Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Mantle
May 15, 2004

I was invited to do a technical screening with Amazon. I already felt pretty gross about working with Amazon, but I think I could consider it if it was with an interesting team.

However, in the invitation email the recruiter provided some resources about how to prepare and they basically were all made by that techlead YouTuber rear end in a top hat.

Is that guy representative of the ideal candidate for Amazon? If so I'm not even sure I want to spend any time at all applying.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Lockback posted:

My main person is usually someone doing a career change and having gone through a bootcamp. I get usually a responsible, experienced person who just needs real software experience (at a good, junior engineer pay) and then we can figure out where in the company is a good place to land.

Can you speak a bit more about this? I am one of those doing a career change having gone through a bootcamp (coming from 10 years of legal practice). I have some university computer science from before boot camp but I've continued to self-study things like DSA and design patterns on my own time after work. After 1 year of experience I was leveled as intermediate by several companies and now 2 years out I'm doing tech presentations at work and getting feedback from seniors that my code reviews with them are making them better developers.

I'm at CAD$90k right now and I want to get into the $150k TC range at a company in the 15-200 employee size in the next few years. I still feel behind other developers in pattern knowledge but I think I'm much stronger than most of my team in understanding business logic and representing it in code, particularly in naming things and putting responsibilities in the right place. Sharing this knowledge is where the focus of my technical presentations at work has been.

From your experience in growing bootcampers, how can I get to where I want to be?

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Lockback posted:

Oh man, legal experience and then got through a bootcamp? Jesus that's like a unicorn. The venn diagram of "Can think rationally and organize thoughts to succeed in a legal practice" and "Can code and doesn't get fight or flight triggered by abstract constructs" is such a thin line.

I think there are tons of similarities, especially surrounding modelling of business workflows in technical language. Contract drafting is like writing code in the sense that there are defined terms and meanings and the objective is to describe a business outcome or process. Writing code is the same thing but using a different shared language. Once you get beyond the point where you can just "make the program (or the contract) work", the craft of communicating ideas and intentions clearly, changing the emphasis without changing the meaning, etc. is very similar. And that's just the hard skills.

quote:

I tend to find the growth path for your "type" is usually "Takes about the same amount of time as a junior, speeds through intermediate, at senior it becomes more about specialization". $150k CAD is probably more in the senior range in Canada (depending on market), and honestly it sounds like right about where you are, or at least where you'll be soon. I don't know that you're ever going to be a master at a language or architect type person, that is an easier path to build foundations when you're young. However, understanding the business and being able to rationally explain how things work is super valuable.

I have, and in SDE interviews, internal recruiters have actually asked me to apply for PM roles. I just really enjoy being an IC and I want to keep going down this path, at least for now. Are there different archetypes of "seniors"? i.e. Is there such thing as a "senior" where I don't have the experience of leading and building a product from scratch? I don't see being able to do that at my current company within the next year. However, in the end titles aren't as important as comp.

quote:

I also think, realistically, you are probably going to need to jump ship reasonably soon if you're still on your first job. Some places will usher you up pretty fast but its pretty rare to go from where you are now to where you want to be in the same place within a tight timeframe.

I'm currently in my second job and have been here for less than a year. I jumped from my first role after a year at $53k when I told them I was looking for a raise to the $70k area and they came back at $60k. Looking back I don't think they could have paid $90k at the time, even if they wanted to because the company was bootstrapped. I think they were having trouble attracting and keeping developers and I heard everyone got raises after I left which coincided with an announcement of outside investment.

From the places that were ok with paying the salaries I was looking for, they were all funded. I think that might be the key thing to look for if I am not able to get the jump in comp that I'm looking for over the next year.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Pollyanna posted:

I would love to learn more about applications of legal theory to software development. Sounds fascinating.

I had actually considered law before I started college, but I heard a lot of horror stories and it sounded kinda fallow.

I don't think it's really applications of legal theory. It's more like similarities in thought processes applied to both domains. I've never formally sat down to write these ideas down so I don't have a super clear thesis about it.

In the practice of law I didn't get to exercise these skills with as much regularity as an IC dev does. A lot of my time as a lawyer was spent reporting, explaining, managing, billing, positioning, and advocating. I suppose my experience in those areas makes me a stronger dev. However I'm much happier now that I can spend more time unravelling and writing logic, which is also the fun part of practicing law.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

thotsky posted:

That the 30% job, and use that position to get an even higher paid job that actually sounds alright.

In the past I have taken the 30% better paying job where I couldn't use it to get a better job because it was a dead end job with no networking opportunities, no mentorship, and no overlap in the direction I wanted to take my career.

I might do it again, but I would only do so if I could come up with a solid exit plan before going in.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Annath posted:

Hi friendly goons.

I am a Registered Nurse, currently working in Public Health. I am feeling the wear and tear of being ground into the dirt for the last 2.5 years while making considerably less than my peers working in the Hospital. However, I don't want to literally kill myself going back into patient care.

I'm interested in the possibilities of leveraging my interest in computers and background in healthcare into something health-IT-computer related. Like Health Informatics or some kind of health software field.

Does anyone have any thoughts on where to start with this? I don't have any knowledge of programming beyond high school C++ classes 15 years ago :v:

I just want something new, preferably that pays better and/or has some telework options.

I'm a bootcamper. In my experience the biggest benefit to bootcamps are that it minimizes opportunity cost. I was back in the market in 5 months, and exceeding my previous career salary in 1 year.

Total opportunity cost was $40k for not working 5 months, $2k for the boot camp (got a govt grant), and $40k in salary differential for my first Junior job. If I had gone back for a second CS degree or even a 2 year program, the not working opportunity cost plus the cost of the program would be in the several hundreds of thousands of dollars.

And in the end, is a person with a boot camp and 2 years experience really at a disadvantage to a person with a 2 year diploma and 0 years experience? Maybe in certain circumstances, but probably not in the majority of cases.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

LLSix posted:

When I catch a bad design in code review

If you can catch this earlier by spending 30 mins pairing at the beginning of the ticket, that's time well spent if it avoids throwing out 2 weeks of work.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

oliveoil posted:

I don't know, probably not hard to do. Bet I could figure it out in a weekend if my brain was working right.

E: oh wait an API. Thought of a UI for some reason. Bet you could automate a UI by hooking up dalle2 to gpt-3. One makes pictures and one makes text. That's all a UI really is, pictures and code in the form of text. That's 90% of the way.

Once the AI gets you 90% of the way there, you only have to build the remaining 90%

Mantle
May 15, 2004

marumaru posted:

trying to find a remote midlevel frontend (react) position for a friend in latam. it's been shockingly difficult for them - openings dried up overnight and the few that remain not only have extreme levels of competition (think 500-1000 applicants per posting) and are almost exclusively senior level.
it sucks. pretty bad time to be job hunting

I have a friend in LATAM working for a Canadian consultancy getting paid in USD. I can make an intro if you DM me a LinkedIn profile. The clients are American and Canadian so his English would have to be good.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

prom candy posted:

Since we're talking about moving around, anyone done the move to Latin America while working remote thing? I've vacationed in Mexico City a couple times and I would love to spend a year or two there. It meets my conditions of good weather + good food + not USA.

I did a short one month stint working remotely in Argentina in November last year. The exchange rate is awesome, weather is great. Food is cheap but can get tiring eating out all the time. It's very European in Buenos Aires.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

bob dobbs is dead posted:

if you wanna be out of the usa to avoid politics i got bad news about argentina

Someone in these very forums said that if you are rich enough you become apolitical. It's very easy to be rich in Argentina as a puter toucher earning US wages.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

leper khan posted:

Some people actually care about human rights.

Also, ITT people muse about making $1M USD a year to develop a fart app for MBS

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Has anyone here been in a IC dev role and reported to a non-technical supervisor? I feel it could go either way-- either you get full autonomy to do whatever you want as long as you are producing because your supervisor doesn't understand what you're doing, or what you are accomplishing isn't recognized because your supervisor doesn't understand what you're doing.

Any other outcomes? What kind of questions can I ask in an interview to suss out which way it might turn out?

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Wandering Orange posted:

All of the Excel lookup functions use 1 for the first row so the non software people, especially the finance people, give 0 fucks.

Doesn't the data start on row 2 since the first row is headers? 2-indexing ftw

Mantle
May 15, 2004

oliveoil posted:

How do you test the return value of a public method of class A that builds an object but passes it to another more complicated configuration object of class B rather than returning it.

I want a unit test that calls my class A public method and verifies it builds the first object correctly since I found a couple bugs in it and don't want to instantiate much of the object graph (class B and maybe further class C) just to check the output of A.

I wish methods that created things would just return those things to the caller instead of passing them on. It would be so much easier to test.

Without knowing the details, it sounds to me like your Class A has responsibility for building the object and configuring the object. Consider how you might be able to separate those responsibilities.

Maybe the pattern is something like your configurator builds a configuration object that the builder consumes.

Mantle
May 15, 2004

LionYeti posted:

A good friend of mine is in the loan officer business and its remarkably poo poo she's looking to try and pivot into development/front end. I know a lot of coding bootcamps are snake oil what's stuff that isn't bullshit?

I don't know about the options where she lives, but when I was researching which boot camps to go to I used LinkedIn filters to find out which graduates were actually getting dev jobs to inform my decision. It's a good way to network too by reaching out and saying hey I am thinking of x bootcamp and saw you did it, can we have a chat about what you thought about it etc

Mantle
May 15, 2004

The other piece of advice I have about career switching is if you are sure about wanting to switch, the best time to do it is in the past, the second best time is today.

Subject to you having the rest of your life in order so that you can weather the possible downtime etc

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Falcon2001 posted:

What's the right way to describe working on a project on a resume if you were part of a team working on it, or part of the group coming up with the design/etc?

Don't hide your action verbs behind auxiliary verbs like "worked on". Just say "built" or "designed".

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Ihmemies posted:

I applied for a job, with a 21-row .txt file containing my contact info, github, resume and application. They actually contacted me and arranged a 45-minute phone interview with HR. I never would have even dreamed of something like that happening with such an application.

Next they want me to do some coding task, with a 80-minute time limit. If I pass with a good grade, I may get to a live HR + technical interview.

If I pass that, they'll arrange some kind of personality test or something.
Drug tests.
Local NSA-equivalent does a basic security clearance...

All this for a 3 month summer job. drat.

Do you have any pro tips on how to prepare for such coding tests? I have done Advent of Code and some algorithm course puzzles, maybe I should do some leetcode to warm up?

If problems contains parsing, maybe use python or rust?
If problems are algorithmic, perhaps C++ because of reasonably short syntax, good speed and lots of features in STL?

They use the https://futureskill.com platform for tests.

I think it makes sense to pick ONE language as your puzzle language. I like Python because it's reasonably fast to write and it has a good standard library.

For focusing on what to practice, I like this site that recommends which puzzles to look at based on how much time you have to study.

https://www.techinterviewhandbook.org/grind75

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Anyone have any experience/opinions on working for consultancies as a software engineer? I found an interesting role up my alley but I'd like to hear more about people's personal experience: https://careers.deloitte.ca/job/Tor...r&?src=JB-12762

Pay is on the low side but I'm interested in the opportunity to work on Privacy by Design. What other upsides are there working for these types of consultancies? Bonuses or other perks? Working with companies I wouldn't otherwise have access to?

Mantle
May 15, 2004

thotsky posted:

The math and dynamic might be different in the US, but here in Norway where we don't have figgies/faang, consulting are generally the highest paying employers in the industry. Consultancy companies are able to charge exorbitant fees for software engineers because they enable companies to circumvent our strong labor laws (and lets them use project budgets rather than hiring budgets on staffing). If you're a senior consultant you might be able to pocket 50-60% of that, which is a big deal.

In theory, a consultancy should shoulder some of the work of finding you work, and in theory the loosening of labor protections should go both ways; if you don't like a project you say you want a new one and they'll switch you out as soon as possible. Large consultancies like Deloitte also have huge long term deals requiring them to provide staff, which can make them a safe harbor in times of trouble.

I get an extra week of vacation, but it's during the period where there's not much to do. There's the typical corporate IT perks. There's a bonus situation, but it's really just a scam to keep part of your pay if you quit before the year is up, or if the company does badly.

Are you able to have a decent work life balance? I've heard stories from people at the consultant level working stress-free 9-5 and others working 12 hour days managing offshore teams.

Another thing that interests me about the work is doing things on a project basis and exposure to a lot of different tech stacks. Is that going to be a given in the industry?

Mantle
May 15, 2004

Nolgthorn posted:

Linkedin is a spam network that I don't understand why anyone still uses. They make their money by allowing people to email you, unironically it's a spam network that you sign up for. I stopped using it a decade ago and since then all recruiters moved to linkedin. That's the only way they contact anyone anymore I guess because of convenience, and I haven't received a message from them since.

It amazes me people including employers seem to insist you have one.

I have a very high cold call response rate on LinkedIn when I use it to do research about companies or particular career directions that I am interested in. For example, when I was deciding which web dev boot camp to take, I used the filters to find out where (and if) graduates were getting jobs and where they were working 3 years after graduation. I also used the filters yesterday to find people working in the military reserve at a company I'm considering joining.

I think people respond because when I write a message, I have a clear ask (a short informational call) and a clear reason for reaching out (one sentence explanation of who I am and why I want to chat).

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Mantle
May 15, 2004

lifg posted:

I just took a test after I applied to a job that was a lot of little timed logic puzzles and personality questions, framed as a series of private DMs from real people. On one hand, it was kindof fun to do, I like puzzles. On the other hand it depressed me that I was being asked to do something this dumb.



Hugh had a special eyepiece to do a spatial reasoning test for Geordi and Dr. Crusher. How are unaugmented humans supposed to be able to do this!

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply