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LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Alchemist theme lets you create 1 alchemical item of your level or lower per short rest, though you can only have one of them at a time (so you can't stock up or anything). Alchemical items have their own issues with scaling, but the theme is one of the few ways to make something out of it.

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LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Depends on what you're aiming for. If you want a Strength/Intelligence warlord, Genasi are the only race in town that will boost both stats, while Dragonborn and Vyraloka are the Str/Cha races, and Minotaur and Goliath are the Str/Wis races, though the Wis build works equally well if not better with Intelligence instead. Past that there's the usual all-stars like half-elves and tieflings who have enough racial support to go with whatever.

If you're going pure lazylord and neglecting strength entirely you can do some fun stuff with things like pixies, tieflings or khalashtar, and you can either stick entirely to strength-less warlord powers or do something like MC bard and take the Daring Blade paragon path if you want to be able to use stand-out powers like Hail of Steel.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Spiked chain MC can also do some interesting things for a rogue, though MC cost is still pretty strong. The only other weapon MCs I've seen use from are net and blowgun, though those are more about some specific niche uses. Pity about the garrote though.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Khizan posted:

Can also use Goliath's Stoneblessed to get a permanent reach increase and one round per encounter of threatening reach.

Also, Fighter mark punishment specifies adjacent targets and you don't have threatening reach, so there's not a lot you can really DO with that range. You can mark from range and not punish it, but there are easier and better ways to do that, like using a Deft Hurler Style with Cleave or whatnot. So it doesn't really bother me.

EDIT: Also, the whip does have a purpose. Warlord's Commander's Strike has a range of your melee reach, so a warlord can wield a whip without the proficiency to add +1 to their Commander's Strike range. Really only applicable to lazylords and definitely niche, but it is a use.

Polearm Master's level 16 feature is an immediate interrupt MBA when a guy within 2 squares shifts or attacks an ally without including you, meaning it expands your threat range as a fighter and also provides interesting options as a strength-based paladin. It is a very useful feature.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Great work! Lots of possible plot hooks for the sequel depending on how things shook out.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Dick Burglar posted:

There is, it's called Dragon King, but you have to be a Dark Sun character because it requires arcane defiling. Avangion is the preserver equivalent and only requires an arcane class so anybody could theoretically pick it up.

Avangion is fantastic on a charisma paladin who MCs into Bard or something, since it's Cha/Wis boosts, permanent flight, radiant admixture on all of your attacks, a healing/buffing/radiant vulnerability boosting aura and an at-will line of sight lay on hands that already comes with most of the lay-on-hands boosters (uses your surge value, adds your ability mod to amount healed) with the only (minor) downside being that it triggers when you or an ally hits 0 (still great for a save, but doesn't let you preemptively heal someone). You're also unaging, gain a bonus to death saves and function as a light source, yay?

There's also Pyreen if you're primal, but boy is that one a destiny that doesn't do much for anyone who easily qualifies for it.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Loel posted:

Kay, so. I wrapped up my 1-20 game, and my Bard player wants to run a 21-30 continuation. So now Im trying to make a bard with no idea what Im doing. Goal is offtanking and loving with the DM's carefully planned encounters.


For items, he's giving me 375kgp. I was looking at


Where do I go from here? :confused:

Eternal Seeker Epic Destinycan let you randomly poach powers from different classes if you don't want to spend feats, while Avangion has a couple of neat features for supporting your party. If you want to off-tank then Demand Respect at level 23 and Discipline the Unruly at level 25 let you punish the hell out of people even if they're already marked by someone else, which lets you inflict some severe damage.

What's the rest of your party look like? If your party's MBAs are good then swapping one of your at-wills for Staggering Note is fun.


Free Triangle posted:

Thanks for the advice, while I'm approaching polearm gamble would it be worth retraining swift spear to forced opportunist so I can push away non-reach melee opponents? Or would you grab both?

Spiked Chain is a somewhat less feat-intensive gimmick if you want a reach weapon with forced movement. The main thing you lose is polearm gambit, but you can get a lot of work with flail expertise (flail attacks that slide knock prone), lashing flail (flail MBAs slide) and dragging flail (slide people you knock prone with a flail).

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Loel posted:

Ah, neat :D What are some good warlord/paly powers to grab before 20?

Warlord level 13: Death from Two Sides means you make an MBA and your ally makes an MBA, and if you both hit, it's a crit for your ally, which is great.

If you have the Combat Virtuouso feat then you can use Strength-based powers with your Charisma mod for the attack roll (not the damage modifier, but who cares with warlord powers?). In that case, Hail of Steel (Warlord level 17) becomes an excellent choice because if you land a hit then every single one of your allies gets to unload a basic attack on your target. It's one of the best enabling powers in the game other than Valorous Charge (Cleric level 27), which is excellent if you pick it up through something like Eternal Seeker. Technically it's possible to have both Hail of Steel and Valorous Charge on a War Chanter bard, and then pick up both the Martial Mastery and Divine Mastery feats so you can have four straight turns of "everyone go ham with +Con to hit and damage". Incredibly excessive though.

If you're still looking for tanking powers, Valorous Strike (Paladin 1)/Castigating Strike (Paladin 13) are mass-sanction abilities that challenge your enemies to attack you, but without a paladin's full kit of feats like Weakening Challenge they can be a little weak, especially if you don't have the defenses to take the hits.

Since you're a tiefling you qualify for Secrets of Belial, which lets you straight up swap one of your utility powers for a utility from any class and there's a lot of good options out there.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Paladin MC bard is also a good build. Bard MC opens Paladin up to the Avangion ED, which is a nice one for paladins.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Yukari posted:

Are you getting both of those from eternal seeker or multiclass swap feats?

Hail of Steel requires a multiclass swap since you need Combat Virtuoso to land the attack, but you can get Valorous Charge on an Eternal Seeker swap no problem since it's just "everyone in AoE charges or makes a basic attack, gains +Con to defenses".

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

dwarf74 posted:

For a super fun exploit, though, my game had a Wild Sorcerer/Gunsmith/Mad Shootist. When their rifle turned into a blaster, their ranged basic attacks got the Arcane keyword and all hell broke loose. It was a real good time.

How did you figure that Mad Shootist gives the Arcane keyword to RBAs? It's powers are arcane, but I don't think it modified your basic attack keywords. Doesn't really matter now that you're done, but I'm curious.

PMush Perfect posted:

Any other tips for running Zeitgeist, just in general? I'm eyeing it pretty strongly right now.

The player's stuff is kind of all over the place power-wise. Escathologist is garbage outside of your ability to fiat someone's survival once per day, Urban Empath is just astonishingly underwhelming, Monument of War is "eh" and Steamsuit pilot doesn't give you nearly anything worth the hassle of every power having a drawback and the suit requiring a saving throw every single time you take damage (outside of maybe a tiefling paladin hero's poise gimmick). Polyhistor and Logos are pretty strong, polyhistor in particular if on a class that makes a lot of basic attacks (essentials classes, fighters). I think Applied Astronomist could also have the Arcane keyword on its powers just because it would be a neat fit for a Cosmic Sorcerer.

Due to the fact that advanced Martial Scientist abilities are doled out over a long span of levels and tend to be rather situation-specific compared to the starter power, you might be better off considering the prep-period from "after an extended rest at 1st level, after a short rest at 10th level" to "after a short rest at 1st level, once per encounter as a free action at 10th level" or so because otherwise you can get stuck with something that you won't use all day compared to the starter power and it kind of goes against the improvisation/blue mage spirit of the theme. Either that or just make it so you can prep the starter power plus one other power or something.

Gunsmith should probably give proficiency in firearms just to make sure that all the ranged weapon classes can use them properly. Could also give superior firearm proficiency at 10 just so they're not outshone by martial scientists (who get proficiency in superior weapons, armor and implements at level 10).

This adventure path has a fair amount of enemies that can hack off limbs or otherwise maim PCs. Figure out how/if they can fix that during or after a fight since by default 3e's regenerate spell doesn't exist. There's like all of one thing that removes limbs in 4e otherwise so it's not something the game normally thinks about.

Generally figure out if your players are the kind of people to get attached to things, and if they are then figure out what they're attached to and work it in some more, same with anything from their backstories. You do a lot of traveling around and meet a lot of people, so there's always the opportunity to tweak something so it better fits the party. It can be kind of silly if everything connects to somebody, but you can get a lot stronger of a response if someone the party knows is working with/in the path of the conspiracy. Also, keeping track of things is rewarded/maybe required, so letting them take notes and/or reminding them of certain details can be good.

You should probably stick to the compilation volumes- it's cheaper to buy 3 of them than all 13 modules and they also edited them to fix and clarify a bunch of things.

Figure out how you want to deal with naval combat. The game has its own little system but it can be pretty underwhelming since you don't really do all that much other than move and shoot something, with the majority of the players just hanging around giving out passive bonuses. It's also pretty easy to game since the most optimal strategy is "target enemy propulsion then kick the poo poo out of them once they're immobilized". If your players actually like their boat, ENWorld sells an "Admiral of the High Seas" supplement where the rules came from, which also includes a big rear end list of magical item enhancements to your ship, a bunch of which are actually fun.

It can be especially annoying because later adventures have enemy ships but don't always tell you what everything in the ship's stat block actually does. The big offender here is the various ammunition types- it will list chain shot but not actually tell you that it does an extra strike of damage when targeting propulsion (making a targeted chain shot by the gunner the single fastest way to turn the fight in your favor, since two strikes to propulsion is instant immobilization). It also does a bit of world-building for both the Zeitgeist and War of the Burning Skies APs, but it's more cute than essential.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
My problem with Urban Empath is that if you're not in a high-density urban environment (or perhaps within 3 miles of one, if the 11th level feature is also supposed to apply everywhere else) then you basically don't have a Paragon Path. You lose both your 11th and 16th level features, leaving only your AP feature (which only works on man-made structures, so it doesn't work if you're wandering around in a forest or something). Your Encounter 11 becomes absolute garbage that unfavorably compares with an at-will, leaving only your kind of cramped Utility 12 and perfectly serviceable Daily 20 powers. And you spend about half the paragon/epic part of the campaign not in urban environments unless you play really loose and round down the "1000 people per square mile" definition to "1 person per 50 ft x 50 ft area" which basically turns anything into an urban environment once the party shows up. There are times when it can work out well when you are in an urban environment, but the floor really needs to be brought up on the powers to prevent the famine situations.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Over at the Giant in the Playground forums there's a guide for DMing RHoD, but it's the 3.5e version. There's still more broadly-applicable stuff in there in terms of plot hooks and theme.

It's also possible to run some sections more Lair Attack style, where you have smaller encounters with no rest in between or put enemies in waves. Dungeon sites like Vraath Keep and the Ruins of Rhest and parts of the Battle of Brindol in particular.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
It's not even 1-20, it's like 5 to 10. Part of it's just the nature of D&D PbPs though, where you have weeks-long battles with a pile of goblin mooks. It took over six and a half years for the GitP guide writer to run it in PbP and that included fast-forwarding through most of the last chapter.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Lemniscate Blue posted:

I cannot even begin to express how insane Grappling Strike as an MBA would have made my Brawler. It's already usable as an OA but to be able to grab on an immediate interrupt as mark enforcement as well? Yowza.

Footwork Lure too. Suddenly enemies are never where they need to be to hit anything.

The Zeitgeist AP is great for this because there's a Polyhistor paragon path all about letting you spend points to boost your basic attacks so you can do stuff like boost your AC or make an attack as an immediate, but the most interesting option is the ability to spend a point to grab a dude except it doesn't cost a point if you have a free hand like a Brawler with the monk MC. And this is a full sustainable grab, not an End of Next Turn one like Grappling Strike. Grab on your immediates, grab on your leader-granted attacks, grab on your charges. And if you hit a grabbed dude with an MBA you can instead spend your points to inflict status conditions like blind, dazed, or weakened (or slowed or immobilized which are a bit redundant, or prone if you didn't have World Serpent's Grasp for some weird reason) and just wreck a dude with your combat challenge or granted attack.

Nalesh posted:

Now this is the kind of poo poo I want.

Brawlers are kind of feat-intensive, but they're pretty fun. There's a really fun combination of feats you can use. Grabbed is a specialized version of immobilized, which means whoever you grab can't move anywhere unless one of the following happens.

1) They make a check to escape, which is normally either an Acrobatics check vs. your Reflex or an Athletics check vs. your Fortitude defense
2) You two are physically separated either by forced movement moving them away from you or you away from them, or they teleport out of your grasp
3) You are rendered unable to take actions (stunned or knocked unconscious, dominated, maybe dazed)
4) You let them go for some reason

Anyways, there's a fun feat called World Serpent's Grasp that means that whenever you hit an opponent who is slowed or immobilized, you can knock them prone for free. This means that as soon as you're grabbing someone, your next hit against them can knock them to the floor, but it also means that if one of your allies can slow or immobilize enemies then you can hit them with a grab attack and clothesline them to the floor.

Fighters also have a feat called Pin Down- if you're grabbing a prone opponent then they cannot stand up until the grab is ended (they escape/incapacitate you/knock you away, etc). This really shuts down mobility since even if they manage to escape by rolling a check as a move action, they probably don't have the move action to stand back up so you can grab and pin them again. Alternatively, if they manage to break your grab with an attack that stuns you or knocks you away, they can stand as a move action but probably can't move anywhere either, so you can roll back up and grab them again.

Brawler fighters also have a feat called Inescapable Hold, which means that any check your opponent makes to escape (either Athletics or Acrobatics) must be made against your Fortitude defense, instead of possibly being able to target your Reflex defense. Fighters are Strength-based (which means they have a good Fortitude), get a class bonus to Fortitude, and Brawler fighters get another Fortitude bonus on top of that, so wriggling out of your grasp gets increasingly difficult as you level. If you're a fighter whose Strength and Dexterity are equal then you can put it off for several levels, but if Strength is your strength then you will want to get it sooner.

Brawler fighters have a bunch of powers that involve punching people. Normally your unarmed attack is the weakest weapon in the game since it has the lowest damage die and no proficiency bonus, but brawlers get their own inherent enhancement bonus to unarmed attacks, which improves the accuracy if not the damage, but those powers frequently have some nice effects like Vicious Uppercut (a power that involves hitting a foe with one hand and then stunning them with a punch). There's the feat Master of the Fist, which is a multiclass feat that makes you count as a monk and gives you the monk's Unarmed Combatant feature, which means your fists are as good as dual wielding longswords (and can get even better with the right feat and paragon path investment, but while the paragon path is great the feat is more of a fun gimmick than anything else), which means you not only have great fighter punching powers but you also have two free hands for the purpose of all your brawler powers that involve having a free hand for grabbing dudes or blocking shots with their bodies or whatever. And since the brawler enhancement bonus is +2 per tier it means that your accuracy scales up faster than inherent bonuses or stuff like ki focuses (though you're still probably going to want one of those options for the damage boost eventually). It also opens up some fun monk feat options at higher levels like Fluid Motion (big speed boost for dragging dudes very far away from their friends) and maybe some more esoteric stuff like Dragon's Grasp (boosts generic grabs, giving you an interesting option) or maybe Driving Rain (really big Bull Rush trick, pretty niche though).

Monk multiclass also opens up Ki focuses, which gives you some interesting options.
-Ghost Strike: Lets you ignore the insubstantial property and punch ghosts
-Blazing Arc: Lets you punch poo poo with fire
-Rain of Hammers: Lets you damage dudes whenever you KO someone, which is good for mulching minions. Also has a power that lets you make an at-will attack as a minor action, great for knocking down dudes once you've grabbed them
-Abduction: Lets your MBAs slide people one square, so you can punch dudes away from your allies. Also has a power that lets you teleport yourself and your target somewhere else so you can settle this outside
-Body of Fire: Like blazing arc, but all your damage is now fire (not just melee), and you can set yourself on fire to damage anyone grabbing you or that you're grabbing (though this does make you vulnerable to cold)
-Forked Lightning: Let you punch poo poo with lightning
-Steadfast Stone: Ignores up to a certain amount of resistance, which includes resist all and means you can punch stone and metal
-Thunderfist: Lets you punch poo poo with thunder
-Iron Body: Expensive, but gives you resistance to your target's attacks whenever you hit someone, which means you're tankier when you're brawling with someone

Brawlers may not be the total masters of area denial like some other fighter builds, but they are extremely good at bullying the hell out of some nerd who just wants to sneak by you and attack your back line. Punching dudes is probably the most simple, effective and stylish route, but there's also a few other brawler gimmick builds involving things like swords or flails for either extra damage when smacking an enemy or making it easier to prone your foe.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Over on Humble Bundle they're doing IDW's Dungeons & Dragons comics, including every volume of the 4e D&D comic for just $1. They're excellent, and writer John Rogers was also the one who the Feywild section in the Manual of the Planes.

LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Gharbad the Weak posted:

I've never gotten anywhere near these, how big are these comics? And are they fairly complete stories, or is there like "Well, great, now I've got to figure out where the rest of the plot is" ?

Fairly complete, John Rogers comic comes in three books of about 5 issues each that focus around a different adventure with its own arc and series of encounters and events. The series was canceled after that, so while there were plot threads for further adventures there's no sudden cliffhangers or any wider continuity than the three books.

Zeerust posted:

So I'm taking my Dark Sun game off a 2(3???) year hiatus, and was curious if the DDI stuff is still accessible/usable. At this point am I just better off trying to track down the offline equivalents? I remember the online builder missing character options anyway.

Don't even know if you can subscribe anymore. At one point I believe automatic renewals worked but new subscriptions didn't, but I may be wrong on that.

LightWarden fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Jul 14, 2018

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LightWarden
Mar 18, 2007

Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!
Generally, just take a look at it and figure out if should be easy/medium/hard/extremely hard for an adventurer of that particular and pick a 4e DC accordingly.

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