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Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Smashing Link posted:

I think I need a test box. Too afraid to give up unraid and Synology.

One of the cooler features of ZFS is that you can just gently caress around with storage pools backed by regular files on disk, so getting the hang of using it on the command line doesn't even require a bunch of drives to play with and you can, say, test scripts on throwaway pools.

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Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



D. Ebdrup posted:

How old is VLC? Take however many decades that is, and add as many years as it'll take until they fix their lovely implementation.

Plex has paid employees, though. Probably just need a critical mass of customer requests.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Thermopyle posted:

FWIW, I think Backblaze B2 is what people mostly use here for bulk cloud file storage because it's cheaper than AWS.

S3 sure but I think Glacier may be cheaper... as long as you basically ever need to restore from backups :v:

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Shut up Meg posted:

If I needed to restore, it would be the result of a whole-house fire and so I'd be needed to make a substantial insurance claim. I checked and the cost of restoring data from a backup would be covered, so that's not a worry.

Huh! I should ask my agent about this.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



I found a server leaning on a junk appliance in the alley behind my building recently and, since I don't have any kettle bells of my own and gyms in my state are closed for COVID19, have been using it for suitcase carries, but I'm wondering if it's even worth plugging in and using as a computer.




I tried looking up the service tag but Dell's website says it doesn't exist, which I take to mean that the machine is old as hell. Looks like it has an expansion card for fiber networking and maybe the power supplies are still good, so it could be worth something in parts, but IDK if it's so old that it'd be outperformed by an RPi or what. Anyone know what model/line the front bezel is from?

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



IOwnCalculus posted:

The service tag lookup sort of worked for me but didn't return a whole lot of detail - PowerEdge 2950 that was manufactured in 2006.

So unless someone has done some crazy rear end parts swapping in it, it's more valuable for the exercise you're getting.

Huh, yeah, it does come up now that I'm at my laptop. Weird.

It looks like a factory build inside, so I'd guess it's all original.

DrDork posted:

If it is indeed a PowerEdge 2950, it's basically worthless--hence being outside like that. Dual quad-core Xeons at 2.x Ghz would be trivial to beat these days--if it's a E5410, it's got a per-CPU benchmark score of ~1800, while a $20 i3-4130 benches at ~3300. If it still has drives in it you might be able to sell those for like $20/ea, maybe. But the rest of it would probably cost more to ship than it would be worth.

Nope, no drives. Guess I'll eventually take it apart and see if the motherboard mounting is standard? (lol)

At least I'll be able to dispose of it more responsibly than the guys who just come by and take anything metal that's not anchored to the ground.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Paul MaudDib posted:

2950 first gen is probably a Cedarwood (Cedar Mills? I forget the name) Pentium 4. Literal garbage at this point. A Dell R610 looks like a paragon of performance and efficiency in comparison.

It notionally should boot a modern 64 bit OS but that chassis looks like it was gutted and may be missing parts.

Yikes - didn't realize P4s ever got Xeon badges. Gross

It's just missing the drive sleds or trays or whatever they're called. Original owner probably wanted to keep his Linux ISOs secret.

Crunchy Black posted:

Is that a NetApp Fibre Channel card? Good lord.

🤷‍♂️

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



This USB3 talk is making me nostalgic for when I used Firewire to network my NAS to my desktop because I already had the dang cable and gigabit ethernet equipment was not what would have considered cheap at the time :allears:

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Duck and Cover posted:

I was curious to the answer of "does somebody make a rack enclosure to lessen noise?". Yes the answer is yes. https://www.xrackpro2.com/ https://www.rackmountsolutions.net/server-racks-cabinet/specialty-server-racks/soundproof-racks/

lol

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



D. Ebdrup posted:

The question is, why the gently caress do you have one dataset taking up more than 50% of your pool when you could have hundreds of thousands.

Newing up a filesystem for every different, ah, "Linux distro" you want to preserve on your NAS isn't going to occur to most people, including me!

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



D. Ebdrup posted:

Ever since filesystems started implementing hierarchies of folders in the 70s, there's been very little distinction between them.
It disappeared completely with zfs, because 'zfs create' and 'mkdir' both accept -p, and 'zfs create' also lets you specify zfs-specific options via -o parameter=value like 'mount' and 'newfs' use.

OK but a folder isn't automatically a new dataset, as far as I can tell, and "alias mkdir to 'zfs create'" is neat idea but not something that's going to occur to most people. Probably not hard to replace a directory hierarchy with a bunch of hived-off datasets after the fact, but still not the obvious thing to do when you're a home gamerserver janitor.

fletcher posted:

Interesting! I didn't know that Windows supported NFSv4. It sounds like Windows doesn't have an official NFSv4 client though, only server. Are you using the client from University of Michigan? I am only planning on accessing these datasets from Windows machines both now and in the future, so I was planning on using the SMB share type on the new NAS.

Could've sworn Explorer became a client after you installed the feature but now I can't find the feature to install since they dumbed down the UI 😑

Munkeymon fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jun 18, 2020

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



D. Ebdrup posted:

No, you do need to alias it, as you suggest - I don't know why it doesn't occur to more people, it's blindingly obvious at least to me.

That was a(n attempt at a) joke dude :P Respect the hell out of your ZFS knowledge but most of us just read the enough of the man page to Make It Go.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



GnarlyCharlie4u posted:

all my traffic would be tunneled

Doesn't have to https://openvpn.net/for/split-tunneling-with-access-server/

If you just want to get to your totally legal backup copies of your music, Plex is very good, btw

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



GnarlyCharlie4u posted:

Plex is great, although I've never exposed mine to the internet. I'm aware of split tunneling though I've never implemented it.
It would work if I were at like Starbucks or something, but the whole VPN from inside my office network, and installing the client software, is apparently a no-no. So the whole VPN route might just be dead in the water anyway.

I bought the Plex Pass and it Just Works with no VPN fuckery. Plex is gr8

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



GnarlyCharlie4u posted:

Theoretically how big could it get?

https://hbfs.wordpress.com/2009/02/10/to-boil-the-oceans/

quote:

Although we’d all like Moore’s Law to continue forever, quantum mechanics imposes some fundamental limits on the computation rate and information capacity of any physical device. In particular, it has been shown that 1 kilogram of matter confined to 1 litre of space can perform at most 1051 operations per second on at most 1031 bits of information.

A fully populated 128-bit storage pool would contain 2128 blocks = 2137 bytes = 2140 bits; therefore the minimum mass required to hold the bits would be (2140 bits) / (1031 bits/kg) = 136 billion kg. […] To operate at the 1031 bits/kg limit, however, the entire mass of the computer must be in the form of pure energy.

By E=mc2, the rest energy of 136 billion kg is 1.2×1028 J.

The mass of the oceans is about 1.4×1021 kg.

It takes about 4,000 J to raise the temperature of 1 kg of water by 1 degree Celsius, and thus about 400,000 J to heat 1 kg of water from freezing to boiling. The latent heat of vaporization adds another 2 million J/kg. Thus the energy required to boil the oceans is about 2.4×106 J/kg * 1.4×1021 kg = 3.4×1027 J.

Thus, fully populating a 128-bit storage pool would, literally, require more energy than boiling the oceans.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Did the CrystalMark homepage always have a bunch of really cringeworthy anime schoolgirl crap on it?

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Are the Rosewill rackmount ATX cases pretty much the go-to for shoving desktop parts in a rack or is there a better option out there? I'd be looking for a 4U because IDGAF about density just having space to put a decent cooler on the CPU.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

Jump to FreeBSD instead 😈

Is there software for FreeBSD that adds an OK web management UI anything like Free/TrueNAS?

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Yeah, I've been using ZFS on Solaris 10 and now Illumos for over ten years and I'm kind of drawn to being able to save the True/FreeNAS config and restore it on new hardware over having to do a bespoke setup over SSH every dang time. Used to be I could spend a weekend janitoring a server and not mind but that's not really the case anymore and probably going to be even less true in the future. Plus it'd be nice to just open a bookmark and see system status and whatnot, too.

Sure, I could learn to use one of those infrastructure as code tools with BSD and find or cobble together a status page but :effort:

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Hadlock posted:

Yes Samba is annoying

Windows has NFS support, though, right? I man, I saw the check box under optional features, but I've never tried it because the smb.conf file I made in 2007 still works but maybe someone has :v:

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

I've been testing this for a little while now, and the autoreplace property, combined with SES-capable SAS chassies, is loving rad, let me tell you. :allears:

Sorry if you've mentioned and I'm forgetting and failing to find it but what chassis are you using?

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Can anyone recommend some tape? This stuff just slides right off the pins 🤨

Coating the pin in super glue seems to have worked but I'd prefer a covering I can see is in place if I have to move a drive around

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



HalloKitty posted:

Not if you kill a nice SSD in the process, especially at the rate netspace is growing..

I thought Chia was write-once-read-many which should be OK on an SSD, but I'm not a shitcoin expert

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Biowarfare posted:

Chia is two-stage: the "mining" (generating your bingo boards) is basically generating terabytes of garbage, writing, deleting, rewriting continuously 24/7. You then copy the completed board to mechanical storage for the next step. The farming (checking your bingo boards) is read every few seconds

I tried doing the former for a bit and on a Toshiba KXG60ZNV1T02 NVME drive, I've used ~30% of it's lifetime bytes in about a week. It will be almost certainly be dead and out of RMA-able state by the end of the month.

Incidentally, I would avoid buying used drives on ebay for ... the next while. Probably same with open box in store. There's a shitload of return fraud happening.

It constantly updates the plots?

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Biowarfare posted:

Once the plots are generated it's read many.

To generate the plots requires it to make like an order of magnitude more trash in temp files back and forth. I think 100GB final output requires multiple terabytes written

And that'd take a while on spinning rust so people just buy cheap SSDs to burn, right? Guess it's a good thing I got one of the fancy new PCIE 4s before the rush :sigh:

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Biowarfare posted:

Yes, that's the point. It sucks up both slow and fast drives. You need the slow drives for long term storage, so all large storage is gone. You need as many fast NVME or SSDs as you can to trash through to write as much as possible, as fast as possible (to generate the bingo boards to put into the rotational drives), so all fast storage is gone. The min size requiring 300G+ means that 128/256GB SSDs are largely untouched, though

A few minutes thought while I was on the Thinking Throne a while ago (because I forgot my phone) and I figure it'd be cheaper to build/buy a server with ~1TB of RAM once then have it generating plots on platter drives that you migrate to, IDK, external USB enclosures hooked up to Raspberry Pis. Then you only pay for one piece of plotting hardware that doesn't wear out and you could even have hot-swap bays for zero downtime plotting. Maybe that USB enclosure thing doesn't strictly work with throughput constraints but it'd be what I'd do if I was serious about touching the poop.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.




The Seagates I bought have a 1.5% failure rate but that's not even the worst on the chart :shepface:

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



codo27 posted:

I mean if you're buying seagate still then its on you

I thought Seagate was goodOK-ish again. Welp!

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Weird ZFS thing I'm trying to figure out: I moved a RAIDZ we'll call src into a new NAS with new drives to migrate the data to, so I made a new zpool we'll call dest and made a fresh snapshot on src called evac then ran
code:
zfs send -R src@evac | zfs receive -F dest
That finished with the only complaint that it couldn't do the SMB share I had set up. OK fine I'll deal with that later, but, since I'm paranoid, I run du -sh on both and there's 300GB of random stuff missing from dest somehow. I guess it's worth noting there's a few old snapshots on src but I don't see how that'd cause files to be missing from a freshly created+sent snapshot. Anyone see what I'm doing wrong here?

e: said vdev when I meant zpool

Munkeymon fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Jan 20, 2022

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



r u ready to WALK posted:

i think you need to run du -A -sh to get the true sizes, if the old zfs didn't have compression turned on but the new one had lz4 by default for instance.
that's the only reason i can think of why there would be a difference if zfs send/receive completes without errors.

The ls -R output is different, too, with the original having ~5000 files the new one doesn't.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

Are there some similarities shared between the files that didn't get moved over?

After some digging, I'm wondering if the last time I moved this data, I got "clever" and made a clone instead of a snapshot. After reading the docs I can find, I'm still not sure if making a clone, writing to it and then making a snapshot on the pool would ignore/bypass the clone.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

The best recommendation I can give is to setup a small test dataset to try with - because I can't remember off the top of my head.
Theoretically the way it'd work is that until you write to it, the clone refers back to the same blocks that are in the dataset that was snapshot'd.

Also, I forgot to mention this the last time, but you might wanna look at zfs-diff(8) too.

I figured it out: zfs receive let the incoming snapshot try to mount itself after it got the first of two snapshots from the sending filesystem, which was the snapshot I made to move the pool the last time. Mounting failed because it was trying to use the same mountpoint that old pool was using and it errored out before it received the second snapshot. I didn't think to compare the snapshot list on the new and old pools before and just noticed tonight that the new one didn't have the 'evac' snapshot that I made to move the data to the new one. Seems like the lesson here it to disable automounting before you send|receive a pool on the same machine.

Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Rescue Toaster posted:

If anybody has rolled your own NAS setup (did your own samba, openzfs, etc...) instead of using a xyzNAS distro, any links to particular configuration guides you found useful? There's so much ancient info online sometimes it can be hard to tell if you're doing things the right way anymore.

I think I can work out the basic setup, muddle my way through samba & UPS fine again, but things like getting an email if the weekly scrub fails, or monitoring smart... that kind of stuff is annoying since the NAS distros at least do it but they never quite do it quite right.

I just found https://github.com/davestephens/ansible-nas the other night and will be giving it a try this time around

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Munkeymon
Aug 14, 2003

Motherfucker's got an
armor-piercing crowbar! Rigoddamndicu𝜆ous.



Rescue Toaster posted:

Thanks, there's some interesting stuff in here. Though I know literally nothing about ansible.

I should probably have mentioned that I'm using this as an opportunity to learn it and also have a thing I can run to stand up a new NAS without re-learning a bunch of stuff every time.

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