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genesplicer posted:I wonder what he would feel, if he knew what his act was going to give rise to. So much is changing because of him, but so many are being killed or wounded. Seriously, dude is like the new Tank Man.
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Feb 19, 2011 08:41
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I can't really see the outcome of the African mercenaries in Libya as something other than it massively loving backfiring and polarizing all dissent in the country against the Ghadaffi regime. If the videos are to be believed, the mercenaries are already getting killed and I can't see them sticking around too long once people start fighting back. I'm also kind of doubting that any of them will survive long if they get caught by the protesters, either. Slantedfloors fucked around with this message at 04:11 on Feb 20, 2011 |
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Feb 20, 2011 04:04
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Narmi posted:There was a Lybian writer interviewed who claimed that the mercenaries that had been captured said that they had been promised $30,000 dollars each, so I doubt there's a shortage of thugs they can hire. $30,000 will start seeming like a lot less once the mercenaries start getting found sans heads. It's nice the thug-for-hire business is undergoing such a boom, though. I mean, they went from $8/day to $30,000? The Mubs should have held out for more.
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Feb 20, 2011 04:14
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sweeptheleg posted:Blackwater guys are probaby suiting up I don't think Libya can afford their civilian-slaughtering rates.
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Feb 20, 2011 04:21
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BIG HORNY COW posted:The way this is all going down, I'd really bet we'll see a deposed President hat trick.
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Feb 20, 2011 05:08
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Petey posted:well, this owns  Egypt was the IMF's golden boy child, too.Hilarious.
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Feb 21, 2011 05:48
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Spiderfist Island posted:Really? I'm not up to date with [what was] Egypt's role in the global monetary system, could someone explain? Mubarak was basically following the IMF's blueprints for Egypt's economy - privatization of public resources/business, cutting food/fuel subsidies, removal of tariffs, etc, and was basically getting fellated by the IMF and World Bank for all he had done to improve Egypt's economy and held up as an example for the Middle East and developing world in general, despite none of that money actually going to the population. In large part, his "reforms" were what led to the conditions that made the revolution possible.
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Feb 21, 2011 06:38
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Shageletic posted:EDIT: About Egypt, more power to them. Though I am wondering where they're going to get the money they need to keep it up. Their medical infrastructure is kind of a joke (at least as far as I know), and subsidies had been cut before because the government claimed they didn't have the money to support it.
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Feb 21, 2011 06:53
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Benagain posted:Then Egypt started and everyone else followed on after that. And since Egypt is basically looked to as the rest of the Middle East's big brother, it's not likely that the other revolutions are going to stop any time soon.
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Feb 21, 2011 08:10
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Ace Oliveira posted:But from all we know, the army could be fighting alongside the protesters, or they could be helping the mercenaries. The protesters could be fighting back, or getting completely wasted by the mercenaries. We just don't know. All we can do is speculate. There's definitely some elements of the army that have already joined up with the protesters. Even ignoring the reports of tanks being used to overrun police and mercenary positions (at the Benghazi airport, I think), there were Youtube videos of dead mercenaries with soldiers among the crowd explaining what was happening.
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Feb 21, 2011 20:56
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Owlkill posted:I'm not calling for boots on the ground or anything like that but gently caress, you've got Italy, France and Spain (off the top of my head) all within striking distance, all with modern air forces. Surely a no-fly zone wouldn't be too controversial an idea. The absolute best solution (that is still pretty lovely) would be for any intervention to come from Egypt or Tunisia. It avoids any of the usual talking points for the regime and reminds the Libyan people that their neighbours are with them. Slantedfloors fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Feb 21, 2011 |
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Feb 21, 2011 21:47
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Intel5 posted:The United States 6th Fleet is based in Italy, there is at least one aircraft carrier within range.
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Feb 21, 2011 21:54
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roundmidnight posted:While it sounds like a good idea to send task forces and such, these uprisings have to be uprisings of the people, for the people, and by the people, otherwise they risk not being able to really take ownership of their revolution. As horrific and disgusting as the Libyan/Bahraini governments reaction to the protests and the number of people killed are, any revolutions have to be entirely internal if they're going to be perceived as legitimate. The point isn't just that they get a new government, it needs to be that the people were able to overthrow their rulers and demand their rights.
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Feb 21, 2011 22:09
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korranus posted:Oh no, Israeli intervention would be far worse than that.
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Feb 21, 2011 22:11
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Uglycat posted:Not endorsing or opposing this view, just pointing out that "the people get the government they deserve" and "democracy has to be earned" were republican talking points, prior to Bush's presidency. Hell, Bush himself used them during his 2000 campaign. Any new democracies have to come from the people and be considered an entirely Tunisian/Egyptian/Libyan affair, because they're ultimately the ones who will have to defend it. If, god forbid, some new jackass tries to seize power in one of these countries, the revolution needs to be remembered as a time when the people rose as one and got rid of him by themselves - as a focal point that can be used any time their rights are threatened. Foreign military aid is just going to fog over the whole issue and make it easier for the lessons learned to be forgotten or ignored. In fact, Iraq and Afghanistan are pretty much the exact conundrum I'm wary of. Outside military intervention overthrowing their oppressive dictators resulted in the new government being seen as either corrupt, identical to the last, or spineless puppets. The Iraqi and Afghani democracies are probably not going to last in their present form because the Iraqi and Afghani people have no personal stake in them.
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Feb 21, 2011 22:25
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Heran Bago posted:So is every dictator snapping and trying to outdo the last or something? Most of these kind of regimes use the exact same blueprint for dealing with internal dissent - politically loyal security services, sprinkle in some hired thugs, and a few elite sections of the military just in case. Any protests are handled by beating down everyone in the streets and waiting for the protesters to give up. Unfortunately, both Tunisia and Egypt showed that kind of preparation isn't worth poo poo when the entirety of the country decides they want you gone. The regimes are coping the only way they know how (maximum force) because all their prior preparations are worth exactly dick-all right now and are only going to get more outmoded in the future. The dictators only hope right now is to scare people into submission while they scramble for a new plan.
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Feb 22, 2011 06:17
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Giant Squid posted:Where are my local idiots getting the whole "this is step one of establishing a global Islamic caliphate" thing from? Scorchy posted:Glenn Beck probably. Seriously. Glenn Beck's official position is that these riots are caused by an alliance of the savage Caliphate-seeking Musselman horde, the Shadowy (totally not Jewish) Cabal of International Bankers led by George Soros (Nazi Jew), and the ever-present Neo-Soviet Communists in an attempt to overthrow friendly dictatorships and DESTROY AMERICA!!!!!!@! Slantedfloors fucked around with this message at 07:21 on Feb 22, 2011 |
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Feb 22, 2011 07:18
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SauceNinja posted:I hope your serious because this is loving awesome. You or whomever wrote that should write speeches used to confuse people. It a fun word puzzle!
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Feb 22, 2011 07:32
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Sleepless Dreamer posted:Actually, how the hell do I convince him that he is wrong. Why bother? He's already ignoring pretty much every piece of evidence in favour of his fake conspiracy theory that makes no sense, why do you think you can convince him?
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Feb 22, 2011 15:49
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Ask him why the US waited until all of their credibility was gone and their claims of impartialness were being mocked.
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Feb 22, 2011 16:01
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Great White Hope posted:Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I know Egypt's fallen, and Libya looks to be on the verge of it, but after those two which government looks like it's closest to falling? Or does nobody have any idea because who knows which country's people will be inspired by Libya falling?
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Feb 22, 2011 16:10
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This is the worst Fuhrerbunker ever.
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Feb 22, 2011 17:00
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Znorps! posted:I'm at the airport and can barely hear what he's saying. Can anyone give a transcript or summary of what he's saying? It will be the same basic idea as Ghaddafi's speech.
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Feb 22, 2011 17:09
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Brown Moses posted:Is he trying to blame outside forces for hiring mercenaires to attack the people? The official position of the Libyan government is that there are no foreign mercenaries in country, but if there are, they were hired by the (drug-crazed) protesters to brutalize themselves.
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Feb 22, 2011 17:18
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Jamsque posted:Massively audible sigh from the translator there, he is clearly fed up with this poo poo.
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Feb 22, 2011 17:26
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I'm just waiting for him to segue into how JFK was kidnapped in 1993 by gay Saucermen from beyond Negative-Pluto in an attempt to steal his identity so they could use counterfeit commerative plates to steal Libya's bountiful harvest of astral bear cheese.
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Feb 22, 2011 17:44
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Everything he can possibly think of before someone comes along and murders him. He's desperately trying to come across the collection of random strung-together words that will open the portal that will allow him to return to the dimension of pure gibbering chaos he originated from.
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Feb 22, 2011 17:48
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I would laugh my rear end off if he keeled over and died of a heart attack.
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Feb 22, 2011 17:54
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Aw, they cut out the feed right before he got to the part where he blamed Betty Crocker for destroying the Incas in an attempt to seize control of the Libyan Pie Industry.
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Feb 22, 2011 18:08
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Omnicarus posted:The Beck-Ghaddafi Hour would be a magical talk news program that I would watch with some devotion. My God. This is genius. B -"...and that's why the Muslim Communists want to control American's cereal supply. Your thoughts, Muamar?" G- "Rainmelon Rat India Snozberry!" Slantedfloors fucked around with this message at 18:18 on Feb 22, 2011 |
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Feb 22, 2011 18:15
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Nuclear Spoon posted:I like the artstyle, but I really don't know what's going on here. Looks like the protester is doing that thing where the stabee pulls the weapon into themselves to get at the stabber? It looks nice, but I don't get what it has to do with the actual situation, though.
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Feb 22, 2011 18:37
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Nonsense posted:What a terrible situation. There are definitely African mercenaries, but there are a lot of Libyan citizens who also happen to be black. It's awful to think they're just as fearful of reprisals from Gadaffi, as they are of wanton abuse from an angry and irrational population. Evidently, it's become an Egypt-type rising where the different cultural groups have put aside their differences because their leader is just that much of a cockmongler. Slantedfloors fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Feb 22, 2011 |
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Feb 22, 2011 20:05
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RoofieMyselfForFun posted:I don't understand why they don't turn the guns around and fight for the people rather than run to Malta, the Army has.
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Feb 22, 2011 20:51
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farraday posted:One of the most interesting parts of the Libyan protests has been the rapid disintegration of the government. The regime seems to be unraveling from the ground up, which is both incredible and terrifying. Someone more knowledgeable about the subject will be able to explain it better, but Libya's government (Jamahiriya) is basically unique in that it doesn't really exist - outside of tribal bonds, the only real concrete aspect of government is focused directly under Ghadaffi himself - there's no one else with even a fraction of his power. Once he was even remotely out of the loop, the whole thing fell apart like dead leaves.
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Feb 22, 2011 21:24
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Zappatista posted:I'm curious as to why Ghadaffi didn't try to buy off/bribe/throw oil money at the people of Benghazi if he and his advisors knew that unrest was likely to spring up there. Why jump to brutal repression if he supposedly has oil money to toss around? Needless to say, everyone remembered that he is literally the entire government and they started burning poo poo down. Slantedfloors fucked around with this message at 21:50 on Feb 22, 2011 |
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Feb 22, 2011 21:45
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Ace Oliveira posted:loving Amen. That's exactly what the Libyan anti-Gaddafi politicians want. But the UN can't even do that, so gently caress 'em. I find it hard to blame the UN completely. They were basically set up by the Western powers following WW2 as a rubber stamp for their police actions and set up specifically so anything they could possibly do can be always be vetoed by the most belligerent members. And then suddenly everyone expected them to actually do something.
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Feb 23, 2011 00:25
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cioxx posted:In other words he is slowly going into Hitlerbunker mode. Except that from what we've seen with his speech yesterday, instead of it being a Hitlerbunker it's a burned out shithole that looks dingier than a college apartment.
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Feb 23, 2011 15:30
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I can definately see the death toll in the high thousands if the reports of random bombings, strafings, shellings, and the use of AA-weapons on crowds are true. Fucker must hang.
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Feb 23, 2011 17:45
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Samurai Sanders posted:Something like "Good job, everyone! Keep doing that thing!" like before?
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Feb 23, 2011 20:00
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Are the airstrikes even still happening? From the sounds of it, a big rear end chunk of the air force has either defected, gone over to "Free Libya", or ditched in the desert.
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Feb 23, 2011 20:15
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