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your evil twin
Aug 23, 2010

"What we're dealing with...
is us! Those things look just like us!"

"Speak for yourself, I couldn't look that bad on a bet."
Of course, most of Red Faction 1 was caves and corridors. It seems like they wanted to return to the roots of the franchise.

But in that case, they should have made 50% of the enemies be humans. Then again, I haven't seen the later parts of the game, maybe we'll be fighting a bunch more humans later, but I assume it going to be mostly bugs. I don't actually mind that, the bugs are pretty cool, but in terms of delivering what people expect from a Red Faction game, some more human enemies couldn't have hurt. Plus it would have made things a bit more varied.

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Gus Hobbleton
Dec 30, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 3 years!
It reminds me of Half-life in a way, where you go through periods of fighting aliens, and just when you're starting to get fed up with aliens, they throw humans at you that completely change the dynamics of how you have to play. Then when you're starting to get fed up with those, they throw aliens at you again and you have to change everything up once again. Hopefully they do that here.

DTaeKim
Aug 16, 2009

I will speak to him and see if he's willing to throw in a few stories. I will simply post them as he e-mails them to me.

Fwoderwick
Jul 14, 2004

They are at least making efforts to vary up cave system A from cave system B, like I appreciated the crystal caverns but they were a little muted. They should have gone crazy with it like the crystal caves in Mexico. While they're at it throw some drat light in there! Just pretend it's the late 90's and coloured lighting has just been invented.

And because everything is so dark I feel it detracts from the games real highlight which is the destructible buildings. It all merges in to one colour palette and I find it hard to get a feel for the scale of the carnage.

Tiggum
Oct 24, 2007

Your life and your quest end here.


So, do we know why everyone thinks Mason deliberately set the monsters free? Do they have an actual reason for thinking he'd do that or is it just "Mason did a thing and then bugs appeared, therefore Mason caused the bugs for some reason."

Also, how loving dumb is Mason that he didn't realise that last transmission was telling him to stay away from the market?

Gus Hobbleton
Dec 30, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 3 years!
Because the guy he shocked in the first or second vid said he did because he's an rear end in a top hat who doesn't like Mason. That's basically all there is to it.

Nuramor
Dec 13, 2012

Most Amewsing Prinny Ever!
Are you going to demonstrate the other plasmabeam?

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Tiggum posted:

So, do we know why everyone thinks Mason deliberately set the monsters free? Do they have an actual reason for thinking he'd do that or is it just "Mason did a thing and then bugs appeared, therefore Mason caused the bugs for some reason."

Also, how loving dumb is Mason that he didn't realise that last transmission was telling him to stay away from the market?

I think the idea is that everyone thinks Mason is martian Hitler because he... didn't manage to singlehandedly kill every single guy in the terraforming facility quite fast enough so now they have to live in caves.

I don't exactly get it myself, but basically everyone blames him for the terraformer incident for some reason, so now they are going to blame him for bugs. I think the idea is basically that they think he's a complete idiot for not knowing that the head rear end in a top hat was in disguise at the terraformer, so they'll think he's an even bigger idiot for not knowing that the same guy was planning to release bugs.

In fairness he is kind of thick, as evidenced by his inability to take hints, but he's really good at killing things so I think everyone else on mars just needs to get their priorities straight. Don't rely on Mason to think, point Mason at the things that need to die and let him get on with it.

Flytrap
Apr 30, 2013

OwlFancier posted:

I think the idea is that everyone thinks Mason is martian Hitler because he... didn't manage to singlehandedly kill every single guy in the terraforming facility quite fast enough so now they have to live in caves.

I don't exactly get it myself, but basically everyone blames him for the terraformer incident for some reason, so now they are going to blame him for bugs. I think the idea is basically that they think he's a complete idiot for not knowing that the head rear end in a top hat was in disguise at the terraformer, so they'll think he's an even bigger idiot for not knowing that the same guy was planning to release bugs.

In fairness he is kind of thick, as evidenced by his inability to take hints, but he's really good at killing things so I think everyone else on mars just needs to get their priorities straight. Don't rely on Mason to think, point Mason at the things that need to die and let him get on with it.

Seriously, I'd like to play a game where people try not to piss off the murder god protagonist. The only reason any of those people are alive right now is because the player is stuck in a cutscene.

Med School
Feb 27, 2012

Where did you learn how to do that?
When he repairs a building that had a computer in it and the computer reforms, does it restore all the porn that was accidentally deleted but you wish you could get back somehow?

Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

OwlFancier posted:

I think the idea is that everyone thinks Mason is martian Hitler because he... didn't manage to singlehandedly kill every single guy in the terraforming facility quite fast enough so now they have to live in caves.

To be fair, he caused just as much damage to the terraformer as the cultists did. They just sort of... EMP'd it in the end.

Nuramor posted:

Are you going to demonstrate the other plasmabeam?

Yes, and there's a way of unlocking it during normal play, but it's an easter egg for later :ssh:. Sooner than you'd think, though.

MentholsNBeer posted:

When he repairs a building that had a computer in it and the computer reforms, does it restore all the porn that was accidentally deleted but you wish you could get back somehow?

It seems to work, but I'd like to imagine that all the people in the photos and videos become Mason with a totally neutral expression.

FlamingLiberal
Jan 18, 2009

Would you like to play a game?



Fwoderwick posted:

That's a shame. :(

Although I'm not sure I can give it a pass simply because imaginary space technology got destroyed in the first hour of the game. Mars was pretty uninhabitable in the first place and now it's uninhabitable and has cool ruins to explore. Just seems a bit lacking of imagination if they keep the whole game underground.
Yeah this whole game feels like a big step down from what they did in Guerrilla. That game really did a great job with open-world destruction. This feels very confined and repetitive.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Are there actually any human enemies in this game? It was kind of hilarious to hear everybody yell about tracking me down, but the upshot is a little enviro damage and the real enemies are just more bugs.

anilEhilated
Feb 17, 2014

But I say fuck the rain.

Grimey Drawer
The game is on sale on Steam this week and this LP actually managed to sell it to me. So good job, I guess.

Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

anilEhilated posted:

The game is on sale on Steam this week and this LP actually managed to sell it to me. So good job, I guess.

Nice! You won't regret it, especially if you can get it on sale.

Update 8: Not Safe For Market
[video]
Mason is a bad listener, but he does get to wax poetic about mars' criminal justice system. And fight a really big alien.

New things this update:
nothing e: well there was a really big bug I guess, but he looked more like a bullfrog :frog:

Things I finally try and show off this update:
Nano Rifle: High damage, low clip size. Against small enemies, you'll waste shots, spend all your time reloading, and hate yourself. Against large enemies, it's actually really good. You'd never know from watching the video though.

Sorry this took so long to post, this is pretty bad allergy season here, and allergies make me sound like elmer fudd under a pile of blankets apparently. Many audio takes were had.

Afinostux fucked around with this message at 05:14 on May 22, 2014

double nine
Aug 8, 2013

About the bugs/human enemies: I'd say the game is about 70% fighting bugs, and 30% fighting humans. I found that fighting humans was a nice change of pace to fighting those drat hoppers all the time, the bugs really outrun their welcome.

Redeye Flight
Mar 26, 2010

God, I'm so tired. What the hell did I post last night?
I used the Nano Rifle all the time in Guerilla, because if you do it just right you can take the wings off bomber planes with one shot. Which is not easy, but extremely satisfying when it happens.

your evil twin
Aug 23, 2010

"What we're dealing with...
is us! Those things look just like us!"

"Speak for yourself, I couldn't look that bad on a bet."
We're finally getting out of the caverns!

(I bet in half an hour we'll be back in caverns again, haha.)

Really liking your commentary - as well as being informative, you prevent repetitive bits of the game from getting boring.

Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

Update 9: A breath of fresh air
[video]

The surface actually seems pretty nice, all things considered. Why did they ever move into the caves? Who knows, let's get into a slapfight with some tentacles while we think it over.

There are no new weapons this update, but there's a lot more effort put into cutscenes and exposition stuff. Also, insubordination.

e: forgot to mention, this game plays its cutscenes over loading screens. In a lot of the surface sections, the framerate can get a little choppy during loading screens for some reason. I don't know what causes this, but it's not that bad.

Afinostux fucked around with this message at 04:49 on May 26, 2014

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

Bonus points to Frank: when the poo poo hit the fan the first thing he did was free Mason. Didn't even need a ham-handed "look you need my help and I promise I'm trustworthy" speech like every movie ever.

anilEhilated
Feb 17, 2014

But I say fuck the rain.

Grimey Drawer
I actually played through this part yesterday, and it took me the punching cutscene to realize that Frank and the Colonel were two different characters. It was quite a schizophrenic experience.

Gus Hobbleton
Dec 30, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 3 years!
I don't blame you, everybody in this game looks alike.

Seraphic Neoman
Jul 19, 2011


These people need hair. It'd do a lot for them.

anilEhilated
Feb 17, 2014

But I say fuck the rain.

Grimey Drawer
Okay, so I just got to the Hellfire section and I'm kinda confused - is RF set in the same universe as Descent? Because the callback is kinda awesome.

Also, about all the bad design decisions the developers made on this game: I just found the black hole gun. Everything is forgiven.
edit: Should probably add I'm having way more fun with this than I ever had with Guerilla. While the demolition was fun, just about everything else about that game was thoroughly mediocre.

Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

Oh, we'll be getting there soon enough, don't you worry.

Update 10: Sneak attack
[video]

Mason finally starts destroying the bad guy's buildings, and uncovers a sinister plot! Or, clears some red dots off a map. One of those two.

New stuff this update:
Banshees: Better pistols, but still pretty unhelpful. They're single shot magnums, but they have a slow rate of fire. Especially slow considering you have one in each hand when you use them. They're like a lower damage shotgun replacement that you're less likely to hit anything with.
Rail rifle: A very nice thing, it shoots a tiny bean that goes real fast. Completely ignores any destructible terrain on its way to the target. The nano rifle is now obsolete.

Rigged Death Trap
Feb 13, 2012

BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP

Funny how you're just headbutting things as your melee.
Is that a feature of the minotaur armor?

Megillah Gorilla
Sep 22, 2003

If only all of life's problems could be solved by smoking a professor of ancient evil texts.



Bread Liar
Is there a reason the cultist all dress like deranged bugs?

Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

Because every concept artist in the world wishes they were painting 40k minis at all times

your evil twin
Aug 23, 2010

"What we're dealing with...
is us! Those things look just like us!"

"Speak for yourself, I couldn't look that bad on a bet."
Ah, the return of the rail driver. Been in every Red Faction game.

It's a shame they changed the special effects for it - they made it a sort of purple particle beam surrounded by rings of purple energy. I'm a big fan of energy weapons, so normally that wouldn't bother me, but in Red Faction Guerrilla it was perfect: a blue smoke trail that looked exactly like the railgun smoke trails in the Schwarzenegger movie Eraser.

Many games have imitated that corkscrew smoke trail effect (Quake 2, Shadow Warrior) but Red Faction Guerrilla was the first to properly imitate exactly how it looked in the movie. Since Red Faction Armageddon uses the same engine they could have kept the same special effect... I guess they just decided to change it for the sake of changing it.

I think the justification for the blue spiral smoke trail in Eraser (and the games that imitated it) is that the air friction of the super-fast projectile ionises the air, creating a trail of plasma. Ionised air is blue.

Afinostux posted:

The surface actually seems pretty nice, all things considered. Why did they ever move into the caves?

Mars' atmsophere is 96% carbon dioxide. I'm guessing the terraformer turned it into a nitrogen/oxygen mix similar to Earth, but without any plants or trees or oceans full of algae a human population would eventually use up all the oxygen.

But that should take a really long time, like centuries. Even factoring in that Mars is much smaller than Earth.

(Perhaps cultists living on the surface are being dicks by not not leaving enough air for their great grand-children... but surely over the course of a few decades the terraformer could be rebuilt? Someone must know how the thing worked.)

The only thing that could make it even slightly plausible is if the terraformer created a sort of forcefield bubble full of breathable air. In Red Faction Guerrilla you weren't flying around the whole planet, everything took place in a region the size of a large city or small country. With the terraformer destroyed there is now a limited amount of Earth-like atmosphere in that bubble, and outside it is still toxic Mars atmosphere.

Or perhaps the forcefield bubble has gone and the breathable atmosphere is now spread thinly across the whole planet, breathable in the short term but dangerous after a few hours.

I'm probably thinking about this more than they ever did.

double nine
Aug 8, 2013

your evil twin posted:

Ah, the return of the rail driver. Been in every Red Faction game.

It's a shame they changed the special effects for it - they made it a sort of purple particle beam surrounded by rings of purple energy. I'm a big fan of energy weapons, so normally that wouldn't bother me, but in Red Faction Guerrilla it was perfect: a blue smoke trail that looked exactly like the railgun smoke trails in the Schwarzenegger movie Eraser.

Many games have imitated that corkscrew smoke trail effect (Quake 2, Shadow Warrior) but Red Faction Guerrilla was the first to properly imitate exactly how it looked in the movie. Since Red Faction Armageddon uses the same engine they could have kept the same special effect... I guess they just decided to change it for the sake of changing it.

I think the justification for the blue spiral smoke trail in Eraser (and the games that imitated it) is that the air friction of the super-fast projectile ionises the air, creating a trail of plasma. Ionised air is blue.


Mars' atmsophere is 96% carbon dioxide. I'm guessing the terraformer turned it into a nitrogen/oxygen mix similar to Earth, but without any plants or trees or oceans full of algae a human population would eventually use up all the oxygen.

But that should take a really long time, like centuries. Even factoring in that Mars is much smaller than Earth.

(Perhaps cultists living on the surface are being dicks by not not leaving enough air for their great grand-children... but surely over the course of a few decades the terraformer could be rebuilt? Someone must know how the thing worked.)

The only thing that could make it even slightly plausible is if the terraformer created a sort of forcefield bubble full of breathable air. In Red Faction Guerrilla you weren't flying around the whole planet, everything took place in a region the size of a large city or small country. With the terraformer destroyed there is now a limited amount of Earth-like atmosphere in that bubble, and outside it is still toxic Mars atmosphere.

Or perhaps the forcefield bubble has gone and the breathable atmosphere is now spread thinly across the whole planet, breathable in the short term but dangerous after a few hours.

I'm probably thinking about this more than they ever did.

I thought that Mars' gravity is too weak to hold on to oxigen? So the oxigen in the air would just slowly (?) drift away into space.

Megillah Gorilla
Sep 22, 2003

If only all of life's problems could be solved by smoking a professor of ancient evil texts.



Bread Liar
Earth's atmosphere does this too :eng101:

double nine
Aug 8, 2013

Gorilla Salad posted:

Earth's atmosphere does this too :eng101:

wait, what?! :supaburn: :derp: :derp: we're all gonna die!

Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

double nine posted:

wait, what?! :supaburn: :derp: :derp: we're all gonna die!

Actually, no!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_escape#Dominant_atmospheric_escape_and_loss_processes_on_Earth

The extent to which this explanation will make sense depends heavily on how much kerbal space program you've played. I'll try and do better.

Picture the earth's gravitational field as a broad, shallow bowl that gets deeper abruptly toward the middle. You might have seen one of these at a local science museum when you were younger.


Now picture the middle of the bowl being full of rice (hydrogen), peas (helium), half potatos(O+), and potatos (heavier gasses, such as O2). This is our "planet"'s "atmosphere".

No matter where you put these objects in the bowl to start out with, they'll roll toward the center. They won't climb any higher in the bowl than where they can come to rest on other particles. Even if you give something a good flick so it rolls up the side of the bowl, it'll just roll back down unless you've flicked it hard enough.

The main source of atmosphere loss in our solar system (according to wikipedia) is solar wind. To model solar wind in our rice/peas/potatos model, imagine an entire kindergarten class throwing magic golf balls at the bowl from across the room1. Most of the golf balls will either miss the bowl, or will strike the lip of the bowl and deflect, as the solar wind would off a real magnetosphere2.

The golf balls that did strike the contents of the bowl would usually strike with enough energy to launch rice and peas out of the bowl, and every once in awhile a half potato would get knocked out. In a really rare circumstance, you might lose a whole potato, but it would be pretty unlikely. In the actual atmosphere, hydrogen and helium are knocked loose all the time (about 3kg and 50g of each per second, respectively). The parts of the atmosphere that we breathe is knocked away at a rate too slow to measure, but the primary loss is from O+ ions getting knocked away from the poles.

There are many, many, many ways that space will probably kill us all, but fortunately having the sun scorch away our atmosphere doesn't look like one of them. I recommend not reading too much about space.



1: the golf balls are magic because for our purposes, they vanish completely when they stop moving
2: this statement is right enough, but mostly wrong

double nine
Aug 8, 2013

Afinostux posted:


[interesting info]
There are many, many, many ways that space will probably kill us all, but fortunately having the sun scorch away our atmosphere doesn't look like one of them. I recommend not reading too much about space.


Asteroid impacts, black holes, supernovas, galactic collisions, gamma radiation death rays, ... what's not to love?

Louispul5
Oct 10, 2012

double nine posted:

Asteroid impacts, black holes, supernovas, galactic collisions, gamma radiation death rays, ... what's not to love?

The slow and inevitable heat death of the universe?

There should be no reason for a terraformed planet to need some sort of terraforming machine. If you just spread land based algae and lichens across the surface, (Say, kicking crates of it out of the back of a helicopter in a few hundred places) it'll start converting the atmosphere. That stuff grows literally anywhere and with absolutely no input from people. Unless they just started colonizing Mars last Tuesday, I haven't played any previous games.

your evil twin
Aug 23, 2010

"What we're dealing with...
is us! Those things look just like us!"

"Speak for yourself, I couldn't look that bad on a bet."
There was no terraforming in Red Faction 1; 80% of the game took place in corridors and caves. Red Faction 2 took place on Earth (and was rubbish and didn't exist).

Red Faction Gurrilla (the third game) was a Saints Row/GTA game set on Mars, decades after the first game, and Mars was now terraformed. There weren't any plants anywhere, it was still dusty Mars, but people were living on the surface in buildings and driving around in cars. However it didn't seem like the whole planet had been colonised, more like there was just one city/settlement surrounded by badlands.

Red Faction Armageddon takes place a generation or two later. You are the son (or grandson?) of RFG's protagonist.

radintorov
Feb 18, 2011
I always assumed that the Terraformer was used more to keep the weather in check, rather than "just" pumping out oxygen and the like.

Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

Just to make things more confusing, in the storm that's so severe that they say you can't go out in it without a heavily armed walker, there are tons of dudes running around.

Update 11: Kara is the best character
[video]

We haven't really known Kara all that long, but already she brings us the best stuff! In this update, things get wild.

New stuff this update:
Scout walker: In all seriousness, we are taking the first boss of the game for a test drive. Not a gimped version, either. A more powerful version, with better weapons

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

Is the sound balance supposed to be all over the place in that first cutscene? I thought we were going to get a hallucination dream sequence or something.

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Afinostux
Dec 26, 2012

Yes, they autoduck for the walker's footsteps for some reason.
And this whole game is pretty much a fever dream

Afinostux fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Jun 1, 2014

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