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subversiveasset posted:What do careers in tax for public accounting/Big 4 accounting look like? I'm looking for a kind of 'year by year' or 'position by position' overview. I've worked in tax for a Big 4 firm for a couple of years now and it just depends on what group you're in. If you're in corporate tax, you pretty much spend your day dealing with 9 to 5 while the specialised tax groups are more project based. Hours wise you're probably being 'shielded' because you're inexperienced and nobody likes juniors billing their clients.  If your team members are doing constant 12 hour days they're probably looking to get promoted/improve their rating, the hours are suppose to be pretty constant and much better than audit. Career wise it's very limited compared to audit (you either become a tax manager in commercial/go to another Big 4 (accounting or law firm)/work for the government) but I'm pretty sure we get paid more than auditors and you have more 'international' experience. In short, tax is a good place to start out but if you ever not want to work in tax, it might be better to tough it out for a couple of years in audit.
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Mar 21, 2010 15:56
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subversiveasset posted:Ah, so instead of audit ("the goal of an audit is to get to an opinion," was the first thing my audit professor says on the first day of the semester...), the goal of tax is simply to get to...a return. I guess this should be obvious. At a base level the goal of tax is to do returns and 'effective tax planning'. I spend most of my time writing RAPs (reasonable arguably positions) for the tax positions that my clients want to take. Most of the people here generally hold a double degree (generally in commerce and in law) so there is a lot of technical work you need to know. The work is generally dependent on the client. One of my clients sends us documents from the US or UK and then when you open the envelope, it's actually a letter from BVI or Jersey (this is the 'effective tax planning' aspect  ).I realised you were also after some kind of year by year guide before so here goes: Start out as a junior (while studying at uni) or a grad. Consultant in first year. Senior consultant in two to three years (you will need to get a CA/CPA/Masters of Tax). If you've gone past the four to five year mark and haven't made senior, you generally get a tap on the shoulder asking if you want to change groups or go somewhere else. Manager in three to five years. Senior Manager in five to eight years. Director in six to ten years. Partner in ten+ years. We also have some kind of 'semi' partner position between director and partner for people who have partnership level responsibilities but aren't actually in the partnership. Unless you're looking to make partner (which most interns end up doing), it's best to leave after three to four years. Nipple Drainage posted:So moving into industry is best done with audit exp? even compared to advisory exp? I think so. Most of my friends in audit who left for commercial got the job either through a referral from one of their clients or via their contacts. Tax-wise, most people I know had to go through a recruiter to find their next job. Hope this helps!
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Mar 23, 2010 06:35
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subversiveasset posted:Thanks for the year-by-year guide. I guess, though, what I was more looking for were the kinds of responsibilities (broadly) by each year/position. Does your group do a lot of tax planning? If they don't then it's probably not the right group for you if you're looking to head into the tax planning direction. Alternatively, doing the more day to day stuff allows an easier move into a commercial tax group since most of it is just the day to day stuff and they outsource a lot of their tax issues. In terms of 100% tax planning, most of the high end international stuff is done by the magic circle while the national stuff is done by the top 4 local law firms so if you want a career in tax planning, thats the way to go. Although on that note, Boston, Deutsche, Goldman Sachs and some others also provide tax advice. Not sure if the terms I use are specific to tax but all the Big 4 here have the same named positions. Deloitte might use consultant and associate interchangably though. In terms of responsibilities, I'm used to seeing: Staff/associate: mostly data entry, tax returns, filing and general research etc. While not every manager I know does so, I generally involve all my juniors in someway or other either but not everyone does. It's about 90%-95 compliance work. Senior: Most of the work in the firm is done at a senior level, they review the work of the juniors and are more involved with the clients themselves. They also do the longest hours and start delegating work around. As a senior you'll need to juggle your workload looking at maybe 50%-70% compliance (with the majority of it being reviewing a consultant's work). If the partners themselves have consulting work, they generally work directly with one or two seniors and use managers/directors to confirm if the advice is correct. You also do a lot of research presentations and start doing some cross-firm stuff with tax partners in other groups. Managers: Most managers don't touch tax return preparation but do spend a lot of time reviewing it. You probably need to take more client meetings to consolidate work (ie, build yourself as the go to tax guy from your clients perspective). Technically you don't need to bring work in but there was a manager here awhile back that brought in a major client and made the jump directly to partner. The other major responsiblity is billing (you need to bill the client a certain $ amount) and 'firm' stuff (from recruitment to appraisals to preparing firm seminars etc). About half my time is taken up with client stuff and the other half with 'firm'. This is also the level where you're expected to be the most technically proficient. Director/Partner: Most of their day to day work is reviewing and signing off on other people's work. The other big responsibility is bringing in new clients. Most partners have a certain quota of new clients (of a certain turnover) they must bring in. If you're sitting on a big client account, you're generally also tasked with other firm or international projects. Last bit, I really hate the 'we are the best' culture and attitude but it's something all Big 4 have and probably need to have.
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Mar 23, 2010 15:35
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