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xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
*golf clap* Nice title pun

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnHdpTpmAsY&hd=1

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xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
So if someone reports an ELT, what is the process that happens? Today, ATC asked several planes if they could pick it up, how strong it was and if it was getting stronger/weaker, but then what?

What if it's on 243.0?

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

Thanks for the write up. How long or what needs to happen for it to be taken seriously vice "another hard landing at a random airport" ?

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
What do y'all think of civilians who fly formation? Military?

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
What if you guys had two planes that want to declare MARSA that aren't military? Are they allowed?

Say my friend and I want to do a rendezvous for a formation arrival, can we?

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

MrYenko posted:

MARSA stands for Military Assumes Responsibilty for Separation of Aircraft.

So... No. :v:

So... we can do identical procedures... we just can't call it MARSA... that seems dumb.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

JohnClark posted:

Not really. MARSA is specifically for IFR operations and requires specific letters of agreement between the controlling facility and the military unit that will be utilizing it. Additionally, as far as I know it's almost always conducted in special use airspace or ATCAA (air-traffic control assigned airspace), not just wherever someone wants to do it. As an example at my place, we have an ATCAA called guard dog that the Air Force uses when they fly a CAP (combat air patrol) over DC. They're usually VFR when they're up there but they occasionally go IFR and will then invoke MARSA when they conduct aerial refueling.

VFR operations are handled differently as was discussed. I'm not aware of any agreements allowing for civilian IFR formation flying withing the US, but someone please let me know if there's somewhere out there where it's being done.

I don't think that's true. We've declared MARSA at random points across the US with controlling agencies nowhere near our home station. Per USAF regs, all we need are radar/radio contact, positive ID and altitude separation.

So as I'm understanding it (FK can correct me...) ATC will absolutely not allow two civilian aircraft to merge as a formation on an IFR flight plan, even if they want (and are able) to, they will have to cancel IFR to do it?

xaarman fucked around with this message at 03:02 on Mar 19, 2014

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Random AR is a perfect example of AR on the fly (or the tanker starting on the AR route but then dragging you somewhere.)

Next question,

How are FAA JOs set up? For example 7110.65 concerns X, 7110.70 concerns Y, etc? The closest example I can give is:

11-217: Instrument/Visual Flight Procedures
11-202v3: AF Flight Procedures
11-2MDS-1v3: Plane specific Procedures
3-1: How to do X,

Each document getting more and more smaller picture.

Thank you all : - )

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
I don't like it when you're squeezing in a few extra radio calls because the girl sounds cute then BAM it's a guy :(

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
I have always appreciated KC BBQ:

http://155.178.201.160/d-tpp/1404/00780IL1R.PDF

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Question: Does tower have to specifically give you approval to overfly the field when commencing a circle?

re: http://155.178.201.160/d-tpp/1404/00022VB.PDF

I asked my student what circling instructions we expected to hear, and he said "cleared to overfly the field, circle NE for a L base to runway 13"

I told him I've never requested to overfly the field, and never said "overfly the field" when requesting the specific circling instructions above. However, tower read back "cleared to overfly, circle NE for a L base to runway 13."

So is it required to say, or is he being nice because he knows it's a student training sortie? How would Tower specifically like me to phrase my circling requests?

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
When the flight is a formation, when are you required to say "Flight" when talking to ATC?

Background: At work, our regs have gone under several revisions. yhe latest debate is when do you have to add Flight to your callsign. The current debate is "Vandy XX Flight" every time you que the mic like that is your callsign, vice only on initial check in. OR, if your flight plan is filed as a formation, is it implied so you only need to say "Vandy XX" because ATC already knows?

xaarman fucked around with this message at 01:40 on Aug 20, 2014

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Do any of you all have a FAR/AIM reference for this? It sounds like all technique which is what we're all going through at work and trying to find clear guidance.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

You write your 3s weird FYI.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Whichever goon had to deal with Loot 15 today at AMA, sorry.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
You guys were awesome, and very polite. My student... spent the entire 2 hours talking poo poo about himself because of his mistakes which just caused even more mistakes... It was quite disconcerting. We are giving him a few days off to hopefully get some help, and I hopefully never have to deal with something like that again (although I will, but it was never this bad.)

The Ferret King posted:

Leave North/West Texas alone and come to the Rio Grande Valley.

I was there like two years ago for an out n back with the Panther XX callsign. I wanted to be like "say initials" to every controller in the CRP region, but I have no idea what your name is.

xaarman fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Oct 28, 2014

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

Zochness posted:

Good deal, I've heard most of the bases around here have good things to say about us. We try to be better than Lubbock, haha.

We have trainees that do that too, things just compound and get worse. Hope your guy gets it figured out.

Me too, it was compounded by exterior factors. He's been pulled off the schedule for a bit to take care of some personal business.

Moving onto a better topic:

I hate hate hate Lubbock. Garbage airport, terrible ramp, terrible vehicles, etc. 90% of the time I will redirect my studs to full stop at AMA rather than LBB.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

The Ferret King posted:

A close call at New York's JFK airport:

http://7online.com/travel/jetblue-flight-stops-short-during-takeoff-at-kennedy-airport/479757/

I'm gonna see if I can get LiveATC recordings of the incident in a bit.

EDIT:

Found the audio from the tower. Not sure if anything happened on Ground Control's frequency that would have added to this confusion, I'm still looking.

Here's the audio file, incident occurs at 00:40

Tower: Carribean 526 can you hold short of 22R?
Tower: Carribean 526 STOP
Tower: JetBlue 1295 abort takeoff
Tower: Carribean 526?
Tower: Carribean 526?
Tower: JetBlue 1295 do you require any assistance?
Tower: JetBlue 1295 turn right Golf, taxi right Bravo
JetBlue: Right Golf, right Bravo and we'll advise, we'll get back to ya JetBlue 1295

Here are the paths that each plane took:



First I'm hearing of this, any more details?

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

two forty posted:

So it's technically the pilot's duty to not engage in chatter than the ATC not causing it in the first place? Usually it's some little quips back and forth, nothing distracting or anything, and I suppose no cause for concern nor a dangerous distraction. I don't mean to impugn ATC or pilots at all, any job where you can't joke around from time to time would be painfully tedious, even more than piloting or ATC is already.

I was kind of amused to recognize the voice of the ATC man at LaGaurdia when there was a recent incident there (a Delta flight i think) and heard some of the clips on the radio (I mean the local FM news station in my car.) I guess ATC guys are minor celebrities in their own rights in certain circles of Internet oddballs.

Boston John is internet famous, I want to talk to him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpHhzvgxkKw

Mocha Hagotdi.

xaarman fucked around with this message at 06:59 on Mar 30, 2015

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
My friend got the dreaded phone number, he called, and they just wanted to discuss a landing clearance and separation during a shady situation. He ended with asking "so... we cool?" aka are you going to violate me, and the controller said "yep, just had a few questions!"

I don't think he got that phraseology used on him though.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
I've been seeing some of you posting about coming to the FAA HQ in OKC...

If any of you all want an hour or two in a T-1 sim in Enid, Oklahoma, PM me about 7 days in advance (less is doable but not guaranteed) and I can probably make it happen.

Not full motion but you can try approaches/formation/in flight refueling.

Let me know!

xaarman fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Jan 4, 2016

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
M-F bankers hours only, the govvy sim operators aren't paid to work otherwise.

If they have a valid government ID and are a US citizen, that's fine. It's for base access.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

The Slaughter posted:

Does that apply to scummy regional pilots as well? Or only government employees?

You can too, but didn't think regional pilots would be that interested in a Beech 400 non moving sim.

two_beer_bishes posted:

Well poo poo, that's going to be tough to arrange. I appreciate the offer and I'll keep it in mind if something changes with my schedule.

No problem.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Question from one of my students: When does ATC consider aircraft a formation with air refueling?

I thought it was when we declared MARSA and cleared to tanker freq, but that can happen at hundreds of miles out. Then, it was within 3 miles when we turn off our squawk. However, that implies non-standard formation without the request...

We were doing student training and the tanker miscalculated it's timing and was late to the Control Point. They asked us to do a 360 at the Internal Point, so we called up Center and asked permission. The question arose that we had already been cleared to Tanker freq, so should that request have been relayed through the tanker?

Also, what reg is all this in? I tried Googling but didn't come up with much ...plus I don't understand how your regs are laid out... J5893.45PW ???

xaarman fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Jan 14, 2016

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

xaarman posted:

Question from one of my students: When does ATC consider aircraft a formation with air refueling?

I thought it was when we declared MARSA and cleared to tanker freq, but that can happen at hundreds of miles out. Then, it was within 3 miles when we turn off our squawk. However, that implies non-standard formation without the request...

We were doing student training and the tanker miscalculated it's timing and was late to the Control Point. They asked us to do a 360 at the Internal Point, so we called up Center and asked permission. The question arose that we had already been cleared to Tanker freq, so should that request have been relayed through the tanker?

Also, what reg is all this in? I tried Googling but didn't come up with much ...plus I don't understand how your regs are laid out... J5893.45PW ???

Weekend holiday bump!

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Got it - I was trying to combine AR procedures and formation when they are two completely separate part of procedures (even though they deal with similar things.)

Also, to the guy who works at KAMA - sorry about this morning and the swarm of T-1s.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Yuk yukyukyuk

https://www.facebook.com/airtrafficcontrolmemes/videos/863976023712556/?pnref=story

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE

MrYenko posted:

Our rule book says anything the DOD owns is allowed in.

I did my bi monthly scan through the aeronautical insanity thread and came across this in an RVSM discussion.

Where is this written? I always have to request non rvsm and its a 50/50 if I get it.

xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Non RVSM aircraft are never allowed, even if they request it - DoD are allowed if requested, on a workload permitted basis.

Which is what is already happening.

I never knew civvies weren't allowed. Harumph.

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xaarman
Mar 12, 2003

IRONKNUCKLE PERMABANNED! READ HERE
Here's how to make a good radio call:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDdG42l3uOQ

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