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Varinn posted:I'm saying that as someone who avoided Starbound news until right when I downloaded it and launched it, that the entire first five minutes feels like a rug dropping down on you. The new player experience is that, yes, you get the little blurb in the beginning about how you're a survivor/outcast/whatever, but the first thing you do is get your matter manipulator from your spaceship locker and use your teleporter to beam down! This is hype! This feels rad! Part of this is that the main storyline isn't actually implemented, which includes animated sequences that will show you just how bad off you really are. I agree with canepazzo that maybe the ship should be broken more than just "out of fuel". The MatMan seems to be something like the future version of a swissarmy knife. A standard small tool that you'd find in a locker on a ship or find on your average person, and not so much as some mind blowing amazing tech. I really do not see the the first part of the game as a "stepping down". I see it as a looking up. You have nothing, but you have aspiration and determination, to reach into the stars, you've made it this far and you are not going to let a broken down ship stop you so you are going to figure out what needs to be done in order to get things back up again. It is a very Cast Away feel, being forced to make do with the tools on hand to survive until you can get a raft built to try and see if you can make it across the ocean. :P
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Dec 6, 2013 00:41
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I really wish I didn't have to do the tutorial bullshit every time I start a new character. I don't mean the quests, I mean grinding for cobblestone and wood to get the basic tools and enough plant matter for armor and bandages. Takes a good 30 minutes at least.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:42
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Genocyber posted:I really wish I didn't have to do the tutorial bullshit every time I start a new character. I don't mean the quests, I mean grinding for cobblestone and wood to get the basic tools and enough plant matter for armor and bandages. Takes a good 30 minutes at least. If they're in the same universe, can't you just leave them a care package crate from another character?
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Dec 6, 2013 00:42
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Varinn posted:Yeah, if the caveman tier is REALLY important to the devs for whatever reason, then it needs to be made more reasonable to someone starting the game up blind. That's a good idea, or even just making your ship hella busted or SOMETHING. I like the idea of having the ship look busted up for the first tier or something. I don't think it should be unable to take you to other planets because that's a huge important part of the game, but having it look a little more worn out at the beginning might make the first part of the game feel more survivor-y. FPzero posted:I just hope that theres eventually a better indication that we should build tools. I mean, it's completely my fault for not seeing the Stone Pickaxe in the crafting list, but I seriously thought that my first pick was going to be the copper one and spent over an hour digging with the Matter Manipulator before realizing the stone one existed. Again, completely my fault but the tutorial never mentions anything and just sort of dumps you off with the beacon boss quest. This over and over. The tutorial missions could be much more thorough. Maybe make them optional or something, but I think it'd be better to hold the player's hand more in the beginning. I read through the codex and that helped a bit, but I think I would have been pretty confused or missed some stuff if I hadn't been following the game for a while before the beta.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:44
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I don't know. I think Vib Rib said it best when he said you have to feel weak so you can appreciate it when you're strong. I'm not even past first tier but I'm okay with it so far. I'd also say it's pretty SciFi from the beginning. edit: wow this thread moves fast mune fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Dec 6, 2013 |
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Dec 6, 2013 00:44
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Kyrosiris posted:Well, I mean, it is day two of the "unstable, expect poo poo to blow up frequently" beta stage. Of course. But that's why I mentioned it. Maybe it can be fixed in a patch to help people down the road. canepazzo posted:Caveman tier would make more sense to me if your ship wasn't available/functioning at the start. Maybe get it back/repair it at the end of the tutorial quest line? The problem with this is that due to the random nature of the game, you could end up on a planet with few resources at first and decide that it would be better to try another one nearby. If the ship is busted, you can't explore, unless the fix is really easy to overcome, which is the reasoning for making it simply be out of fuel, requiring you to go find coal.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:45
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Genocyber posted:I really wish I didn't have to do the tutorial bullshit every time I start a new character. I don't mean the quests, I mean grinding for cobblestone and wood to get the basic tools and enough plant matter for armor and bandages. Takes a good 30 minutes at least. Build a base in Alpha sector and write down the coordinates. You can then go there on another character and all your stuff will be there.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:45
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I really like the flashlight effect. Please tell me you can strap one to a hat to make a miners helmet and explore with the flashlight on and a weapon out.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:46
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Fintilgin posted:I really like the flashlight effect. Please tell me you can strap one to a hat to make a miners helmet and explore with the flashlight on and a weapon out. You can stick a one handed weapon like a short sword or a pistol in one hand and flashlight in the other.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:46
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Varinn posted:Yeah, if the caveman tier is REALLY important to the devs for whatever reason, then it needs to be made more reasonable to someone starting the game up blind. That's a good idea, or even just making your ship hella busted or SOMETHING. I think I get what you mean. Starting out with like some cheapo sci-fi stuff (maybe useful but it's fragile and plastic and crap and breaks when you try to actually use it) and then having to discard it and work your way up from copper would be cool, and would fit with the theme a bit better. Like, you start out with a mining laser that breaks after ten shots and a healing station that has an electrical fault after one, and the only way to repair them takes some serious ores from serious planets and to get those you'll have to work your way up from copper- that seems fairly reasonable to me.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:47
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FPzero posted:Of course. But that's why I mentioned it. Maybe it can be fixed in a patch to help people down the road. Yeah, that wasn't directed at you, per se, and more just to the general "you".  I imagine the team knows there's deficiencies in the tutorial and intro questline, but they were fixing things with the game until the very second they said "okay, seriously, just push it now, we'll patch in a few hours".
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Dec 6, 2013 00:47
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Somfin posted:I think I get what you mean. Starting out with like some cheapo sci-fi stuff (maybe useful but it's fragile and plastic and crap and breaks when you try to actually use it) and then having to discard it and work your way up from copper would be cool, and would fit with the theme a bit better. Like, you start out with a mining laser that breaks after ten shots and a healing station that has an electrical fault after one, and the only way to repair them takes some serious ores from serious planets and to get those you'll have to work your way up from copper- that seems fairly reasonable to me. And what if you use those 10 shots on something other than what you need to make your pickaxe?
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Dec 6, 2013 00:49
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Why is everyone so dismayed at the survival part of a sandbox survival game? Isn't starting out with jack and clawing your way up to eventually be a tiny God the whole point of the genre?
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Dec 6, 2013 00:49
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FPzero posted:Of course. But that's why I mentioned it. Maybe it can be fixed in a patch to help people down the road. Make it busted but flying, maybe? No tech or 3d printer, teleport works unpredictably, uses more fuel than it should... Alternatively, tutorial planet has the guaranteed necessary biomes and materials to finish the quest line.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:50
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FPzero posted:which is the reasoning for making it simply be out of fuel, requiring you to go find coal.  I had no idea this was a thing. I thought you had to kill the first boss to get special spaceship fuel before you could leave the planet.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:51
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Danyull posted:And what if you use those 10 shots on something other than what you need to make your pickaxe? Then you still have your manipulator tool and it'd be exactly like it is now  I like that idea
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Dec 6, 2013 00:51
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dvorak posted:For me, the game is now about searching for and raiding civilizations, and taking everything not nailed down. It is the most fun way to play. This. I feel like Indiana Jones every time I go to a new planet. Actually, I suppose I would be more like the Nazi's in Indiana Jones, what with all the slaughter and destruction going on. Calling it Caveman tier is misleading. It's the Viking tier.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:51
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Mental Midget posted:Why is everyone so dismayed at the survival part of a sandbox survival game? Isn't starting out with jack and clawing your way up to eventually be a tiny God the whole point of the genre? To some people its the building.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:51
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Bolian Blues posted:
This really needs to be better explained in-game because it seems to be what most people think. The game never says "Hey, go get some fuel!" it says "Hey! Build this! Do that! Now build this! Kill this extremely hard thing!" and doesn't even mention the fact that you can fly a hundred trillion miles away and steal an anvil from a medieval blacksmith and make some gold armor right away.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:52
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Mental Midget posted:Why is everyone so dismayed at the survival part of a sandbox survival game? Isn't starting out with jack and clawing your way up to eventually be a tiny God the whole point of the genre? Because there are better ways to implement that survival? You aren't actually reading the points here.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:52
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I apparently unlocked an Energy Dash tech, but I can't figure out any way to use it.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:54
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The Crooked Warden posted:I apparently unlocked an Energy Dash tech, but I can't figure out any way to use it. Double-tap the direction you want to dash in. Edit: assuming you've equipped it, etc.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:55
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So what's a planet seed with a good glitch town? I want to see more that the game offers me and I can't find one no matter how hard I look.
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Dec 6, 2013 00:56
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Varinn posted:Because there are better ways to implement that survival? You aren't actually reading the points here. Maybe, but the type of examples you give are all "Came more or less prepared, I even got my tent packed up!  " when the game portrays it as "I don't know what the hell I am doing my ship is out of fuel and I'm going to starve to death. ".Enzer fucked around with this message at 01:05 on Dec 6, 2013 |
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Dec 6, 2013 00:58
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Enzer posted:Maybe, but the type of examples you give are all "Came more or less prepared, I even got my tent packed up! Exactly. It feels like the 22nd-century version of "oh god my jeep is out of gas and all I have is a swiss army knife, I'm so hosed".
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Dec 6, 2013 00:59
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I think the devs should have a huge "THIS IS AN ACTUAL BETA" overlay when you first log in or something. This game is not feature complete. The progression isn't balanced. There aren't any good tutorials that explain basic things. This will all be in the game, eventually. But you can't expect much from day 1 of a beta that they're using to actually test various things. I feel like a lot of the "complaints" wouldn't exist if the game was in its complete state, with better hand-holding tutorials/quests and a storyline that explains why you're building from the ground up. At that point I bet the first tier would be over pretty fast, too. Like maybe you'd build yourself some copper armor, find yourself a nice weapon and boom, you summon the boss and whack it into submission and, hey, look, guns! or whatever. I mean, I feel like that would make people like Varinn feel better. Even if you are stuck making a pickaxe or whatever you'd have cooler tech to play with a lot sooner than what we're seeing now.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:00
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Kyrosiris posted:Exactly. It feels like the 22nd-century version of "oh god my jeep is out of gas and all I have is a swiss army knife, I'm so hosed". Or possibly, 'my plane went down in the middle of Canada and all I have is this hatchet.'
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Dec 6, 2013 01:01
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All of this has happened before, all of this will happen again. Never change, beta testers. 
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Dec 6, 2013 01:03
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A public beta is for giving impressions of how the game plays and feels, y'all. You can relax, I'm sure the starbound devs can handle feedback about stuff without a bunch of people reciting lore entries.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:05
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Right now the problem I'm having is that I've basically ran out of predictable options. I've already built a set of full iron armour and the best iron sword I can make, but thats where I'm stuck. In order to make better armour I need tonnes of silver, but I don't know where to get any and I'm pretty much out of ideas. My plan for next time is to just explore more parts of the galaxy and hope I find somthing that can help me.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:07
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OK, trapped the tier 3 boss and killed it, unlocked the X Sector, and am busily racing towards the end of the tech tree. Gone through Durasteel, Aegisalt, and Ferozium so far. No more new crafting recipes so far except more melee weapons, basic furniture, and racial armor, so I guess they weren't lying when they said the higher-tier stuff isn't enabled/implemented. 
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Dec 6, 2013 01:07
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Varinn posted:A public beta is for giving impressions of how the game plays and feels, y'all. You can relax, I'm sure the starbound devs can handle feedback about stuff without a bunch of people reciting lore entries. I think it's less about white knighting and more about how people are just loving sick of hearing how a pickaxe ruins your immersion on day 2 of a beta release that has limited content available.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:09
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Kyrosiris posted:Exactly. It feels like the 22nd-century version of "oh god my jeep is out of gas and all I have is a swiss army knife, I'm so hosed". Somfin posted:Or possibly, 'my plane went down in the middle of Canada and all I have is this hatchet.' Yes! That is more or less what I get that they are trying do to here. And in the grandscale of things, knowing that you started off as this loser in a broken down ship that almost died of starvation, craweled your way back to being able to survive, to get your ship running, to exploring ruins and other civilizations and planets and the rest of the loving cosmos and eventually learning how to develop stuff that makes you into a techno god is kind of great. I'm actually really surprised that the people who are having issues about having to use pickaxes for three of eleven tiers of tech are not also upset that the starting Legendaries are loving made of magic. Varinn posted:A public beta is for giving impressions of how the game plays and feels, y'all. You can relax, I'm sure the starbound devs can handle feedback about stuff without a bunch of people reciting lore entries.  You are saying that you don't like what basically comes down to aesthetics and the game gives you a reason and you hand wave that and say it doesn't matter, you're impression on how the game should be should matter, not the game's story or reason for doing the things it does. To give a really lovely analogy, it would be like playing one of the recent batman games and complaining that why doesn't batman just shoot the criminally insane crime bosses that keep breaking out. Story and setting have an importance, and apparently Starbound has an unimplemented main quest line so it is actually of importance to this game compared to say Terraria or Minecraft where there is no story or reason for things being the way they are.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:09
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The whole "caveman" thing kinda falls flat when you start with a space ship, 3d printer, and a high tech matter manipulator, and you have to use said manipulator to cut down your first tree, and mine the stone for your first pickaxe. if it can do all that, why cant I just freaking use that instead of having to bang rocks together for progress?
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Dec 6, 2013 01:11
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Enzer posted:Oh come off it. Nah man, you're just MAD. You're not entitled to your opinion whatsoever. edit: for content, anyways, when I eat in my ship I don't restore my hunger bar, but when I eat on a planet I do. mune fucked around with this message at 01:14 on Dec 6, 2013 |
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Dec 6, 2013 01:11
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Tengames posted:The whole "caveman" thing kinda falls flat when you start with a space ship, 3d printer, and a high tech matter manipulator, and you have to use said manipulator to cut down your first tree, and mine the stone for your first pickaxe. if it can do all that, why cant I just freaking use that instead of having to bang rocks together for progress? You can! Very slowly. A cobbled-together pickaxe is going to dig things faster than a swiss army knife, and that's basically what the MM is. Edit: And Tiy basically said as much that later, unimplemented tech tiers will have direct upgrades to the Matter Manipulator.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:13
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Tengames posted:The whole "caveman" thing kinda falls flat when you start with a space ship, 3d printer, and a high tech matter manipulator, and you have to use said manipulator to cut down your first tree, and mine the stone for your first pickaxe. if it can do all that, why cant I just freaking use that instead of having to bang rocks together for progress? Clocks posted:I haven't read up on the backstory, but presumably you are either escaping / a stowaway / setting out on this tiny rear end ship to god knows where. The only things you have with you are this matter manipulator you find, a weapon, and some seeds. The 3D printer isn't loaded with any useful things you could create and you didn't bring any tech with you. It makes sense that the matter manipulator you have now might not be some super duper high tech one from back home or whatever. Even more, it's easier to use technology when you already have it than when you have to make it. I know how to use a flashlight, but I sure as hell don't know how to build one. So starting out with more basic tools and eventually working your way up works even in a lore/immersion sense. Because your ship doesn't start with much more than a weak-rear end matter manipulator and how exactly are you going to know how to upgrade it if you're stranded on some planet with not much more than that and a flashlight? The tool is used for moving poo poo around and has some power to break a tree (eventually), the rest you have to build up yourself. I mean, you can use it and very slowly mine rocks if you want, but a pickaxe at that point in time does the job a lot faster.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:14
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One thing I really dislike is that monsters respawn too quickly. Went down a cave and the opening is more than a screen away? Hope you like fighting in cramped spaces!
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Dec 6, 2013 01:15
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So is there any real benefit to setting up a cool base aside from making a nice looking place. It seems like I'm never on a planet long enough to warrant spending time on setting up a cool base.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:15
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Nomikos posted:OK, trapped the tier 3 boss and killed it, unlocked the X Sector, and am busily racing towards the end of the tech tree. Gone through Durasteel, Aegisalt, and Ferozium so far. No more new crafting recipes so far except more melee weapons, basic furniture, and racial armor, so I guess they weren't lying when they said the higher-tier stuff isn't enabled/implemented. How'd you unlock Ferozium? My tech stopped at Aegisalt.
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Dec 6, 2013 01:15
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