The Anti-vaccination movement!

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > The Anti-vaccination movement!

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

I dont know posted:

I...I didn't even know that breach vaginal birth was legal anywhere in this country, though I suppose that shouldn't surprise me. I probably don't need to tell you, but your aunt was lucky as hell. It's not an uncommon outcome in breach births for the baby to suffocate and the mother to hemorrhage to death.

It creepy to think of the anti-vaccine people being a whole pathological lifestyle rather than one very wrong belief. It reminds me of pro-anerexia/pro-bolemia people in that regard.

It was breach twins too. That's taking all sorts of risk.

# ¿ Mar 25, 2014 23:42

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# ¿ May 11, 2024 07:03

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

ToxicSlurpee posted:

Complaining about that vaccine is also particularly stupid. The reason it comes under fire is because some people believe that promiscuity of any level should be severely punished so HPV is just God's way of punishing women who bone more than one dude over the course of their lives. While, you know, totally ignoring the fact that things like rape happen and humans have a long history of being really, really lovely at being monogamous. Or that not every religion is against sleeping around a bit.

There are also, of course, more ways than just loving to get HPV and the more strains of it you pick up the more likely they are to give a woman cervical cancer which is, you know, A Big Deal. In particular the strains that cause that are most commonly transmitted sexually but there are other ways to get it and seriously, it's a goddamned virus it doesn't give a poo poo how many dicks you've contained. If you get it it's going to do its thing no matter how you got it. It would be best if we could just, you know, exterminate that poo poo.

In JAMA published on 2/9/2015

quote:

Conclusion:

Human papillomavirus vaccination was not associated with increases in STIs in a large cohort of females, suggesting that vaccination is unlikely to promote unsafe sexual activity.

# ¿ Feb 24, 2015 22:04

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

Discendo Vox posted:

Please don't make me chase down citations. The source is here. The research comes with a large set of caveats that should be included in its citation, particularly for policy purposes.

The short version is that they can't actually make those conclusions based on this dataset. The conclusion statement you quote goes outside the data, as is not unexpected for a clinician-facing publication, especially JAMA (online first status is also a warning sign). This study was whipped up to act as a persuasive document- it's not actually particularly valid (though it's very well-written).

We may find the policy appealing, but for scientific research, that can't be enough to justify a rhetoric of science. If we wish to distinguish ourselves from what we hate, we need to hold ourselves to a higher standard.

I just picked that paper because it was the most recent one. There have been other papers in other journals. I can pull up the citations if you want. The papers out there right now show that there is a small percentage of parents concerned about sexual disinhibition and then several papers trying to show no increase in risky sexual behavior after vaccination. The quality of those studies are meh, either retrospective or cohort with "experimental" statistical analysis. I don't think that you'll get any prospective well-run studies for this question due to cost. There hasn't been a paper that affirms this concern about increase in risky sexual behavior.

# ¿ Feb 24, 2015 23:43

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

Habibi posted:

Every time someone drags this out, or the idea that XX illness was already dying out due to better hygiene/nutrition/etc... when the vaccine was introduced, and that we could easily do without said vaccine because of our comparatively improved health, I wonder how a disease that was almost dead in pre-vaccine, 1950s-hygiene-and-nutrition-and-medicine-level America, manages to roar back to life so dramatically among a tiny unvaccinated population, not to mention one which often prides itself on how well it takes care of itself, in 21st century hygiene-nutrition-medicine America. It is so weird.

A good counter-example would be syphilis. It's incredibly treatable but we have no vaccine. The bacteria is highly susceptible to the same penicillin used in the 1940s with a 100% cure rate if given antibiotics. There is also no treatment besides antibiotics and our immune systems aren't getting better to defeat the bacteria. We now have cheap reliable testing to test for the disease. Despite these effective tests and treatments, we have not even come close to eliminating the disease. Compare the incidence per year of syphilis, a disease that we could treat exactly how you mentioned, versus any other disease that has a vaccine. We've eliminated small pox. We almost eliminated polio. Syphilis isn't going away.

# ¿ Feb 25, 2015 01:55

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

ToxicSlurpee posted:

Probably. That's like $67 per American so in the grand scheme of things it isn't a huge sum of money. It's really really easy to make people freak out about anything with "billion" in it though.

The cost of a hospitalization if you land in the ICU is $1000+ a day. Medication alone will cost a few hundred. Where the vaccines "make" money is in preventing the serious complications or death. For every 1 person that dies of measles, about 10 have to go to the ICU (~1%) for example.

# ¿ Apr 29, 2015 12:40

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

ToxicSlurpee posted:

An ounce of prevention equals a pound of cure, as they say.

Clearly, we also don't need fire codes anymore because who dies in fires anymore?

# ¿ May 1, 2015 02:21

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# ¿ May 11, 2024 07:03

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

So what you're saying is that if my child gets measles, it will erase the effect of all the other harmful vaccines I've given my child?

# ¿ May 10, 2015 07:41

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > The Anti-vaccination movement!