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^This, but also check voltage like Kid said. You want to check for voltage between the lugs that the #12 wires terminate on and the neutral/ground bar on the left, where the white and bare wires terminate. If this is like most fuse boxes, the top left pull-out fuses are the main and the top right pull-out fuses are protecting the other hazard cable (usually a sub-feed or range). If you have 120v between neutral bar and each hot, you'll have to take apart each non-working outlet until you find the bad wire run or junction and then replace it where you have access. You also have 30a fuses on wire that's rated for 20a, which is probably why it burned the wire somewhere along the line before burning the fuse.
Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 05:47 on Feb 27, 2017 |
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Feb 27, 2017 05:37
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Re: the baseboard heater. I don't know what's going on with not killing power completely and getting weird voltage. Like you said, it's 240V, so a 2-pole (double) breaker should run it. Was the breaker that you shut off single or double pole? Almost makes me think this 240V heat circuit is protected by single pole breakers and shutting one off gave you the odd backfeed voltage. As far as sizing your new heaters goes, you want about 10 watts of heat per square foot. You can get by with as little as 6 or so watts/ft if it's in a basement or room with good insulation. This circuit could def be on with another room's heat, but that shouldn't affect the weird voltage. If you figure say a 16a load on your heat circuit using 240V, that means you can have 3840 watts of heat on a single 240V circuit; it's common to feed from one heater/thermostat to another instead of making home runs for each room. It's okay to go overboard with the replacement heater size, but you'll need to figure out which rooms are together and add them up to make sure you won't be tripping breakers. Keep in mind Current*Voltage=Watts and that #12 wire is rated for 20a. I don't think you'd have to derate the wire, but don't plan on trying to get a full 20 amps out of each heat circuit. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Mar 1, 2017 |
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Mar 1, 2017 22:54
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It's okay to check voltage of each hot leg to ground, but yeah, you'll have 120V to ground and 240V between your two hots.
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Mar 2, 2017 18:52
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I'm not up to date on 2017 code which changes some kitchen things, but if I understand correctly you can have an appliance on with 20a counter circuit as long as it'd use less than half of the circuit amps. I've always put gas ranges on with a counter outlet, but I've heard lately that new ones draw more than a person might think, so check on yours. Def keep the microwave and disposal on their own circuits. I think 2017 changes 15a dedicated appliance kitchen circuit GFI rules, but I'd still GFI protect everything in the kitchen that has metal housing like the disposal and dishwasher if it were my kitchen. Don't short yourself on counter top circuits; if you like to cook or entertain don't limit yourself to just two. edit: microwave should be a 20a run. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 16:44
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Raised by Hamsters posted:Yeah, it's a wee little microwave but I'll run a 20 for it. Yeah, hood and range are what I'd do. Fridges usually only pull 6 or 7 amps, they'd be fine too. Not sure what the rule is, but I've always used a counter outlet circuit for under cabinet lights and hidden the outlet (or transformer if low voltage) in the cabinet. If you have the counter space to warrant it and are going to have the walls open anyway, I'd go for 3 kitchen counter circuits. Oh, and in case your old kitchen isn't like this: put the dishwasher receptacle in the undersink cabinet and run the cord through the cabinet like the drain. Lot of old houses had direct wired dishwashers or an outlet behind it. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 21:02 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 20:57
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I was under the impression undercabinet lights can be on the small appliance circuit as long as they aren't hardwired. I don't have a code book on me, but I think 210.52(B)(2) would be the only thing hanging one up (no other outlets on the 2 small appliance circuits, which of course is exempted for outlets feeding installed appliances). People never want the min 2 counter ciruits, which I guess is why I haven't gotten docked for it, really need to get right with the code. Hard wired lights on a small appliance circuit is expressly forbidden in the same section I think.
Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Mar 5, 2017 |
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Mar 5, 2017 21:18
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If your existing box is on a stud, it's no problem. Cut the nails or screws on the old box with a reciprocating saw and replace with a fan rated cut-in like http://www.homedepot.com/p/Madison-...SBFAN/203343431
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Mar 17, 2017 03:40
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You don't need a neutral in every 3-way box, but you do need one switch box per room to have a neutral as a general rule. Many(most?) new occupancy sensors don't require a neutral, so I'm not sure this rule will stick around.
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Apr 18, 2017 17:53
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Raised by Hamsters posted:Thanks, that makes sense. Googling around it seems this falls heavily on local interpretation. So just to avoid any issues, I might just run 2x 14-4 to this specific box. My town has been hell to get any answers from. 404(C) as of 2017 states that "Where multiple switch locations control the same lighting load such that the entire floor area of the room is visible from the single or combined switch locations, the grounded circuit conductor shall only be required at one location". Prior, as of 2011, it was required at every box. As always local jurisdiction has the final say, just wanted to save you from buying 14-4 if you already have -3.
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Apr 19, 2017 06:03
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knowonecanknow posted:I need to wire an outlet but also have two lines coming out as well. What is the best way to get it all to fit in the 14 cubic inch pvc box? is it worth pig-tailing everything and stuffing it all to the back of the box then have a 4th line come from the tail to the outlet? I also considered using both sets of screw terminals and the back stabs, is that a good idea? Some times it feels impossible to cram everything into a box. It's all 12-2 btw. Are caps more resilient than I give them credit for? I'd def pig-tail it. It'll make it easier to fold the wires neatly back in the box and I trust wirenuts a whole lot more than an outlet for tying everything together. edit: Stab-in outlet termination is only for #14 wire Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 23:34 on Apr 19, 2017 |
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Apr 19, 2017 23:30
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If you're hooking it up low-voltage (115v) then white, red and yellow all hook up to L2 according the the plate. Follow the plate diagram: Pur to L1(black on cord), blu and org to eachother, brn and blk to eachother, and wht red and yel to L2, the white wire on your cord. Oh, and the green on the cord goes to the ground screw in the motor wiring compartment. The plate also says that this is for clockwise rotation looking at the shaft end, so follow the plate if you want rotation reversed. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 14:18 on May 16, 2017 |
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May 16, 2017 14:01
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dad on the rag posted:Ah, I see but one of the things that is confusing me are all the extra colors because there are only those three wires (purple, blue, yellow) coming out of the motor. So, purple to black L1 and yellow to white L2. Green on the cord to the ground screw on the motor. Blue and orange to each other but there is no orange? No brown, black, white, red, orange wires on the motor that I see. Am I just blind and there should be extra wires? It's hard to tell from the first pic what's going on, can you take a pic of the open wiring compartment? Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 02:55 on May 17, 2017 |
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May 17, 2017 02:50
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other people posted:We have a gas range (both the stove and oven are gas) and out of the blue it tripped the breaker on the circuit it is on and continues to do so any time we plug it back in. I plugged it into an outlet on a different circuit and it tripped that breaker too, so it is definitely an issue with the range and not its outlet. Just to be clear, it trips even when not trying to ignite, right? We can probably rule out the ignitors or overcurrent if so. The circuit board could be fried, but I doubt that would trip the circuit. Checking the receptacle and cord was a good first step; the only other easy thing I'd recommend is checking the wiring box on the range that the cord goes in to. Check for signs of arcing; I've found (fried) mice in them before. You can test for continuity between hot and ground either on the cord or where the cord terminates, but it'll probably just tell you what we can already guess: a hard short from hot to ground somewhere. On a side note, I'm a big fan of gas ranges as a home cook and could never go back to electric.
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May 19, 2017 18:45
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other people posted:http://imgur.com/a/kVy5u Check the smaller, left (as pictured) prong to the round ground. You'd probably have hot to neutral continuity through the oven light bulb.
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May 19, 2017 23:00
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I'm stumped (though not much of an appliance person). I really expected a short between hot and ground. It's possible that it burned completely through wherever it was arcing though. Hard to make the judgement call, but if there's no obvious arcing evidence underneath the back panel I wouldn't want to sink 200 in labor and more in parts on it. I don't mean to insult, but as a longshot, your meter does say "0" and not "Ol" for "overload" when checking to ground, right? You own a meter and thought to check the cord and receptacle, so I doubt this is an issue.
Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 23:44 on May 19, 2017 |
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May 19, 2017 23:41
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Yeah, I'm braindead, it's a phase to ground short. And 300 phase to neutral would be close to what a 60w bulb would be. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 23:53 on May 19, 2017 |
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May 19, 2017 23:46
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other people posted:I "own" that thing because it was left at our house when we moved in. I googled how to use it. Drape Culture has it right. OL means no measurable continuity, so it's not a short, which makes it confusing as to why it's tripping. The short has possibly burned through to the point hot and ground are no longer in contact, but that should mean that plugging it in no longer trips the circuit. So have fun checking out the back for black or melted spots and possibly shopping for a new range.
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May 20, 2017 00:33
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SoundMonkey posted:i'm having a ductless mini-split air conditioner installed soon. well i think am, the dude's coming today to have a look at the place. It's possibly cheaper to go 220. I assume a large (maybe average?)mini-split needs more than 20amps @ 120V and would necessitate a #10/2wg run instead of #12. I've never installed one 120V, so check the unit max/fl amps. The breaker isn't much more expensive and the disconnect, whip, and install would all be the same price.
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May 24, 2017 03:04
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Refresher question on circuit load. Say I want to get a device that's rated at a 20A load (let's ignore what it's actual draw is, this is just its nominal draw). It's my understanding that to safely use such a device, I'd need it to be on a receptacle / circuit that was rated for at least 25% more amps, so that the device wouldn't exceed 80% of the circuit's capacity. Is that correct? If so, what even is the next step up from a 20A receptacle? I'd expect you'd normally go to 220V power at that point. Looked at the product page and it's hard to tell what they mean by 20amp. Are the full load amps 20.0? What's the service factor? Does the unit need a 20a plug? and etc. I hate when product page are vague like that. Looking at the instructions, it seems like it comes with a cord and plug pre-installed. Basically use whatever properly wired outlet fits the cord and hope they've made a good product. An efficient 2hp motor will use close to 20 amps, so I'd def plan on having it on by itself. If it's a unit that you'd wire yourself and you had the option, I'd rather wire it 240V than run bigger wire and use 30a twistlocks. oh and glynnenstein is correct on it not being a continuous load Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 03:25 on May 24, 2017 |
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May 24, 2017 03:18
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minivanmegafun posted:Are mini-splits worth considering if I'm in an area where natural gas is cheap? Do mini-splits that do gas heat and electric a/c exist? No duel units that I know of. They're fine for area cooling, but the heat pump would probably be a waste if you're installed for cheap gas. Just spitballing, but I assume heat pump vs cheap gas probably doesn't justify the install without decent local electric company rebates. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 03:36 on May 24, 2017 |
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May 24, 2017 03:27
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quote:I've got 3 questions. 1. No. With the wash outlet installed, that wire isn't going anywhere. 2. Yes, this is normal assuming ground and neutral are bonded in the panel. 3. You should have six inches of wire in the jbox from where the wire enters your junction boxes, but I probably wouldn't change it at this point. You'll need a GFI outlet if the circuit has doesn't have a GFI breaker already. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 14:17 on Jun 6, 2017 |
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Jun 6, 2017 14:13
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Sir Lemming posted:So I just moved into a new house, and there are some electrical outlets that will need replacing for sure. They're obviously old (super beige) and plugs just seem to fall right out of them. Since we're replacing them anyway, I'm curious about trying something that's piqued my interest: built-in USB ports for charging. Does anyone have experience with this, or heard any horror stories to convince me it's a terrible idea? I was going to say use name brand, UL listed outlets only but the article starts off with that. I've been using Legrand ones and haven't had any issues. No idea from the engineering side of things, but I'd guess they're as safe as the adapters you plug into regular outlets.
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Jun 13, 2017 03:25
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Scrapez posted:Looking for some advice/expertise... 1. It depends on your total light load. Figure up your total wattage and divide by 120V to see how many amps you'll draw. In houses you can often go with a 15 amp circuit and save a couple bucks using #14 romex. 2. In my state, inspectors use how the property is taxed to determine which codes apply. If it's a farm building, you could use UF and no conduit. If it's on a residential property it may be treated as a non-attached garage. If it's commercial then everything will have to be metal-clad. 3. Not sure if there's a hard and fast rule here, but if it's reasonable to think it's exposed to weather you'll want weather resistant devices and wiring methods ie bell boxes and WR GFIs. 3b. Definitely GFI if it's possible that it will be a damp location. Depending on your local authority and property use, you may not be required to have GFI protection, but I would given the openness. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 19:11
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Barn talk: Don't use mc cable in damp locations. If this is a farm barn, use UF. If this is a residence and you don't want to put up a door, then it's probably a damp location and you'd have to use conduit. If you put up a door, you could use flexible metal raceways. Protecting nm wire means protecting it all the way, whether it's by drilling through the center of studs in an enclosed wall or protecting it with conduit. You can't just protect it up the wall and then leave it exposed to the elements or occupied room. edit: or metal flex in damp. Liquid-tite or seal-tite are ok. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 03:05 on Jun 30, 2017 |
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Jun 30, 2017 02:43
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Why not? The cladding is aluminum, right? So there should be no concern about rust. poo poo, looked up a product page and 330 in the NEC and you're right. Never used it outdoors or underground myself and just assumed it didn't have XHHW in it. Edit: Oh, was looking at PVC clad MC cable. Pretty sure regular MC isn't listed by the manufacturer as being suitable for damp or wet locations. edit edit: yeah, no regular non PVC clad mc is suitable for damp or wet locations. Never seen the stuff, probably p expensive. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 03:56 on Jun 30, 2017 |
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Jun 30, 2017 03:36
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Why not? The cladding is aluminum, right? So there should be no concern about rust. Aside from the code mandating following manufacturers' instructions, I can only think of a couple reasons. The segmented metal isn't as water resistant as emt or pvc conduit. Regular mc isn't rated to carry the ground on the metal shell and so (theoretically) in a damp/wet area there's a greater chance of energizing the metal coating compared to emt. I've personally found that regular mc cable coating has a solid measurable ground (shock-worthy even), not that I'd ever depend on it for a ground. They do make mc where the coating is rated to carry ground, but that's not really applicable. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Jun 30, 2017 |
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Jun 30, 2017 05:21
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devicenull posted:WTF. This. At least hook up the ground to the neutral; it's not code to have bonded ground/neutral in subs, but it's better than nothing at least maybe there are groundrods connected to those stranded copper green wires. As to where the USE in the lean-to disconnect comes from; was the transformer put in after this wiring was started? Is there a pole on the property feeding other outbuildings, or an old meter pole that is no longer being used? Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Jul 6, 2017 |
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Jul 6, 2017 00:35
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devicenull posted:What's that greenish box to the left of your meter (on the wall)? That almost looks like electrical cable coming out of it. phone
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Jul 6, 2017 00:36
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angryrobots posted:There are a number of issues with that electrical installation. Yeah, I feel silly for talking about code compliance with this a few pages back. You can fix this, but it would mean trenching a new line from the house to the barn. 4-wire subfeeds and unknown power sources aside, you could go the cheap route and probably prevent burning this down by bonding the 60a disconnect enclosure, redoing the barn jbox with a pvc adaptor going in to a 6x6 jbox and then up (in schedule 80 PVC) to the breaker panel which would need a ground rod. Even if you did this, I'd be worried about that lean-to falling down or settling enough to damage that hanging PVC conduit. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 02:23 on Jul 6, 2017 |
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Jul 6, 2017 02:12
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Hubis posted:Still better than the old "use a match to find leaking Freon" trick What's the trick? Smelling for phosgene?
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Jul 10, 2017 02:54
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Freon is non-flammable though.
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Jul 10, 2017 13:53
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^^^^^Thanks, learn something new everyday. I feel for the people who worked on ac prior to freon. I asked dad while I was helping install an ac condenser today, and he said that when he started he used a halide torch (on freon, which has chlorine in it).https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFXSt-krDZA I think there's a copper plate in the burner assembly; not sure if the flame color will change w/ just map or propane burning. Not an ac guy and might not have this right, just do labor for my dad and brother who are. edit: or maybe w/ the halide torch you don't need the copper plate, either way I didn't know about detecting chlorine like that. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Jul 10, 2017 |
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Jul 10, 2017 21:42
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You probably have a hot-surface ignitor, which are cheap and easy to replace. Thermocouples are also pretty cheap and easy to replace too if ^^^^^^^^^^ is your case. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 18:52 on Jul 17, 2017 |
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Jul 17, 2017 18:45
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SoundMonkey posted:i really wanted the outlet 14" from my kitchen sink (and right in behind the only sensible place to dry dishes) to be GFCI, but apparently it's wired double pole and double pole GFCI breakers for some reason get markedly more expensive the lower the amperage. the dude said a 60 amp one would be cheaper than a 15 amp one and yeah he was right. Do you need two circuits on the one outlet? You could always disconnect one of the hots, put in a single pole breaker for the other, and put in a GFI. It's not a 240V receptacle, right? Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 15:52 on Aug 7, 2017 |
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Aug 7, 2017 15:49
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Yeah, start w/ the breaker. If it is wired correctly, disconnect and isolate the wires in the jbox that had the GFI and see if the breaker still trips.
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Sep 14, 2017 00:18
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The Zombie Guy posted:Hola DIY goons. I was about to install a dimmer switch for the dining room, and I didn't get what I expected after the plate came off. Normal 1950's(?) NM wire. As long as you don't need a neutral for your switch (and you shouldn't), you're fine-ish. It's not great having an non-grounded metal box/device but isn't correctable without running new wires. In general I'm less worried about possibly getting shocked than starting a fire via nails/screws into a stud. If power for this circuit goes to an outlet first, you could GFI protect that and ground the switch to the metal box with a bit of bare #14 or #12. If you can't easily replace the wire between light and switch (assuming there is a ground in the light jbox) or GFI protect the circuit I'd probably just replace the switch. It's not like it's less safe than before. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 22:20 on Sep 30, 2017 |
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Sep 30, 2017 22:18
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Yeah, it won't be any worse than what it was.
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Sep 30, 2017 23:57
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If you can't get slack, get a plastic box on each old romex and put new romex between the boxes. The most realistic answer is to probably leave it as those splices are probably about as safe as the rest of the knob and tube system (or upgrade your wiring to get rid off all k/t for the same reason). Getting everything on arc-fault breakers would also lessen my anxiety if it were my house, but I assume you have a fuse-box. Anything short of replacing the k/t is polishing a turd. For the record, you can have 2 conductors in a 1/2" nm connector, but they have to be 12/2 or 14/2. I've never seen any acceptable k/t connector other than the weather-head looking one angryrobots posted.
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Oct 13, 2017 03:12
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On an unrelated note, gently caress sewage push stations in general. Just replaced a float in one and the previous electrician had loose wires nutted together just inside the enclosure (power in, line voltage down to float and back, and power down to pump). The methane (i assume) had corroded the exposed wire and nuts. The homeowner said she had questioned the electrician about it when he fixed the corroded bits a few years back and was told there was nothing to do but replace the wirenuts and clean things up every few years. I assume he just couldn't be bothered to drill a hole in the cement enclosure and bring the wires out to a weatherproof jbox. After pulling the pump out and going to get supplies, the homeowner hosed the pump off so I got to work in poo poo-soaked grass. I'll take snakes and wolf spiders over poo poo any day.
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Oct 13, 2017 03:31
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Doctor Butts posted:
You could replace that conduit junction that feeds the light with a 4" or 4 11/16" metal box. It's probably going to throw off the spacing of the rest of the conduit, so you might have to replace things all the way to the next box in the first photo (which would maybe help with the first issue). Replace both junctions with metal boxes and reuse the conduit you have. It might not be long enough so you'd have to add on to it. If the wires aren't long enough, make new runs in the redone section and wirenut them in the new junction boxes. For the wires that aren't already wirenutted in those junctions, make sure you cut them off long enough to work with. After getting metal junction boxes in, you could come off of one to feed a ceiling outlet with MC cable or EMT (to plug the light in). Is this outside the US? Haven't seen those junction covers before.
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Oct 17, 2017 00:25
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