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Being a Yuppie isnt bad
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May 7, 2014 17:52
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McDowell posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCicqORi8Mc&t=130s I've seen American Psycho, it's a good film, but the critique isn't necessarily totally accurate.
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May 7, 2014 17:58
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McDowell posted:As part of their skin-deep social concern; Yuppies are generally averse to any kind of action requiring hardship or sacrifice, which are necessary to prevent disaster in the long term. I disagree, but then again maybe we have different definitions of what yuppie means here? I'm thinking the Hoboken crowd - whose jobs are certainly more challenging, require more intellectual investment and much longer hours than your typical retail or whatever position. e Oh, my mistake if I misread. If its social issues only, I suppose, but I don't think anyone has a moral obligation to be concerned with anything, never mind anything that doesn't necessarily effect them. It might make you a bit of a bad person, but then again that's a wildly wide net to cast in the first place.
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May 8, 2014 13:25
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How do you determine which of the people at these banks deserve death? Furthermore, isn't committing violence for the purpose of class interest the... exact same thing? I would think the government is more culpable than the banks themselves. If someone breaks the law, punish them according to the laws in place (don't believe in the death penalty btw). This mob hoo-rah BS is funny to read because of its impotency, but it's also ludicrously misguided and childish to me.
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May 9, 2014 14:38
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BUSH 2112 posted:I doubt that there are many Americans in this thread who didn't have their lives significantly affected by what happened. And it's the whole system. Those bankers are the ones who bankroll the companies that bankroll the politicians that pass lovely policies that hurt people. I'd prefer that there was never political violence, but I'll be honest: I'd be okay with 100 rich people being murdered to save the life of one laborer. Because they're loving parasites. Luckily, you've used the vaguest terms possible for absurdly huge swaths of people in complicated sectors, so you can point to the worst of the worst for someone you don't like, and the most innocent and cool and good person for the group you do like
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May 9, 2014 15:25
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Buffer posted:I have to admit I do become more sympathetic to Robespierre as we get further and further from 2008 without many consequences to anyone with a net worth over a million USD. That's an awfully arbitrary number. Why should there be consequences to someone with that net worth?
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May 9, 2014 15:26
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Necc0 posted:Hi. I had to sleep on my friend's couch for four months because of the 2008 crash. Go gently caress yourself. Do you wish death upon people in the finance sector?
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May 9, 2014 15:28
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Good point, let's change the bar to tbp's net worth -$1. What makes you assume that? And regardless, how would my person net worth factor into my previous post?
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May 9, 2014 15:31
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Necc0 posted:I sure as poo poo did at the time. Interesting. Did you do anything in the time since regarding financial regulations, legislation, etc?
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May 9, 2014 15:31
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Buffer posted:Your IRA is over a million bucks? If you make regular, even relatively small, contributions from an early age, by the time you retire your IRA can easily be 1m or north of that. It only requires a small amount of discipline re: saving, but that's the magic of compound interest.
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May 9, 2014 15:34
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Talmonis posted:I sure do hope you're not trying to lay the blame for the lack of consequences the rich who perpetrated the crash endured, on the working man who lost their livelyhood. Because that is sure where it seems you are going with this. No blame - I'm more curious if feeling the effects of the recession manifests itself as latent ill-will toward a relatively vague group ("the bankers") or if it spurs action. All the OWS stuff was interesting to me both in terms of what it did accomplish and what it didn't. I'm also very interested in the people that both felt the effect of the recession harshly but still were against the OWS movement on seemingly superficial grounds ("They're hippies!"). That's a very curious sort of cognitive dissonance to me. Personally I would put the fault for all the actions with the government a lot moreso than the financial institutions. You can expect a private individual to act within the confines given to them and push the limits as much as possible - when they cross that line I think the punishment should come from the people designated to dole it out. Granted, I don't hold any murderous anger toward either set of individuals (I see that as hypocrisy to be honest), but were I to assign blame it would overwhelmingly be on the administration I suppose.
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May 9, 2014 15:59
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SedanChair posted:It's not a vague group, it's just a bigger group than makes you comfortable. I don't think you know what people who work at banks do.
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May 9, 2014 16:18
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SedanChair posted:Do you think we are talking about tellers here? Who are you talking about? M&A? Brokers? I can't seem to figure it out, which is why "Kill all bankers" is ridiculous even without considering the hypocrisy.
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May 9, 2014 16:31
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SedanChair posted:Anyone in finance that makes over the SS tax cap should be forced to work as a Wal-Mart greeter until the people's council has determined that they're fit to rejoin society. The people's Wal-Mart, of course. You could be IT at a bank and make that. It's a ludicrous sentiment based on deep misunderstanding.
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May 9, 2014 17:13
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gradenko_2000 posted:Being the IT guy in a bank doesn't make you "anyone in finance", what the hell. Is the call center agent taking take-out orders for McDonalds a chef? Fine, what about the middle office folks? They'll make over that specified amount but their job can be largely focused on managing risk. Are they dead or are they cool? My entire point is that the anger is largely uneducated and misdirected.
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May 9, 2014 17:24
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Talmonis posted:You ever stop to think; "Maybe the sort of thing I just said is why the working class get mad at the rich and their supporters?"  Do I care if my Republican Uncle gets mad because I told him his views on Reagan being good are uneducated?
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May 9, 2014 17:30
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gently caress You And Diebold posted:tbp literally has a multi-page rap sheet, don't argue with him, it just lets him poo poo up the thread faster. This is the laziest thing. My argument is both cogent and logical, but because it is slightly different to the ludicrous memetic one parroted over the past few pages suddenly it isn't worth engaging (because I have probations on a comedy forum for unrelated things)? Surely if there's something wrong with what I am saying someone could point it out.
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May 9, 2014 17:40
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Femur posted:This anger is necessary to effect change. If we for example shoot a 1% into the sun at random every day, there would be motivation to make everyone even, thus reducing your individual chance right? The threat of violence in a developed first world nation is essentially neutered. You're not going to see a violent, anti-finance revolution within your lifetime. zoux posted:Afaik all of the TARP money has been paid back with interest. It has.
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May 9, 2014 17:42
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Femur posted:This anger is necessary to effect change. If we for example shoot a 1% into the sun at random every day, there would be motivation to make everyone even, thus reducing your individual chance right? That's just absurd mob violence though. If you can't even decide who was at fault, how can you justify mass murder? Are you mad at AIG, Goldman for some reason, the government? It's crazy.
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May 9, 2014 17:50
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:Yeah, good point there actually. I guess one of the biggest problems is how widespread this system is, making it difficult/impossible to run away from. I mentioned a desire to leave the country a couple of months ago but on further reflection I don't even know if there is a place to move to that won't have similar issues given the global scope we are dealing with. Do your best on an individual level to make life better for you, then when you have the means attempt to enact change as best you can.
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May 9, 2014 17:58
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:Terrible advice, most people do this and it doesn't account for anything. What do you think most people do all day? How is that terrible advice? The alternative is wallowing in misery.
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May 9, 2014 18:02
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Job Truniht posted:So they can get killed too? People would be lesser eager to do this poo poo if we actually decided to go after them for it. The substitute for punishment is no punishment at all. That is an insane thing to think.
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May 9, 2014 18:04
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:It is worthless advice because that is what people do anyway. The problem comes when it gets difficult to do that. It is not what people do anyway. You can see in this very thread that most folks, even supposedly politically active ones are uneducated as to where to place the culpability for the biggest economic decline in a long time. As for your second part, I'm not. I'm active in my part regarding regulation of the finance industry.
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May 9, 2014 18:11
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Captain_Maclaine posted:Well then big guy, enlighten us: Where should we place culpability for the biggest economic decline in a long time? I would start primarily with the administration for not enacting legislation designed to prevent the risks taken that led to the crisis, nor nationalizing the offenders when they had the chance. Then after that, I'd be pretty pissed at AIG.
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May 9, 2014 18:16
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:How are those two things related at all? I am saying most people already try on an individual level to make life better for themselves. I was referring primarily to the second part of that sentence. Not many people bother to do anything about the ills that plague them it seems (i.e. those that suffered from recession yet decried OWS entirely on aesthetic grounds). I was excited to see the fellow I was posting with before had done so, it is uplifting.
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May 9, 2014 18:17
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SedanChair posted:Have you ever been this upset about how murderers and rapists are punished? Because the financial crimes that led to the collapse are much more heinous. I am strongly against the death penalty. Job Truniht posted:Legislation was already in place until Clinton, Rubin, and Greenspan pushed to deregulate it. I know?
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May 9, 2014 18:18
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e Sorry double
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May 9, 2014 18:19
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:Ok, so if we assume that everyone already tries to do the first part then it is the second part that you seem to be implying does the work. Perhaps you could further elaborate on that point because presently it is pretty vague. The most direct route I think would be studying up on the way our economy works and understanding it well, then participate in campaigns that agree with whatever it is one may decide would be a good idea, or form some sort of lobbying group to help push the issue. There are plenty of ways to help enact change or at least try, and yes the deck is rigged absolutely and it is a travesty, but I think giving up or whatever the initial person I was replying to wanted to do is a cop out.
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May 9, 2014 18:23
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computer parts posted:Insurance "loses" all of the time, it's just that they have enough people under their plan (and these people rarely need the service) that it's a net positive. Well, not CDSs haha
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May 9, 2014 18:25
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:So you advocate entry into an already rigged game? That is supposed to encourage people? Most liberals I know at least have the social intelligence to cover over the fact it is rigged. At least you are honest, I guess. Well in this case not playing is not a winning move. So if your options are between losing and playing with a tiny percentage change to win, the latter seems much more palatable.
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May 9, 2014 18:30
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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:By the same token, though, 'not playing' potentially frees up the energy and will to, y'know, find a different game. Using your analogy, if I'm playing chess with you and yet you start with seven additional Queens on the board while I have nothing but pawns, I'm essentially boned; does it make more sense, in such a scenario, to keep playing in the hops that maybe I'll figure out some dazzling maneuver that will at least let me capture one or two of your pieces before the inevitable loss, or does it make more sense to say "gently caress this, dude, let's play Jenga instead"? I definitely agree, this is a good post and I shall consider my words more carefully when responding to those that feel that way in the future.
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May 9, 2014 18:43
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GROVER CURES HOUSE posted:Yes. Do not teply to tbp. Right, I was very right-wing when talking about enforcing financial legislation and regulating the banks. You caught me red handed!
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May 9, 2014 19:08
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:tbp if you are sincerely right wing your behavior and method of argumentation is kind of sadistic in a subtle, passive-aggressive sense. I'm not going to bother assigning a label to it, I have my opinions that I've put effort into coming to and evaluate whenever I'm presented with new information and would like others to take from that what they will. Getting involved in the congealing nature of whoever's "side" you are on leads to, in my opinion, crazy things like calling for the murder of a large group of vaguely defined people. e To me it's funny that just disagreeing with certain notions will draw the labeling out as well. I've posted in this thread and another iteration of it my support for a GMI, nationalizing the banks and holding those that work in regulated industry accountable for their actions. I have what could be considered, I suppose, libertarian social values in that I do not give a poo poo who marries who or whatever someone smokes, and have posted in D&D multiple times about my support for drug amnesty and rehabilitation. But saying something like "declaring a huge amount of people death-worthy is crazy!" makes me a Republican right-winger, or something. tbp fucked around with this message at 19:16 on May 9, 2014 |
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May 9, 2014 19:14
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:You don't get to assign your own labels, your statements and actions allow others to define them for you. If people are saying you are right wing and can empirically back it up then you are right wing. Consequently, you would also be a sadist via your own method of argumentation and how this interacts with your stated beliefs. I'm not following the latter part of that, could you please elaborate? e If this constitutes a derail however I apologize for asking for the conversation to be lengthened.
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May 9, 2014 19:18
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:If you are sincerely right wing you likely don't believe any of this and giving people pithy advice if they are feeling hopeless or otherwise in dire straits, and then giving them "opportunities" which are equally hopeless but which comport nicely to your own brand of orthodoxy is sadistic. Everything I've posted is sincere so there is no duplicitous nature to whatever I write. I'm not sure what you mean regarding "opportunities" but if you are referring to the offers I had made in a previous thread I genuinely leveraged several former employers for positions and had sent one to a person who had contacted me, it wasn't super ideal but he hadn't gotten back to me and the position is likely filled by now. Good Citizen posted:tbp has been mostly reasonable in this thread and some of you are sounding kind of crazy right now Thank you Good Citizen (I sound like RoboCop writing that)
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May 9, 2014 19:24
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Cheekio posted:See this? It betrays that you assume you're debating a subject with someone in good faith. You're still like three steps too close to the tv screen. As I've stated before every one of my posts has been sincere and I believe I had stated my opinion in both a logical and coherent way, and would not be averse to clarification if either of those criteria has not been fulfilled to a necessary degree.
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May 9, 2014 19:28
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GROVER CURES HOUSE posted:Poster notorious for debating in bad faith not debating in bad faith?? M-maybe a change of heart??? We should totally ignore all precedent and encourage him further. I'm only "notorious" for that among the same crowd that I'm disagreeing with over clearly ludicrous opinions now, perhaps that has something to do with it?
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May 9, 2014 19:32
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Job Truniht posted:None of this is going to happen- not with the current state the Democrats are in. You could perpetually elect Hillary Clinton in office and still never see a single prosecution by the SEC that didn't result in fines and dropped charges. From what I know of him, I'd quite like to see Bernie Sanders get a chance, or even just get some time in the debates to spur the discourse in the direction he'd likely take it.
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May 9, 2014 19:36
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Oxxidation posted:Dude, you got busted asking the mods to make you probate-free so that you could land on as many people's ignore lists as possible. You're probably doing a crackerjack job of that so far, but once evidence like that comes out it's time to change course. I didn't get busted, it's a public forum, and I was just making a joke with my friend who happens to be a moderator.
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May 9, 2014 21:16
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tbp fucked around with this message at 00:02 on May 10, 2014 |
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May 9, 2014 23:57
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