Drug legalization thread

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Drug legalization thread

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

potato of destiny posted:

One interesting thing I've noticed here is while there's been a certain amount of bluster from the feds toward the medical marijuana shops (mostly sending threatening letters to shops that they felt were too close to schools), the actual enforcement has seemed remarkably lax; there doesn't seem to have been much actual enforcement, just (I think there was a grow op busted sometime last year, but that's the only one I recall hearing about).

The DEA has been quite famously raiding California dispensaries, despite the initial claims from the Obama DOJ that they wouldn't do so.

How are u posted:

This is all true, but, as mentioned earlier in the thread, the Fed does have the ability to make life extremely unpleasant for states that buck the trend in the form of withholding all sorts of Federal subsidies and grants. Money upon which most every state dearly depends.

So yes, the Fed could very well play hardball to try and bring Colorado back into line.

On the other hand, they have thus far refused to do this in response to MMJ, which is equally contrary to federal law. Yes they raid dispensaries, but they haven't yet withheld funding in the way you describe (and as they famously did with drinking ages in the 1980's). Perhaps full blown legalization will be enough to make them do so? It certainly would depend on the politics.

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 04:31

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# ¿ May 16, 2024 08:20

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

PT6A posted:

Not saying they are. I just find it to be a pain in the rear end when people who like one drug evangelize for it and hate against another drug. Adults should be allowed to choose what substances they put in their body, and laws should only be designed to limit societal harm (think drink-driving laws and such).

Someone was saying how much worse their experiences with alcohol had been, and I was merely posting a counter-anecdote. Neither should be a basis for policy, because everyone has different experiences with various substances.

Well then it's a good thing a lovely poster provided us with research showing that everyone's anecdotes of "I've had worse experiences with alcohol than cannabis" are in line with reality.

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 05:01

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

Ah Pook posted:

Either there is something obvious I'm somehow missing, or this graph is two bars comparing the total number of "harms". What.

maybe read the link from a Psychopharmacology journal if you're interested in how they quantify harm?

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 08:08

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

The other problem, which existing dispensaries are already having to deal with, is that no banks want ton get involved. Its a lot harder to run a small business when you don't have access to loans or even a checking account for your business.

# ¿ Dec 20, 2012 06:08

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

quote:

�To that end, we�ve created a companion online tool that allows anyone to make different assumptions and then immediately see the impact on state revenues. We hope this will be useful for state lawmakers and citizens as Colorado weighs how best to implement Amendment 64 and regulate recreational marijuana.�

It would be nice if the article linked to this online tool.

edit: looks like it's here http://coloradofutures.colostate.edu/calculator/

edit2: interesting that the assumed retail markup is 175%, which is quite high compared to things like retail alcohol.

bawfuls fucked around with this message at 00:41 on Apr 26, 2013

# ¿ Apr 26, 2013 00:31

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

redshirt posted:

Or would off-Presidential cycles be bad for a legalization bill?

Yes. Remember, Prop 19 failed in California in 2010

# ¿ Jun 8, 2013 05:06

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

Skiers love their weed. It makes me wonder if any resorts in CO/WA will find a way to do cross promotional stuff when the retail sales are up and running.

# ¿ Aug 25, 2013 16:45

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

Jeffrey posted:

The resort probably won't kick people they catch out, but they probably will kick anyone the forest rangers kick out. I can't imagine a resort telling someone they have to go home and stop spending money because they catch them with weed. Do you get kicked out with no warnings for other rule violations? I understand they can't condone weed on the premises, but there's a big range of actions they could take between "ignoring it" and "kicking you out first offense". I would think the latter would get them a lot of chargebacks with little gain.

At present, this kind of enforcement varies greatly from one resort to the next. There are places where you can get out of a hotboxed gondola car and stroll past the lifty like nothing happened, or where a ski patroller might complain on the chair that he 'didn't bring enough weed for this pow day'. Others will clip your ticket and boot you out for the day if any official catches you. But most will give you a hard time for smoking in a public place and tell you to take your safety meetings out of the way in the woods next time, because 'this is a family resort'.

I have heard of the local forest rangers in Utah actually patrolling the parking lots and the hill at the ski areas looking for weed, and citing/arresting folks. Within the community that's considered highly unusual/aggressive enforcement.

In general, most resorts won't hesitate to revoke a day pass for any major rule violations.

bawfuls fucked around with this message at 02:48 on Aug 26, 2013

# ¿ Aug 26, 2013 02:42

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

It's still a bit vague though. Are they going to give banks and other financial institutions the go ahead to work with these state-compliant businesses?

# ¿ Aug 29, 2013 20:07

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

The Maroon Hawk posted:

This article from CNN has an admittedly vague paragraph on that topic:

http://www.cnn.com/2013/08/29/politics/holder-marijuana-laws/index.html

"some leeway from the justice department" doesn't exactly sound like the kind of strong footing a financial institution would want before entering into contracts with federally-illegal businesses.

So that situation is unlikely to change until federal law changes, which is probably to be expected I suppose.

# ¿ Aug 29, 2013 23:20

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

a lovely poster posted:

I can't believe how many people are celebrating what amounts to the DoJ repeating what Obama said when he became President. Are you all so naive?

There is no small step here. This is the same situation we've been in up until now. They will continue to ignore the end users and attack the distribution under the guise of protecting the children or whatever bullshit they make up.

It does mean something, because the DOJ could sue these states over these laws. They could mount a court challenge and kill this stuff before it even begins, but they have chosen not to do so.

# ¿ Aug 31, 2013 17:29

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

Broken Machine posted:

Even arch-conservatives are voicing their support for taxation and legalization. National Journal ran an article today about Grover Norquist's position on it. He enthusiastically supported it, explaining that it wasn't really a tax increase:

But really who cares, aside from the fact that his support means that GOP legislators are now in the clear.

Hahaha, all of the comments on that page are calling Norquist a RINO/progressive/traitor to the cause.

# ¿ Oct 24, 2013 23:45

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

We already had this discussion of prices for existing products derived from rare and difficult to grow plants.

http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3511253&pagenumber=90&perpage=40#post419377880

twodot posted:

Wasabi is hard to grow, it basically only grows near certain rivers in Japan. It's so expensive that 99% of things marketed as wasabi are not wasabi at all and just horseradish. You can buy it in America for ~$60 per pound. 800-2000 per pound is right around the price range for black truffles. Black truffles are so hard to grow that humans didn't succeeded in cultivating it until the 1800s. Even now, we literally have to harvest it by hand using either pigs or specially trained dogs, again so expensive that 99% of "truffle" products are actually just using synthesized compounds that were found to be some of the major flavor components of truffles.

It surely requires effort and skill to grow high end marijuana, but $800 per pound is an absurdly high price for almost any plant, and on the scale of difficulty marijuana is not anywhere near the difficult end.

edit:
I should clarify that I'm not saying that it's impossible for marijuana to cost $800 per pound in a legal market. I'm sure individual brands could find some success at that price point, much like it's possible to buy a bottle of wine for $800. The point is that if you could grow legally, you could do so at a very high level of quality at a price point well below $800 per pound.

# ¿ Nov 10, 2013 01:55

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

On that topic, here's a cross post from the Ski and Snowboard thread that's pretty amusing and ridiculous.

http://www.vaildaily.com/news/9485596-113/vail-pot-families-numerous

quote:

Dear Vail Resorts,

Let me explain to you why I will not be returning to this resort anytime in the near future and will indicate to other families on online forums that they should decline to come to Vail as well.

As you are aware, marijuana is now legal in Colorado. I have been visiting Vail and Beaver Creek for many years now with my family, and enjoyed all my years here with no real problems. We have a lot of memories here. Within the span of several days, my son and I were exposed to numerous conversations on buses, gondola rides and restaurants related to recreational drug use. The fact that people are restricted to smoking pot in the privacy of their room doesn�t mean that they won�t reek of pot on gondola rides, or that they won�t be talking about getting high with numerous other substances within earshot of numerous families. Within the span of two to three days, I had at least three to four separate occasions in public areas where I had to specifically ask people to not talk about their drug use. People were obviously put off by my asking them to stop, and I was furious to even be put in this situation.

I think the public debate on allowing pot to be sold is completely off. The people who live this type of lifestyle can�t afford to support resorts like Vail that frankly cater to a demographic more like my own, and candidly, you don�t get to be successful by engaging in this type of lifestyle. Why am I going to pay to come to a resort where my son is exposed to these sorts of things? I don�t want him skiing or going anywhere on his own � he is a teenager, and why should he be shaped by these types of conversations?

Not only this, but it�s a safety hazard. Do you think I want people speeding by me on the slopes who were high the evening before?

I really recommend you get this situation under control as quickly as possible because word will get out to families very quickly. At this point, I�m very much inclined to go to Utah for my vacations instead of Colorado. You can�t be a destination resort for high-earners and a pot-town at the same time � you have to choose.

# ¿ Jan 1, 2014 23:49

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

TenementFunster posted:

lol at being high "the evening before."

man, do I have some bad news for them them.

That was my favorite part. This person has no clue how many people are high all around her on the hill.

# ¿ Jan 2, 2014 00:01

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

The Maroon Hawk posted:

It's pretty hard to overstate how prevalent pot usage is among skiiers and snowboarders here, especially among college-age people. From what I understand there's around 10 smoke huts in the trees at Breckenridge at any given point in time (sometimes the ski patrol will tear one down to make a show, but a new one will pop up elsewhere), including a famous two-story smoke hut. I've stumbled across them at other ski areas, too.

Its not just Colorado either. Weed has been deeply entrenched in ski culture for decades. I know plenty of boomer aged people that smoke nearly every time they ski, and nearly everyone I've ever known who could be classified as a ski bum also enjoys it.

Being surprised that people smoke weed while skiing/riding is just as absurd as being surprised folks do it at a concert.

People are perhaps a little more open about it now because social norms are evolving, but it's always been there.

Remember Henrik Harlaut, the dreadlocked Swedish slope style skier who's pants were falling down in the Olympics and who gave a WuTang shoutout after his run? He famously smokes a shitload of weed, as does Tanner Hall, the pro skier and cofounder of his ski sponsor Armada. Tanner's Instagram account is literally @tannerhall420.

edit: famous video segment with "Rasta Stevie" of Telluride from 1988

bawfuls fucked around with this message at 00:07 on Feb 22, 2014

# ¿ Feb 21, 2014 22:43

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

19 o'clock posted:

Word is the forest service took it down and not Vail. I'm gonna ask around to see if there isn't more to it.

That would make more sense, considering it is forest service land and thus their responsibility.

# ¿ Feb 23, 2014 10:56

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

Nintendo Kid posted:

Most local breweries are mediocre (IE coors level) at best, you should really stop hyping them up, honestly.

Where do you live that this is the sad state of affairs?

# ¿ Jun 19, 2014 08:57

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

Powercrazy posted:

Most Brewers are poo poo, hard to believe but it true. Now there are several like Dogfish head, Arrogant Bastard, Harpoon, Great Barrier and dozens of others that are excellent, but as a general rule just because its a "microbrew" doesn't magically make it better than Bud.

I guess I'm spoiled because San Diego is practically exploding with quality microbrews.

Stone (maker of the aforementioned Arrogant Bastard)
Karl Strauss
Ballast Point
Green Flash
Port Brewing
Societe
AleSmith
Modern Times
Lost Abbey
Coronado Brewing Co
Saint Archer
Mission Brewery

That's just the first dozen that comes to mind, and they're all fantastic. I realize SD is known these days for having lots of microbrews, but I figured most major cities had some good ones just not as many.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2014 21:32

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# ¿ May 16, 2024 08:20

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

(This is obviously anecdotal, and colored by the fact that I live in a city with excellent beer available all over and have a friend group that's largely white and privileged)

Drinking among my peers tends to fall into one of two categories: lets hang out and have a few beers, or lets get hosed up. In the first case, everyone pretty much drinks quality microbrews. In the second case, we drink cheap beer for drinking games or progress to hard alcohol.

I wonder what proportion of the Bud/Miller/Coors sales are from drinking games/parties/binge drinking, where their bland flavor, lower ABV, and cheap cost are all positive attributes.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2014 23:21

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