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Suntan Boy posted:They're supposed to be pretty capable little machines, but with heavy emphasis on the "little" part. I have to keep telling myself "no" every month or so. I bought them for like $8 around 10y ago. The jack plane is bent sheet metal. Neither would actually cut and ended up in the scrap pile. Also Bessy pipe clamps are like a $1 more than HF and miles better.
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Dec 4, 2020 20:47
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Ah yes, the faithful "mini plane".
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Dec 4, 2020 20:57
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Today I learned it is possible to over-clinch a nail and subsequently spent an hour re-making the lid to a japanese toolbox
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Dec 4, 2020 21:20
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My house has a staircase with an ugly handrail that appears to be just a long 2x4 with mitred ends. It might look nice if I unpaint it and give it a better finish, though. Will I be abusing my plane if I use it to scrape the paint off?
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Dec 4, 2020 22:04
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My lesson of the day: It turns out you should not try to do nice fine little dovetails in cedar
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Dec 4, 2020 22:10
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rt4 posted:My house has a staircase with an ugly handrail that appears to be just a long 2x4 with mitred ends. It might look nice if I unpaint it and give it a better finish, though. Not if its the $14 plane above
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Dec 4, 2020 22:30
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JEEVES420 posted:Also Bessy pipe clamps are like a $1 more than HF and miles better. Bessy clamps are about twice as much as these particular HF ones, but you're 100% right about the quality difference. Fortunately, it doesn't matter overmuch, since they're just part of a quick and dirty moxon vise. rt4 posted:My house has a staircase with an ugly handrail that appears to be just a long 2x4 with mitred ends. It might look nice if I unpaint it and give it a better finish, though. You can use a hand plane to take off most finishes, including paint, but it'll tend to chatter a bit until it can bite into something more substantial. If the paint's not too thick, adjust it for roughing work so that it just barely takes off the wood underneath, too. You'll probably want to take the plane apart and treat the sole, blade, and chip breaker with paint solvent afterwards, though. Stuff tends to stick to inconvenient places. cakesmith handyman posted:Not if its the $14 plane above Suntan Boy fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Dec 4, 2020 |
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Dec 4, 2020 22:30
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I'm doing my first mortise & through tenon and I've got the mortise all set but I'm looking for suggestions on how to cut the tenon. I don't have any handsaws apart from a coping saw, but I do have a router + table, a miter saw, a jigsaw, a nightmarish table saw, and a bunch of other random stuff. I have ideas on how to do it on the table saw, but the horrible machine is a Tool of Last Resort because I mean just look at it: it has, hopefully, seen better days. It's also much less rusty than this picture, but it still just lives in my backyard. It rattles like hell, does not cut straight, and i'm sure it will some day try and kill me also, same question, but for cutting some wedges for wedging the tenon
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Dec 5, 2020 00:28
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Bloody posted:I'm doing my first mortise & through tenon and I've got the mortise all set but I'm looking for suggestions on how to cut the tenon. I don't have any handsaws apart from a coping saw, but I do have a router + table, a miter saw, a jigsaw, a nightmarish table saw, and a bunch of other random stuff. I have ideas on how to do it on the table saw, but the horrible machine is a Tool of Last Resort because I mean just look at it: I made a living with one of those for some years, friend. If it doesn't cut straight, that's on you; read back a page or 2. Set up a sled or just beef up your trusty miter gauge and go to town.
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Dec 5, 2020 01:07
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Bloody posted:I'm doing my first mortise & through tenon and I've got the mortise all set but I'm looking for suggestions on how to cut the tenon. I don't have any handsaws apart from a coping saw, but I do have a router + table, a miter saw, a jigsaw, a nightmarish table saw, and a bunch of other random stuff. I have ideas on how to do it on the table saw, but the horrible machine is a Tool of Last Resort because I mean just look at it: That is actually a pretty decent table saw. Maybe give it some love and don’t leave it in the yard and it will treat you better too?
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Dec 5, 2020 01:10
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I think at this point most of the un-straight-ness comes from the obnoxious levels of vibration it's achieving that I have done nothing to fix but my FIL apparently hosed around with a lot and this was as good as it got. Probably needs a new idk pulley or something
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Dec 5, 2020 01:10
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:If you have a crosscut sled and dado stack for the table saw, that is a good ( and fairly safe) way to make tenons. Otherwise I would use the router. Mark the shoulders and tenon thickness and rout away the waste with a straight bit. Then clean up the shoulders with a chisel. unfortunately there's nowhere else for it to go - our shed is 100% full of everything else, and our house is 700 square feet  future house definitely has a proper workshop, but there's not even really a decent site to add one here
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Dec 5, 2020 01:11
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Really the router table is your best, safest bet. My eyes kinda glazed over at your post since the saw was what you described and pictured.
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Dec 5, 2020 01:15
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yeah that makes total sense and idk why I kind of forgot about it. what about wedges?
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Dec 5, 2020 01:18
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You probably realize this, but just to make certain: if you cut tenons on a router table, you need to do it a little at a time. Don't try to take off the full width of the bit and 1/4" of depth in one shot.
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Dec 5, 2020 01:24
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Back to an earlier discussion, I've been cutting tenons on the bandsaw and it's an excellent choice.
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Dec 5, 2020 01:30
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Bloody posted:yeah that makes total sense and idk why I kind of forgot about it. what about wedges? On the table saw, but you can tack on a wooden rip guide. Size is a determining thing, you don't want them slipping down alongside the blade.
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Dec 5, 2020 01:39
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You guys are sleeping on this bitBloody posted:I don't have any handsaws apart from a coping saw Can you come up with about $30? Get https://smile.amazon.com/s?k=ryoba+pull+saw something from there, within your budget if you can. Having a small straight saw that can do both rip and cross cuts of small bits is essential to woodworking. Like, if I was going to list the very first tools for anyone to do woodworking it would be, in this order: 1. vise or clamps or both 2. saw 3. other stuff Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Dec 5, 2020 |
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Dec 5, 2020 01:53
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Leperflesh posted:You guys are sleeping on this bit I'd probably put a saw first. Flip over a couple of 5-gal buckets, put the board on that, and then put your knee on the board, you are the clamp. Agreed about picking up a cheap Ryoba or this set if you are a bit more flush. If I started over today id definitely go the Japanese route (and still might) its way way cheaper to get to "decent" via that path.
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Dec 5, 2020 02:29
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Are either of these thickness planers likely to be worth the asking cost? https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/402119437508108/?ref=product_details&referral_code=undefined https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/814338139131807/?ref=product_details&referral_code=undefined
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Dec 5, 2020 04:40
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Grimson posted:Are either of these thickness planers likely to be worth the asking cost? Eh....... I’d probably skip the ryobi, maybe on the delta? My old boss had a ryobi of similar vintage but different model and it cut wood fine but the switch was unreliable and the thickness adjustment was pretty sloppy. They both look pretty well used, for better or worse.
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Dec 5, 2020 04:47
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:Eh....... I’d probably skip the ryobi, maybe on the delta? My old boss had a ryobi of similar vintage but different model and it cut wood fine but the switch was unreliable and the thickness adjustment was pretty sloppy. They both look pretty well used, for better or worse. Okay, I don't need a thickness planer at this point, so I can wait until I feel like I'm committed enough too woodworking to make the DeWalt feel worthwhile
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Dec 5, 2020 04:51
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Grimson posted:Okay, I don't need a thickness planer at this point, so I can wait until I feel like I'm committed enough too woodworking to make the DeWalt feel worthwhile
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Dec 5, 2020 04:59
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So as part of making my next little boat project, I need to make a building board. That board will be 6' long, and I need to cut two tracks into it for 't-tracks' to hold various tools and things during the project. Those tracks must be perfectly parallel to each other as well as perfectly aligned with the center of the board as well as perfectly straight. I don't know anyone with a router, so I am probably going to buy a cheap router to do this. My plan would be to get a 6' long (minimum) steel straight edge and clamp it to the board and use that as a guide for the router. Does that seem like a reasonable approach or should I consider some other method? The only other option I can think of would be to travel over an hour to Woodcrafter or Woodworkers Source and pay them to do it? Or maybe there is someone in the greater Phoenix area that has the proper equipment to do something like that right and would be willing to assist? Thoughts?
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Dec 5, 2020 05:42
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The Locator posted:So as part of making my next little boat project, I need to make a building board. That board will be 6' long, and I need to cut two tracks into it for 't-tracks' to hold various tools and things during the project. Those tracks must be perfectly parallel to each other as well as perfectly aligned with the center of the board as well as perfectly straight. How tight of a tolerance is "perfect"? One one-thousandth of an inch? A sixteenth? With the kind of thing you're talking about, I don't think tolerances tighter than around 1/32" are achievable by most human hands (that is, using rulers, marking knives, and hand squares, but not stuff like CNCs or other high-precision machines). Plus, wood moves on its own, so your perfectly-cut tracks might wander slightly after they've been cut and the wood has a chance to relieve stresses. Plywood's more stable than wood...so is MDF but I wouldn't recommend it for anything where you'll be sliding stuff around on it because it wears easily. Of course, metal is the ne plus ultra of stability; it still expands and contracts with temperature, but not nearly so much as wood does. Assuming you don't actually mean perfect but just "less than a sixteenth of an inch", you can probably still do this with wood. A router would do that job, but with the caveat that routers can wander easily if you aren't careful. If you haven't used one before then this becomes a greater concern. You can also cut grooves with a table saw or circular/track saw, using a fence or a track that can be squared with the edge of the board to keep it parallel. And of course there's the router plane...I don't own one, but I imagine it could do the job. As usual, it might help if you described what you're actually trying to do with this board and why it needs these two tracks cut so precisely in it.
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Dec 5, 2020 06:06
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:How tight of a tolerance is "perfect"? One one-thousandth of an inch? A sixteenth? With the kind of thing you're talking about, I don't think tolerances tighter than around 1/32" are achievable by most human hands (that is, using rulers, marking knives, and hand squares, but not stuff like CNCs or other high-precision machines). Plus, wood moves on its own, so your perfectly-cut tracks might wander slightly after they've been cut and the wood has a chance to relieve stresses. Plywood's more stable than wood...so is MDF but I wouldn't recommend it for anything where you'll be sliding stuff around on it because it wears easily. Of course, metal is the ne plus ultra of stability; it still expands and contracts with temperature, but not nearly so much as wood does. 1/64th is a glue joint. When you're making doors this is the target tolerance
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Dec 5, 2020 06:13
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osker posted:1/64th is a glue joint. When you're making doors this is the target tolerance Human hands can achieve high tolerance on a number of things, especially when aided by machines. I was reacting to the specific "I need two slots that are both exactly a certain distance from a reference point and are also perfectly parallel" -- I may well be missing something (especially since I really ought to be in bed right now), but I'm having trouble seeing how you can get that dialed in to 1/64" or better using the tools commonly available in a wood shop.
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Dec 5, 2020 06:20
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Sorry, I am sometimes not great at describing things. As I mentioned a couple weeks ago I am going to be building a large model ship. The build board is what holds the model while it's being built, and also holds a number of different tools that help put it together and keep everything in alignment. I suppose I should have used "as close to perfect as possible", as these two tracks will be used throughout the entire process of building the model and they should be as nearly perfectly parallel as possible to make everything work better without introducing errors into the ship itself. Here are a couple of pictures of what a build-board looks like, showing the embedded tracks, and the very early part of frame assembly showing how the tracks hold different jigs to help with assembly.   Hopefully this makes it more clear. My plan is to use 3/4" thick MDF with a melamine surface for the board. It will also have a supporting frame that will allow for proper leveling of the surface.
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Dec 5, 2020 06:27
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So is this just a miniature drydock for your miniature ship? I think extruded aluminum might work better than wood, it comes with t-track slots and should have the sort of tolerances you need? Maybe it's not accurate enough. E: ok, yeah, it's a tiny drydock. I still think aluminum might work better.
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Dec 5, 2020 06:29
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Olothreutes posted:So is this just a miniature drydock for your miniature ship? I think extruded aluminum might work better than wood, it comes with t-track slots and should have the sort of tolerances you need? Maybe it's not accurate enough. Not sure I know how I would get extruded aluminum with the exact measurements I need, with the t-track slots in the right locations, and how expensive it would be? I've never seen what you are talking about so I'm not sure about it - is the surface flat so that I could put the plans down on it like you see in the 2nd photo? Also as you can see in the 2nd photo, at various stages of the build different things get mounted directly to that building board so it will have holes drilled into it for mounting.
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Dec 5, 2020 07:05
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A steel straightedge 6' won't be perfectly straight, but if you lay it flat on a flat table it'll be pretty drat close to straight. I think what I would first plan on doing is to cut one straight channel using maybe a 4' level or some other very straight metal thing firmly clamped to the board (do four feet, then move the track/level/whatever and align it with what's already cut), and then I'd build a little jig to ride in the first channel and hold the cutting tool for cutting the second channel, which would guarantee exact width between them and the 2nd channel would be exactly as straight as the first one. I would also get thick enough stock for the bottom board that if I hosed it up, I could flip it over and have a second shot. As for what I'd cut the channel with: a router is an option. If you already have a circular saw, you can set its depth properly and do several runs as you would cutting a dado in several passes. If you have a table saw you could put in a dado blade and do this very accurately in two passes (cutting the channel from underneath). Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 07:38 on Dec 5, 2020 |
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Dec 5, 2020 07:36
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Leperflesh posted:A steel straightedge 6' won't be perfectly straight, but if you lay it flat on a flat table it'll be pretty drat close to straight. Thanks, some good ideas here. I do have a circular saw but not a table saw since I don't do much full-size woodworking. I might see if the local Ace tool rental place rents routers rather than buying one for this. I know there are some woodworker types in my neighborhood also, so I might try to go introduce myself and see if one of them would give me a hand for a few bucks or some beers or something.
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Dec 5, 2020 07:53
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The Locator posted:Not sure I know how I would get extruded aluminum with the exact measurements I need, with the t-track slots in the right locations, and how expensive it would be? I've never seen what you are talking about so I'm not sure about it - is the surface flat so that I could put the plans down on it like you see in the 2nd photo? Also as you can see in the 2nd photo, at various stages of the build different things get mounted directly to that building board so it will have holes drilled into it for mounting. You can order extruded aluminum direct from a manufacturer, but that might be a bit beyond what you want to do. They definitely make large plates with integral T track slots at regular intervals, you can see one in a video posted a page or so ago being used as the bed for a circular saw jig. As to the exact spacing you need for your T track, that's a question for the supplier. There's the video, those come in essentially whatever size you are willing to buy. Which is a thing, for sure, I don't think this would be cheaper than a big sheet of MDF. Olothreutes fucked around with this message at 10:40 on Dec 5, 2020 |
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Dec 5, 2020 10:37
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The Locator posted:Thanks, some good ideas here. I do have a circular saw but not a table saw since I don't do much full-size woodworking. I might see if the local Ace tool rental place rents routers rather than buying one for this. I know there are some woodworker types in my neighborhood also, so I might try to go introduce myself and see if one of them would give me a hand for a few bucks or some beers or something.
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Dec 5, 2020 14:42
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I think the benefit is a high level of precision without a need for a lot of measuring and remeasuring. T-tracks have a consistent size, resist warping and deformation, and the hardware is easy to modify and upgrade. This project is more approachable by someone who's comfortable "assembling" something instead of crafting something. Woodworking is expensive in raw materials and time. It's rewarding work, but it's not always approachable; Youtube videos only get some people so far. I feel like experienced woodworkers take for granted the physical control and discipline necessary to get really accurate cuts and measurements, and not every hobbyist has the time or resources to learn those skills, especially if they only occasionally do woodworking projects. I struggle with this a lot, so this is partly anecdotal, but it reflects the issues I've run against since I've started making and fixing poo poo. E: I'm willing to bet that whole assembly is lighter than a plywood one.
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Dec 5, 2020 15:29
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The Locator posted:Sorry, I am sometimes not great at describing things. A couple of things. If you are planning to do it yourself the steps are 1. Square up the outer edge of your baseboard 2. Use the outer edge as a reference to setup a track/circular saw and cut a guidance channel (optional) 3. Use a router with an edge guide to widen and deepen the channel to your T-slot dimensions. (something like this https://www.amazon.com/Bosch-Deluxe-Extraction-Adapter-RA1054/dp/B00005RHPP) 4. Repeat on second channel using the first channel as a reference. Using the channel instead of the edge ensures that the 2 channels are parallel to each other even if drift occurs in the first channel which is the most important dimension. Remember to account for the width of the channel when you move to the second one. As others have said, this is a very straightforward task on a Table saw with a Dado blade. In that case once your outer edge is square (and the table saw fence is square to the blade) you can do this in 2 passes. Doing it with just a circular saw (or table saw without the Dado) is also an option but a bit of a pain since you need so many slightly offset passes. You would probably finish it with a chisel, manual router, or plane if you did the grooves without a dado. If you are using melamine topped MDF then you may want to tape your cutting lines to help reduce chipping. Extruded aluminum can typically be ordered by the linear foot + extrusion pattern and then you cut it to length. This can make shipping expensive but a local metal supplier may stock or be able to order it for you. This includes T-slot track.
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Dec 5, 2020 16:39
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A 6' steel angle can still flex a bit in the middle, seconding that anyone with a table saw and a dado can do this in no time and it's not much trouble for them to do. If you enlarge the holes for the screws going into the knob a little, even if you are a bit out of square, you can shift the whole thing a little bit within the t-track. If using an edge guide on each side of the table, please first check that the table is same width across the whole thing as a sanity check. Another option that skips the t-track entirely would be to make a lip on one edge of the boat hanger (like with an angle bracket) that goes over one side of the worktable, and the knob goes in horizontally into a lip on the other side of the table, so it self-squares against the table when you tighten that side down, instead of coming into t-tracks down through the top. Since this isn't locked into place with t-tracks, if you move it a lot it could go way out of square if you aren't careful.
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Dec 5, 2020 17:44
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Anyone done one of the homemade shop air cleaners? Winter time with a closed shop has reminded me how much I hate dust. I sort of built one in to my miter saw cart just as single tool dust collection but I'm looking for something more like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fixd7LqnWow There tends to be two design philosophies, putting the fan before or after the filters. After keeps your fan clean, but I feel like before would move more air\dust around the whole shop, making it less likely I'm just cleaning the same 100 sq feet. Airflow doesn't care about my feelings though:(
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Dec 5, 2020 18:26
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bobua posted:Anyone done one of the homemade shop air cleaners? Winter time with a closed shop has reminded me how much I hate dust. I sort of built one in to my miter saw cart just as single tool dust collection but I'm looking for something more like this How big is your shop and can you sketch your workstation layout? If you are trying to get good overall dust collection you should really be ducting your exhaust inlets to the unit. PVC pipe and dust collection hoods on tools works a treat and allows you to minimize fan capacity. edit: The video you linked, that guy is a loving moron. If you follow his design pick up an explosion-proof fan. Fine combustible particulate and unsealed motors don't mix. Put the fan on the clean side of the system whenever possible. osker fucked around with this message at 19:22 on Dec 5, 2020 |
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Dec 5, 2020 19:06
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No no no, this is for air cleaning. Shop is ducted for dust collection to the tools already. This is basically a replacement for these guys https://www.homedepot.com/p/WEN-3-S...wE&gclsrc=aw.ds
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Dec 5, 2020 21:11
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