getting a full body CT this week to see if and where more cancer is hiding. In all of these cases, these were 5/6 year old rabbits (the one whose nerves was affected was only 3 when I got her) whom I personally rescued, and they had extensive uterine carcinomas discovered when they were spayed. In all cases, the cancer was believed to have spread out of the uterus, and later necropsy confirmed cancerous growths in various other places causing the indicated symptoms. I could be wrong and the rabbit had two unrelated cancers, but as the paper I cited indicates, it's more likely that the uterine cancer had simply spread before we discovered it. All of them (save Lily Rose, who is still with us) had to be euthanized when their pain and quality of life became too bad to manage medically, but none of them had a gentle, entirely pain-free end. None of them lived beyond 8 years, either - all could have potentially seen 11 or 12 had they been spayed before they developed the cancers.
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Nov 17, 2008 20:07
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God what a bunch of horror stories. Must be horrible to watch those cute little things waste away into nothing. Kind of weird that this kind of thing isn't more well known, or maybe it isn't that weird. After all my previous vet nearly killed my Billy by giving him regular antibiotics. I'm pretty sure I convinced her though. She's in an unexpected financial setback right now but I'm going to make sure it gets done at least in the next couple of months, I'll take her myself if I have to. I know she wants the best for this rabbit. It's just hard to have other people telling you how to take care of your own pet, easy to take personally.
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Nov 17, 2008 23:45
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More anecdotal evidence: before Zen was spayed, she hated being held, pooped everywhere, and humped everything all the time. Now she's resigned to being picked up, poops only everywhere (and I mean everywhere) in her pen, but not a poop outside the door. Oh, but she still humps everything. But the shelter handler says that's just her being the uber-dominant bitch she is. <3
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Nov 18, 2008 01:25
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It's been a while since I've posted any pics, and this was just too cute: I love her tail sticking through the cage . Since I've moved into my dad's place, they seem to have developed a co-dominant relationship. Nobody mounts, both groom about as often, both eat at the same time. It's quite odd, It's rarer to catch Ben grooming on camera though because generally the sound of the lens extending makes him look up and stop what he's doing. Annie launched her way into the hay box, through the blocker box:  She was having a wonderful time. I've also got a vid uploading right now of her playing on my bed, trying to flatten it .
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Nov 20, 2008 18:25
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Those pictures are adorable! To keep with the cuteness trend, here's one of Houdini... He hopped into my lap and started chomping away on my pajamas. 
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Nov 20, 2008 19:14
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Buster and Thomas decided to "help" me with some sewing the other day. My camera's old and slow so I missed most of the cutest pics...  
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Nov 20, 2008 20:41
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 Not quite as cute, but I like the look on my cat's face, "gross, you're letting that lick you."  Melty bunny.  And Mr. Mocha Boo
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Nov 20, 2008 23:23
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I love that coloring that Mocha has. I think it's one of the best coat colors ever
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Nov 21, 2008 20:44
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Bobblehead Biddy posted:
I've tried a few different carriers, and found that the ones with a little seatbelt slot at the top work best in the car. My bun Pompom just got neutered last week (hooray), and the vet was surprised at how excited he was to get into his crate. A towel at the bottom, a handful of hay, a carrot or some leafy greens, are definitely good for long rides. I also stop to give him little bowls of water, and pet him, but that's only because I'm a slave to cuteness. He's the best copilot. edit for cute: 
rushivywithglocks fucked around with this message at 01:26 on Nov 22, 2008 |
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Nov 22, 2008 00:43
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Okay, the year's first snow fell in the Netherlands and I thought I'd give my snowman a pet.  Not much of a likeness is there?  And not wanting to be outdone on the cute pics department here's my friend's new bunny: 
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Nov 23, 2008 22:29
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so I've now been at VCA for 4 hours. I woke up and annie was hiding in an odd place and not wanting to move. She didn't even respond to vegetables. Initially she wasn't responding to the removal tube and so she had to be sedated. Now she's slowly waking back up and they're trying to normalize her temp. Then I'm takng her to emergency care for overnight monitoring. It's going to be at least $800-900 by the end of this. Suddenly the cost of a furminator doesn't seem so bad, although the doc said she found some weird grainy stuff in there too. Most likely she'll survive but the vet said we're not out of the woods yet. God what a morning. UPDATE: Finally home now, Annie is at the overnight emergency clinic. The VCA bill was 706, the minimum overnight bill is 307, that's if they don't have to decompress her stomach again or do any xrays or whatnot. Then there's a whole 'nother day of fees tomorrow when I take her back to VCA. I'm just waving goodbye to what's left of my college savings by this point. It told me how much I care about her though, when they mentioned the cost, my worry wasn't if she was worth it, my worry was just how long it would take me to pay for it. Finding the weird "gritty" stuff in her stomach bothers me. A possibly vindictive EX was over friday and saturday, and suddenly a fine bunny becomes an emergency disaster. The vet didn't even know what the gritty stuff was.... Plus I have to wake up at 5:30 to transfer her from the overnight clinic back to VCA tomorrow. I miss my bunny.  UPDATE, 3 AM: received a call from the overnight clinic informing me that her kidneys have not started yet, nor has she eaten on her own and she cannot poop. Thank you. I'm going to sleep great now. If her kidneys don't start by the end of Monday it basically will be hopeless. If for nothn else, at least let this post remind everyone that everything Alucinor said is true. I hope she pulls through. Deceptor101 fucked around with this message at 12:08 on Nov 24, 2008 |
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Nov 23, 2008 23:43
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Poor Annie. Mocha and Creme send their best wishes.
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Nov 25, 2008 00:26
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Sorry to hear about Annie, Deceptor This happened a couple months back but it was the most intense grooming session I'd ever seen Lola give Mr. B   And these youtubes are pretty old (the first was when we first got Mr. B and before we bonded him and Lola) but I think they're great. Mr. B had an EC problem before we adopted him and you can sort of tell in the first video...but he tries! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKxlaUjl-5Q http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH82dIUe4cA
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Nov 25, 2008 09:11
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Ok UPDATE! Just got back from dropping Annie off at day 3 of vet care and she has made a dramatic improvement overnight. She's eating, pooping, peeing, moving around sniffing things, oh god it's wonderful. Yesterday the doctor had given her a pain suppressant which can sometimes cause miracle recoveries, but can also sometimes stifle the kidneys, which is exactly what we didn't want to do. They're going to run bloodwork today to see if her kidneys have indeed improved, but the doctor was THRILLED at how much better Annie looked. One interesting thing is she recommended I almost entirely cut pellets out of their diet. Right now I only give them a small handful once or twice a week, which hardly even seems like it can be counted as part of their diet. She still isn't sure what and where the white gritty stuff came from, but from now on I'll be giving Annie some laxitone or something 2-3 times a week. I'm so relieved, thinking that this morning I could have picked her up, and have spent the same $1600, and they'd be recommending putting her down was just overwhelming and I had trouble sleeping. I'll post some pics of Ben and Annie re-united tonight!
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Nov 25, 2008 18:11
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That's fantastic. I'm so glad to hear there was a happy ending!
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Nov 25, 2008 18:25
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does anyone know a general price range for how much it costs to get a bunny spayed?
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Nov 26, 2008 01:48
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Wrath of Zidane posted:does anyone know a general price range for how much it costs to get a bunny spayed? As far as I'm able to tell, it depends on your vet, city and country. People have quoted < $100, including pain meds, to anywhere up to and including $300. For me, it was $120 canadian, including medication from my vet. I also adopted a male rabbit from the SPCA for $50, neuter included. Just be sure your vet knows how to handle exotics like rabbits - even if you have to pay more. Price does not necessarily equal quality, but with finicky creatures like bunnies you don't want to take chances with a less experienced vet.
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Nov 26, 2008 02:19
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Bagleworm posted:As far as I'm able to tell, it depends on your vet, city and country. People have quoted < $100, including pain meds, to anywhere up to and including $300. For me, it was $120 canadian, including medication from my vet. I also adopted a male rabbit from the SPCA for $50, neuter included. I feel like I've commented this before, but I'm not sure if my cost was me being ripped off or a product of being in Manhattan, but Zen getting spayed, including the meds, and not an overnight stay, was in the neighborhood of $500.
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Nov 26, 2008 03:06
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Ok Annie is home, acting perfectly normal, and of course that means, refusing to take her medication. Anyone have any recommendations for how to best do this? I can't soak pellets in it because shes not allowed to have pellets... I've heard if you can manage to get the syringe in her mouth she'll swallow, but I'm handling her kind of like fine china right now. Tips would be greatly appreciated. Oh and Ben of course was very glad to see her:  Well, eventually, Kind of:  They're both acting like she was never gone, the only real way you can tell that it ever happened is that my credit card is near maxed out, Annie is missing some hair on her right paw where they put the catheter/IV and Annie spent a good 20 minutes grooming herself, possibly thinking "Why on earth haven't I cleaned myself sooner?" E: I read on rabbit.org that mixing the medicine with banana or apple sauce or something can work, and it did. However since banana isn't really absorbent I'm not sure she got a full dose, tomorrow I'll switch to applesauce as that will mix better. Deceptor101 fucked around with this message at 05:41 on Nov 26, 2008 |
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Nov 26, 2008 04:39
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Yaaay! This is the happiest end that it could be. I'm so happy for you.  Should she be getting something that starchy though? Cuz it sounds like that may be the reason she's going on a no-pellet diet.
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Nov 26, 2008 07:06
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One other option is to draw up the dose, then draw up an equal amount of apple juice. She may then just take the syringe without issue. If the applesauce/juice doesn't work, I wouldn't worry about handling her a little more roughly. If you do it right, the amount of restraint necessary is less than she'd experience at the vet during a basic PE. My trick for getting meds into rabbits is to put them on a towel on a table or counter, with the biting end close to the edge. Have someone else restrain her there, typically by petting her till she's flat, then gently rest their hands on her shoulders and hips. If she moves, she'll feel the hands and press downwards again to get away from them. Then you crouch down so you can see her mouth, and then jab the syringe in. If you have to, you can use your free hand to control her head which she will inevitably try to turn away as the syringe touches her whiskers and lips. I know I sound like I put my rabbits in a headlock and pry their mouths open, but mostly you PLAN to be rough with them, but you'll then find that your hands are used to guide rather than actually restrain. When I say "control her head", what usually happens is, I cup my left hand around the top of the forehead, with my fingers barely touching her right jaw. If she tries to turn right or go up, my hand is there and she'll turn away; if she tries to turn left, my right hand is there with the syringe. There's no actual pressure or grabbing involved, but it pisses her off, and the next thing she does is bite the syringe, and we're good.
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Nov 26, 2008 15:26
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alucinor posted:1. Where is his hay? Hay is absolutely, unarguably essential. If you can't or won't feed hay, he'll die a painful young death, and you should rehome him ASAP. I disagree. My gf has been raising rabbits for show for 18 years and a quality pellet (16-17% protein) is what she feeds daily. Due to lack of proper storage, she isn't able to keep hay around regularly. As long as you have a good pellet with a min fiber of 17% you don't need to give your rabbit hay all the time. Good rabbit feeds are Purina, Heinhold, Manna Pro, Kent, Buckeye, etc. which can be found at farm supply stores, grain elevators, and some pet food stores. This is from http://rabbit.purinamills.com/ "When rabbits are fed a high fiber complete pellet, the feeding of supplement hay is not a requirement. The rabbit’s diet should contain a proper fiber level to ensure a healthy digestive tract." Purina does a lot of research on rabbit nutrition and management! But, yes of course if your rabbit pellet does not have the proper amount of fiber, you do have to supplement with hay or veggies. But a good pellet is all a rabbit requires (and regular probiotics for safe measure), everything else is icing on the carrot cake.
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Nov 26, 2008 17:04
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galahan posted:I disagree. My gf has been raising rabbits for show for 18 years and a quality pellet (16-17% protein) is what she feeds daily. Due to lack of proper storage, she isn't able to keep hay around regularly. I was expecting this to come up sooner. I understand that a pellet-only diet may be the easiest and cheapest alternative for a breeder, but I respectfully disagree with the overall validity of your statements as they apply to optimal rabbit health, and feel that your advocating a hay-free diet is detrimental to the health of the pet rabbits owned on a small scale by people who will read this thread. I will address just a few of the issues you raise: 1. Purina is a pellet manufacturer, the research they do is intended to bolster their claim that pellets are the only necessary nutrition. Pellets were developed as a cheap, economical, and calorie-dense food in order to get meat and lab rabbits up to slaughter weight more quickly. They were never designed for promoting long-term gut health in an animal that was expected to live a decade or more. 2. Vets, scientists, and rabbit rescuers have done a lot of research too, and all of their claims argue that long strand fiber - only found in raw hay, not in compressed hay cakes or in manufactured pellets - are the ideal diet for proper gut function and optimal long-term health. The preponderance of research suggests that pelleted diets with small particle fiber are more likely to lead to enteritis, and that the beneficial properties of the fiber are reduced. 3. With regard to the minimum fiber content of the diet: the Textbook of Rabbit Medicine states that for meat or production line rabbits, where rapid growth is needed, the diet should contain 10-15% minimum fiber. However, for pet rabbits, the ranges given are higher, with the upper limits ranging from 20-24%. 4. Purina's highest-fiber pellet, Fiber-3, contains a max of 25% crude fiber. It also contains carbs like Cane Molasses and Dried Distillers Grains, which are detrimental to a hindgut fermenter like a rabbit. In contrast, commonly recommended grass hays contain around 30% fiber (orchard and timothy) with no added carbs. Hay is therefore an easier way to provide the needed fiber requirements. 5. Every one of Purina's rabbit chows contains only alfalfa hay. Alfalfa is not a grass hay, it is a legume, and it is unique among hays in that it is: "higher than most hays in calcium and protein and can, when fed in conjunction with high-calcium feed, cause dangerously high levels of calcium in the system. On a dry weight analysis (more accurate than straight percentages), alfalfa comes out among the highest in calcium content, and lower than most grass hays in fiber." [rabbit.org] There is also evidence that an alfalfa based diet interferes with free phosphorus in the hindgut, leading to rickets, osteomalacia, and bone density issues. So while a higher calcium content may be necessary for a breeding program where the rabbit is using her available calcium to produce milk and fetuses, there is too much evidence that it is detrimental to pet rabbits who do not have these requirements. I did not yet research the other feeds you mention, but I would not recommend any alfalfa-based hay. Instead, if pellets are to be included in the diet, we recommend grass-hay based pellets such as Oxbow Bunny Basic T or Kaytee Timothy Complete. All of this evidence explains the recommendation which I constantly make, which is also that of the House Rabbit Society: for pet rabbits, who are intended to live an optimal lifespan of 8-12 years, a higher amount of fiber, in the form of free-feed, long strand hay, is the optimal diet. Pellets are just not an acceptable substitute unless you are willing to compromise your rabbit's health and longevity. Edit: apparently I love the word optimal today. alucinor fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Nov 26, 2008 |
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Nov 26, 2008 19:42
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Oh and you forgot that nice stemmy hay is great for keeping long teeth in check. On a pure pellet diet you'd either have to give lots and lots of wood chew toys or get dental work done from a vet.
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Nov 27, 2008 07:43
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Don't forget how having hay around is a huge help in litter training your rabbit.
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Nov 27, 2008 08:30
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galahan posted:I disagree. My gf has been raising rabbits for show for 18 years and a quality pellet (16-17% protein) is what she feeds daily. As a rabbit person, I've wanted to post and join in more bunny related stuff, but...this. Since it's come up though, I hope it's alright for me to throw in my opinion. In my opinion, there is no one right way to feed rabbits and I'm hesitant to trust any person or group who says otherwise. There are benefits to both of the diets you generally see promoted: a mostly pellet diet, and a mostly veggie diet. I've seen rabbits do well on both, and live long healthy lives on both. I would hope that a new rabbit owner would research both diets and decide what works best for them and their bun, and go from there. I've also known people who do not feed hay at all, ever, period, never have and never will...and they have long-lived buns and little to no issues with digestive health. Purely anecdotal, I know, but talking with several dozen people who've had rabbits longer than I've been alive has convinced me such a thing is possible, if not ideal in everyone's mind. For the record, my buns get a generous handful of grass hay every day, in addition to their pellets. On the topic of hay, it's generally accepted among breeders that you do not feed alfalfa hay with an alfalfa-based pellet, due to the combined amount of protein and calcium. I don't personally know a single breeder who feeds anything other than grass hay.
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Nov 27, 2008 11:52
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We're moving from the Denver to Detroit area in a few weeks and I'm trying to work out the logistics of bringing along our six little ones. The cats have made the trip before, so I'm not so worried about them, but we've never taken the bunnies or guinea pigs very far. I'm guessing you'd put the bunnies in the same carrier so they can comfort each other. I'm not so sure about the guinea pigs, they live together, but sometimes they get in quarrels with nipping, though I've never noticed any wounds. Any general advice on rabbit and guinea pig long distance transport would be greatly appreciated. (Sorry for sneaking the piggies into a rabbit only thread)
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Nov 28, 2008 16:23
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Baitu posted:We're moving from the Denver to Detroit area in a few weeks and I'm trying to work out the logistics of bringing along our six little ones. I had to move a truckload of pigs and rabbits from NC to WI, so I feel your pain. If the pigs quarrel, unless you can provide large enough carriers (something 1'x2' or larger, like a tiny petstore cage), it's definitely best to separate them. If you have a rabbit/GP rescue near you, we always have tons of those tiny cages laying around, so you might be able to get a bunch for free in exchange for a small donation and the assurance that you're only using them as transports. You may have some re-introduction issues when you put them back together, that's normal. I didn't bother putting pigloos in my carriers, just draped towels over the whole thing. I also used towels instead of bedding, and just changed the towels nightly, using big trash bags for both the clean and dirty. For the bunnies, I used very large carriers - big enough for the pair and a small rectangular litterbox. For both, I bought a bunch of these to use as hay mangers. They fit well into the holes on most carriers. You can also just drop the hay in loose if you prefer. I didn't leave the water bottles on all the time, only at night and during rest stops - instead I gave a lot of cucumber and melon and other very wet veggies. Traveling in the winter, you don't have to worry about heat stroke, so you're good there. My only other recommendation would be to plan your nightly stops, and find an exotics vet within an hour of each stop (preferably a 24h emergency service) just in case you see problems. Better to do a ton of planning and not need it, than to end up frantically searching a strange town at 3am. Good luck!
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Nov 30, 2008 16:24
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 His and Hers doors for the box . It's just one big box obviously, but they both like to have their head sticking out.Question: Annie has nearly forgotten (well I assume it's her) litter box training. Poop is all over the cage (well sized and formed thankfully) but she pees just outside the litterboxes. I've even seen her jump in them and hang around and eat hay, but then I come back and there's pee right outside it, a huge steaming smelly pool. To be quite honest, both she and ben knew when I got them so I have no idea how to re-teach her. tips?
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Dec 1, 2008 06:20
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Help, my bunny's god drat retarded and won't stop eating my pillows/carpet/curtains. Obviously I can afford new pillows but I'm worried he'll give himself some kind of lethal indigestion by means of a blockage. Because he doesn't just chew, he ingests everything he manages to get near. How to make him stop? I've tried rubbing gross things on them but that doesn't deter him one bit. I haven't tried tabasco yet...
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Dec 1, 2008 10:04
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xx
Hana Dammit fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Feb 16, 2017 |
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Dec 1, 2008 12:09
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I'm so sorry to hear that Hana...I just took mine on a 6 hour car ride and I would be very sad if this had happened. Hopefully the necropsy can shed some light on the situation.
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Dec 2, 2008 00:46
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I'm sorry to hear about your bunny Hana Dammit, he looked like a dear friend.
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Dec 2, 2008 04:12
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Dude, that rabbit sounds more awesome than most people's dogs. A small consolation: finally got some shots of Mo and Cowslip that suck less than usual (drat fast camera shy rabbits)! They were not happy that I was bothering them so soon after treat time and before bedtime.  Click here for the full 800x600 image. GAH EVIL FLASH!  Click here for the full 800x600 image. Very blurry shot of Cowslip's awesomely colored eyes. Working on a new cage for them, but the ones I've tried to build Cowslips knocks down asap, even with a thousand zip ties, and he, for some reason, likes this four story ex-chincilla cage. Mo's about the perfect fit for it, Cowslip, not so much.
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Dec 2, 2008 16:42
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I think we've talked about this before, how would people rate Zupreem compared to Oxbow? We had a sample from the first time we visited the vets and Mocha approved. A friend works in a pet store in Michigan and they can't get Oxbow. Since Oxbow wont sell directly to the common man anymore, I'd rather support a good local store. We currently have a good stock of Oxbow (both pellets and hay), so we'll be able to transition them slowly if we change.
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Dec 4, 2008 03:54
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I mostly lurk here, but I thought I should share some pictures of my Oliver. He's a Holland Lop and has been the (almost) perfect pet for a small Brooklyn apartment. He does not like being picked up, but he will sometimes let us pat him... if we're lucky. Or holding treats  Here he is hiding (and pooping) under our bed:  He really likes to climb on things. He doesn't always know what to do once he's conquered something, but he does know that he likes to go up! Here he is on top of a footrest we usually store in the corner of the room. This is before he figured out that he was "trapped" on top of it.  (Don't worry, the wire isn't usually there, and we do watch him carefully when he's out anyway. Finally, here he is posing for the camera. He loves attention! 
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Dec 6, 2008 01:09
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TravBot posted:Eeee, widdle bunny paws. I love watching bunnies wash their faces. Oh, all three of my buns shake out their paws (I call it "whipping out the paws") before they wash their face. I had never heard of it before, do any of the goon bunnies here do it too?
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Dec 6, 2008 01:22
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Oh yeah Annie and Ben do the paw shake before grooming or washing or anything. It's like a little spasm of cuteness! (that IS a good thing)
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Dec 6, 2008 01:36
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Yeah, Oliver does the paw shake too, pretty much any time he goes to clean his face. I think he must be shaking the muck off his feet (as though he would ever step in muck!) He also always licks his paws after he scratches himself, which I can't quite explain. My favorite, though, is when he cleans his ears. He can just get the end to his mouth, so he can clean it directly! Way too cute Edit: More picture.  TravBot fucked around with this message at 03:18 on Dec 6, 2008 |
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Dec 6, 2008 03:09
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