Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

«‹›17 »

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Tuxedo Jack posted:

Let's do some real talk for a minute...

So I've started buying my DKoK army, with a full platoon and 12 Russes in the mail, as well as designs for a Baneblade, a Hydra, some Chimeras, etc...

I've been made to feel really guilty for going into heavy mech for a traditionally footslogging army. The DKoK fluff really doesn't suit what I plan to build...

How horrible would it look, and how stupid would I feel (if DKoK gets an update) - if I painted my DKoK army as Armageddon Steel Legion?

There are noticeable differences, the lack of goggles, the length of the coat, the helmet... And I don't want to do a deep conversion on all of the models, but it seems like this could give me a cool and unique army. But would it look right? Would I just hate myself for not painting them as Krieg?

No one cares about how you paint your models more than you. If you think it'll look good, go for it. If it bothers you too much, don't. No one here can tell you if you'll hate yourself or not...

# ¿ May 23, 2014 20:42

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 4, 2024 12:38

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

so, do quad guns now snapshoot and ground targets?

# ¿ May 23, 2014 22:22

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Dump_Stat posted:

My FLGS was sold out of rulebooks pretty much right away, but when I went in, the manager, who I've known for years and have treated to beers on more than one occasion said that he had set one aside just for me because he knew I would be in sometime this weekend. So, I got my new books. That's why I love my local gaming store and the rapport that they form with their neighborhood customers.

I have nothing against GW stores, but you just don't get that kind of person to person customer care outside of local shops. Long live the neighborhood geek stores!

I'm glad you have a nice store but I have to say the best person to person customer care experience I've had was from a GW store manager.

I was spending some time in Melbourne. Went into the GW there and had a chat with the manager; he asked what I was working on and I showed him some pictures of my orks. He asked me how I did the skin and I told him it was a pretty simple technique; Thrakka green wash over a yellow base. I lamented though, because I was very close to running out of thrakka green and the new citadel shade didn't quite yield the same effect.

I went back to the store a couple of days later to pick up an order and he presented me with a bag full of the old citadel washes including two full pots of thrakka green. The dude didn't want cash or anything. He was just happy to help me out by bequeathing me his personal supply of old washes.

So basically, don't dismiss the GW staff out of hand. They're mostly fellow hobbyists and have the same passion for the game as you or I. Though I'll grant, some of them can be totally dickbags.

# ¿ May 24, 2014 11:02

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Raphus C posted:

Man, templates on open-topped vehicles are really hurting Trukk-Boyz. They were already bad, what with have 12 Boyz and a PK nob that can be challenged out, but now they are less protected on the way in. Battlewagons too.

First they took our 4+ cover, now they take the protection of our vehicles. drat.

Basically, Mega-Armour Nobz all the time. They laugh at most templates and don't give a poo poo when tanks explode.

Play Orks like they're terminators.

At least now the PK nob can now carve a hole through the enemy unit. The biggest problem I found wasn't that the PK nobs were dying in the challenges it was that they were only able to take care of the sgt who challenged them and not do any damage to the unit.

# ¿ May 24, 2014 11:58

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

P-Mack posted:

So can someone explain to me what Forgeworld is? It sounds like its a semi-independent branch of Games Workshop catering to people who find the game too straightforward and inexpensive, but that literally doesn't make any sense to me.

You're kinda correct. Forgeworld make premium resin models for fantasy and 40k and models and rules for the Horus Heresy game (often referred to as 30k) they also make supplements for 40k and Fantasy with rules for their models.

Basically, if you want to put sculpted shoulder pads on your dudes or doors on your rhinos, with your chapter logo on them, You'd buy them from forgeworld. Or if you wanted a squad to be wearing MKIII power armour. Or you wanted a thunder hawk or squiggoth.

# ¿ May 24, 2014 23:24

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

I'm going to have to buy more plague bearers now aren't I?

I'm probably ok with that.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 03:27

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Hollismason posted:

It'd be a good idea. You can do a lot of funky things with Daemons now.

I've got 14 of the old metal ones I used in 5th with the old CSM dex. I try and run as many of my units as factors of 7 for papa N. So I might try and get my hands on 6 more of those and a box of the new plastics.

I don't think I should need more than 30... Such a shame I can't summon them in units of 7

Cataphract fucked around with this message at 03:48 on May 26, 2014

# ¿ May 26, 2014 03:45

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Thundercloud posted:

See what I should be doing is finishing my space marines. What I'm thinking of doing is digging out the two black reaches + extra 30 orks plus warbikes plus grots plus 3 killa kans I've got and starting to put together a proper ork army. I've got about 90 boyz, but 60 have choppas and 30 have shootas, and as assault hasn't been fixed I'm a bit leery of two units of 30 boyz with pistols.

I've painted close to 50 ork shoota boys over the past couple months... I'm almost certain they're going to make choppas really good again and I'll have to paint more boyz.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 13:54

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Indolent Bastard posted:

He contracted it by touching Carl at their recent game. It is still too early to tell if it is temporary case or if it is a life long affliction.

it appears to be temporary. I just read the "choosing your army" chapter and my mind is boggled. It seems even a "battle forged" army can take multiple "combined arms detachments" and, from my reading, they don't necessarily need to be from the same codex... what is going on? this chapter is so flippping confusing.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 14:49

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Ignite Memories posted:

Are you making GBS threads me

pah. I think being able to flame open topped vehicles and the insides of buildings is rad as gently caress. If you're running trukk boyz you should have a whole bunch of trukks rocketing across the board who cares if you lose a handful to some flamers.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 15:29

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

adamantium|wang posted:

No, you've got it right dude.

Just wait until you get to where it lists what units can score.

urgh, I just got there. That feels like such a step backwards... when they introduced the concept of "only troops can score" in 5th (or was it 4th) it was a bloody great move and improved the game so much.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 15:38

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

adamantium|wang posted:

Now your boyz can get incinerated by Hellhounds and Heldrakes both inside and outside their transports!

that's a terrible example. A heldrake is 170 points and, sure, it's murder against MEQs but against orks it's likely to drop, what, 30 points worth of boyz?

# ¿ May 26, 2014 15:42

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Daedleh posted:

Out of a 12 strong mob of Orks that's pretty devastating. The remainder will now get chewed up between overwatch and every single army striking first.

Even losing the lot isn't "devastating"; they're ork boyz! You should have another 80 of them on the table a few inches behind them. If a unit of 12 orks draws focus from a heldrake then they've done their bloody job as far as I'm concerned. It means my lootas aren't getting targeted.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 15:51

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Ignite Memories posted:

Ah, ok, so you're saying that the solution to my army getting crippled is buying even more orks? YOU DON'T SAY?

Oh, no, that's okay, I didn't enjoy using elites or fast attack units anyway Who needs anti-tank in an edition when I can just shoot flamethrowers at my enemy's vehicles and -

oh?

Oh, only MY vehicles can take damage like that?

YOU DON'T SAY?

If your army is 12 ork boyz in a trukk... then, yes, you probably need some more orks. The army generally thrives with a high model count.

And, my point is, the sky isn't falling. Ork trukks have always been paper thin and can be wrecked pretty simply by bolter fire. You're always going to suffer a high volume of casualty running trukks and the ability for someone to do a couple of wounds to the occupants of an open topped vehicle is pretty negligible odds were that the vehicle was going to get wrecked anyway.

and sure, non open topped vehicles can't be flamed... but they also can't be used to assault from.

there's also a few things that got better for orks in 7th as well. the change to the damage chart means that your battlewagons are now less likely to explode which means you can rely on them to block line of sight, even after they've been wrecked.

Overkill in challenges means a PK nob can now take out a chunk of a unit and isn't stuck fighting one model in the first round of combat.

plus there's a new codex, next month?

edit: and here's some of my orks for the top of the page

Cataphract fucked around with this message at 16:20 on May 26, 2014

# ¿ May 26, 2014 16:11

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

LordAba posted:

It won't have that much of an impact, honestly. You should be able to charge out of normal flamer range anyways, and heldrakes will still vector strike+flamer guys over just flaming guys. Nobody is going to load up on hellhounds and the pipeline terrain pieces just to counter the ork/dark eldar threat.

However it is still a random poo poo change that just punishes orks and dark eldar for no reason seeing as those armies aren't very strong on their own. Coupled with the assault out of closed vehicle changes it seems GW loves random rules for the sake of random rules.

actually vector strike got nerfed. it now only does 1 hit against ground targets as opposed to d3+1

and, yeah, if you're an ork army playing against someone who is spamming flamer weapons you're hosed from the get go.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 16:14

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Ignite Memories posted:

I've got 2 trukks, 2 wagons and 3 buggies and i've got enough loving vehicles thank you very much. But it sure fucks up my wagon full of shoota boyz, who actually appreciated the option of hanging out in their transport for a couple turns and not getting obliterated instantly like all the rest of my troops choices. I've been running hard boyz and MANZ in the two trucks because 12 boyz in T-shirts literally never accomplished anything ever. So now a single heavy flamer pointed in the window can roast 100 points of hard boyz without even NEEDING to draw their anti-vehicle weapons, and now those are free to shoot at my meganobz.

The point of meching up is that even though your vehicles were PROBABLY going to get wrecked, sometimes they wouldn't, and that squad would be ready to kick some rear end. It was literally my army's armor save. Now we can't even count on that.

The overkill thing is neat, but it should have already been that way for the last five years. Sorry if i'm not super stoked that I got a couple of my power klaw hits back, but you're basically asking me to thank them for removing their boots from my testicles and stomping somewhere else.

but if it's wagons full of shootas they'll be 18 inches away from the guys with the flamers... and like I said, a heldrake's a heldrake. They're nasty in any situation but, they'll get d6 hits against the occupants of a wagon which is at most 36 points of shoota boys a turn. presuming it kills the full 6 every turn it only makes its cost back after turn 5.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 16:24

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Ignite Memories posted:

Oh is it only d6? That's much more reasonable than what I was picturing.

Cuz you know us orks, we like to actually squeeze all of the models onto the vehicle if we can. I was picturing a flamer template which hit basically everything in the vehicle.

I'm just a grumpy gus because my army was at a pretty reasonable power level when I first started and I got to slowly watch it become a joke. If they make warpheads not suck it'll go a long way for me. My dual warphead HQ loadout was one of the the most unpredictable ways one could forfeit a game of warhammer.

every army gets its day in the sun* and the new ork dex is just around the corner

*except tyranids

# ¿ May 26, 2014 16:32

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Raphus C posted:

I thought the balance to assault was overwatch, and the fact that you would be assaulting with fewer models (transport capacity and all that), but I am sure since it is assault it needs something else to help those poor-done-by shoota gitz.

But you shouldn't have been taking Trukk Boyz if you actually gave a poo poo about them doing anything. They aren't even a good throw away unit. Seriously, just take 3 MANz in a trukk for 155pts. Thanks to the fact that you can now take multiple detachments, you can have loads of MANz with Bosses in Trukks. These guys laugh at most templates.

The moral of the story is that the list was not competitive to begin with. If you don't care about winning, nothing has changed. If you are playing for laughs with your mates, just house-rule it away.

Getting first turn and having two trukks of MANZ going flat out across the battlefiend is fantastic. Especially knowing that if they do blow up the vehicle there's a good chance it'll end up even closer.

Turn 2... we charge.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 16:39

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Oh boy. I hope a MORKANAUT can just be full of bomb squigs

# ¿ May 26, 2014 17:23

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Lungboy posted:

Reminder that flamers have a range of ~8", while transported units can assault from >8" away...

Wall of death ignores the range of the template and as such template weapons will always hit units declaring a charge even if they are 12" away.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 17:32

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Daedleh posted:

The MANz look like repaints of the existing ones. From what we've heard (from the same source who first described the Gorkamorkanaughts), the new MANz are a complete redesign.

They're new. The guns and helmets are completely different.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 17:53

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Ghost Hand posted:

In actual play I have found troops to be even more precious now. Being able to own an objective when others are on it is golden.

It also eliminates the whole "Just kill off all his troops" tactic. (which I personally found kind of dull).

It may not appeal to everyone - but in the two games I've played so far, those troops units were awesome.

Fair enough. My reaction was pretty knee jerk. It's just that I remember list building back in the day when people took the bare minimum of troops.

# ¿ May 26, 2014 23:44

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

So does the new smash attack rule mean you also forgo your bonus attacks for charging of for having additional CC weapons.

The 6th version said you halved your attack characteristic but the wording of 7th version says you can make a single smash attack and I spose it is somewhat ambiguous.

# ¿ May 27, 2014 07:19

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

HiveCommander posted:

It sounds like Captain Sicarius' coup de grace attack; where you substitute your normal attacks for a single strike. It's a really, really stupid nerf and it makes life that much harder for Tyranids who now have an even harder time trying to crack open vehicles with the smash, flight-mode switching and vector strike nerfs, and in an edition where people can have 7 Land Raiders in 1850 points, it's not looking good.

I don't mind the idea of having multiple Combined Arms detachments to have an army that is mostly heavy support etc. It's a nice throwback to old Chaos Iron Warriors lists which is pretty cool. Lords of War in normal games is stupid though, and Imperial Knights should get the IA treatment.

Ultimately I think it's just going to become more important to have that chat with your opponent pre game and decide how you want to play. How many detachments you'll agree on and what kind of detachments.

# ¿ May 27, 2014 08:33

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Fix posted:

I just wish they could have given us one single example of even an experimental detachment that would have made this design worth the iteration, but no they goddamn don't. It's so full of hope and promise, but literally nothing else of substance, kinda like the last two years of allies.

Well inquisition and knight detachments are different. And I presume that formations are kind of detachments as well sort of maybe.

I kinda see this as them laying the groundwork for different force org charts that will each yield different bonuses to the models included within them... I don't know how well it's going to come out in practice. But, hey, we can always hold out that there'll be a detachment that'll let genestealers assault from reserve I guess.

# ¿ May 27, 2014 08:51

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

xtothez posted:

When I saw the previews for Combined Arms and Allied detachments, I did think that there would be a wider selection of other detachment types. Something like an all-Elite FOC with Objective Secured, or a 'strike force' FOC with extra Fast Attack but no HS / Lords of War / Fortifications.

Perhaps it would have taken the spotlight off Unbound, but it would have been a nice and slightly fluffier way of building armies around a theme.

But it's not like the combined arms detachment is all that restrictive to necessitate variant charts. Formations I kinda get. But if a detachment came out that had an extra elites slot and one less heavy it wouldn't really make a massive difference to the way I build armies.

Cataphract fucked around with this message at 10:00 on May 27, 2014

# ¿ May 27, 2014 09:57

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Ojetor posted:

It took them close to a year to nerf Flamers and Screamers. Plus, it only happened because a new Daemon codex came out.

The WD daemon update was in August 2012. The 6th ed Daemon codex was March 2013. So it was 7 months. 7 months of glorious sales.

# ¿ May 27, 2014 22:20

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

PierreTheMime posted:

Hmm, I'm having a real problem coming up with lists for CSM/Daemons because I just want too much and am having a problem focusing. Has anyone come up with decent builds they'd be willing to share? I'm likely going to stick with my successful CSM build of a Biker Lord with Spawn etc, but mixing in Chaos Daemons is making the points tougher.

What points level are you running?

I find it difficult to run under 1500 but at around 1750 I can fit in

Nurgle lord on bike with spawn, 2 squads of plague marines, a squad of cultists, a heldrake, 3 oblits, autocannons havocs, a GUO a squad of plague bearers and an aegis with quad gun

Unit sizes vary depending on actual point levels but I've had fun with that list.

# ¿ May 28, 2014 15:10

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Lungboy posted:

I just had a look at the Dark Vengeance set on the GW site to see if it had a new mini book yet (the assumption being there would be one asap), and found this little nugget of poo poo:

"Please note: To get the latest set of Warhammer 40,000 game rules you will need to purchase the new edition of Warhammer 40,000."

That sounds horribly like there won't be a new mini book at all.

It was a similar situation when 6th came out and they still had assault on blackreach on the shelves but who knows if that's the case now. Perhaps the new boxed set, if there is one, will only contain the most basic of rules in an effort to force you to get the proper rulebook for the full game.

# ¿ May 29, 2014 15:57

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Indolent Bastard posted:

Come on over to the Community Edition thread and maybe we can make your 6th ed book usable again.

two pages in and that thread is already a clusterfuck

# ¿ May 29, 2014 16:24

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Power Player posted:

Yeah, regarding Overwatch, it was sort of just "here, whoever is getting assaulted gets a buff, flat-out." There's no choice there. They couldn't have made a rule like the new Jink rule that has a tradeoff for Overwatching? Like you then strike at Initiative 1 in that same combat or something

2nd ed over watch was great in this regard. You forwent shooting in your turn in order to shoot during your opponents turn.

Something like this would be a great way to balance assaulting from outflank. Guys know that they might be ambushed so they take the chance by going on over watch. They get to shoot at full BS but it could go to waste if the out flankers don't appear or appear elsewhere on the battlefield. It's not an automatic bonus. It's a tactical decision.

# ¿ May 30, 2014 05:16

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Panzeh posted:

2nd ed overwatch is the kind of mechanic that makes more sense in the smaller scale that 2nd ed had. Unfortunately when GW increased the model count with 3rd ed, you kinda had to ditch rules like that. I think in theory a "defensive fire" model of overwatch is a good idea, it's just really badly implemented. Flames of War does it a lot better.

Oh sure, it wouldn't port well at all.

But what if it was a hybrid; declaring over watch meant you forwent your shots but could fire at an assaulting unit at full BS. that way over watch is a tactical decision and not something that happens automatically and won't bog down an opponents turn with a delayed shooting phase.

# ¿ May 30, 2014 13:55

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Thundercloud posted:

Are normal Nobz on 40mm bases?

Here's a question. With this new detachment fuckery where you can include infinite force orgs in your army, and the mention of special force orgs in codexes, what are the odds on the following?

Special force orgs for themed lists in codexes? ie Speed Freaks, Dread mob, Council of Ancients, Young Kings Court, etc.
Will the characters changing force orgs be dropped in favour of specialist force orgs? ie Warboss doesn't make one unit of Nobz troops, but there is a special force org with Nobz as troops?

Has anyone got sight of the Ork codex yet?

I'm thinking of getting a Stompa as a centrepiece model, and logic would say they'd include it in the codex as it's a big plastic kit they sell in store and putting it in the codex so people don't have to bug another �30 book to use it would help drive sales, but what the gently caress do I know so I'm asking if anyone's got the skinny on how the new codexes work.

Meganobz are on 40mm but regular nobz are 25mm (though the ones from the nobz kit barely fit on those bases)

I think they might allow characters to give objective secured to units (without changing their slot) but I don't know about codex specific force org charts. We'll see.

There's heavy indication that the stompa will get rolled into the book.

# ¿ May 31, 2014 09:59

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Lungboy posted:

New Big Gunz. New Shokk Attack? New Mad Doc?

I am so pumped for this release. Those big guns look great and I love that the new meganobz don't seem to be too much of a departure from the old ones so they'll blend nicely in an army of mixed models.

# ¿ May 31, 2014 13:06

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Slimnoid posted:

Don't fix what ain't broke.

Indeed, the only thing "broke" about the old design was that it was resin. So a plastic SAG that maintains all the good parts if a flipping rad model is ok in my eyes.

# ¿ May 31, 2014 16:24

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

JerryLee posted:

On those dataslates, I'm going to start vomiting so hard if dataslate special rules are how they finally fix deep strikers not being able to do more than shoot and hold their dicks. Sure, those guys can't assault from deep strike but I can see that coming now that they've established a quasi-precedent.

It seems pretty clear that they're not going allow assault from deep strike. Any one that could do it in 5th (vanguard vets, daemons) got the ability taken away in 6th.

And since the ability to assault from reserve/outflank and from stationary vehicles got rolled back it seems very unlikely that they'll add the ability to assault from DS to anyone.

# ¿ Jun 1, 2014 22:31

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

krushgroove posted:

Game$ Work$hop Sucks - check
Eldar Rape Diorama - check
Black-skinned Salamanders - check
Fascist Symbol Discussion - check

What else are we missing in this thread?

Home brew rules for power rangers.

# ¿ Jun 2, 2014 00:16

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

I just noticed the logo on the GW page has changed... boy, I am excited

Only registered members can see post attachments!

# ¿ Jun 3, 2014 10:35

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

What'd a 1500 point sisters look like nowadays? I'm (foolishly) considering putting one together. I've inherited a few models from a mate and I've always liked the look of the army so I figure I can just trawl eBay, gumtree etc. and slowly add to the collection over time.

# ¿ Jun 3, 2014 12:09

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 4, 2024 12:38

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

Has anyone tried scoring the tactical objective cards at the start of the turn? That way your opponent gets a chance to react once you are in position.

# ¿ Jun 4, 2014 09:30

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

«‹›17 »