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farraday posted:Qaddafi has announced at least three ceasefires. I wouldn't be surprised if he announced a cease fire ahead of the meeting either. Announcing is not the important part. At this point he's announcing that he's going to attack again. He shouldn't have bothered.
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Mar 28, 2011 16:54
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Lascivious Sloth posted:Are you a pol sci 101 student, because you have no idea what you're talking about. The quote doesn't even relate to Libya in the context it was said. If you're trying to spin the quote to have meaning then you need to provide an explanation. Are you saying that the US is a foreign power telling Libya what it should and shouldn't do? or that Obama is the power telling the US people what it should and shouldn't do. Either way you're just grasping at straws to create meaning. I can help out the Regressive in question. What he's really saying is this: "I don't have a point, but since the Teabaggers like to glorify things as symbols to score cheap points, I'm going to throw this George Washington quote out there because I have nothing to add to the conversation and, being without an able mind, think that my interpretation is the one that will immediately come to your mind, hence proving my point that isn't really proving it in the slightest." That's what their quotemining really comes down to: they want you to interpret something instead of them arguing their point because they have none.
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Mar 29, 2011 02:28
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straw man posted:Obama is at pains and contortions to project that America does not lead the charge in Libya. Plays better in Brussells, maybe. But here at home, why should we want our sons and daughters to fight in the Middle east for France? This isn't taken from Facebook as well? Anyway, unless we're strapping our soldiers to cruise missiles, I think we're safe.
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Mar 29, 2011 02:47
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St1cky posted:I know there's UN forces on the ground, I'm just pointing out that the US is selective about how they approach these things. Of course, no one in the US has any idea what's going on there and I only have an idea because I've started using BBC to get my foreign news instead of our "news" sources. I think that's why we're letting Britain and France do the heavy lifting. If things go bad, it's their mess to help out and settle and we can walk away with the 'we can throw in a little help if you want' sort of deal. We've got enough poo poo to deal with and having our allies who are neighbors anyway help absolves us of anything really miserable. After all, we're to blame for two unstable countries. No sense making it a third. I think it's the perfect solution, honestly. We help but we don't get our hands dirty. It's the best that could happen after the foreign relations disaster of the last decade.
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Mar 29, 2011 05:52
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Cartouche posted:I began by thinking that Gadaffy was a Bond villain. I am now beginning to view Obama as such. Except Obama is more like Dr Evil, giving Gadaffy a way out of every situation. I get the feeling the CIA is there to end this quickly. And by end this quickly, I mean 'execute every single member of Gadaffi's family and burn them on a pyre so we can get back to our own poo poo.'
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Mar 31, 2011 15:17
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LASERS
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evilweasel posted:The CIA isn't exactly great at james bond stuff. Cartouche posted:Well, in all fairness to the CIA, you'd not hear much about the successes. I imagine they may be doing things the easy way, like helping several Libyan officials to resign publicly to undermine the regime. A lot more effective than a few snipers.
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Mar 31, 2011 20:32
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Brown Moses posted:With Saif being named as a war crime suspect it'll shut down any chance of a negoiated settlement with Saif as some sort of temporary leader, something the regime would probably have demanded if Gaddafi had left. With that option gone it would seem the only way to resolve the conflict is to get rid of the entire Gaddafi family, and I'm sure his inner circle is probably thinking that the only way to survive the revolution and stay free is to turn on the Gaddafi family, something I'm sure those members of the international community in contact with Gaddafi's allies will be focusing on during their conversations. Let's be fair: there is no way in hell any member of that Family was going to remain in charge. The time for that to realistically happen was when the revolution started and before they started killing off people. For the Gaddafis to really expect a truce to be taken seriously after all of this shows how loving out of touch they are. There are two choices they have: they can either beg openly for asylum and run like hell, or they can be executed. Given how far this has gone, I would not be surprised to see Twitpics of them in a bloody pile on fire. A Winner is Jew posted:I thought Ben Stein was cool because he put his own money on the line for people to win on a game show. Then I read about his politics. Ben Stein's insanity can be summed up like this: He went from a speechwriter for one of the worst presidents in history, then salvaged himself by acting in a lot of things, and THEN threw that all away just to speak out in favor of Nixon and his own insanity for absolutely nothing but his reputation, his job, and a lot of money. In short? The man's a loving idiot.
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May 16, 2011 18:47
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I was going to ask how Bill Maher could be mistaken for Ben Stein, but then I realized they were on Comedy Central a lot during the '90s and they're both stark raving insane. So no worries. I don't think Maher wrote for Nixon, however. No, wait, he banged Ann Coulter. So there's his connection to insanity.
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May 16, 2011 23:54
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Young Freud posted:The Israelis for years have been using Apaches to assassinate Hamas officials, so there's precedent in using attack helicopters being used to hunt down and isolate Qaddafi and his senior commanders. I would say that the endgame for Qaddafi is coming close. I'm doubting he'll be taken alive, and will probably commit suicide when they finally come close to capturing him. Do we know anything more about his family as well, if they've successfully escaped the country?
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May 27, 2011 04:49
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Xandu posted:5 year old girl was killed during clashes in Sana'a yesterday. The fighting will only get worse. No kidding. You would think that a Middle Eastern government would know not to create martyrs in cases like this, but here we go yet again. We're going to get more bloodshed followed by more anger and disgust, followed by more unrest and uprisings. Note that in most cases the easiest solution--buying off the protesters or such--is never an option. It's always crush them under your own sense of power and then that fails horrifically. When will these loving rulers ever learn?
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May 30, 2011 05:58
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ecureuilmatrix posted:In particular, that general is a pig. In general, the whole drat "these filthy whores might accuse our brave men of being rapists!!!" mindset is a pigsty. It also explains why the protesters are so angry. Can you imagine an institution that corrupt and grotesque existing? No wonder several people are dying for this: it's mocking people to hit the breaking point. And it always follows the same thing: those in authority think that showing force backs their authority, and all it does is show how desperate and petty they are, hence enraging the populace to take more action.
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Jun 1, 2011 02:49
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Brown Moses posted:Two hours have passed since they announced they'd be making a statement in an hour, another bad sign for the Yemeni government. At this point, it's pretty much a sign that if he's still living he won't be physically able to be the president. Xandu posted:Consensus seems to be that Saleh was injured in the attack on the presidential palace's mosque and taken to the hospital for burn damage on his face. The government has walked back its claim that Saleh will give a speech tonight, the deputy information minister al-Janadi did instead. So instead of getting a dictatorship shooting its own citizens, we're going to have more than two groups possibly maneuvering for power in the absence of the current leader. Crap.
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Jun 3, 2011 19:24
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Actually, wasn't NATO asked by the rebels to assist them as Gaddafi was murdering them all simply because he could? Iraq was a war that was started on trumped-up charges and false evidence, but this military action was pretty much something that was requested.
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Jun 8, 2011 19:16
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Lawman 0 posted:
You're absolutely right. The one problem a lot of regimes have is that they really lose touch with reality at the expense of power. The narrative they like to push is one where they are strong, dedicated, indestructible,and infallible. But every single part of that 'machine' is a human being and is as flawed as anybody else in this world. They may manage to slam and slap people down, but when it comes to people finally having enough then that force is unstoppable. Even if you destroy the people, you do not destroy the movement. I'm surprised the idea of a regime being completely unstoppable still persists after the American Revolution, to be honest. No matter how big something is, no matter how strong they look, the real victor is the one who has nothing left to lose. As the Arab Spring shows us, you underestimate movements at your own peril because they have nothing but time on their side, and that is often enough.
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Jun 10, 2011 01:50
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and made me realize that in the modern world no matter how hopeless things get their will always be the chance for true change. 
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Pureauthor posted:Man, things in Syria are really going downhill right now. Isn't this the way it always goes? Just like Libya, we get protesters who are getting sick of their conditions, then the government has a crackdown where they kill a lot of people but try to lie their way out of it, then poo poo gets really real and eventually it gets to the point where the government has to make concessions or is usurped? You would think Syria would have figured this out by now.
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Jun 10, 2011 14:53
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Xandu posted:I've got no reason to believe this is true, but interesting if it is. Teenage Mutant Ninja Gaddafi! Dictators on the half shell! Sorry, couldn't help it. Xandu posted:Not that Jordanian parliamentary elections are particularly fair, but it's still a notable development. They're showing more smarts than most of their neighbors. "Revolution? gently caress that, we'll give you what you want now so we're not driven out on a rail."
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Jun 12, 2011 19:19
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Gaddafi must be desperate if he's pulling the 'I come in peace/just kidding' thing again. How many members of his family are still living again?
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Jun 16, 2011 22:24
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dj_clawson posted:I suspect he's wise enough to see that. He seems pretty on the ball compared to every other ME dictator. Considering he's coming to this conclusion before he has several hundred people executed, this is indeed a wise decision. "Well, I see the winds are a'changin. How about we just set this poo poo up now, I'll keep my position but allow you guys to do your thing, and we just call it even?" Finally, a monarch with some drat sense.
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Jun 20, 2011 00:24
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A student posted:The Libya / Iraq comparisons fall apart when it comes to the legal authorization, the motivations, the scale of involvement, and the reasons for regime change. Exactly. The only ones who are chanting 'Libya is Iraq' are the same people looking desperately to hang something on Obama while casually ignoring how they blindly supported Bush on much, much less simply because it was 'their guy' in office. Not to mention that Britain and France are heading this little mission since it's in their part of the world. Let's stop being dishonest here. If anything, the criticisms of this becoming Iraq ignores the whole purpose of the Arab Spring, the dictatorships and their oppressive behavior, and the effects of capitalism driving people to revolt because the system's massive swings drive people to the point of starvation and poverty.
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Jun 26, 2011 08:34
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Lascivious Sloth posted:I don't think so much that it's as a warning to NATO as much as it is posturing to his followers and trying to paint NATO as imperialist aggressors as he has been since NATO was involved. He is trying to start up an anti-western and anti-rebel uprising in Tripoli. It won't work. Yeah, all he did was justify the military action there now.
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Jul 2, 2011 04:38
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Spiderfist Island posted:Especially seeing that over half of said Embassies are now representing the Rebels, and all his overseas assets are frozen, and NATO's probably reading the radio around Tripoli round the clock, and... To be honest, Ghadaffi was never getting out of this alive. The rebels know that if he is anything less than dead, then they'll have to deal with him undermining any honest attempts to have a democratically run Libya. And given his terrorist ties, he would probably be in power within five years. The road to Libya's future goes right through the Ghadaffi Family. If they are not killed, their money will be frozen since Ghadaffi has just admitted he'll use terrorism to get revenge. Lascivious Sloth posted:Syrian state TV says Hama governor sacked Do any of these people in power ever read history? It tends to end badly when you give a group of people the ultimatum 'follow or die.'
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Jul 2, 2011 16:38
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Plastic_Gargoyle posted:How much money has CQ really got in his coffers to fund this kind of thing? You can't rely on mercenaries forever, eventually the well will run dry. Not to mention that having nothing but mercenaries puts you at their mercy. It wouldn't take much for them to say 'triple my pay or we walk' when you're forced to have new soldiers defend your last stronghold.
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Jul 9, 2011 07:16
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Kane posted:I'ma cross-post from D&D: If I may be so bold, it seems like the main thing about this whole year's uprising across the world is one of opportunity and not just freedom/liberty. It seems the push towards globalization and a consolidation of corporate wealth has resulted in a mass screwing of the entire international proletariat. Maybe the issue at hand isn't just rulers who can't cope, but everybody in the world has rumbled that capitalism as a concept simply does not work in its current state. And since avarice seems to be a very big issue with revolution (money does equal power in this instance), maybe we're on the cusp of something far, far bigger than the Middle East. It seems in the wake of all this austerity, there is a lot of emotions coming to the fore that trump a lot of lives. I'm not sure if this means the Middle East is special in this regard or that we're hitting a very big flaw in how the world operates. In a strange way, it seems that pushing companies to hire overseas just showed the issue with American-styled capitalism. Instead of giving corporations free reign to pay peanuts, it's just giving people a sweet taste of middle class life only to take it back and piss a lot of people off.
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Aug 8, 2011 03:38
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Toast Museum posted:By that logic, nobody in the US should ever protest, right? I mean, they have it better than most of the rest of the world, and for any given protester I'm sure you can find issues on which their position is injurious to someone else. But comfort is subjective, and that is really what is at stake here. We can talk about bridging differences ideologically all we want, but one thing that binds people together is the idea of financial and economic freedom to do those things we want. While most people would see it as a dire thing, it's actually a relief. We don't have to bridge differences in this case but just emphasize what we all want. And that is the freedom and the money to live life in a much better fashion. Althusser was right: money is the base of how our world works, and without it nothing else really functions. The rest of the superstructure--arts, entertainment, business, et cetera--simply does not hold without that money. Perhaps we should be pushing that as a way to enact change as well?
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Aug 8, 2011 14:20
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Xandu posted:Lots of "confirmed" talk on twitter right now that Gaddafi is trying to cut a deal to flee the country right now. At this point he better just start making friends because he is certainly going to need them. I'll be surprised if he comes out of this alive. He pissed off a lot of people.
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Aug 14, 2011 23:30
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Lascivious Sloth posted:Remember those long rambling speeches Gaddafi made during the early days of the revolution and resolution 1973? He's batshit insane which means he is unpredictable and not capable of rational thought. If he's really in Tunisia, he's staying there. And given his 'promises,' most likely in a coffin. His word really means nothing at this point.
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Aug 15, 2011 02:12
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Zeroisanumber posted:If it gets bad enough we might, might send in the 6th Fleet to finish Gaddafi off, but it would have to be a really bad stalemate with a lot of civilians trapped and no chance of success for the forseeable future. Gaddafi's gonna die. And he brought it on himself. If he didn't start off this whole thing with 'just kill everybody and gently caress any agreements I might make,' he might have a chance to live out the rest of his insane life in exile. Instead, he's shown he's cruel and cannot be trusted. The real question left is if he's going to run and be caught or if there will even be a show trial. I imagine he'll just be shot on sight with the whole of his family just to put a period on his reign. And Egypt and Israel might be going at it...loving hell.
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Aug 20, 2011 06:05
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Brown Moses posted:*poo poo is going down* Goddamn. Is anybody fighting for Gaddafi at this point? I can't imagine many of his remaining forces are going to fall on the sword for that weird motherfucker.
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Aug 20, 2011 22:31
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Sivias posted:I wonder what CQ is doing this very moment. Here's a hint.  Larger version: http://i.imgur.com/DhlXJ.png
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Aug 20, 2011 22:46
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Brown Moses posted:At least this should all be over before my wife gives birth. The fact that you are the person to go to for this along with that makes your job even more impressive. You're doing a hell of a job. You should do this for a living.
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Aug 21, 2011 01:17
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Brown Moses posted:The Khamis Brigade had the best weapons avaliable, so now the rebels do.  Sorry, had to be done. Slave posted:I bet there are a lot of very fancy guns floating about now I'd imagine the mercenaries are better armed than Gaddafi's men, even his son.
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Aug 21, 2011 16:58
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J33uk posted:That sounds scary as gently caress What do the 'government minders' think they're really going to loving do? They're going to die unless they surrender, and at this point they would be better served running like hell or just banding together to surrender. Then again, we are talking about Gaddafi supporters who didn't run last night, either.
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Aug 21, 2011 18:56
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Brown Moses posted:There's a big audience for their bullshit, so it probably just reinforces their delusions. These are people who literally believe the rebels are just small groups of terrorists supported by Qatari heavy armour that's currently rolling through the streets of Libya murdering babies,and that's not exaggerating the poo poo they believe. Just like with a lot of rural Americans: if you have a strong enough bias, you can be led to believe in anything with just the right amount of 'evidence.' And there are some enterprising people out there that will always taken advantage of that.
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Aug 22, 2011 16:26
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Scaramouche posted:This is frankly bizarre, but... am I wrong in kind of optimistically hoping that Turkey can have some kind of influence in the Syria affray? I'm trying to find the cynical 'turkey profits by screwing syria' angle, but it seems like they're legitimately pissed at Assad's shenanigans. It can't be easy dealing with a tyrant that's detached from recent history that's pulling this sort of poo poo on your own doorstep. Turkey's doing Assad a big favor: he can walk away, or he can go the Qaddafi route. And being sodomized in front of the world and then executed like a mangy dog is not a good sign.
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Nov 16, 2011 08:04
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OwlBot 2000 posted:Who sodomizes and executes mangy dogs? PETA has much to answer for. DarkCrawler posted:Looks pretty clear that we are looking at an another civil war here... That's the way these things usually go: it just takes one incident, no matter how small, that sets off people to make a valid change in their circumstances. It goes against the dramatic convention that we think life is ruled by where everything builds up to a climax. But it's just like how the Berlin Wall fell: give people a reason to fight and they will. And the harsher the regime, the more rabidly they fight.
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Nov 16, 2011 16:55
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