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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:This is confusing to me as well, their workload structure must be a complete mess if the updates to a bare-bones minecraft clone are so glacial, I realize it's not quite the same as minecrafts simple graphics, shapes and concepts, but surely it would take less then a year for them to only add the equivalent of minecrafts zombie and skeleton with almost the exact same combat system from the looks of it. Basically there's a huge difference between editable blocks world and editable rolling voxel landscapes. This is a good reason why nobody should attempt the latter, ever.
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Feb 14, 2015 10:39
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Kazak_Hstan posted:What exactly is the different between "voxels" and "the way other games are made"? I'm not sure on what level you're asking the question but let's say like you're talking about the way, let's say, terrain is usually drawn. In the game world of warcraft, the version that was released in 2004, individual vertices are about 3 units apart (a character runs 8 units per second). It's seriously embarrassing that I know these things. Based on the fact that humans jog about 5km/h, you could say that in WoW, terrain is effectively a grid of vertices half a meter to a side. Now, vertices of terrain in a heightmap have a lot of data attached to them if you're not trying to optimize at all. You've got 12 bytes of position data, 12 bytes of normal data (which way "up" is on that terrain, for lighting), it's also got probably like 4 layers of textures and some baked-in shadow data (40 more bytes). There are cheats you can use to get this down (terrain meshes only tend to save the "z" position because the x and y are always in the same spot, I think wow did something clever with shadows), but let's just say 90 bytes per vertex total, which is a lot. This means that a square kilometer of full-resolution terrain, ready to be sent to your video card, is 360MB. 4MB for each byte of vertex data. So let's say you have a square kilometer of voxel data at half a meter resolution. Let's say that it's also half a kilometer tall (landmark's islands are half as tall as they are wide). Well, that's 4TB of voxel data PER BYTE OF VOXEL. It's very easy to get away with a byte per voxel (or maybe even half a byte!) but that's still just so, so much data. And then when you have the data, you have to convert it into vertex terrain so it can be drawn. And then you have to convert some portion of it again when something changes. That's why minecraft did the smart thing: 1 voxel per meter. one quarter of a kilometer high. Then you can have 2 bytes per voxel and still only use 512Mb per square kilometer. And the build limit used to be lower! 256Mb per square kilometer! If you think you're going to make a photorealistic, editable world in voxels, hahahahahaha. This is me laughing at you. The only game-related use of voxels other than minecraft I've seen be successful is using it to build terrain in a developer tool. That way you can have someone with a super-powerful machine edit things somewhat slowly, but when it comes time to send it to a user, you package it up as a mesh and send it to them.
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Feb 17, 2015 08:16
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Oh and landmark is quarter meter resolution because lol.
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Feb 17, 2015 08:18
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a slime posted:It's worth noting that all the storage requirements you described are worst-case. You can do smart things to dramatically increase resolution while reducing requirements. Voxel Quest is one example, but I'm sure the Voxel Farm people are doing this as well. Yeah, so were the storage requirements for heightmaps!! In fact, they were well past worst-case scenario. Saying "well sure a cube kilometer of world in landmark costs more than 15,000x as much per unit-byte as a cube kilometer of space in WoW, but you know you can really cut that down some!" is so far past missing the point, jesus christ. EDIT: Yeah I know there are a lot of great ways to triangulate voxels. You know what else is a great way to triangulate? Having triangles in the first place. "This totally unnecessary step can be quite fast if you do it right", jesus.
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Feb 17, 2015 19:59
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Also a quick note that Voxel Farm is the tech behind Landmark. So, you know. Everyone in this thread can judge how well they've pulled that off.
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Feb 17, 2015 20:04
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I stopped playing in the era of burled wood. I still pop in to see if it's been fixed occasionally. The thing that's going on nowadays is that resources are really quite easy to get unless you want to actually make something. For building you need bulk resources which take forever to gather except with high-level tools, and for tools, armors, weapons, whatever, you need "aspects" that only come from disenchanting tools, armors, weapons, whatever. So you have to kill monsters until they drop rare gear which is usually trash but exists entirely to disenchant for aspects. And also the game still runs just as bad as it did the day I first installed it. Also they put in caves but then they ran too lovely so they took out caves but you can teleport to a cave from the island nexus, but the cave it takes you to is lovely and tiny and might as well not exist.
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Feb 19, 2015 15:25
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itsnice2bnice posted:You can also talk with one of the lead devs about the important topic of "Ogres, Orcs, and Goblins" here: http://www.reddit.com/r/EQNext/comments/2w9n3m/ogres_orcs_and_goblins/ quote:What do you want to see in EQN's versions of them? That's interesting, I wonder what they quote:EDIT: To clarify, we're not revamping ogres. We like the design we've already shown to you. Uh, okay, then?
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Feb 19, 2015 15:30
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JuffoWup posted:not even survival mode. Can monsters even invade your land area? If they were planning a survival/creative game, then combat and monsters should have been in sooner than some tools to improve on the basics. If they wanted creative first and then go towards survival, then it should of had unlimited materials for everyone to just go crazy making things. Also, why is there land rent? Who is collecting it? Why in a beta game where they want our creative juices flowing to make awesome things for eqnext do we also have a land charge to make things? They had to add the rent because there were a ton of people who joined the game, claimed land, dropped some crafting tables, and then quit forever. The remaining players then demanded upkeep so they could get prime spots. Of course when those players built their masterpieces and then quit forever, SOE realized their mistake.
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Feb 20, 2015 11:31
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Tenzarin posted:Wow will boost back up to a retardily huge number with the new xpac and then dwindle back down. They let you buy your sub with gold now, I'm pretty sure they only want to sell you a $40 dollar box now. Buying your sub with gold brings blizzard more money than buying it with money.
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Mar 20, 2016 09:43
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JuffoWup posted:Now I'm doing the starting tutorial and it sounds like the game is more of a "build your own dungeons because we can't be rear end-ed to do it ourselves." This is what it always was, and what it was advertised as. Now that EQ Next isn't happening I have no clue what landmark actually is now.
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Jun 9, 2016 21:03
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Alexander DeLarge posted:There's a flood of MMOs coming out that are the antithesis of what has come out of this genre since World of Warcraft. Problem is, these games take 5+ years to make and many of them are just hitting alpha since they were crowdfunded in 2013 and people burned themselves out by playing wipe after wipe doing the same poo poo over and over. It's why I'm going to go into Albion Online having fun while others are going to have to push themselves through doing the same things they've done before or not play at all now that it's out. SOTA is a really funny example. The original timeline was it would be released by the end of the year 2016. It will not make that, but if they can get the bug whack a mole under control, they could easily release in mid 2017, which as far as kickstarter mmos go is, you know, fine, whatever. People are already talking about it as if it will never come out though. Yo can we wait until it's like, a month late first?
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Sep 23, 2016 01:16
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PF1_Kssab98 The main thing I remember.
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Jan 7, 2017 04:02
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Why would anyone feel the need to pay some nobody with 3k subs?
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Jan 7, 2017 05:25
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And they couldn't get them to work right so they had you teleport into a 'cave'.
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Jan 10, 2017 02:36
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