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Magni posted:T6 was easy. The Bayern is a bloody mosnter that can go toe to toe with a New Mex while being faster and having a way stronger secondary battery to mulch up destroyers. It's at Rank 15 that the suffering begins. Bayern owns. Regularly cit the New Mexico (normally 12-15k range) and occasionally the fuso.
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Oct 9, 2016 10:48
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Not saying the Warspite is definately a better ship (although I think it edges it) but I can say for sure its more fun.
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Oct 9, 2016 11:16
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NTRabbit posted:Pretty much this I'm so shocked that I'm actually agreeing with a stupid pubbie.
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Oct 9, 2016 14:38
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What captain skill builds do you guys like on the Atago? I finally picked one up and have been seriously enjoying it. Having a hard time picking a T4 skill though. Fire chance is already really high on the HE shells, so DE is pretty useless. I guess ti comes down to either manual AA or AFT, both of which seem really lackluster considering how anemic your AA is to start with.
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Oct 9, 2016 16:03
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Hazdoc posted:The ribbon system is a little hosed sometimes. A pen to a module will give a penetrating hit, but deal no damage (like, you penned a secondary or something and it eats the damage). On the flip side, you can overpen a torpedo bulge on a plunging shell into the water and for some reason it'll bounce into the ship for a normal pen. Its loving voodoo magicks. I should have guessed. These are some of the same programmers behind World of Tanks, where you could put a 30lb shell through a drivers hatch and somehow his body would absorb 100% of the damage and the tank was otherwise unharmed.
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Oct 9, 2016 16:09
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Lakedaimon posted:I should have guessed. These are some of the same programmers behind World of Tanks, where you could put a 30lb shell through a drivers hatch and somehow his body would absorb 100% of the damage and the tank was otherwise unharmed. As a former military tank driver, I can confirm this is 100% the case. And I know some drivers who would be improved by the experience. Gwaihir posted:What captain skill builds do you guys like on the Atago? I finally picked one up and have been seriously enjoying it. Having a hard time picking a T4 skill though. Fire chance is already really high on the HE shells, so DE is pretty useless. I guess ti comes down to either manual AA or AFT, both of which seem really lackluster considering how anemic your AA is to start with. I still think picking up DE is the right call. Your fire chance is already high, but it pumps it up even higher. If you're playing against BBs in the stealth role (waiting outside detection range, lobbing rounds on them when they shoot at something else, then restealthing before they can turn and fire on you) then you want the maximum possible fire chance. It might only add a small relative improvement, but you're going for those tiny gains that give you an edge over the other team. Catching CVs in Ranked is really rare, and you're really better off putting those points into something you'll use reliably.
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Oct 9, 2016 16:25
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Jesus the Atago owns super hard. Fantastic guns that do a fuckton of HE or AP damage (8k salvos against BBs np), fast heavy damage torps with great arcs, speed, *repairs*, and good armor. Anemic AA is about the only complaint you can level against it, but who cares with how rare CVs are. First blood was one of my torps detonating a Pensacola named "Freekill1234." Name was super accurate. 
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Oct 9, 2016 17:13
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kaesarsosei posted:Not saying the Warspite is definately a better ship (although I think it edges it) but I can say for sure its more fun. Far as I can tell, literally the only advantage the Warspite has over the Bayern is a somewhat tighter turning radius. In all aspects the Bayern is either even (same guns and rudder shift time) or superior (most everything else). It doesn't get a spotting plane like Warspite, but its base range is higher to compensate. I mean, I still love the old lady, but as it stands the Bayern just does all the same things and more. Although I kinda agree on the Warspite being more fun, mainly because doing well in it feels better because it's not so blatantly OP.
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Oct 9, 2016 17:24
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It'll stay that way when the RN battleship tree is released, because the Revenge class battleships they put at tier 6 won't match Bayern either
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Oct 9, 2016 17:44
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Nordick posted:Far as I can tell, literally the only advantage the Warspite has over the Bayern is a somewhat tighter turning radius. In all aspects the Bayern is either even (same guns and rudder shift time) or superior (most everything else). It doesn't get a spotting plane like Warspite, but its base range is higher to compensate. Without any evidence of this, because I rely on theory crafting of others, but owning both ships, I feel like Warspite shell dispersion and gun accuracy is significantly better than Bayren. That being said, I "enjoy" Bayren far more. Partially because I like brawling in my battleships and I love German secondaries, and partially because Warspite's turret traverse is so terrible it seriously impacts how "fun" the ship is for me. Edit IJN Cruisers Goons, help me with these I know I am playing them wrong. I am always getting myself killed trying to get them in torpedo range of the other team. Thus, I know I must be doing it wrong. What is the right way to play this line? ZombieLenin fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Oct 9, 2016 |
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Oct 9, 2016 18:12
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ZombieLenin posted:Without any evidence of this, because I rely on theory crafting of others, but owning both ships, I feel like Warspite shell dispersion and gun accuracy is significantly better than Bayren. Don't go into torp range just to get into torp range. Torps are a defensive or SUICIDE rushing tool on cruisers. Not another weapon to try and use all the time. Once you get access to the 10km torps, they can be used to slow advances and fire into smoke clouds, too, but that's at later tiers. Stick at range. With the CLs up to the Kuma, you want to be at moderate range, drenching everything with HE and getting the gently caress out and concealed if you start taking fire from a BB or multiple CAs. The Tenryuu and Kuma are giant destroyers, not burly brawlers. Their torps are for corner ganks or suiciding on somebody. The Furutaka and Aoba are squishy with fairly meh arcs. Their 203mm guns, however, are the biggest for CAs at their tiers, so you want to sling some AP along with that HE to punish broadside CAs or deal more damage to BBs once they're burning. Keep moving and be wary of BB fire, as IJN citadels aren't terribly hard to hit, especially with the thinner armor of these 2 ships. The Myoko begins the "armored" IJN CA playstyle, with lots of 203mm guns that shoot ridiculous HE and laser accurate AP. Harass and be stealthy. You want to light things up, and then AP poo poo that starts to turn when it realizes its being slammed with HE. Your 10km torps can be used on BBs that are going bow on at 12km, so long as they don't stop, they will boat into the end of the torp's range and potentially take one or two. Your armor exists, but you MUST be angled, and it works better the sharper the angle. You can definitely bounce CA shells, though, and you shouldn't be afraid to brawl the RUS or US CAs. Just be aware that you'll need to turn away to bring torpedoes to bear, though. You are not a German CA. Don't brawl German CAs, they will gently caress you up and you won't even get a citadel to console yourself, and they have better torp arcs and vastly superior sonar too. At high tiers, IJN CAs require stealth builds. Basics of Survivabiliy 1, Expert Marksmen 2, Vigilance 3, Demolition Expert 4, Concealment Expert 5. Hazdoc fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Oct 9, 2016 |
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Oct 9, 2016 18:30
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How do Japanese cruisers compare to US cruisers at higher tiers? I really want to mess with Aircraft Carriers' day but i remember the pensacola being a gigantic disappointment about a year ago compared to the Myoko and even the Cleveland, does it get better afterwards? I never saw the New Orleans so i have no idea.
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Oct 9, 2016 18:52
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Flagellum posted:Main gun accuracy and rudder shift. It's one of the best ships in this game imo. You won't have problem adjusting to it if you liked fuso. Huh that surprised me. For IJN BBs I've usually gone Main Gun Arm+Accuracy and then both damage controls
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Oct 9, 2016 19:22
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Polyakov posted:How do Japanese cruisers compare to US cruisers at higher tiers? I really want to mess with Aircraft Carriers' day but i remember the pensacola being a gigantic disappointment about a year ago compared to the Myoko and even the Cleveland, does it get better afterwards? I never saw the New Orleans so i have no idea. US CAs at high tiers aren't terribly good. They have RADAR, which is nice, but no torpedoes means they can't really brawl (which would be great because they have decent armor, good turret traverse, and high normalization shells), and low shell speed makes hitting targets at range difficult, especially evasive ones. They excel at medium range, and are best used in conjunction with their AA to screen or their RADAR to blow through smoke walls and ferret out DDs. The Des Moines at 10 gets a gimmick, DD level fire rate on its 203mm guns.
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Oct 9, 2016 19:48
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Hazdoc posted:US CAs at high tiers aren't terribly good. They have RADAR, which is nice, but no torpedoes means they can't really brawl (which would be great because they have decent armor, good turret traverse, and high normalization shells), and low shell speed makes hitting targets at range difficult, especially evasive ones. They excel at medium range, and are best used in conjunction with their AA to screen or their RADAR to blow through smoke walls and ferret out DDs. The Des Moines at 10 gets a gimmick, DD level fire rate on its 203mm guns. Fair, how do Japanese or indeed German/Russian cruisers rate for clowning on planes?
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Oct 9, 2016 20:13
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Polyakov posted:Fair, how do Japanese or indeed German/Russian cruisers rate for clowning on planes? From my experience all German AA, including cruiser AA is insane.
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Oct 9, 2016 21:07
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I'm a total rear end in a top hat. In both boats and tanks if I'm one of the two tier 8's on my team in a tier 10 match, I will just drive straight until I die.
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Oct 9, 2016 21:57
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The highest tier Russian cruisers get some strong post-war AA suites, but they dont get any defensive fighters. They also tend to be kinda large, easily spotted, and have a big turning radius, so in turn they are also slightly more vulnerable to torpedo bombers. But they also get long range (short duration) radar which is nice. The Japanese generally have the weakest AA gun coverage, although the Zao is pretty adequately armed.
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Oct 9, 2016 22:03
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Nordick posted:Far as I can tell, literally the only advantage the Warspite has over the Bayern is a somewhat tighter turning radius. In all aspects the Bayern is either even (same guns and rudder shift time) or superior (most everything else). It doesn't get a spotting plane like Warspite, but its base range is higher to compensate. These are all things I held to be true as well but the Warspites main guns have an intangible better quality to them. I played through the Bayern very recently and bought the Warspite fairly shortly after unlocking Bismarck so its easy for me to compare my experience in them. I would discount the Fuso stats as I last played it over a year ago. Similar with the New Mexico.  In game I regularly see salvos from the Warspite that I was expecting to get those lovely 1k hits or maybe a 4k pen land for an 8k salvo. The arcs are similar but the Warspite dispersion feels much tighter.
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Oct 9, 2016 23:03
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I managed to cit NC with Eugen at 14 km!
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Oct 9, 2016 23:28
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The Warspite has great sigma dispersion (vertical) and its horizontal dispersion is not at all bad either, so I don't think it's intangible. Very accurate ship.
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Oct 10, 2016 00:33
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The Warspite having good guns is good news to me, because the dispersion, the turret traverse and the speed were what I hated about the Bayern. I feel like I tend to play on instinct and reaction rather than sticking to two or three general paths through a map. I tend to realize stuff happening on the map later than some people  , and need to be able to get to locations in a short amount of time with as much firepower as I can. That's why I like Tier VII German BBs, as they fix the speed and have torpedoes, while the Fusou at the equivalent tier makes up for speed with more and different guns. (I also hated what I tried of the slow US BBs back in beta)I'm a little nervous about advancing to the Nagato because I feel like I might end up being one of those bads who will suck in it and hate it despite it being commonly lauded as one of the best boats. I'm hopeful and excited for the Amagi and possible British battlecruisers though! Sidesaddle Cavalry fucked around with this message at 01:14 on Oct 10, 2016 |
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Oct 10, 2016 01:11
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If you hated the turret traverse on the Bayern and are looking at the Warspite I've got bad news for you...
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Oct 10, 2016 01:34
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SkySteak posted:Huh that surprised me. For IJN BBs I've usually gone Main Gun Arm+Accuracy and then both damage controls IJN BBs are actually fast and maneuverable enough to dodge incoming torps. Also first rank 5 queue:  
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Oct 10, 2016 01:37
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What's the generally accepted skills for a US BB captain? I'm about to redistribute him.; He'll be at 12 and in the Colorado soon.
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Oct 10, 2016 01:47
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Insert name here posted:If you hated the turret traverse on the Bayern and are looking at the Warspite I've got bad news for you... Yeah that makes me less happy but at least I might be able to land a shell or two on things during an initial exchange at 15km instead of bracketing. atsf illustrated a little bit of that really well in his how-to I just hope that trait transfers over to a proposed non-premium BB line as well
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Oct 10, 2016 02:03
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DiHK posted:What's the generally accepted skills for a US BB captain? I'm about to redistribute him.; He'll be at 12 and in the Colorado soon. BOS, Expert Marksman (I've read that fire prevention actually only reduces fire chance by 1% or so instead of 7 otherwise I'd go with it), Superintendent or Vigilance depending on playstyle (I strongly prefer having the extra Repair Party on most ships. Even on brawlers like the Scharnhorst, anticipation is way more important than seeing the actual torps sooner). At tier 4, AFT or Manual AA. Manual AA is great for US BBs, but I usually take AFT anyway. Tier 5, meh. I don't think any of them are hugely important. You can skip them and grab Manual AA and AFT from tier 4 to become a floating Death Star if you want.
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Oct 10, 2016 02:19
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The thing that makes Fire Prevention garbage is that it's multiplicative so for example the Atago's guns go from 17% fire chance to 15.8%.Vengarr posted:Tier 5, meh. I don't think any of them are hugely important. You can skip them and grab Manual AA and AFT from tier 4 to become a floating Death Star if you want.
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Oct 10, 2016 02:46
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Vengarr posted:...I strongly prefer having the extra Repair Party on most ships... I find that I generally don't use the extra Repair Party unless I'm taking Repair Party II. The really long cooldown on it makes it difficult to use (at least at ships of the tier that I'm floating), and it's hard for me to feel like I really got something out of it. When it does it makes the difference, but it feels like an edge case.
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Oct 10, 2016 03:25
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loving hell I hate the dispersion on the kaiser's guns, I'm less than 2km from the target and I'm still hitting the water and the sky with the same salvo.
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Oct 10, 2016 03:28
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Yorck acquired. This is the one that should fire HE most of the time, yes?
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Oct 10, 2016 03:52
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Sperglord Actual posted:Yorck acquired. This is the one that should fire HE most of the time, yes? Yeah, unless you're below ~10km.
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Oct 10, 2016 04:33
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Sperglord Actual posted:Yorck acquired. This is the one that should fire HE most of the time, yes?  Don't forget to use your torpedoes.
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Oct 10, 2016 05:12
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The torpedo arcs are pretty good.
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Oct 10, 2016 07:31
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Got 300 matches in the Warspite and absolutely love that ship, the Bayern is flat out superior though. Guns are very reliable damage dealers (less overpens) and have better range, and armor is a different league altogether. The only difference that matters though is that Warspite is a gorgeous boat while the Bayern is ugly as gently caress.
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Oct 10, 2016 10:44
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Incorrect. All that matters is the white ensign.
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Oct 10, 2016 12:01
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nodm posted:the Bayern is ugly as gently caress. I will cut you. <  >
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Oct 10, 2016 14:05
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So I'm getting back into this game, got a few tier 3 and 4 boats and a tier 5 destroyer. How bad an idea is it to just throw some money away and buy a tier 6 boat for some ranked battle suffering?
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Oct 10, 2016 14:21
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Not the greatest, because the T6 Ranked only goes up to rank 15. (It's also not very bad at all, I had a total of 1 loss all the way to 15 playing the New Mexico. As soon as you hit 15 though and it shifts to T8, that's when the real shitters playing map border hugging BBs come out).
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Oct 10, 2016 14:29
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Magni posted:I will cut you. < Eh, the WWI era historical look is fine. The fictional WW2 rebuild, which youŽll be looking at 90% of the time, just looks all sorts of wrong to me, a few bits and bobs from the Tirpitz and Gneisenau (both stunning ships) randomly rearranged.
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Oct 10, 2016 14:30
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