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Just impulsively bought fear and hunger 1 and 2 because I want to feel something this spooky season
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Oct 31, 2023 00:12
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| # ¿ May 10, 2024 06:04 |
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Does anybody know of any traditional style roguelikes that can be played with a controller? Ever since I've developed chronic pain in my hands and shoulders I haven't been able to use a mouse and keyboard, but I've been craving like crazy something to scratch my dungeon crawl stone soup itch
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Oct 31, 2023 18:20
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goferchan posted:Ohhh Lunacid came out of EA, been waiting for this one. Oh poo poo, the gameplay I saw of this on iron pineapples channel looked hella good. I wouldn't have expected it to come out so soon SettingSun posted:I quite enjoy Shiren on the Switch, as for as roguelikes with controllers go. I looked this up and it looks exactly like what I'm looking for. Thank you, I'm going to have to check this out. Farquar posted:I hear Jupiter Hell has good controller support, if you want a sci-fi dungeon crawl. As somebody who avidly played Doom RL back in the day this looks mighty tempting as well
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Oct 31, 2023 18:37
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Broken Cog posted:
To be honest that's what I liked about monster train over slay the spire. I always found it fun that I could take a relatively weak monster and permanently upgrade it into a WMD, or put hold over on a healing spell to indefinitely rejuvenate an awoken unit. It always felt like I could intentionally break the game with some kind of synergy I cooked up. Meanwhile in slay the spire, I never got the feeling I was creating synergies or card engines and more so just scrounging together whatever crumbs the game gave me. Not to mention that in monster Train it's more feasible to save yourself when you're in a vulnerable low health state after a hard fight, because enemies aren't going to be able to immediately attack your pyre, giving you an opportunity to scrape by if you play it right. In slay the spire It would just piss me off if I lost a lot of health in one fight, and then I would go to the next without any opportunity to heal, and then because of my first hand draw its mathematically impossible for me to defend myself and the run ends. I'm sure that for others in the thread that's what is appealing to them about slay the spire- improvising and making do with what's offered to you, and the importance of damage aversion to set yourself up better for the next fight. For me though, it's just not a satisfying level of control over the circumstances and my strategy.
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Nov 2, 2023 18:31
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Just tried out Golden Krone Hotel. It wasn't clicking with me at first because It seemed limited, having no real inventory beyond your potions or weapon variety other than swords. But once I had a run last long enough where I was able to switch back and forth between vampire and human form a couple of times, I could see some ways into the depth and I'm more excited about it now. I especially like that the potions are random and need to be identified, but it shows you the three possible things that it can be, giving that slight sliver of hope and intentionality when you reach for the bottle in times of need
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Nov 8, 2023 05:03
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Wow Balatro is fun as hell How do I keep them from taking the demo out of my grubby little hands
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Dec 26, 2023 21:05
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How complex are the controls for Path of Archa? Is it something that I could realistically map to a Xbox controller using xpadder, or is it like dungeon crawl Stone soup where there are so many niche button uses and diagonal movement that would make it impossible
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Dec 27, 2023 19:46
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Teriyaki Koinku posted:I got around to playing Balatro and holy gently caress is it exactly my kind of jam, it's so loving good. I am right loving there with you. I am on my knees begging that whatever they are announcing in January is a full or early release.
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Dec 29, 2023 16:24
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Upsidads posted:never excited when i see a game that i mistake for hearthstone
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Jan 4, 2024 05:43
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HopperUK posted:I've missed this one so far! Looks fascinating. There's a demo on steam which I played a little bit of last night, it's pretty fun. It doesn't have the same flare and polish as Balatro, but I like How much control it offers despite how small the possible action space is in blackjack proper. I think it's clever how the damage dealt is based on the difference between totals, meaning that even if you don't think you'll win the hand, you might want to hit just in case it reduces damage. Of course if you bust you take all of it, but surely this is a crowd that appreciates risk and reward. The special cards can make instances go on longer than you would think, What with negative cards or discards, stuff like that. There's depth here that shows me the blackjack gameplay is more than a gimmick
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Jan 8, 2024 15:41
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Balatro is out today and I bought it instantly, I've been addicted to that demo.
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Feb 20, 2024 16:47
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Stone cards are also great If you have a deck oriented towards small hands. Like if you're upgrading pairs, or have that joker that gives a plus 20 multiplier if you're only playing up to three cards, throwing in a stone card is a useful way push that even further
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Feb 24, 2024 19:59
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I was having a lot of fun last night with a polychrome Scholar Joker(+20 chips and plus four multiplier for every Ace played) and the DNA joker (If you only play one card for your first hand, add duplicate of it directly to hand), which allowed me to give myself 13 aces lol. It got even better when I got the hiker Joker (add +4 chips to card every time it is scored) and those 13 aces ended up being like about 30 chips each before scholar even kicked in. I love all the cards that allow you to actively develop on them, rather than just remaining a static flat bonus. Hopefully the universe will recognize that today is my birthday and let me have another swashbuckler plus gift card run
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Feb 24, 2024 20:05
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I could see how balotro is similar to luck be a landlord in a macro sense, but balatro has so many of its own unique mechanics that to just call it a luck be a landlord clone is reductive. In Balatro You have all these little ways of manipulating the randomness, be it by discarding, using tarot, or Joker abilities. Luck be a landlord in my experience is more about maximizing synergistic symbols in order to ensure that they land next to each other. Balatro is of course also about creating synergies to get big points, but you get to choose the cards that you play in order to intentionally trigger Joker effects. They are siblings, not identical twins
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Feb 26, 2024 16:59
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mystes posted:Balatro is exactly 65.2% similar to Luck be a Landlord and anyone who thinks it's 64% or 66% similar to luck be a landlord is a loving idiot and I'll fight them to the death This is all we have until somebody releases a semantics rogue-like where you argue with an AI with increasingly granular language
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Feb 26, 2024 17:10
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Tequila Bob posted:Am I a bad person if I turn off the random minotaurs on Barony? Not at all imo. The philosophy my friends and I have with barony is that the easier you make it, the more fun it is. If it weren't real time, like Nethack, maybe I would feel differently, but that's because a rogue like of that fashion gives you time to think through a stressful situation and make a risky but thought through calculation of what to do (random scroll that my teleport me? Perhaps this potion is a berserk? Let's see) In real time though, you're just going to get your poo poo pushed in by the Minotaur rushing you down which is not all that engaging of a challenge
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Feb 26, 2024 17:20
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mystes posted:Visual novels aren't games but they are roguelikes You loving moron. They're rougelites
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Feb 26, 2024 17:27
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What are the keys in Raging Loop If not meta progression
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Feb 26, 2024 17:28
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unattended spaghetti posted:Something that I really appreciate about Balatro’s design compared to other deck builder type games is that it is relatively possible to pivot your style because of jokers being the primary means of synergizing, and because planets and tarot and spectrals are relatively plentiful and varied.  I like the twist of having a standard 52 card deck which you can then modify and amplify using the passive joker abilities and planet upgrades.Something that wore me down with slay the spire was I felt that I kept trying to build into particular strategies, but then the game wouldn't drop some keystone card that would make the deck viable. Then I'm already invested, it's expensive to get rid of cards, and I would also have to spend in order to get new ones. The way that balatro allows you to refresh yourself consistently at the shop by selling your poo poo and trying something new gives me a greater feeling of agency over how I adapt Tea Party Crasher fucked around with this message at 18:17 on Feb 26, 2024 |
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Feb 26, 2024 18:14
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I'm a fan of monster train's pared down map mechanic where you just choose between two sets of benefits by going either left or right. The decision feels meaningful because you know broadly what you are going to get and can apply that towards your build, and the risk/reward aspect feels more intentional when you are choosing between resources like health or long term benefits to your deck like the chance to duplicate a card
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Feb 29, 2024 19:40
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I never found slay the spire's map mechanic engaging. Intellectually I understand it's giving you agency over what path to go down and reap its benefits (bosses, fires, stores), but in my opinion the paths don't diverge or intersect enough to feel like a meaningful choice. It feels more like I'm required to manually confirm that, yes, I do want to continue to the next monster encounter which is the only node in front of me.
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Feb 29, 2024 19:48
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cock hero flux posted:deckbuilding games are what happens when someone comes up with cool worldbuilding and aesthetics for a game but can't come up with a plot or any game mechanics As someone struck with lameness I'm all here for it. I love feeling like I'm doing a lot by just pressing A five times and watching an animation of a big number happen. My favorite aspect of persona 4 was the way that it would let me open up a menu and teleport around without having to manually make my character walk around. My joints want killer, no filler
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Feb 29, 2024 19:54
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victrix posted:
If there isn't there should be, although from what I can tell most of the rogue-like ecosystem is taken up by deck builders lol.
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Feb 29, 2024 20:07
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That's fair flux. Even as someone who likes a good deck builder, I think we're about to reach the point where the bubble pops because there's only so many ways to iterate on a style of game that is inherently about limiting player input by compressing options into a hand of cards. I eagerly await the perfect compromise between ergonomic low drag gaming and the high player input of something like dungeon crawl Stone soup which was my favorite rogue like before my crab hands. Golden Krone Hotel came kind of close, but I found it kind of boring because loot was limited to just being stat buffs to armor and damage, or some sort of temporary effect from a potion. Shiren also seemed good but all of the menuing made my thumbs go What the gently caress, what the gently caress is this
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Feb 29, 2024 20:16
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Falcon2001 posted:This is actually one of my favorite things about this style of game. If you have full control, then the game can very quickly become 'implement your build, ignore bad options and pick good ones' - this is fun, I like ToME for example, but I really enjoy having to roll with the luck and build with suboptimal options because that's all I'm getting. To me it's one of the foundational benefits of the genre, and it's something I appreciate in Magic the Gathering Limited/Draft, for example. Agreed. That's one of the tenuous connections these games have with old school roguelikes, the onus on the player too roll with the unexpected or suboptimal and see how far they can take it. That's the advantage a random perma death having game can have over a longer single player experience, it's more permissible to saddle players with negative consequences ot require them to adapt because it pushes them to experiment, and instead of being required to do it over the course of an entire campaign it's just for one run and then the context is reset
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Feb 29, 2024 20:26
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Archa looks cool as hell and I would be willing to provide the developer many unseemly sexual favors for built-in controller support
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Feb 29, 2024 20:28
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It feels embarrassingly shallow, especially because Jupiter hell meets my need of being playable on a controller, but something about the isometric angle and everything else about the presentation and soundscape made me put it down. Maybe it's because I just wanted it to be doom RL again and hear Doom sound effects I'll give it another shot next time it's on sale
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Mar 1, 2024 17:54
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King of Bleh posted:The oldschool games with "spoilers" like Nethack etc are really just metaprogression in another form, and are arguably worse in that regard than the +1-to-starting-HP format because they give players the false impression that memorizing a bunch of obtuse secrets and gotchas has anything to do with skill or mastery. Consider me one of the weirdos who actually prefer the nethack style. I certainly understand why rogue likes/lites have decided to have more player facing information, but I've always loved how mysterious and murky older traditional rogue-likes are. The feeling that I could potentially discover some new secret has always been so much more tantalizing than "number go up", Even though I'm the kind of freak who also loves idle games. Modern iterations in the genre certainly have less gotchas, but the constraints of the possibilities space are more obvious for it. With about 10 runs You can start the already grok what the rhythm of the game is and know what to expect, then it just becomes about grinding wins and optimizing how you play. I can understand people's annoyance with the archaic and opaque nature of nethack and it's contemporaries, but they have a greater sense of immersive sim style emergent gameplay and adventure than their modern descendants which are more streamlined strategy games. unattended spaghetti posted:My preference if there is any is the lateral progression. More options that balloon the possibility space of a game is good. And for especially complex games I think the lateral type can serve the purpose of drip feeding complexity to players so they're not overwhelmed as they gain competence. Agreed on both points although I'm more neutral on numbers go up meta progression. There's certainly a huge benefit to opening up more possibilities the longer someone plays so that they aren't smacked in the face with a hundred different options upon opening the game like stone soup. As far as numbers go up meta progression goes, I find it more unengaging than outright offensive. Oh I completed a run and my health went up? Cool I guess. It seems like it would be more interesting If it resulted out of a decision I made within the run, or was because of a particular piece of loot Tea Party Crasher fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Mar 1, 2024 |
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Mar 1, 2024 22:40
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I would love to have that kind of experience more often with games. The communal aspect of both information and misinformation elevated the poo poo out of Dark Souls for me
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Mar 1, 2024 22:53
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As far as a new Berlin interpretation goes though, That sounds like building sandcastles at high tide to me. If you described to my high school self who was playing Nethack via PuTTY Games like slay The spire or Hades, I would have said they weren't rogue likes. Seeing the genre shift and morph in real time tho has made it more reasonable to me
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Mar 1, 2024 23:00
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Falcon2001 posted:I was arguing against it on the last page, but I do agree that as a deliberate choice, I think this is good. Notably though, Dark Souls constrains a lot of that mystery to things like lore and explanations instead of gameplay, and has a generally small number of 'bullshit, how the gently caress would you ever figure that out' things...and frankly if you're Dark Souls I think you can get away with having some stuff like that, because you have such a huge playerbase. I would say that the community information aspect is meaningful to gameplay, because I've had many instances where a message has clued me into a secret area, a hidden item, or hinted at an elemental weakness of an enemy. I think I understand what you mean though in respect to how such secrets aren't going to result in irreversibly loving over your progress that you'll have to fight to earn back. I get how lovely that is because for nostalgia I recently played through King's quest 6 again with a friend and we got locked out of beating the game multiple times over stupid poo poo like throwing a tomato instead of giving it to a log lol
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Mar 1, 2024 23:10
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nrook posted:the idea that skill is just another form of metaprogression is certainly one of the takes of all time I don't think they are saying that skill is a form of meta progression, but instead that arcane knowledge is
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Mar 2, 2024 01:40
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Quixzlizx posted:Seriously, if one person in a room of 100 said that out loud, I bet the other 99 people would all simultaneously think, "I bet that guy is fun at parties." I bet this guy is fun at parties
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Mar 2, 2024 19:10
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nrook's post about the Berlin interpretation being descriptive makes a lot of sense to me. I mean it's called the Berlin interpretation, not the Berlin limitation.cock hero flux posted:yeah it's not really pedantic to say that two largely unrelated things should not be in the same category of thing. Roguelike is in a weird place because I can't think of another genre that really has this problem. If I said "FTL is a shooter", would you consider it pedantic to respond with "no, that's wrong"? Rogue likes seem to have the immersive sim problem, where the qualifying attributes cannot be reduced to one mechanical or thematic dimension. First person shooter is obvious, because it's first person and you shoot. Meanwhile, like immersive Sims, the qualities of a roguelike are more abstract and have a lot of varying mechanics. The closest I've ever been able to come to thinking of an alternate genre name for traditional roguelikes is "single player virtual TRPG", which is a bit of a mouthful and not exactly catchy. That's what I see as separating those old school rogue likes from the modern lite variants though: something like Nethack is meant to simulate something like dungeons & dragons, with all kinds of tangential and niche actions considered in the rule set, meanwhile something like slay the spire is more similar to a streamlined strategy board game.
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Mar 2, 2024 19:22
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Quixzlizx posted:The issue is that most people are not emotionally or intellectually invested in the "Berlin Interpretation," or even know it exists. So when you tell someone that a game isn't a roguelike based on that, it only matters to you, not them. And there's no reason for it to matter to them, it's just some nerds who got together and declared something. It would be like a Catholic getting mad when Protestants/non-Christians don't view the Council of Nicaea as objective truth. Dude This is a thread for discussing roguelikes, It is not that crazy to discuss what makes it a genre. The Berlin interpretation is a useful document for understanding the perspective of the initial close followers of the genre, and we can use it as a whetstone to sharpen our own understanding of it. I don't see you making any actual points about the contents of the Berlin interpretation, you're just trying to bully people by calling them nerds for bringing it up. Look around you, we're all nerds, let's just discuss some nerd poo poo
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Mar 2, 2024 19:25
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cock hero flux posted:
Intellectually I understand that most dungeon crawl Stone soup players interact with it as something of a competitive online score attack game, so refining it to be more balanced in that direction makes sense, but as somebody who just played it for my own offline adventures It always just seemed like they were sanding off any interesting edge from the game
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Mar 2, 2024 19:33
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I'm confused by your nickelback example. Is your point That it's rude to tell people You see genre differently from them? Like if I told you that Bob Dylan was my favorite rap artist, you would just nod your head and go Yes tea party crasher that's wonderful?
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Mar 2, 2024 19:51
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Snake Maze posted:That's an interesting idea. What kind of games do you think would fit in the "Traditional Roguelike" thread? Are there any traits that they would have in common? Lol
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Mar 2, 2024 19:51
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Countblanc posted:my favorite first person shooter, skyrim Skyrim is actually an arena movement shooter, because there are arenas and you move
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Mar 2, 2024 20:08
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:"Procedural Death Labyrinth" is the one I heard that I thought worked rather well. if I ever re register that's gonna be my username
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Mar 2, 2024 20:12
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