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I hope Chavez wins. I've talked to both camps of Venezuelan people. Some have told me that things have gotten worse with Chavez. Toilet paper shortages seem to stick out the most in my mind. On the left, I was told that Chavez has brought more good than harm. Lower class people are a lot better off it seems. To be quite honest it is my selfish desire to see Chavez in power. The simple fact of having a nation-state function differently than most is precious to me. Also, he makes me feel good when he exposes American imperialism. As a pissed-off historian of America it's very comforting.
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Oct 8, 2012 03:32
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HUGO RAFAEL CHAVEZ FRIAS WINS!! 54.42% of the votes 7,444,082 people They say that a few votes still need counting, and a few more were discarded/invalid. Frijolero fucked around with this message at 03:44 on Oct 8, 2012 |
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Oct 8, 2012 03:37
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Russell William Thorpe posted:I honestly have no clue if a Hugo Chavez win is good or bad. It's the same as an Obama/Romney win. Not much will change.
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Oct 8, 2012 03:55
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ekuNNN posted:I'm happy that Chavez won, but I feel I mostly hear propaganda about non-western countries, so am I right in being happy? My position is mostly based on taking the opposite of what I feel the news here wants us to think and being a socialist. I hear he helped the poor a lot but "he's bad for the economy". That's what I've heard from both camps of Venezuelan people. (The few that I have talked to abroad) The leftist think he's great ONLY because he's helped the poor so much. The people on the right HATE having to pay so much for electronics. That's the way I would sum it up.
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Oct 8, 2012 04:08
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ekuNNN posted:Well, the "bad for democracy" things we get here (in the Netherlands) about him are mostly just cult of personality stuff like his personal tv-show. But I'm betting that he still spends comparatively less on promoting himself than Obama (or any US president) does, for example. Oh most definitely. And I'm not worried about State-Owned media. I've seen what private media can do in the US and I am extremely discontent about it. Meanwhile, NPR (non-profit) is one the best media outlets which we have (by best I mean objective/fair)
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Oct 8, 2012 04:12
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Russell William Thorpe posted:Man the Venezuelan twitter feeds are interesting... a lot of them seem to be quite upset about the outcome. It probably has more to do with them being middle-class.
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Oct 8, 2012 04:14
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Russell William Thorpe posted:What does "Me Iria Demasiado" mean? Are you serious? It means "I would leave (as in go) too much." It seems to be a meme. Someone said "I would leave too much" instead of saying "I would leave immediately." It's a simple slip of the tongue or bad vocabulary.
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Oct 8, 2012 04:21
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How about some quick social journalism? "Caracas, City of Farewells" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsD8Edq2cgw This is a video by what appear to be middle-class/upper-class Venezuelan youngsters. They claim that the situation is so bad that they are intending on leaving. Many of their friends have already left. It is really unpopular because many Venezuelans are offended by the idea of these young adults complaining about their conditions (also it seems that they think they are ditzy/innocent/dumb). The description says "Please don't clap when the airplane lands." Though I'm not Venezuelan and know almost nothing about the conditions (aside from talking to several people from Caracas) it seems like this video is forced and biased. The people in the video must be relatively well-off if they can afford to leave. I've seen these sentiments among many middle-class/upper-class Venezolanos. They are anti-Chavez because they can afford to. Frijolero fucked around with this message at 04:37 on Oct 8, 2012 |
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Oct 8, 2012 04:33
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PrezCamachoo posted:What about when you take into consideration Chavez's daily speeches that go into hours long rants that must be carried by all stations? Kinda like how I can't enjoy the radio/TV/internet because I have to listen to corporate brainwashing? The solution is TURN IT OFF.
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Oct 8, 2012 04:44
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NKVD posted:That’s a good point, they’re not really analogous. HEY-O!! Besides, he's putting himself out there to be liked or disliked, hated or loved, noticed or neglected. If you hate Chavez and he comes on the TV for hours you're not going to like him much more.
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Oct 8, 2012 05:24
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Deceitful Penguin posted:I love this question to bits. We're in an English speaking forum where you have to pay Exacto! The Venezuelans I've met abroad (notice that they had enough money to travel) hated Chavez. Why? Because electronics were so expensive and because there was a huge toilet paper shortage once. Also those handful of people were lighter skinned than Chavez. Latin America is mired in petty racism. A lot of people hated Chavez because he was on the darker side.
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Mar 6, 2013 23:02
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to join and people here and in the GBS thread kept asking why none of the Venezuelans were in favour of Chavez or even tried to use this as a point against him. 
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El Hefe posted:Yeah exactly, 6.5 million Venezuelans don't like Chavez because they can't buy video games and because they have to save on toilet paper. Oh gently caress off. The Venezuelans I met were very clear that toilet paper shortages and high prices were major reasons to dislike Chavez. I'm not trying to be funny like you. We're talking about upper-middle class people who have 'suffered' because of Chavez's policies. Their parents were also upper-middle class and they indoctrinated their children with the idea that things were pleasant before Chavez. High murder rates fueled their discontent even more. Are you disagreeing with the fact that well-off Venezuelans dislike Chavez? Frijolero fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Mar 6, 2013 |
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Mar 6, 2013 23:15
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El Hefe posted:Try actually at least visiting the country before having strong opinions on the subject rather than relying on what some idiot Venezuelan told you or something you read online or in some book. The people I talked to were Venezolanos!! I'm not going to rule them out as a source of information on the matter. I'm not going to call them idiots either. They had money. Chavez's policies made it harder for them to use that money. It's a valid argument. It's also shallow as hell, which is what I was pointing out. Now please enlighten me on your visit to Venezuela. Did you see people living on the street? OH NO! I see that when I look outside. Did you see people getting murdered? OH NO! My family had to move out of Mexico because of the violence. But they are not blaming a single political leader for it.
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Mar 6, 2013 23:27
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Amused to Death posted:Mexico and arguably most places has in recent time not had a political leader who was in power for as long, or who has wielded as much power/influence as Chavez has. I mean it works both ways. Chavez gets all the credit for improving the nation(for people on that side of the argument), it's only natural if someone opposes Chavez, he'll get an equal amount of blame in a negative fashion. The PAN was in power for 12 years. A six year presidency is a long rear end time.
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Mar 6, 2013 23:36
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Look guys, Chavez obviously sucked because his coup failed and was later democratically elected. What the gently caress kinda tyrant gets democratically elected? What a loving loser. Meanwhile he did things with oil money!! Who does that?!?! And let's not get started on how his rhetoric and actions promoted participatory democracy in places that were not familiar with it. I give him 2 out of 5 Francos for lack of effort. 
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Apr 2, 2013 03:49
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