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VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
So thanks to this thread I finally decided to try playing some Go.

Some people might be turned off by the fact, that you might be the only person of your rank bracket on the server in some timezones. So the automatch will give you the same opponent several times in succession.


After his eighth loss in half an hour, our pubbie here displayed the proper attitude.


:getin: My only regret is that I forgot to screenshot those resignation popups.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qav4l6ro0p2kjor/tears.zip

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VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
Can anybody recommend good Go programs for Android. I am mainly looking for a go problems display.
I tried almost all of the free ones by now.
Until now WeGoIgo lite is my favorite, but it has some minor problems which annoy me.

Has anybody tried any of those non free tsumego apps? Can somebody give recommendations?

e: also, most of the programmer's sites recommend some collections that lead to forests of dead links, anybody know any good digital problem collections that are still being offered?

VictualSquid fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Nov 16, 2012

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

Blendy posted:

Magic Baduk Go is a collection of problems. It's got 4 levels of life and death problems and a collection of tesuji. I'm not sure how many programs are there in total but it seems like a decent amount for a free app.
It's a pay app. And I don't really want to install the free version as it got really lovely reviews, and wants to make phone calls from my phone.
Unless you have tied it already, and experienced no surprises?

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

uXs posted:

So I joined KGS again today. Apparently the sound is broken and WMS is too lazy to fix it. To be honest, I've kind of had it with WMS since he refused to fix another bug several years ago.

Is there no better server/client yet?
You can get the sound to work by setting Java to backward compatible mode, generally.

There is a manual somewhere on the KGS-help sites.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
"Solution" is pretty well defined in game analysis. It means that you know who would win in a perfect game.
Even with chess we are still pretty far from even that, even though chess programms started beating top players around 10 years ago.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
So I tried out OGS. Couldn't even figure out how to mute the stone sound.

Also, could someone add me to the group? I use the same name as here.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
Nice. Doesn't Tygem have all this already? Fuseki/Joseki helper and live score estimator at least.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
I got a laminated-wood folding board and glass stones for 40 Euros. I think in the US you get something like this even cheaper.
http://www.amazon.de/Hebsacker-Verlag-Go-Spiel-Studenten-Go-Set-Master/dp/B001GXUKTG/

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
So, I have decided to give you some reviews of the current Go-apps for android.

Gogrinder is probably the best tsumego app around.
+ Very nice interface for problems.
- Can't do anything else.
- the input method for full boards is pretty bad.
- You need to bring your own problems.
- Costs 1$

WeGoIgo Lite usable multi purpose app.
+ Good interface for playing and reviewing.
+ Optional Gnugo opponent.
+ Support for Kogo's.
- Tsumego mode is terrible.
- Ad supported. There is a paid version without ads.

ElyGo is pretty much a clone of WeGoIgo.
+ Added IGS support
+ Actually actively developed, and the developer is receptive about bugreports.
- Costs 6€

KGS-Client
+ You can play and chat on KGS.
- Lots of annoying limitations ( Can't make custom games, can't listen to audio-lectures ).
- Input method is annoying.
- Costs :10bux:

Pachi
+ Strongest free computer player for android. ( The pc version is 2d KGS).
+ Pretty good interface
- Eats your battery like crazy.

I would recommend getting WeGoIgo Lite, Grogrinder, Pachi and maybe the KGS-Client.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

Drewski posted:

I'm so excited to find this thread! I was introduced to Go about 3 weeks ago and I've been going crazy thinking about it every day since. I've created a profile on Pandanet and downloaded Panda Tetsuki on my iPhone, which uses IGS. I don't think there are any KGS iPhone apps, is that correct?
There is no iphone app. Correct.
But there is a Tygem iPhone app, I think. Which is the server people actually play on.
While KGS is used mainly for chatting.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
I think if you are meeting up with people from somewhere else, instead of looking for random people on a server, ogs is a lot better then kgs.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
Did you try reducing your java security settings?

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

oiseaux morts 1994 posted:

Can we have a jubango watching party or something.... someone should provide a commentary as the games emerge

http://gogameguru.com/tag/mlily-gu-vs-lee-jubango/
We could get together on skype or something.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
I just noticed that the game starts at 2 am for me. Pretty annoying. I will probably get up early the next day to try to watch the end.
If anybody notices a nice livestream with commentary. Could you try to record it?

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
How the game of go looks in our minds:

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

uranus posted:

Just finished a 13x game with Pander http://online-go.com/game/483457

I'm wondering if when he invades at move 47 if there was a way to stop him, or does a 3-3 invasion always get the corner if done right?
With walls that think you could have tried for a killing move, like move 50 at e2, but it is still somewhat risky.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

Kheldragar posted:

The 4-4 kick and descent so you don't get hane'd is joseki!? :psyduck:
You mean this one?
http://www.josekipedia.com/#path:pdqfqepfre

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

Kheldragar posted:

Xopods, can you tell me how you're supposed to live when you invade the 3-3 and there's one enclosing stone? The sequence always goes like this for me (Even if that's already "dead" after white 6), and if Black plays A, I play D, and if black plays B, I play C which means there's lots of ladders and stuff to consider if black just blocks. I've never seen a game where black let me connect underneath yet.


If you didn't want to go through those ladders, you should go with 6 at s2 for the classic joseki.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

uranus posted:

there's lots of beginners on ogs (online-go.com), pretty quick to get a game there.
When did that happen?
Last time I was on ogs it was full with sandbaggers with 30k rank.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
I wrote you some comments. As you said, your main problem is that you take to much influence, and give your opponent to much territory in return.
http://eidogo.com/#25A0LcK1r

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
I found a pretty great video where Elwyn Berlekamp talks about go.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puK3qYiMKpQ

Has a nice segment on the history of go, and why go is awesome.
A basic explanation of the rules.
And a long segment on endgame and counting.

E: he also talks quite a bit about rule systems in the Q&A portion:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Qya14k8IfA

VictualSquid fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Apr 20, 2014

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

Xom posted:



Status?
Looks like seki to me.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

oiseaux morts 1994 posted:

Re: KGS in decline, it begs the question then: Where have those players gone?
They don't play go, obviously.
They hear that Kgs is terrible so they start playing on some other server that is even worse in all of xopods' categories. Then they give up.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

xopods posted:

So it's not the obnoxious behavior of internet players that turns people off of Go, but the people who criticize obnoxious behavior?
No I am saying it is the behavior of really obnoxious internet players that turns people off of go. As opposed to the behavior of slightly less obnoxious internet players.

Which server would you recommend as one that is better then KGS in any of your points?

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
The Problem I have with this is that the attitude and sportsmanship on KGS compared to almost all other gaming communities is also positively astounding.

The few times I was at the only Go-club in my area, it was an experience pretty much like KGS. Mostly encouraging to beginners, but after a bit half the club only wanted to practice for the upcoming tournament and the other half was having heated discussions about some other boardgames.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

areyoucontagious posted:

Do you guys have a preferred YouTube lesson series? Someone both entertaining and knowledge? I've watched a few of Nick Sibicky and he seems alright.
Nick Sibicky and Joshua Lee are ok. But the only one I would call legitimately good is Batts/Dwyrin.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

areyoucontagious posted:

So I'm getting a little discouraged. I know you're supposed to lose 100 games, but I feel like after 10-20 I'm not learning anything. I'm studying webpages about go and things like that but the concepts seem to just fly out of my head when I start playing. Is this just perseverance at this point, or do some people (like me) just not get it?
You need to alternate studying and playing for fastest results. As in if you study too much you can't understand it, but if you play to much you keep making the same mistakes.

Just ask a stronger player for a review/teaching game. He will tell you what to focus on next.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

areyoucontagious posted:

Thanks for the replies. I play on http://online-go.com/, which I guess used to be nova.gs? I've been on KGS before, but that was a long time ago and a false start. I've only recently been taking the game more seriously. Also what is ITGO? Is that the ITGO league thing? I can't really figure out what to do with that. :/
ITGO is our private chatroom on KGS. Most of us hang out there and chat about go.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

yehdawg posted:

Hey guys,

I'm trying to play on gokgs.com but for some reason java is now blocked on like every freakin' web browser. Anybody else having trouble playing online? Every time java tries to load it just stops and says java is blocked cus of security reasons, and this happens on all browsers.
Some Java update (about a year ago) increased the default security setting for java.
You need to lower the default security level for java in the global java settings, or add an exception for kgs.
I don't actually know how to do that on windows.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
So, I tried to play again for a bit.

And in my second game I had this crap:
http://eidogo.com/#4dmvUquHI:0,14

Seems like I have totally forgotten how to fight. Can't even find a good way out of this even when I am reviewing.
How would you guys play here?

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

AdorableStar posted:

Has Kgs been down all morning for anyone else?
It was down when I came home from work. Now it seems to be back.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
I suppose Baduk-Knifefighting is the logical follow up to Chess-Boxing.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

bollig posted:

Okay well i tried to take on a bot but now it left the room (KGS). Can I leave the room now without being penalized.

I guess I"m that intimidating.
Yes, you can leave. If you leave too often your old escapes get turned into losses, but you need a lot for this. And Free games don't count anyways.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

Fortuitous Bumble posted:

I've been trying to learn this for a couple days, I lost a few games on KGS and one player was nice enough to explain some of the places I screwed up. Not sure when or how to start playing rated games, I seem to have achieved the lowest rating possible after challenging a bot on some sort of blitz settings.

I don't entirely understand the logic behind the time system either. It seems like there's a main clock, and then once that ticks down it moves to a shorter secondary clock? It seems counter-intuitive to me, are go games supposed to speed up as you approach the end of the game?
No, it is an overtime system.
If you run out of time you still get a few seconds per move instead of losing immediately.
You can also imagine that your time remaining gets rounded up to 30 seconds if it is below that.

Well, Go games do speed up at the endgame but not because of the time system.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

AdorableStar posted:

You mean where you should be counting the values of every move and trying to find some good tesuji? :sun:
I have been told a few times that you should use most of your time during the late opening/early middlegame. And that if you are not in Byo-yomi during the endgame you played to fast.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

PaganGoatPants posted:

I want to learn how to play this game. Are there are any recommended videos that explain the rules/moves etc before I jump into the tutorial?
I can't think of any videos for total beginners, but there are two great interactive tutorials.
http://playgo.to/iwtg/en/
http://www.gokgs.com/tutorial/

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
I have been wondering about the endgame for the L+2 group recently.

Normally white will hane in from the side because it is massively sente.
But what is black's best local move here, and how large is it actually?
The group you get if black plays the hane on both ends is actually seki for example, so that can't really be the best outcome.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
My ideas:
1) resign
2) tenuki
3) try for some crazy desperate capturing race. Maybe starting at f15.

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.
The most unexpected surprise to ever surprise the go world happened.
Soon hell will freeze over and Winds of Winter will be released.
Stone-sound is back on KGS.

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VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

uranus posted:



how would you respond to this? seems.. not a very efficient move.
I would double approach normally. But with that enclosure on the other side I would also consider something around k17.

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