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ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Sheep posted:

From a sane standpoint your interpretation of the constitution is basically correct, but the problem is that it hinges upon Japan having a strong rule of law when in reality it's all about bureaucratic whims.

Yeah, and that's why I said it wouldn't go anywhere.

Sheep posted:

How many times now has the diet's composition been found to be in a state that contravenes the constitution, yet they decide to just let the results stand because it'd be mendokusai to fix it? Even the Supreme Court was basically like welp gently caress it.

Under the current electoral system, three times. The 2009, 2011, and 2012 elections were all declared unconstitutional despite token attempts at rebalancing districts.

What happens is that the Supreme Court says, "we're not going to nullify, fix it before the next election." The Diet passes some kind of redistricting that does almost nothing, pretend they have fixed it, and then act shocked when the next election is also ruled to have been unconstitutional. The Supreme court then says, "we're not going to nullify, fix it before the next election." The Diet passes some kind of redrist-...

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ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

hadji murad posted:

Those social norms go out the window pretty fast if the person is anonymous in some situations. A lot of the rear end in a top hat behaviour that occurs on trains, just simple rudeness, would never occur if that person was around an equal they knew.

Kids learn it from a very young age when to obey the norms and when to not.

Being an rear end in a top hat to certain kinds of people is not a violation of social norms. That IS a social norm.

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Mozi posted:

Also doubles as a footwarmer for your out-of-towners.

This is the joke I'm going to use when my relatives ask about crazy Japanese toilet seats.

"It's really nice for warming your feet in the winter."

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:
It seems like it might be a little bit of column A and a little bit of column B.



Hashimoto has been barely keeping above water in approval polls since 2013. The drop in approval between 2012 and 2013 is difficult to explain in detail due to a lack of aggregate polling data(that I could find), but it seems like it's most clearly linked to Hashimoto's statements concerning comfort women.

The issue with attributing it entirely to that is that Hashimoto also launched his full court press with the Japan Restoration Party and his merger with Ishihara in that period. So some of it could also be explained by people's ambivalence toward his newly outlined political direction.

There is an interesting pattern I found, though. When the issue first started being discussed heavily, the support for reforming Article 9 was somewhat positive. However, around 1/4 to 1/5th of poll respondents from 2013 stated they had no opinion on the issue. Since 2013, changing Article 9 is an issue that the LDP has taken up with gusto under Abe's leadership, and it's been debated heavily on a national level. Voters like it less as they learn more about it, and the issue currently stands at 55% against which is up 4% compared to a month ago.

Hashimoto's Osaka Metropolis plan has followed a similar trajectory. He was able to sell it until the point where he had to start explaining what he actually meant by it, and as voters found out more about it they liked it less and less. The lack of support from the major national parties also probably harmed his effort.

So at this point it looks like Hashimoto's jaunt into Japanese politics is at an end, and he'll probably go back to TV. Expect to see him as a frequent guest on shows like Sunday Japon.

Moon-rune links for those interested:
Support for Article 9 Reform in 2015: http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/politics/20150511-OYT1T50021.html
Handful of Article 9 Reform polls from 2013: http://doumin.exblog.jp/18693277/

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

MediumWellDone posted:

I just wish there was more of a chance for people to developed critical thinking skills earlier. To be honest I've only been exposed to a small selection of the student population, but the majority of university students I've worked with over the last two and half years seem like big junior high school kids.

The current system doesn't produce well-rounded students because it's not meant to. It's purpose is to institutionalize classism. The big companies all hire people from the top universities who just happen to be rich kids, and the executives there shrug their shoulders and talk about what hard workers the graduates from the top universities are. The admissions directors for the top universities all grant admission to the kids from the top high schools, who just happen to be rich kids whose parents paid for tutoring. The admissions directors shrug their shoulders and talk about what hard workers the kids from the top high schools are.

The high school entrance exam regime discourages applying to a school you're not sure you'll have the test scores for. The top high schools take the kids with the top exam grades who knew they would get good grades because they're rich and their parents have paid for juku since they were 6. The school principals shrug their shoulders and talk about how much hard work the junior high schoolers put in studying for their entrance exams.

That's the system, and every aspect of it is designed to make it difficult to cross class boundaries. Do poorly on your entrance exam when you're 14? Oh, well that means when you're 19 you have no chance at any of the better 4 year universities. Guess you should have studied harder when you'd just barely hit puberty.

The problem with the Japanese education system has nothing to do with what they're teaching. Nobody cares what the schools are teaching because it's all about making sure poor kids get told to gently caress off through an arcane series of "fair and standardized" testing. As long as that's happening, the system is considered to be working in the eyes of the people who wield power in Japan.

There's also a special note I would like to add about the public high schools. High school is not compulsory, and the poorest families are shut out of high school entirely due to the fees for uniforms, books(students are required to purchase all textbooks), ensoku, etc. I wish the problem with the Japanese education system was simply about what they're teaching. Unfortunately the entire system is rotten top to bottom so while you might be able to get Toudai to teach critical thinking, the higher education most students actually go to probably never will due to the nature of the system.

icantfindaname posted:

Internet says an amendment just requires a supermajority in both houses plus a simple majority referendum. That doesn't seem that much worse than the standard parliamentary constitution amendment of just a supermajority in both houses. Significantly easier than the American one anyways

I don't think Abe will bother trying to change the constitution. I think he'd rather the situation remain ambiguous. If he tries to amend the constitution now then it will make it seem like he knows his interpretation of the constitution is wrong. It's much safer for him to violate the constitution however he likes, and then let the Japanese Supreme Court sort it out. Their rulings don't seem to have any real impact so it's a good strategy. He wins either way.

The only way he loses is if he's dumb enough to continue his campaign to amend the constitution and the voters tell him to gently caress off. I don't know what polls he's looking at, but there is no demographic in Japan that supports the idea of Japan going to war. Old people, the demographic that has political power, actually might oppose it more than younger people do. Over time he's looking more and more like Japan's George W. Bush. A war-mongering dolt with a penchant for quixotic diversions to enact deeply unpopular policies.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Jul 16, 2015

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Trivia posted:

If anything Japan is a prime candidate for geothermal, but it's anyone's guess as to why they're not going down that avenue.

There is so much loving NIMBYism concerning people really horrified that geothermal is going to ruin their beautiful onsen. It's tragic.

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

caberham posted:

Can you guys tell me more about the protests all around the country? Any more photos or important speeches? What is the police response?

Protests about what? There's been on-going organized marches and demonstrations about nuclear power since Fukushima. I'm sure those same people are protesting Article 9 stuff since Abe started talking about changing that.

A certain segment of the Japanese population loves orderly marching on <insert political or social topic> so you're going to have to be more specific. Usually there's police blocking traffic for the marchers along the route. It's not really adversarial, but who knows, there may be some big news I've missed in the month I've been back home visiting family.

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

caberham posted:

I always mix up you with kapalama sorry

Oh poo poo, lol, I leave the country for a few weeks and crazy news happens.

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Kenishi posted:

Japan targets boosting birthrate to increase growth

Between no one having babies, no one buying anything, and an increasing number of vacant dwellings; at least there are some people that realize that Japan is so far in the shitter that the only thing that will save them are immigrants.

Yeah, and it's worth noting that the specific number chosen by Abe for his new plan is a pretty blatant war time dog whistle to boot.

His plans for a higher birth rate are biologically impossible at this point. The one thing about Japan that exacerbates the entire situation is the fact that people just aren't getting married the way they used to. The birth rate among married women is the same as it ever was. The problem is that the marriage rate has fallen substantially, and Japan has zero support or collective understanding for children born to single parents.

Abe is living in a fantasy land, and I'm really not sure what his real objectives are. All of his proclamations on this issue are going to crumble. Between the G* conference at Ise, his new 3 arrows, Womenomics, and his call for a higher birthrate.. he's creating a loving lot of trouble for whoever becomes the next prime minister. He's gonna be termed out in a few years, and these are all long term goals. There's a small chance the next prime minister could be DPJ, but lol, not loving likely.

So he's basically salting the earth with bullshit to please his dead relatives.

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Mr. Fix It posted:

There are no term limits for the position of prime minister. None for President of the LDP either, afaik.

Did something change then? LDP has a term limit of 2 3-year terms for a maximum of six years.

edit:
LDP bylaws still say the President of the LDP is limited to 2, three year terms: https://www.jimin.jp/english/about-ldp/constitution/104216.html

Yeah, this leaves out some sort of, "there's no rule that says a donkey can't play baseball," kind of thing where Abe remains PM while not being LDP president, but let's be real.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 11:19 on Nov 13, 2015

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Kenishi posted:

Taking a look at their party constitution. It merely states that a president has a limit of 2 consecutive terms, which seems to suggest that an LDP president could step down and then let someone else become president and then come back on the next election cycle and run again.

So your contention is that you think Abe is going to be termed out then come back later as prime minister yet again?

Like, I understand the part where that's technically a possibility, but he's still gonna be termed out. If past is prologue someone will replace him, and he'll go on to do something cushy somewhere more lucrative.

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

icantfindaname posted:

I'm not denying Japan is hosed up, but it's still always cool to see purestrain orientalism about the true nature of the cruel, inscrutable fascist Japanese

If what they posted was "purestrain," you must be living in a world free of most forms of exaggeration, and I envy you. Stop being silly. Japan's not super friendly to immigration. Immigration on a much larger scale would solve a lot of problems. These things are facts. They are the most mainstream of mainstream opinons on this topic, and jumping all over them for stating them in a way you didn't care for is just stupid tone policing bullshit.

LimburgLimbo posted:

There are a ton of zanichi that have assimilated and you would never know until they tell you.

The part where, "until they tell you," is pretty salient here since most of them survive by just letting everyone assume their family has been in Japan since the beginning of time. So if you mean, "people who can 100% become indistinguishable from Japanese people to Japanese people" have an okay time of it then yeah, I guess you're right.

Rekinom posted:

If I'm coming off as orientalist, then that's not my intention, as I haven't said or implied anything bad or wrong about Japan or Japanese people. Just wanted to have a public policy discussion, I guess.

The "in a million years" kind of phrasing was probably an overstatement, but beyond that it didn't seem too off the mark.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Dec 3, 2015

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

icantfindaname posted:

The idea that Japan, or the Japanese ruling class cares so much more about 'the Japanese way of life' than anything else that they would literally rather waste away into nothing than allow a single drop of non-Yamato blood on their island is a massive [citation needed] and also racist and orientalist yeah, sorry.

This is a straw man. The point made was that they care more about preserving the status quo than increasing GDP. That's not controversial. The LDP is a conservative party. It's not shocking they want to preserve the status quo rather than institute real reforms that could end up changing the makeup of society in order to juice growth.

icantfindaname posted:

You're talking about a country whose almost sole objective since 1870 has been development and catching up to 'the West' culturally, militarily and economically. You're already seeing Abe and friends desperately pulling on the lever to put more women to work to try to revive the economy, even with Abe being about as close to a cartoon fascist as you'll ever get.

This is hilarious. Abe isn't desperately pulling on anything. Womenomics is a cheap political ploy designed to make the electorate and the world think he cares about equality in some way. He has outlined some goals. He has done almost nothing to actually move Japanese society toward those goals. Even the most concrete of his plans, the day care initiative, falls well short of actually meeting demand for those services.

icantfindaname posted:

At the same time, obviously, they're also racists who would rather not have foreigners around and would rather have women stay at home making babies where they belong, but to say that they don't care at all about things like GDP is in direct contradiction to like 150 years of Japanese history and does in fact reek of orientalism, especially when you contrast it one sentence later to the rational, white Western Wall Street stockbroker

It's very clear that GDP growth is linked to population growth. It's not some fringe theory. It's well understood that it's real hard to grow the economy if the population itself is shrinking. So there's a mechanism right there for them to increase economic activity that for some reason they seem reticent to make use of. I wonder what that reason might be!

Sure, the Abe administration probably does care about GDP growth to some extent. However, to pretend they're working as hard as they possibly can to achieve it is pure fantasy. There's tons of people who would love to come to Japan that would be a boon to the Japanese economy. Japan is a safe rich country with many opportunities for people. A lot of those people, such as nurses, even work in the specific sectors Japan desperately requires at the moment. Still, again, for some reason that according to you couldn't possibly be motivated by any ill will, there's reticence to make use of those people.

With all that on the table I don't understand how you can argue with the point that the current administration cares more about the status quo than they do increasing GDP. It's very clear. It's been true for a long time, and dumb bullshit about comparisons between stock brokers and Buddhist monks doesn't change that basic fact no matter how much you dislike the tone that accompanied it.

Abe's pulling on all the levers except the one that's known to work pretty well. Maybe a different political party could open things up. Historically speaking, though, the likelihood of an opposition party getting its poo poo together to do that is low. So we're left with the situation we have now where the immigration policy is damaging the country, and there's no political will to change it.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 16:53 on Dec 3, 2015

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Truga posted:

vvvv: :wtc: what kind of logic is that?

I'm having trouble digging up the entire context, but it appears as though he was talking about dynamic shifts in American society. The most complete quote I can find of what he said is like, "A black person is president in America. A slave! When the United States was founded it would have been unthinkable for a black person, a slave, to become president. That's a country with dynamism."

The point he's making makes sense, but he articulated it in a really dumb racist way that shows he wasn't thinking much about it beyond wanting to shorthand the American civil rights movement into a political talking point.

Ran Mad Dog posted:

I hope they're having a good time now rolling around in the poo poo of their one party state. :shrek:

Japan being a one party state isn't really new. LDP factions have basically functioned as political parties for all but a few years of Japan's post-war history. Japanese leaders being cozy with the large media companies also isn't new, and the press club system has perpetuated a chilling effect for years.

The thing that seems new is that Abe has done a really bad job of keeping his fingerprints off the micromanagement of it.


ErIog fucked around with this message at 03:14 on Feb 19, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Geostomp posted:

Still, even in a country not known for racial sensitivity, you'd think he'd know better than to equate all black people, and especially the President of the US with slaves. That said, it's not really any dumber than what we get from right wingers here in the US.

It's a similar to gaffe to when Trump said, "they're rapists," when he announced his candidacy. Politicians want to be able to talk in broad strokes and assume that introducing caveats like, "some" or "may be" makes their talking point less solid. So they remove the caveats without realizing that they've now said something really racist. They know what they meant, and they assume everyone else should have known that what they meant was not precisely what they said.

In this case the missing caveat was, "If this were 200 years ago then he would have been..." This kind of thing happens in political discourse all the time, and yes, politicians whose job it is to communicate with people should be much better than they are at saying what they mean to say.

The racial insensitivity piece stems from where and when the caveats I'm talking about get removed. In the US, for example, white politicians almost never talk about "white people" without introducing some kind of caveat to explain exactly which people they're talking about.

They do this kind of thing way more often when talking about non-whites and it exposes their stereotype-based thinking.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Feb 19, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Peel posted:

That kind of reads to me as something that's only offensive when translated into the American context where there's a stricter etiquette for talking about the subject, rather than in itself in the original Japanese context. But I don't know much about that context.

It's inaccurate in the sense that there were always free black people in the US, but still.

Nah, it's pretty racist. It's not like nihonjinron KKK racist, but it shows a lack of cultural sensitivity on his part for not adding the few words it would have taken to not sound real racist. It does feel like there's probably someone who didn't like him who decided to quote him without full context to try to make this an issue, but he hosed up on his phrasing real hard. Translations can make it sound better or worse, but it being in Japanese doesn't give him a pass. He made a leap from black man -> slave that wouldn't be possible unless you were thinking in terms of tokens, stereotypes, and talking points.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 13:22 on Feb 19, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Chomskyan posted:

Shinsuke Sugiyama, Japan’s "deputy foreign minister". In this case he was Japan's envoy to the UN.

It's worth noting that his statements don't strictly contradict the apology made during the recent agreement, which was pretty vague. They do however contradict the Kono statement (which Abe previously said he'd uphold) and the government investigation that preceded it.

It really depends on how you parse the sentence, "The issue of comfort women, with an involvement of the Japanese military authorities at that time, was a grave affront to the honor and dignity of large numbers of women, and the Government of Japan is painfully aware of responsibilities from this perspective."

The larger issue here is that the only thing we have to go off of in terms of this new agreement is the text of the very brief joint statement. As far as I know the actual agreement text hasn't been released, and since the above sentence is so vague there's no way to definitively say whether or not Sugiyama's statement contradicts the details of what Abe agreed to.

Forums Terrorist posted:

hum it's almost as if the ldp want this to stay an issue to distract from all the terrible poo poo they're doing/the japanese economy being loving dead

I really don't think Sugiyama's statement was meant to rile up the base ahead of an election that's, at the earliest, four and a half months away. In America with the longer time scales for campaigning maybe you'd be right, but not in Japan.

I think the actual agreement text not being released was a purposeful move by Abe to try to have it both ways. He spends a lot of time outside Japan talking with other world leaders, and he probably wanted to do something so that he doesn't have to keep talking about the comfort women issue while in his role of representing Japan to the world. However, he also knows that the nationalists in his party and in his base would be real angry with him if he ceded too many of the "disputed" facts to South Korea.

He wants the international credit for solving the comfort women issue while trying to pretend, domestically, that the agreement doesn't offend his party's notions of Japan's national honor. I'm betting that if we ever see the real text of the agreement it will be quietly dumped out on some government website with a very questionable English translation directly following Abe's re-election.

Mr. Fix It posted:

when ever one of these deputies opens their mouths I think we're getting an unfiltered view of what Abe-chan believes and thinks.

Sugiyama basically repeated what Abe, himself, said in 2007. It's also not a controversial opinion among most Japanese politicians who can trace their lineage back to people in positions of power during the war. For many of them this is a personal issue.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 04:15 on Feb 25, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Silver2195 posted:

The grammar here is ambiguous. Are you saying war crimes denial is uncontroversial among most Japanese politicians, because most of them can trace their lineage to WWII-era officials, or are you saying that it's uncontroversial specifically among most of the subset of Japanese politicians who can trace their lineage to WWII-era officials?

I'm saying that war crimes denial is not uncommon among Japanese politicians, most of whom are right wing. Some of them probably deny for reasons of nationalism, but for some of them there's definitely the extra motivation of "don't say mean things about my direct ancestors."

There's not as much turnover of the political ruling class in Japan compared to other countries. So it's somewhat harder for the current ruling class to come to terms with the past than the general population. If Japanese politics was less dynastic in the post-war era I think the domestic political discourse on the topic of war crimes would be different.

I'm not saying it's the only factor or that it's 100% true of all right wing Diet members. I'm just pointing it out as one of the important factors to consider when thinking about why it has been so difficult for the Japanese government to move past these issues.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 05:15 on Feb 25, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

My Imaginary GF posted:

I think it's because no Japanese government would ever survive pursuing a policy of sustained devaluation of the yen. If the yen gets stronger, do the Japanese conglomerates make more money, or less?

Japanese conglomerates make more money, nominally, due to the value of their foreign transactions being reported in yen. Japanese exports also probably sell better when the yen is weaker. So I don't know what you mean by "no Japanese government would ever survive." That's the opposite of reality. Abe has been taking a beating since the yen strengthened a few weeks ago.

I do think the negative interest rates are necessary, though. Domestic demand has shrunk due to falling wages and a declining population. Japanese banks are sitting on a lot of dead cash. The only way for that money to be useful in the economy is if it's not parked in the BOJ.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 08:31 on Mar 7, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

My Imaginary GF posted:

I think the issue is more with debt, than it is with exports. When you've got 230% debt-to-GDP, your GDP ain't gonna grow by reducing the value of your debt.

Is your claim that GDP will grow if the value of the debt increases due to deflation? I don't see how that does any good either since deflation just means GDP growth has to be that much more vigorous to offset the impact of deflation.

So yes, I think GDP has way more of an opportunity to grow with moderate inflation than with moderate deflation.

Nearly half of all of Japan's government bonds are held by those conglomerates and about a quarter are held by the BOJ itself. The vast majority of the holders of Japan's public debt were not happy when it was like 90 yen to the dollar a few years ago. So I'd like you to source your claim that public debt is a concern for Japanese conglomerates.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 08:43 on Mar 7, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

My Imaginary GF posted:

Japan can only shrink its debt by engaging in a devaluation so massive that to do so would cause those conglomerates to go belly-up.

What are you talking about? The conglomerates do better when the value of the yen is low. They want cheap yen. Like I said, when it was 90 yen to the dollar the conglomerates were all moaning about having to post overseas losses and not being able to compete with China on price. I guess if it was 180 yen to the dollar they might dislike that due to the cost of oil and other imported raw materials, but they seem pretty happy anywhere between 105 and 125.

I guess in a theoretical scenario where currency devaluation happened overnight it would have a pretty significant impact, but I don't think Japan is in danger of having hyperinflation anytime soon.

Japan's public debt is held almost entirely domestically. So I don't see what the doomsday scenario is for the debt causing an implosion of the Japanese economy. If push came to shove they could print yen over time to pay off bond-holders as they became due. The thing is, though, that demand is so low in the Japanese economy that the new money would end up being parked in reserves or rolled over into new government bonds just like all the other dead money is now.

People really shouldn't worry about the DEBT so much because that money is at least circulating through the economy. It's going to pensioners, paving the inaka, and paying for healthcare. It's stimulating what little demand actually exists in the economy. The bigger problem is the dead money being parked doing nothing, and that's what the BOJ's negative interest rate scheme is trying to fix.

Please walk me through your fantasy scenario of how the public debt, 90% of which is held domestically by entities very happy to have parked money with the government since they had no plans to use it anyway, craters the Japanese economy. I'd really like to know how the mechanics of that work because it doesn't make any technical economic sense to me.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 09:44 on Mar 7, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Kilroy posted:

If you live in 18th century England, sure. Otherwise it's marker of a little too much eccentricity.

He's not licensed to practice law in Japan though.

Langley Esquire is the name of his legal services firm. It's not the name he uses generally.

Him not being licensed in Japan has more to do with the fact that foreigners can't just go and sit the Japanese bar exam, and even the 392 foreign lawyers who have registered with the Japanese bar since they first enacted the system in 1986 are severely limited in what they can actually do.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attorney_at_foreign_law

Generally he acts as a go-between for foreign people/companies who need to interact with the Japanese legal system and Japanese people/companies who need to interact with international legal systems.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 09:24 on May 30, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

mystes posted:

Are you sure about this?

I'm not sure about recently, but I doubt you could in the early 80's when Langley was attempting to do it.

If you have source that says otherwise I'd be willing to read it.

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Stringent posted:

pre edit quote

If someone were to be a huge pedantic rear end in a top hat then yes, the statement, "foreigners can't just go sit the Japanese bar exam," is probably false in 2016. If you actually go look at what becoming a full member of the Japanese bar entails along with the pass rates now(and in the early 1980's when Langley was attempting to do so), I think you'll find that the structure of the system does a good job of keeping foreigners out.

Like I said, there's 392 registered foreign members of the bar in a country of around 130 million people. The number of foreigners among the ~34,000 regular members of the par is probably even smaller than that. In a country as large as Japan is with an economy as large as it is you would think there would be more foreign members of the bar.

So it just depends on your point of view. If you want to go full Politifact "there will still be a program called Medicare," on it then yes, you could easily prove me wrong. That misses the overall point, though.

mystes posted:

I don't have a source that specifically says "in the early 80's it was possible for foreigners to take the bar exam," but if you have a source that indicates there was previously ever a citizenship requirement to take the bar exam at a certain point in time, perhaps I could work from there to determine when that changed?

While I doubt there was ever a citizenship requirement in modern times, the Japanese bar system has a number of requirements in place that make it de facto Japanese only. Every time talk of reform has come up, the legal trade groups all fearmonger about how foreigners are going to sue everyone imaginable if you let them practice law in Japan.

http://www.jpri.org/publications/critiques/critique_II_9.html
https://jurisjapan.com/2011/02/13/getting-to-%E5%A4%96%E5%BC%81-or-so-you-want-to-be-a-lawyer-in-japan/
http://www.japantoday.com/category/business/view/foreign-lawyers-fight-for-reform-in-japan

Generally the way most foreigners cope with this is the same way Langley did. He has a law license back home. He has experience from his career. He can put together a good business doing what he does. I doubt not being a full member of the Japanese bar is really holding someone like him back.

However, it would be nice if there were more of a level playing field for foreign lawyers wanting to practice in Japan.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 14:46 on May 30, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:
edit: W post

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:
They're not "my concerns." I'm not going to put together a policy document for you. I'm not a lawyer, and I'm not going to pretend I know how to fix it.

Thankfully, there are actual lawyers who have written about this very topic that you can go read the opinions of if you bother to Google. The first article I linked makes some good points about Japan not playing fair when it comes to reciprocity with the New York bar, and I'm sure there's lots of other lessons to learn from how more open countries have implemented their law licensing.

Law licensing in Japan is a protectionist racket by design. That protectionism has a disproportionate impact on foreigners. There's more lawyers in single states of the US than the entirety of Japan. It has nothing to do with language. A person motivated enough to want to be a Japanese lawyer would probably be able to learn Japanese just fine. Learning Japanese would probably be the easier part of their study.

Toshimo posted:

Replace bar exam with Phoenix Wright games for filthy gaijin.

The parts of Phoenix Wright that were cut/pasted from the Japanese legal system would horrify you.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 15:30 on May 30, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Aredna posted:

Using your own numbers: 392/34000 is 1.1%. Gaijin make up 1.2% of the population in Japan. That doesn't seem like gaijin are disproportionately affected by the law.

Also, from my sources, Langley was once a member of the Georgia bar, but he let his registration lapse and isn't even an official lawyer anywhere though. "The longstanding joke in the legal community is that the only bar Langley has joined is the 'Roppongi Bar Association'"

Those 392 are not full members of the bar. Also, if Japan had a more open system like, for instance, how there's no residency or citizenship requirement to become a CPA in Illinois, then the comparison to the number of foreign residents of Japan would be moot since non-Japanese non-residents could become certified.

Japan is the world's 3rd largest economy. Does it seem to you like having ~400 registered foreign lawyers is reasonable compared to the amount of economic activity happening?

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Aredna posted:

So they are members of the bar or they're not members of the bar? I'm kind of confused now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attorneys_in_Japan#Membership_for_foreign_attorneys

Aredna posted:

Why does it matter how many registered foreign lawyers there are based on the economy? It's roughly the same ratio per capita of gaijin vs. non-gaijin so it seems pretty fair.

I'm comparing it to the size of the economy because it's a good way of demonstrating the disparity between Japan and other countries with similar amounts of economic activity. Corporate and trade law are areas where foreign lawyers may want to practice, and economic data is a way to talk about how big the need might be for Japan in terms of foreign lawyers.

Why are you comparing it to the number of foreign residents? Do you think a residency requirement is a good idea? Shouldn't a good Japanese-speaking American or German lawyer be able to become registered as a full member if they can pass the licensing exams? Not everybody needing access to the Japanese legal system resides in Japan.

Also, comparing it to the number of foreign residents requires tacit agreement with Japan's immigration policy.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 02:59 on May 31, 2016

ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

mystes posted:

What a great idea. They should make it so that American and German lawyers can become lawyers in Japan if they pass the Japanese bar exam!

The Japanese bar has a number of requirements that are very difficult for non-residents/non-Japanese to meet. Among them is the requirement that you be a member of a Japanese regional bar association. I bet most of those require years of experience in the specific region which would be impossible to attain without at least residency, and for some of the smaller ones it could very well be impossible for any non-Japanese to register.

If the system is as open as you claim then why are there so few of them compared to the size of the economy and the size of Japan's population?

I guess they're all just really lazy and Japanese is hard. Why would they have any interest in the world's 3rd largest economy. It's not like there's a lot of money floating around there.

ErIog fucked around with this message at 03:06 on May 31, 2016

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ErIog
Jul 11, 2001

:nsacloud:

Stringent posted:

In case you were wondering what all these edits are for.

This certainly isn't creepy stalker behavior.

mystes posted:

completely speculative idea that people might be secretly passing the bar exam

I never said this. gently caress off.

Aredna posted:

and is discouraged otherwise due to cost for in-house attorneys

So you admit there's pressure against foreign attorneys to try to become full members of the Japanese bar?

My point was never that there aren't foreign lawyers working in Japan*. My point is that they are not given the same opportunities as Japanese lawyers are when it comes to becoming a full member of the bar, and that means they have fewer options when it comes to how they can practice.

*cue people taking single sentences from previous posts out of context

ErIog fucked around with this message at 05:29 on May 31, 2016

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