DREDD - Judgment is coming (more specifically on September 21st)

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > Cinema Discusso > DREDD - Judgment is coming (more specifically on September 21st)

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Remove Dredd's helmet and this is a generic action movie. That's really not a good thing.

# ¿ Jun 23, 2012 22:30

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# ¿ May 15, 2024 05:42

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

etalian posted:

Yeah but capturing the the acidic satirical natural of the series would be much more challenging than going the interesting setting for a action movie route.

I think the Stallone movie captured the feel of Mega-City One pretty drat well and made it really unique and visually compelling. Like, it felt like a place that needed hard-core "I am the law" Judges to dish out serious justice and keep the peace.
I'm really not feeling that in the DREDD trailer.

Payndz posted:

I suppose one problem is that the Stallone film burned through some of the more iconic and 'straightforward' Dredd villains (Rico, the Angel Gang)

But since this is meant to be an introductory "reboot" and isn't connected to the Stallone movie (which came out 15+ years ago and people probably don't remember too well anyway) why would it matter if they re-used some of the more straightforward Dredd villains?

# ¿ Jun 24, 2012 05:35

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

No one is screaming bloody murder, though. :confused:

People are expressing legitimate concerns based on what we've seen so far. If the final product ends up being awesome, then that's great! It's not like we want the movie to fail, we're just setting up realistic expectations based on what's available.

# ¿ Jun 24, 2012 11:27

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

WickedIcon posted:

Yeah, I pretty much figured you would be one of the ones who liked it. For all its faults it has amazing production design and art direction.

And Alan Silvestri's soundtrack is pretty kickass, too. The main Dredd theme rules.

der juicen posted:

I really like the song in the trailer. Really worked with the slow-mo first scene too.

I did too, so I looked it up.

# ¿ Jun 24, 2012 18:31

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Timby posted:

Much like everything else besides the look of Mega-City One, though, it's completely inappropriate for Judge Dredd. It's "action hero suite 101."

I said it in another thread, but Silvestri's Dredd theme would have been nearly perfect for Captain America, instead of the bland junk ("Star Spangled Man" aside) that Silvestri turned out for that film.

The Avengers anthem he did for 'The Avengers' was pretty righteous, though.

# ¿ Jun 24, 2012 20:19

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

massive spider posted:

I actually prefer Dredd as an unthinking fascist to be honest, the whole "well shucks maybe I'm in the wrong after all" thing doesn't really work for me.

To me its a lot more interesting and braver to have a protagonist who's just an out and out dick rather than try to humanise him.

I dunno, when you have a one-note (but "badass") protagonist, you end up with Rorschach and you're stuck with the audience cheering on a character they really shouldn't be cheering on just because he's "badass".

# ¿ Jun 24, 2012 20:29

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

achillesforever6 posted:

Plus didn't it have a great score?

It totally did.

The effects were pretty great, too - the ABC Warbot was loving righteous, the make-up effects on the Angel Gang were nuts, and Mega City One looked like an even more dystopian, overcrowded, and hosed-up 'Blade Runner' and it looked great. The movie had lots and lots of problems, but the production values and visuals were not among them.
Also when Stallone was in full costume and kept the helmet on, he absolutely nailed the look of Judge Dredd.

# ¿ Jun 25, 2012 03:47

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Neo Rasa posted:

blackguy32 : That Dredd vs. Death game does follow the comics a bit more (it better, it was made by Rebellion, the owners of 2000 AD Comics!). I liked that again, unlike the movie it had mutants, zombies, incineration for minor crimes like "illegal possession of a goldfish," liberals, vampires, internal affairs judges that would completely destroy you if you messed around too much with the civilian populace, etc. You couldn't go around slaughtering them, but you COULD incapacitate and arrest just about anyone for the most minor thing. Also the immortal moment where I shot someone with an incendiary round and while they were flailing around on fire punched them which caused the upper half of their body to fly off their legs and splatter against a wall. Five seconds later the "Actually Dredd, that may have been a bit harsh." voice over from your boss plays. Also that game is notable for having Left 4 Dead in it as one of its mini-games. Zombie Holocaust coop owned.

The best part was how every time you arrested someone, it would pop up on your HUD with what their offense was and how much time they were going to serve, and they were usually context-appropriate. It was pretty entertaining.

# ¿ Jun 25, 2012 06:11

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

AccountSupervisor posted:

Thats why I said I know its part of his character, but for Stallone it worked because Stallone is Stallone and an audience can connect with that.

I just dont think it works with Karl Urban. Sorry but I think its a poor decision to cast somebody like Urban for a role that requires you to not see the main characters face.

Karls "gruff" is not good enough, I dont think he does the grit of Dredd very well it comes of as incredibly forced.

But you're not supposed to connect with the actor, you're supposed to connect with the character. That's especially true with Dredd - you're not supposed to know what he looks like under the mask, similar to V in 'V for Vendetta'.

# ¿ Jun 25, 2012 23:20

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

But the problem with that is with Dredd he's not supposed to be a "real person", you're not supposed to connect with him the way you would with Hugo Weaving as V (since you know who Huge Weaving is, what he looks like, and what he sounds like). Dredd is and always has been faceless - his character is carried by his actions and dialogue rather than his facial expressions. Rorschach worked just fine as a memorable, comprehensible character (both in the comic and the movie) prior to him getting unmasked. Hell, even on the page you don't know exactly what Dredd sounds like, because in the written medium it's left to the reader to fill in how the characters sound in their head. With the Stallone movie, Dredd sounded "like Stallone", for better or worse. Likewise, in this new trailer he sounds "like Karl Urban", and as someone intended to be a faceless character that pulls me out of it a little bit because I know who Karl Urban is and what he sounds like.

Frankly I think it'd be even better if Dredd were played by a total unknown and you never found out who played him. I think that would go a long way towards selling Dredd as a "faceless avatar of Justice", and would really break the actor-character connection you're bringing up.

# ¿ Jun 25, 2012 23:42

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

AccountSupervisor posted:

Either the cinematographer needs to carry some of that weight and exaggerate the character visually or the actor needs to, and it looks like neither is doing that here.

But the thing is neither of that has anything to do with your original point of being able to see Dredd's eyes (which would violate the #1 rule of Dredd). That's my point - you can pull off Dredd without seeing his face; the comics have been doing it for 30+ years. The very point of his character is that you don't see his face. If you have to see his face, you've missed the point. That's a constraint I'm quite confident movies can work around - see also: Rorschach, V for Vendetta, the Predator (to an extent), the Batman movies, etc.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2012 00:06

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Bugblatter posted:

But V for Vendetta is the only one of your examples where you don't see the actor's face?

Eventually you see the face of Rorschach and the Predator, but they still worked just fine as faceless entities prior to them being unmasked. In 'Predator 2' you see the Predator's thought-process in the meat freezer as he figures out he's in a trap, and you never see his face until after the fact. With Batman you could argue that seeing Bruce Wayne's face is unimportant to knowing what Batman looks like since they're arguably separate "characters". The point is that Batman works just fine as a character by himself despite being in a full cowl that hides everything except his jawline and his eyes.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2012 00:39

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

AccountSupervisor posted:

Maybe in the full film Ill see the necessity and get the vibe of a "faceless judge" but so far all I feel is "Who the gently caress is the main character and why the hell is he so boring?"

I think you just don't "get" Dredd, and hopefully the movie will convey why he's faceless. Frankly I'm not seeing the magical necessity that we need to see a character's eyes to connect with them, and why he's apparently coming across as a complete non-entity blank to you just because you didn't see them in the trailer. That's seriously the most baffling part to me. Was 'Robocop' "boring"? Robocop's personality and performance is radically different once he goes from "Murphy" to "Robocop", to the point that knowing what he looks like and initially seeing his eyes is completely irrelevant. What about Spider-Man? Or Lavarr Burton on Star Trek? So when you don't see someone's eyes, you're unable to read their body language or voice in order to determine character and motivations and the like? How do you function in real life when interacting with someone wearing sunglasses (who surely isn't a trained master actor, and is just a normal person doing something normal like wearing sunglasses)? What about talking on the phone with someone? How can you ever enjoy books, what with there being nothing visual at all for you to connect with? Like I'm seriously not getting what the absolute necessity of eye-contact is. :confused:

Don't get me wrong I totally understand that eye-contact is important in communication, but you seem to be acting like it's the be-all end-all and it's really not.

AccountSupervisor posted:

But what you are not understanding is that all of these examples have what is necessary to make up for these characters having no face. Performance, body movement, blocking and camera movement/placement.

Dredd has none of these things in this trailer. Theres nothing interesting about this character and the lack of eyes/face pushes that to an extreme.

I guess I disagree, or I'm at least willing to give the movie the benefit of the doubt until I see the whole thing because all we've seen is a 2-minute trailer. Dredd being faceless is an important (if not defining) part of his character. If they were going to violate that and show his face, why bother making a Dredd movie at all? :confused:

Edit-- forgot another great "faceless character" example: Darth Vader.

Xenomrph fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Jun 26, 2012

# ¿ Jun 26, 2012 00:51

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

AccountSupervisor posted:

I read Dredd comics when I was younger, so dont tell me I dont "get" Dredd. Read my first post, I very explicitly say "I know this is part of his character".

You said that, but you aren't acting like you understand it. Right out of the gate you were asking why they didn't show his eyes. If you have to ask that about Dredd, regardless of the medium or who's playing him, it's a pretty good reason to think you don't "get" Dredd. You're never supposed to see his face, full stop.

AccountSupervisor posted:

I dont like to come at films that are adaptations from a fan level. I try my hardest to willfully blind myself to my foreknowledge of the source material so that my perspective is fresh and nothing in my critiques is left up to "well thats the way it was in the source material".

Well when you're adapting something from the source material, I can only hope you'd be true to it where it matters, otherwise what's the point of even adapting it?
Yes you have to make concessions for the medium, but if you have to sacrifice defining character traits in order to adapt it, you should probably stop and think about what you're doing and why.

AccountSupervisor posted:

Robocop, Spiderman(you see Parkers face, so this doesnt count) and Geordi from Star Trek all had characteristics that were highlighted by performance, camera placement/movement or were just interesting characters in the first place. Plus these characters faces are more visible than Dredds. His helmet is large and distracting and doesnt fit with his face well. Urbans jaw is just not big enough.

Frankly I think you're jumping the gun, I guess we'll have to wait and see how the movie plays out. I think he looks fine in the trailer (although I wish the costume design was closer to the source material/Stallone movie) and I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt because it's hard to gauge Urban's performance across the entire movie from a 2-minute trailer.

AccountSupervisor posted:

90% of people who are going to see this film do not read Dredd comics and have never seen the 95' Stallone film or they have and share most people sentiments towards it. They arent gunna watch this trailer knowing that Dredd is supposed to be faceless and that its part of his character/thematic. I guess Im only speaking on behalf of the general movie audience theoretically, but I cannot see people who arent familiar with the source material being too excited that you cannot see the face of a boring character portrayed by a non-recognizable actor.

I dunno, anecdotal evidence here, but I showed the trailer to my father this morning and his only exposure to the character is the Stallone movie 15 years ago and he seemed pretty entertained by the trailer.

AccountSupervisor posted:

I dont know, I just think they really hosed up by both making him boring and choosing to stick with the facelessness.

I guess the big difference is I didn't find him boring. :shobon:

To each their own I guess.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2012 03:25

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Flatscan posted:

Honestly, I've got no real problem with that and I'm quite looking forward to seeing someone attempt to depict a modern dystopian city rather than just rehashing the Bladerunner-esque future cities of the seventies and eighties. The world has moved on from the period in which Dredd was originally conceived, when it looked like London was going to be taken over by concrete ghettos like the Thamesmead estate.

What exactly is a "modern dystopian city"? Detroit?

A big part of sci-fi is seeing crazy poo poo that doesn't actually exist. Why would I want to see a movie set in a crazy year-2100 super-overpopulated city that looks like it takes place in 2010 Detroit?

# ¿ Jun 27, 2012 19:45

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Couldn't they reprint it with the names changed? Like, I thought satire was protected speech?

# ¿ Jul 31, 2012 10:33

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

I bought the blu-ray from Amazon pretty much sight-unseen a couple days ago, because of what I read in this thread. I like Karl Urban a lot, I've enjoyed what (little) I've read of Dredd, and I even really liked certain elements from the Stallone movie. I'm looking forward to watching Dredd. :munch:

# ¿ Jul 20, 2013 20:27

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Myrddin_Emrys posted:

Karl mentions a sequel...

http://www.airlockalpha.com/node/9759/dredd-takes-steps-toward-sequel.html

Now Urban is seeking fan support to help make the sequel a reality.

"I think the more people that campaign for it, the more people that email, Twitter and write into Lionsgate and say 'We want to see more of this,' then the more likelihood is that we'll get to see that. We certainly are doing everything we can to ensure that happens."

Does he make mention of ways to contact Lionsgate or anything? That'd likely be step one, giving fans the necessary avenues to make their voices heard.

# ¿ Jul 20, 2013 20:54

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

My copy of Dredd shipped out today, should be here by the end of the week! :toot:

# ¿ Jul 24, 2013 04:58

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Coffee And Pie posted:

Maybe Stallone Dredd and Urban Dredd are just alternate universe Dredds.

Fun fact: apparently there was a spin-off tie-in comic for the Stallone movie that acted as a "sequel" to the movie, and featured Judge Death who was literally an alternate-dimension version of Dredd.

# ¿ Jul 24, 2013 06:04

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

So I did finally get to watch 'Dredd', and I liked it quite a bit. I definitely prefer the Stallone movie's depiction of Mega City One, though; it actually felt, well, futuristic. I didn't mind it as much once they were inside Peach Trees, but the opening sequence of the movie didn't feel nearly as futuristic as I think it was supposed to.

Movie was still pretty kickass, though. I didn't expect it to be so gory or violent, but I'm really not complaining. I'd be more than happy to see more Dredd movies starring Karl Urban.

# ¿ Jul 31, 2013 06:46

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Alhazred posted:

She should stick to villain roles. I think she was terrible when she was supposes to give that big inspirational speech in 300.

She was pretty solid in the Terminator TV series, too.

# ¿ Aug 1, 2013 03:23

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

I think the best part of that pic is The Scowl :mad:

. You nailed it.

# ¿ Aug 1, 2013 15:37

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Arschlochkind posted:

If I were to make a badge for myself it'd have a surname a letter longer than "ANDERSON", which already looks sort of cramped. Wonder what judges with super long names think of having tiny letters crammed in there - sort of takes away from the effect.

Yeah, if I were to make a badge, I'd likely make up a name. I don't think my actual last name would fit on the badge. Dellamarggio :suicide:

# ¿ Aug 2, 2013 02:32

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

There's a ton of things the Stallone Dredd did right - when Stallone keeps the helmet on, he's spot-on as Dredd. The depiction of Mega City One is awesome, and the soundtrack by Alan Silvestri owns. The animatronic ABC Warbot is completely kickass, too.

# ¿ Apr 5, 2014 07:55

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Wittgen posted:

The only thing I remember about Stallone Dredd is "Eat recycled food." I was very young when I saw it.

I'm getting mixed signals. Is it worth watching? Is it worth watching only as campy 90s action fun?

It's worth watching. If nothing else it's worth watching as a comparison piece to the Urban Dredd.

# ¿ Apr 5, 2014 09:54

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Xoidanor posted:

I'll go one further, if you're hungry for a 90's action movie just drop all the alternatives and go straight for Demolition Man. That movie was just so good.

It's a cool movie and I love it for a lot of reasons, but not really for the action. If you're going for pure action in a 90s movie you can do a whole lot better.

# ¿ Apr 5, 2014 17:09

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

GORDON posted:

If Demolition Man were released today the PC brigade would be all over the internet arguing Cocteau was the good guy, because he was working toward the Greater Good.

To be totally fair a lot of aspects of the movie's future ARE pretty cool. I love their self-driving ultra safe electric cars.

# ¿ Apr 6, 2014 00:00

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# ¿ May 15, 2024 05:42

Xenomrph: Dec 9, 2005; AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill

Think of the good side: now Urban can focus his energy on making Dredd 2 happen. :haw:

# ¿ Apr 30, 2014 05:15

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