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Pick posted:Also I don't care if they don't have the NSA's ability to sort through literally all my info and every second of recording; there's no guarantee that someday they won't. Confident my company won't be able and willing to try to blackmail me in ten years? People are absurdly careless with their rapidly-degrading privacy rights. Or that they'll secure that data in a meaningful way and it won't get hacked by any idiot who wants it for whatever reason.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:40
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WampaLord posted:Are we arguing about the concept of spying in general or just this one dude's situation? Because my answer changes depending on that. Then the phone shouldn't need those capabilities
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Feb 11, 2017 19:40
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Improbable Lobster posted:Then the phone shouldn't need those capabilities The phone doesn't! THE APP DOES! It's an app that can control the mic while it is running, that's all!
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Feb 11, 2017 19:41
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I'd put it in a small Faraday cage when not at work if I was OP.WampaLord posted:The phone doesn't! THE APP DOES! OK so if they don't need it to listen to you then why do they need mic privileges at all? Why have the app if not for the purpose of being able to use it?
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Feb 11, 2017 19:42
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WampaLord posted:Are we arguing about the concept of spying in general or just this one dude's situation? Because my answer changes depending on that.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:42
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Holy poo poo you all have seen too many movies.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:43
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WampaLord posted:Holy poo poo you all have seen too many movies. I mean someone literally just cited an actual court case in real life where such a capability was used by a nefarious person to spy on children in their bedrooms. Literally that happened.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:44
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Moridin920 posted:Or that they'll secure that data in a meaningful way and it won't get hacked by any idiot who wants it for whatever reason. How does that protect me from the company misusing it?
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Feb 11, 2017 19:44
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WampaLord posted:Holy poo poo you all have seen too many movies. They have literally no reason to request mic privileges. If they aren't going to use them then they don't need them.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:44
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Pick posted:How does that protect me from the company misusing it? I'm agreeing with you in the sense that there's no guarantee that all your data isn't going to end up in the hands of some Bulgarians because that company's HR IT procedures are shithouse (which they probably are).
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Feb 11, 2017 19:45
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Seriously, that situation would make me want to take a second job as a police officer so they can't check in on what I'm doing
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Feb 11, 2017 19:46
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Mini Faraday cage is easier.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:46
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Pick posted:Seriously, that situation would make me want to take a second job as a police officer so they can't see what I'm doing It's clear that you have an extreme view on privacy considering your "I only pay cash to not be tracked" comment. E: VVV I'm not even arguing anything, I'm just saying a thing.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:46
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WampaLord posted:It's clear that you have an extreme view on privacy considering your "I only pay cash to not be tracked" comment. This is an ad hominem argument that doesn't address the merits of what anyone is saying lol.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:47
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WampaLord posted:It's clear that you have an extreme view on privacy considering your "I only pay cash to not be tracked" comment. It is bad for companies to stalk you
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Feb 11, 2017 19:48
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Moridin920 posted:Also all it takes is one fuckhead in HR with a grudge and suddenly they are using their poo poo to harass individual employees. This is a lawsuit waiting to happen even aside from the OP's situation. It's just a bad idea. Obv HR doesn't have the manpower to monitor all employees at all times but it's not either that or nothing. it's... it's not a lawsuit waiting to happen...  i already explained why the app needs the microphone. the app isn't recording anyone's conversations. quote:every MDM platform has those permission requirements, citrix needs control over the microphone because apps within citrix may need access to the mic and aren't being installed natively. If you run a web conference thru an app in citrix, citrix needs access to the microphone
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Feb 11, 2017 19:51
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You're going to be sorry when you realize you allowed NotoriouslyPoorEthics Corp. to detect that you spend 99% of your day alone in your house jerking off and probably won't mind taking a call, compared to IT wunderkind Andrew who is currently paragliding in Saskatchewan
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Feb 11, 2017 19:52
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Mirthless posted:it's... it's not a lawsuit waiting to happen... Mirthless, you can't imagine a situation in which a nefarious employee with access to that data uses it in a nefarious way EVER? Even though it has already happened with the NSA and also with some public school employee spying on kiddies??? Like c'mon it's a hilariously loving stupid idea for very questionable security gain on the part of the company.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:52
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WampaLord posted:Holy poo poo you all have seen too many movies. Moridin920 posted:Mirthless, you can't imagine a situation in which a nefarious employee with access to that data uses it in a nefarious way EVER? Even though it has already happened with the NSA and also with some public school employee spying on kiddies??? No, I CAN'T, because I've worked with this kind of software and it literally cannot do the thing you think it can do The only people in the company who would even be able to access that information are in the IT department, and they have much better ways to spy on you than your GPS data and the microphone permissions the webex applet in citrix has
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Feb 11, 2017 19:53
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Mirthless posted:the app isn't recording anyone's conversations. They can't understand this part, I tried.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:53
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Pick posted:You're going to be sorry when you realize you allowed NotoriouslyPoorEthics Corp. to detect that you spend 99% of your day alone in your house jerking off and probably won't mind taking a call, compared to IT wunderkind Andrew who is currently paragliding in Saskatchewan I don't think they would like to talk to me while I'm jerking off though
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Feb 11, 2017 19:54
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Mirthless posted:No, I CAN'T, because I've worked with this kind of software and it literally cannot do the thing you think it can do Your explanation was a broad "this is why many apps need the mic permissions" thing that doesn't address why the company also requires the dude to have his phone on him 24/7 and keep that app installed all the time. Do we know specifically which app OP is talking about and have you worked with that specific app and seen its code?
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Feb 11, 2017 19:54
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Do you guys think a hot dog is a sandwich?
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Feb 11, 2017 19:54
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Tater Love 
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Although if he has a private phone idk why he doesn't just leave the work phone at the office he does seem a bit paranoiac. I'm just arguing the merits of your guys' "don't worry about security/privacy" stuff because they are badly formed arguments just begging for it (like that ad hominem one). Every app I install nowadays needs every permission on my phone it's absurd. My flashlight app needs mic permission ffs.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:56
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Moridin920 posted:"don't worry about security/privacy" Never did I say this. Security and privacy are both important, and your work phone is intruding on neither.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:57
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WampaLord posted:Never did I say this. Security and privacy are both important, and your work phone is intruding on neither. I'll be honest and say I didn't read the actual Reddit post and just jumped in; if this is a company work phone and he already has a private one I don't understand what his issue is.
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Feb 11, 2017 19:58
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wow here's a case profiled by PBS that details this exact issue
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Feb 11, 2017 19:58
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WampaLord posted:They can't understand this part, I tried. No, literally all you've been saying is that people take privacy too seriously
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Feb 11, 2017 19:59
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Moridin920 posted:Your explanation was a broad "this is why many apps need the mic permissions" thing that doesn't address why the company also requires the dude to have his phone on him 24/7 and keep that app installed all the time. Some people have to have a phone with them 24/7 because their job is important and they need to be available. I am sure he is being well compensated for his time. I'm on call sometimes and am expected to have my work phone with me at all times when I am on-call, that is normal. If he signed up for the job with on-call expectations he should expect to have to carry the phone with him everywhere he goes. If he's just in a bullshit busy work job, that is a problem with the employer, not the practice. If he's doing something important they are compensating him for his time. On-call is a necessary practice in some fields, IT especially. You can have a job that requires you to be on-call and still have a good work/life balance. Most of my on-call time, I never get a single call. Some companies are like that. Moridin920 posted:Your explanation was a broad "this is why many apps need the mic permissions" thing that doesn't address why the company also requires the dude to have his phone on him 24/7 and keep that app installed all the time. I have never specifically managed mobile devices with citrix but I have worked with Citrix for most of the last 8 years, I have worked with the Citrix mobile app and I have worked with the Citrix director, which is probably the same backend platform the MDM system uses, and I can definitively say that nobody is using it to monitor the things you are doing
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Feb 11, 2017 19:59
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Improbable Lobster posted:They have literally no reason to request mic privileges. If they aren't going to use them then they don't need them. Isn't it a citrix app? That needs mic access Edit: I can't believe I backed up a Mirthless post, heaven help me lol
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Feb 11, 2017 20:00
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I want to hear about the crazy stalker family that one poster mentioned, not this phone crap.
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Feb 11, 2017 20:00
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Moridin920 posted:I'll be honest and say I didn't read the actual Reddit post and just jumped in; if this is a company work phone and he already has a private one I don't understand what his issue is. That's exactly the situation which is why I've been calling him a paranoid loon this whole time. Improbable Lobster posted:No, literally all you've been saying is that people take privacy too seriously Quote me saying that. All I'm saying is that the phone isn't spying on you.
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Feb 11, 2017 20:01
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Mirthless posted:I have never specifically managed mobile devices with citrix but I have worked with Citrix for most of the last 8 years, I have worked with the Citrix mobile app and I have worked with the Citrix director, which is probably the same backend platform the MDM system uses, and I can definitively say that nobody is using it to monitor the things you are doing What about the case Pick just posted? App being used to track employees off the clock? I mean that's GPS not mic stuff so you might be right that the dude shouldn't worried about the mic listening in on him specifically but in general I think the point is he is uncomfortable with the app itself. But again dude should just leave his work phone at work, problem solved. e: IT sounds like a poo poo field in general. 24 hour on call is normal really? That loving blows lmao.
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Feb 11, 2017 20:01
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Moridin920 posted:Although if he has a private phone idk why he doesn't just leave the work phone at the office he does seem a bit paranoiac. This is something the two worst posters in the thread are weirdly militant about, like if someone posted a reddit thread fussing about how the priest might be touching their kid cause he doesn't like going to church and they fell all over themselves snorting at the very notion and then someone linked the Catholic pedophilia scandal and they responded with a million posts each about how a priest covering up sexual malfeasance is a thing that only ever happens in movies, that's crazy, you're all crazy What I'm saying here is Mirthless and WampaLord are pedophiles
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Feb 11, 2017 20:03
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whether or not the platform can be abused in some cases is irrelevant. You can access GPS data in a lot of MDM platforms but 90% of orgs out there will not let anyone outside of the IT department into those systems for very good reasons. This is basic, basic, basic industry stuff, you do not allow non-IT users to have administrative access to IT systems. And GPS data is the extent of what you can access through those platforms, at least through the common ones. They're not spying on you with MAAS360 or Citrix or Iron Mountain, and if they are, the only thing they're going to know is where the phone is, they're not taking video, recording audio, whatever Now if your boss wants you to install a custom coded MDM platform specific to their medium sized finance company you should probably be afraid
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Feb 11, 2017 20:05
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WampaLord posted:That's exactly the situation which is why I've been calling him a paranoid loon this whole time. WampaLord posted:The difference is the NSA has the manpower to analyze all that data. You think his company's HR department is pouring over every single employee's device, listening to hours of audio to see if he says something bad when he's at home? WampaLord posted:Holy poo poo you all have seen too many movies. WampaLord posted:It's clear that you have an extreme view on privacy considering your "I only pay cash to not be tracked" comment.
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Feb 11, 2017 20:05
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e: bleh nm
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Feb 11, 2017 20:07
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Moridin920 posted:What about the case Pick just posted? App being used to track employees off the clock? You generally get paid well, and most of the time you're not going to get called after hours. It really sucks to have to take a call at 3 in the morning but it might happen once a year. If you're getting called every single week it's a problem with the company, they need to hire more people or fix whatever problem keeps needing your attention. If they won't, then you find another job. 
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Feb 11, 2017 20:09
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Mirthless posted:You generally get paid well, and most of the time you're not going to get called after hours. It really sucks to have to take a call at 3 in the morning but it might happen once a year. That sounds a lot better than what I was imagining, which was half-stoned panicked executives calling at all hours of the day trying to figure out how to Save Image to Desktop.
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Feb 11, 2017 20:12
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Moridin920 posted:That sounds a lot better than what I was imagining, which was half-stoned panicked executives calling at all hours of the day trying to figure out how to Save Image to Desktop. No if they are calling you at 3 AM it's because everything is on loving red alert.
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Feb 11, 2017 20:12
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