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SALT CURES HAM posted:Because frequently when people who are not part of a minority want to speak their own minds on how that minority should be treated, they'll hide behind a made-up "friend" who is that minority and conveniently shares their hosed up, lovely opinion. I started out writing a post assuming that this was more or less the case, but then E-Tank posted the start of this page. Maybe you, me, all of us, should be giving our interlocutors the benefit of the doubt. Discendo Vox was right all along! 
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Jun 29, 2014 01:58
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." The only difference is that it's an issue of ableism rather than racism.
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nutranurse posted:Dude, we cannot test for homosexuality or transexuality the way we can test for the mental illness that is autism. Being gay/trans =/= having a mental illness (for instance, being autistic). Why are you drawing this terrible comparison? Just to be obtuse or? SedanChair posted:But how oddly specific we are in our definition of "disorder." Which is more debilitating, to flap your arms and hop in place while playing video games or to lack all capacity for analysis or introspection and fail to recognize the danger in Rick Santorum's eyes? To have a detailed interest in trains or to fear people based on their race? Political opinions SedanChair doesn't like: literally worse than autism. Eta: Also, I think people missed this: SedanChair posted:That's because autism is mostly pretend in the first place. 
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Jun 29, 2014 02:59
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A lot of the talk here seems to refer to this hypothetically, or as a phenomenon relegated to China, but is there anything right now that prevents a woman in any country which allows abortion to do it sex-selectively?
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Jun 29, 2014 03:15
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rkajdi posted:Yes. We've past laws in this country in several states, though it's just really standard abortion restrictions in drag.  How do you even enforce this?! Do you have a woman sign a declaration that she is aborting for a legitimate reason? This loving country.
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Jun 29, 2014 03:27
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Discendo Vox posted:My understanding is that it mostly exists to prevent the spread and, particularly, advertisement of sex-selective abortion practices. For some immigrant populations, the sex of the child is sufficiently important culturally that there was a concern that the practice would become common. It still likely is common, but the theory is it can't operate openly for that purpose. This isn't necessarily due to a preference by either individual parent, but rather the perpetuation of sexist cultural beliefs. A good correlative source, if you need evidence that this sort of practice exists, would be to look at the relative male and female population of orphanages in various countries. That said, this set of discussions is all quite far afield from autism. Okay, I guess I wasn't making myself clear: how do you stop a woman aborting her fetus once she learns that it is of a sex she doesn't like? From what you're saying and what I read on the wikipedia page, I guess the laws may be targeting specific screening services, but, I mean, it's absolutely common to learn at some point what sex your fetus is, if you want to. Is the usual way always beyond the threshold of legal abortion in these States? rkajdi posted:You discriminate against women from Indian or South-east Asian backgrounds. Half of this is me just being flabbergasted at the idea of this, but another is because it's relevant as to whether preventing people from autism-selective abortion would even be enforceable, or what the consequences are of trying to fight it. SedanChair posted:What can I say? With my own ears, at a conference, I heard one of the country's foremost experts in designing curricula for autistic children say that it's OK that plenty of kids will be given diagnoses of autism despite not being autistic, because it's worth it to provide early intervention to those who do have it. Sorry if your kid has been diagnosed or something. That's just saying that this expert does not think that false positives are a problem here in light of the intervention proposed, that is, that it is not going to cause harm to non-autistic people falsely misdiagnosed to be such, not that it's "mostly made up". Are you familiar with prophylactics?
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Jun 29, 2014 03:50
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SedanChair posted:Of course, that's exactly how she explained it. But it does mean that there are lots of parents going around saying "my child is autistic" when it isn't true. That's what the words "made up" and "pretend" mean.
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Jun 29, 2014 03:56
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SedanChair posted:Advocacy organizations propose that autism is a growing threat. That's made up, and overdiagnosis is why it's made up. Discendo Vox posted:A false positive diagnosis of autism can be really harmful, in as much as it changes the entire curriculum and treatment of the child. It might be less of an issue for those diagnosed incorrectly later in life, but at the early age many children are being diagnosed at now, it raises the possibility of treating a child inappropriately, while simultaneously missing some other treatable condition. This is not a new phenomenon.
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Jun 29, 2014 04:08
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SedanChair posted:I don't need good evidence, they don't use it. What you call "improved diagnosis" is diagnosis designed to cast as wide a net as possible. It's impossible to draw conclusions about increased incidence -- it's like setting a new record for the Pike's Peak hillclimb after you've paved it. This isn't me calling anything by any term. I am trying to trace back the claims that you are arguing against here: SedanChair posted:Advocacy organizations propose that autism is a growing threat. That's made up, and overdiagnosis is why it's made up. I should have been explicit that I was quoting Atheism Speaks: quote:How Common Is Autism? The CDC, which apparently provides some of the numbers that AS cites, is less conclusive: quote:More people than ever before are being diagnosed with ASD. It is unclear how much of this increase is due to a broader definition of ASD and better efforts in diagnosis. However, a true increase in the number of people with an ASD cannot be ruled out. The increase in ASD diagnosis is likely due to a combination of these factors. I am not going to obligate you to prove a negative, but does anyone else know where AS are getting their certitude?
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Jun 29, 2014 05:00
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