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Started this series while I've been waiting for my next job to start, and it's fantastic. I am in the middle of Fortune of War, and it's gratifying that the story basically flow between books as easily as between chapters. There's a few parts I've had some trouble with, especially as I've never really been sailing. In Master and Commander, when Aubrey is at the shipyard when he first gets the Sophie, what exactly does he do with the yardmaster and the mast? I got the impression he pulled a caper, but I couldn't figure out what or why.....
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Oct 1, 2017 20:17
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Genghis Cohen posted:The dockyard bloke is someone whose priority is the wellbeing of his stores, and wants to minimise risk of damage or waste by being very conservative with what he issues out. He doesn't want to give Jack this yard which he considers too big for the Sophie, in his opinion it would increase the chance of carrying away, or straining the mast and hull. Jack is much more daring, and is also a very good sailor who is willing to back his opinion. His priority is to make his new command go fast, so it can catch prizes and make his fortune. The implication seems to be that he's right and the semi-landlubber is a fussy old woman. That makes sense, thanks! I caught that he broke his ship to get something he shouldn't have, but couldn't quite smoke it, Thanks!
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Oct 2, 2017 03:51
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I'm at "Treason's Harbor" and when Stephen and Martin are in the diving bell lifting the galley's sunken "treasure", it killed me when they couldn't figure out how to tie the knot on the hook. Stephen's line about not wanting to ask for help "So they don't think I'm not a complete sailor" was so perfect. My wife asked me what was funny and I had to just say "nothing" rather than explain 3000+ pages of leadup.
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Oct 23, 2017 19:43
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uPen posted:Holy god Post Captain is long. Introducing Diana and Sophia, going bankrupt, escaping through Spain, the Polychrest and then the Frigate with the bees. Agreed, I found Post-Captain to be the hardest book to get through. The naval action at the end was one of the best of the series though, and Post Captain and HMS Surprise are really just 2 parts of that Chapter of Jack's life. HMS Surprise was one of my favorite of the series, so you just kinda get through it.
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Nov 3, 2017 21:45
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Genghis Cohen posted:Holy hell, that bit in HMS Surprise when Jack brings Stephen out of Port Mahon. "tell him that if the commandant is not here in 10 minutes, I will kill him on that machine". The extreme tension and horror of the scene is portrayed so well by the terse writing. It just sort of gets across how disjointed, quick and hard to take in the whole episode was for those involved. Everything about HMS Surprise is really good. Maturin's short interactions with the Indian girl Dil and the big Naval action near the end are great. I also love how the great duel that is essentially the climax of books 2 and 3 are entirely composed of like 3 paragraphs It really is fantastic. I feel like it's a high point in the series.
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Nov 5, 2017 03:36
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"Why,' said Stephen, 'it is because they are curtailed of course.” " -- “...looking angrily at the wombat: and a moment later, 'Come now, Stephen, this is coming it pretty high: your brute is eating my hat.' 'So he is, too,' said Dr. Maturin. 'But do not be perturbed, Jack; it will do him no harm, at all. His digestive processes--” -- My favorite is probably: “Why there you are, Stephen,' cried Jack. 'You are come home, I find.' That is true,' said Stephen with an affectionate look: he prized statements of this kind in Jack.” Also add just about any description of Stephen laughing.
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Nov 13, 2017 23:39
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Colonial Air Force posted:It's actually bothered me for a while, but usually in the car, then I forget to look it up or ask. POB is usually really good about avoiding anachronisms, so I thought it was odd. O'Brian uses can a lot, now that I saw that I notice them using it all the time. He does say the Surprise uses leather tankards for beer, so I think he is consistent. In Reverse of the Medal did O'Brian really mess up Babbington's name and have to correct it in the next book? That's pretty funny.
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Nov 25, 2017 02:40
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Genghis Cohen posted:Where? I don't remember that. http://wiki.hmssurprise.org/phase3/index.php/William_Babbington Fanny refers to him as Charles and no one says anything, and then in the next book she says its because of a masked ball. Seems like O'Brian just forgot the name.
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Nov 26, 2017 02:02
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Phy posted:I'm sorry to interrupt fun quote time but I just finished The Thirteen Gun Salute, and did Stephen just spend the entire book practicing with a sharpshooter's rifle only to ice Wray and Ledward offscreen? I finished that book a week or so back and that was basically my exact reaction. Thirteen Gun Salute Spoiler: Killing them off-screen I liked. Somethings an intelligent agent does are not witnessed and of all things, Stephen would be most discrete with that. The dissection was loving cold though. And bringing it to Van Buren as basically a play-date just added insult on top. That's just how little Stephen thought of those two.
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Dec 21, 2017 23:16
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Professor Shark posted:I remember thinking in 13 Stephen totally killed these guys and dumped their bodies on his friend, but I didn't want to ask for confimation Arglebargle III posted:It's strongly implied that Stephen shoots them as they try to leave town. In the most Stephen way, it's possible the Sultan had them killed with Stephen's assistance. That's why it was perfect that it wasn't witnessed by the reader. But actually, yeah. Stephen gunned them down while chewing coca leaves.
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Dec 22, 2017 16:55
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Yeah, he pulled a really nice hurling move (game is hurling, the stick is a Hurley), and promptly loses the game for his team because he didn't know the rules and couldn't pay attention enough to the game to figure it out. It's especially funny because his hurling pickup is basically a textbook skill that would be really hard to do with a cricket ball. The earlier payoff too on Stephens "unusual" bat (he just cut his own Hurley) is also a nice joke. I don't know if you'd be allowed to effectively hit the ball twice in cricket, but if you are and Stephen could do a pickup like that he'd be a world class century man for sure. But he has he bugs and hookbills instead.
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Dec 25, 2017 06:38
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The Lord Bude posted:Beverages were chilled by tying the bottles in a net attached to a rope and dropping them deep under water for a while. Right, and if I recall they were drinking the Sherbet not in the middle of the Red Sea, but when they were watering off the coast, and I assumed they were drinking it then because the water was actually cool (since they usually drank Claret or something from a bottle, so not made from the cool water thy were taking on). I may be wrong about that, but I believe they were specifically drinking Sherbet because they were just a bit offshore.
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Jan 19, 2018 22:15
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Quick informal poll -- Books then literally googled "Aubrey Maturin Something Awful"
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Jan 21, 2018 02:03
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I haven't watched the Movie yet as I wanted to at least get through Far Side of the World, and now I'm on Yellow Admiral and I sorta might just finish off the series before seeing the movie.
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Jan 22, 2018 17:17
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PhantomOfTheCopier posted:Ah that is a much better summary. Hazing. Makes sense now. The funny thing is as crazy as Reverse of the Medal was, O'Brian had to dampen the real trial of Cochrane because it would be too crazy for a novel. In the real trial the color of a lapel was a crucial disputed point and the politics behind it were way more nuts and petty.
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Feb 6, 2018 16:37
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Truelove is a good one, I like the books that dive more into the personal dynamics of a ships crew. How is the unfinished voyage? I just finished Blue at the Mizzen and thought it was an excellent way to end the series. Is the Final Voyage worth reading?
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Feb 27, 2018 10:24
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PlushCow posted:Don't bother with The Unfinished Voyage. It's only a few chapters and not worth the full price of a novel. It's nice to know, and comforting in a way, that Jack and Stephen's adventures together would continue after Blue at the Mizzen. As you say Blue at the Mizzen was an excellent end to the series. Thanks! It's weird to have read all 20 in they last 6 months but then leave the unfinished voyage, but I also feel, I dunno, dirty reading a story that wasn't meant to be published. MeatwadIsGod posted:I'm on the last chapter of the first book in the series and have really loved it, even if many of the nautical descriptions go by me. The relationship between Jack and Stephen is so genuine, and the book is often really funny. One thing that was a throwaway line from Stephen very early on has me curious though. He mentions - only once - that he's recently been absorbed in cryptograms and so far it hasn't been touched on again. It's kept me guessing at an undercurrent of espionage throughout the whole book. FYI, Post Captain is maybe the lowest point in the series and hardest to get through. HMS surprise is I think the best of the whole lot and it's really the second half of the story started in Post Captain. Commit to reading them both. Before (or after) Mauritius command is a good break point anyway if you don't just charge though it. The naval terminology actually gets a little lighter and easier to read as a non sailor too, the first book is the most dense. And Stephen never learns a damned thing. Lockback fucked around with this message at 00:08 on Mar 1, 2018 |
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Mar 1, 2018 00:05
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Decius posted:Post Captain is the hardest to get through, but arguably the most important book of the whole series, setting up all the domestic parts for the rest of the series. It's also the most masterfully written in my opinion, full of subtleties and nuances and a series that's already so perfectly written. But Jack behaving like a scrub the whole book and Stephen's resentment and depression makes it very hard to read or re-read. Them being on the worst ship ever built with a crew that's not very happy for most of the book parts on sea (not many in the first place) doesn't help either. As MeatwadIsGod mentioned, the drawing room stuff was not the series strongest suit, and the I think the tone suffered from the listlessness of the characters more than it should have. I don't think it's a bad book, but it does strike a tone that is different than Master and Commander and isn't really returned to until the trial. I really give my warning since Post Captain and HMS Surprise are really a continuation of one another, the reader can get dogged down by Post Captain when you really need to read those two together, both are essential to one another. That and HMS Surprise is my favorite of the entire series. uPen posted:Post captain has a ship full of bees, it can't be bad. This is a fair point.
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Mar 12, 2018 22:06
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Aubrey trying to press his debt collectors was also really funny.
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Mar 12, 2018 22:09
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Admiral Bosch posted:Popping in to say this thread is making me actually sit down and read these books... boy oh boy, Post Captain is boring so far. Maybe my temperament would be better suited to Hornblower, but COME ON. get back to sea already. i don't care about maturin getting friend zoned Yeah, that was my reaction too. The Naval battle at the end of Post Captain is really badass though, and HMS Surprise is (I think) probably the best of book (although there are some later ones that come awfully close). No other book in the series spends quite so much time in Jane Austen world. Some later books have quite a bit outside of the sea but I found them more engaging (although I also never liked Austen/Bronte so its all a matter of taste).
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Mar 26, 2018 15:59
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MeatwadIsGod posted:The true romance is Killick and the Woman he bought in an auction. Everything else is window dressing.
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Mar 27, 2018 16:37
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Murgos posted:I just realized that Maturin kills all of Diana's known lovers except for Jack, although he was going to. Maturin is super duel-happy. I know its done on purpose, but I enjoy the dualism of Maturin lamenting war, violence and tyranny but then super willing to stab anyone who offends him.
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Mar 28, 2018 23:24
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I mean, I'm not going to spoiler my reply so if you don't want to hear about later-book drawing room gossip skip it.Fire Safety Doug posted:I thought Jagiello did try his luck with Diana, but got turned down gently, so he went for the "absurdly pretty" girl back in Sweden? I'm pretty sure there's no comment from Jagiello or Diana that either of them attempted anything with each other. There were rumors which came from French agents trying to sow discord, but I thought that whole episode in Sweden was showing that Diana had finally given up chasing men and was now literally above it all in a balloon. She was the one who arranged Jagiello's marriage, and, let's face it, Jagiello was absurdly good looking but he didn't have near the guile to even try to seduce Diana.
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Mar 29, 2018 15:46
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builds character posted:Look, if you guys want to believe that Diana, who doesn't view sex as a particularly big deal, and the really really really ridiculously good looking Lithuanian didn't get together after she thinks that Maturin jilted her for some hussy then I don't know what to tell you. I'm also pretty sure you're supposed to read between the lines when Diana is having the sex talk with Sophie that she just sleeps around and it's no big deal. Hands where I can see them, buster.
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Mar 29, 2018 16:24
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While I agree you could read that there was an affair (and it isn't out of character of Diana), the whole thing was setup like a Three's Company episode: 1. Maturin was getting letters from the French 2. Jagiallo was absurdly good looking and kind of an idiot 3. Diana was obviously pissed at Maturin and looking to get even That's why the reveal of "Diana is flying balloons, not living with Jagiello, and actually set up his marriage. WHAT A RELIEF!" is written the way it's written. If Jagiello actually did have an affair then the whole reveal and catharsis of Maturin makes no sense. Plus, if Jagiello and Diana did have an affair, Stephen would have tried to stab Jagiello. Because that is exactly what Stephen does.
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Mar 29, 2018 16:35
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AlphaDog posted:What do you mean, "tried to"? He has wanted to stab people and have his mind changed. And in this case Stephen would have wanted something public, would have challenged him with a nasty insult that would burn his soul, and then he'd really only want to wound or disfigure Jagiello. Stephen is still a gentleman.
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Mar 29, 2018 22:03
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Ok, I'm now certain that we meet stephen's father. They could be 2nd cousins and refer to her as "Aunt" instead of "Great-Aunt", which would probably be more likely than calling father & son cousin, especially since Stephen is referring to his great aunt as "Aunt" here. (Or they could be cousins once removed. OR have a weird incestuous circular family tree.)
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Jun 4, 2018 17:32
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I think time still passes even though the historical years don't (so the characters don't match the years anymore), but yeah Pullings is either super well off or had been financing a hell of a opiate addiction.
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Aug 25, 2018 13:13
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Finally read 21, and it's a bittersweet read. Shame about the pretty obvious Chekhov's "Dude Stephen is clearly going to shoot/stab in a duel" that is unresolved....
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Sep 28, 2018 17:28
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I can't remember the line, but when Jack spots the other captain had a black armband and idly wonders if he killed his son during the last engagement gave me chills. They used the line again in the movie, but it wasn't as impactful.
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Oct 8, 2018 22:09
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I enjoyed the final action in Post Captain, where the Polychrest founders and the Fanciulla is taken. That was a pretty fun battle.
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Oct 11, 2018 20:16
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Holy crap, that is awesome. Are you going to do any other recipes?
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Oct 25, 2018 18:42
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Yeah, the joke is they are so addicted to their coffee they drink rat poo poo from a coffee bag despite knowing exactly what they are doing. Killick still knows how to make a good brew though.
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Feb 9, 2019 07:23
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Nuclear War posted:How did Martin die? He doesn't die. He thinks he contracted VD from Clarissa Oakes and tried to "cure" himself with mercury nearly killing himself. Aubrey sends him off to live on his lands. He might have given him a parsonage, or maybe he was going to and then changed his mind. Davidge: Killed in action, which was disappointing because I thought his story wasn't quite done, but ah well. West: Dies when the Volcano erupts, which is a pretty metal way to die
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Mar 13, 2019 22:02
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Raskolnikov2089 posted:Didn't he just have lustful thoughts and flirted a little bit and thought that was enough for god to punish him with a VD? He did at first and that's why he was uncomfortable but then something happened and its almost certainly that he slept with her since she had no qualms about sex. I guess it's left up somewhat to the reader but I don't think he'd try to kill himself over thoughts.
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Mar 15, 2019 00:27
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You can always tell when Stephen wants to get to some stabbin'
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May 20, 2019 17:16
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Stephen just LOVES to stab people. It's a funny duality where Stephen seems adverse to battle and war in general but loves a duel, whereas Aubrey seems to relish a battle (though, not afterward) and in social situations is mostly a teddy bear.
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May 21, 2020 16:51
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:There is a blink-and-you'd-miss-it mutual apology scene at one point i believe. Yeah, they have one of their conversation-isn't-about-the-conversation scene, but it is easy to miss it.
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May 21, 2020 21:09
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Lemony posted:I mentioned this briefly in the Milhist thread, but the second time I read Master and Commander I felt like a moron when I realized that the first time Jack and Stephen meet they challenge one another to a duel, and that the duel only doesn't happen because Jack is so happy that he received a command that he immediately apologizes when he runs into Stephen. And they eat a bunch of clams instead. Sax Solo posted:e.g. a Stephen who very much wants to let us know that his daughter is beautiful and brilliant, not like Jack's fat stupid kids. Jack's kids are awesome though. Sax Solo posted:so in the books we also feel like we're losing Jack too, or only seeing him through Stephens (often uncharitable) eyes, I disagree, and think it's more about Jack's position and the plotline, not how it's written or how the author feels. The most charitable passage towards Jack comes when Stephen listens to him play without Jack's knowledge and that comes late in the series. God drat is that scene beautiful.
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May 26, 2020 14:51
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freebooter posted:I'm only up to book 13, but it's striking how Jack and Stephen have virtually nothing in common except music, and yet they are great friends. And strong coffee. In fact, strong coffee is probably the bedrock.
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May 27, 2020 15:23
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