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I've been toying with the idea of going through the process to obtain a service dog for about 6 months now and though I'm still a little ways away from being able to afford to adopt a dog, I figured it was time I came and asked about it. I've done a crap ton of research up to this point so I think the easiest thing for me to do would be to write out how I think this process would work for me and then have you guys tell me if I'm seeing things accurately. Let's talk about my first. I live in Georgia in the USA. I am seeking a service dog for psychiatric issues (panic attacks and anxiety disorder) which I've had therapy for on three different occasions, am medicated for, but I don't think I've ever been formally diagnosed with a disability related to these problems. I do believe I qualify as having a psychiatric disability under the ADA as my panic and anxiety do interfere with daily life activities like eating and sleeping but also non ADLs like traveling as a passenger in a car or a plane. As far as I know, you must be diagnosed professionally with a disability under the ADA (though you don't have to be seeking disability assistance) and the animal must perform at least one task for you that you cannot do yourself to help mitigate the effects of your disability for you to qualify for a service animal. You aren't required to register with any national body and are not required to provide documentation of any kind UNLESS you wish to fly with a psychiatric service animal. All that businesses and landlords can ask you is if the animal is a service animal required because of a disability and nothing further. Your animal is not required to have any special clothing that designates it as a service animal. So its clear that from US laws, it would be pretty easy to scam the system (though this would make you a lovely person and you could be arrested or fined). I'm trying to go about this in the proper way so that I'm 100% legal with my dog. In Georgia, there is only protection for service dogs in training in the event that: the trainer is from a certified school and the dog is being trained for people with physical disabilities. I plan to train my dog on my own as I have experience with training dogs and as the tasks I'll require of my dog are simple motions to train. The steps I'm considering following: -Go back to mental health professional and have myself officially assessed and documented as having a psychiatric disability -Have them write a prescription for me to have an emotional support animal. This is just for the interim period when I am training my dog so that I can avoid being told I cannot keep a dog in my apartment complex before the dog is fully trained as there is no coverage in my state for my particular sort of service dog in training. I'm hoping to move to a house with a fenced yard that allows dogs but that's still up in the air. -Contact adoption agencies for the breeds I am considering: Shetland Sheepdog, Poodle (standard or miniature), Labradoodle (standard or miniature), Labrador Retriever -Enlist the aid of a local service dog trainer to help me choose the right young adoptable dog for my needs -Once I've adopted my dog, I'd enroll in obedience classes as a way to get started with socialization and training (though I know I could do this without the classes) -Then I'd work on the disability specific skills I'm looking for: deep pressure therapy, circling in crowded situations, stand stay crowd control -Once my dog could do at least one of these skills and I felt confident that they could behave in public and were fully house-trained I'd begin got bring the dog everywhere with me I am able, including planning to bring the dog on flights My questions: -Does that above process seem about right? -Any advice you can give me about the process of finding the right dog, training, seeking proper housing, or getting a dog to the point where they'd be calm on an aircraft? -I was originally concerned about fitting a German Shepherd, Labradoodle, or Standard Poodle on an airplane but apparently people do this all the time without issue. Any info on this would be great. -I want to hear goon experiences with service dogs both as say a business owner or as a handler -I'm considering purchasing the two Teamwork books on service dog training that I've seen suggested before. Has anyone used these books or used other books they think might be better? Resources I've been using: - ADA SD Q&A - Differences between emotional support animal, service animal, and therapy animal -Suggested minimum standards for SDs - Psychiatric SD tasks - SD trainer directory to find people to train your dog, train you how to train your dog, and help you select a dog JibbaJabberwocky fucked around with this message at 13:51 on Sep 21, 2014 |
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Sep 18, 2014 16:33
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| # ? May 17, 2024 07:56 |
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Unless I'm misreading, you say you're planning to train a service dog on your own. What is your experience training dogs? Do you think you're equipped to do that? It's not a simple process just to socialize and housebreak a dog, much less train them for what you're describing. I'd be concerned that you're trying to take on too much, but that's just me. Don't get me wrong - I'm not doubting your disability, I would just be concerned about getting in over your head when it comes to providing a structured environment for a dog that needs to be trained to very specific requirements.
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Sep 19, 2014 08:39
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Why do you have to train the dog yourself? Seeing eye dogs are trained from a very young age and according to Guide Dogs Australia they go into service at about 20-24 months. Wouldn't it be easier for you to get a trained dog?
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Sep 19, 2014 09:17
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I have had experience with dogs all my life. My parent's two German Shepherds were two when I was born and I grew up with them. I can't claim I helped with their initial training but I did help with its upkeep. These dogs were impeccably behaved and so was our most recent family dog. I never thought basic obedience training, socializing, and housebreaking was a particularly complicated process but I suppose for some people it must be considering the terribly behaved dogs I see. Our dogs were always held to very high standards of behavior so I guess I'm just used to expecting that sort of behavior from my dogs. That's why I'm looking very specifically at breeds that are known for their intelligence. Picking the right puppy is the real hard part. I wouldn't be considering it if I thought I was unable. That's also where choosing the right dog comes in as well. I did mention I was planning on getting help with that. The person who I'd choose to help me pick out my young dog initially from an adoption would be the same person who I could contact for help if I was ever running into roadblocks with training. Many service dog trainers also train trainers to train their own dogs. So I'm all over asking for help if I find I need it. I definitely understand why both of you would ask about that and I know for sure if I had a physical disability like poor sight or deafness or even like a seizure disorder, I'd not feel confident in raising my own dog because they would be required to perform tasks for me that I do not know how to train. I also want to make it clear that in the US, there's no laws saying your dog must be trained by an accredited school or anything of the sort. I do understand that guide dogs still tend to undergo a rigorous training even in the US because their tasks are so complicated. However it is reasonably common for individuals to train their own service dogs if they feel able. Some of the books I mentioned earlier: Teamwork I and II were written specifically to teach disabled handlers how to train their own service dog. Service Dogs aren't cheap and fully trained dogs can run you thousands of dollars. It's not really a question of money for me, the tasks I expect from my dog aren't particularly difficult positions to train. I'll be pouring through the Teamwork books for definite and I know the second book describes how to get your dog to stand-stay. Circling is also a easyish task to train because you just get your pup to follow the food around your legs. The biggest one for me is deep pressure therapy. Which is basically just getting the dog to lie on your chest fully or partially depending on their size and stay there. So once they've got the basic command "lie down", you can easily transition to "lie down on me." To me, the hardest thing after getting the dog will be socializing them to everything including airplanes. The downside is that I can't ever bring my dog to work as I'm going to be graduating soon and beginning to work as a nurse. On the upside, I can basically make my own schedule and I'll only work three days a week. That leaves me lots of time to work just with my dog and take them with me. So I'll have more time with them than a person who works a normal 9-5, 5 days a week.
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Sep 19, 2014 13:44
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As I understand US federal law, you don't need any kind of certification for the dog nor any kind of prescription from a physician, you just need to be able to answer "what kind of service does this animal perform" and you can go anywhere from fine restaurants to airplanes. I can't imagine they can keep you out of a hospital, the disability law doesn't make any distinction, I don't believe.
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Sep 19, 2014 17:52
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Yes and no. When it concerns most things, the only thing you have to do is answer questions about what tasks the animal can perform. Still, you should qualify as disabled under the ADA to legally have a service dog so part of the reason I want to mosey in to see a clinical psychologist is to confirm this. 'cause while I'm pretty sure I do qualify, I'm not 100% sure. Secondly, I'm seeking coverage just in case I can't find the perfect pet-friendly rental place next year and I have to use the Fair Housing Act to be allowed to keep my dog until they're trained. My getting paperwork done and diagnosed on these points is purely to cover my own rear end. I also expect to be hassled at some point about my dog and though it's not required, having documentation already completed would make me feel better about it. Secondarily, psychiatric service dogs have to provide documentation when flying though physical service dogs don't. Nice little bit of "I can't see your disability so prove it," discrimination there but I know its because people were cheating the system and they ruined it for the rest of us. So I *will* have to have documentation regardless and it'll be easier if I already have seen a someone about it even though it will be a different letter than the one for a prescribed emotional support animal. As for hospitals, you can't be a nurse with a service dog unless you're working in a non-hospital environment. Sterility is too big an issue in the hospital. Now if I got into a car accident, the dog could come with me anywhere in the hospital that wasn't sterile but as someone working at the hospital, no dice. This isn't as a big a deal for me since my panic tends to manifest at night or when I'm traveling away from home. Which are both times I could keep my pup handy.
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Sep 19, 2014 18:38
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I'm not intimately involved in service dogs, but I figure I'd take a stab at this. Service dog handlers seem to have a pretty good internet presence if you know where to look. I imagine SD forums will be a great resource for you going forward. They'll help you through some of your more SD-oriented questions. Not all dogs are cut out to be service dogs. This may seem obvious, but... it's really really important and bears repeating. It's great that it sounds like you already have someone who will help you pick out a dog. Other people I know have gotten dogs as pups directly from a breeder, or gotten involved in local dog social circles and put the word out through rescues that they're looking for a SD prospect. You'll be looking for a dog who is in tune with people, non-aggressive and who copes well with stress. You may have to ask yourself the tough question of what will happen to your SD prospect if it ends up washing out. Will you rehome? Will you keep it as a pet? Can you afford to keep a pet and another SD prospect? Once you have a well suited prospect, the idea is to get them out and about as much as possible, while ensuring the dog is successful. Here's a good article on how to socialize a dog properly: http://www.clickertraining.com/node/3953 Public access training is probably where most of your attention will go after initial socialization. This involves crowd navigation, food refusal, settling when told, focus on the task at hand and not soliciting attention. Air travel in the cabin isn't too unusual for SDs. Their ears don't pop like ours do, so the biggest hurdle is the constant high noise and small area to settle. But with socialization and public access training it shouldn't present a significant problem. You mention GSDs. They're awesome dogs, but overall I don't think they're particularly well suited to be service dogs. There are of course exceptions to the rule, but the vast majority of GSDs that I have worked with are dog aggressive, human aggressive, fearful, extremely energetic and/or anxious to at least some degree. Shelties are also sort of a mess right now and the majority I know are fearful and serious alarm barkers. Poodles are pretty neat dogs, but pretty goofy and energetic. Doodles are similarly energetic and goofy... only more so. Is your schedule something that can accommodate a dog when it's not traveling to and from work with you? Will you be able to devote time to fulfilling its exercise needs and training beyond service dog stuff? Training your own SD is pretty stressful since there's a sort of "I have to accomplish this or else" threat hanging above everything that you do. I'm sure there will be good days and bad days. They're not a cure-all and can introduce more problems than they solve. Other people can be pretty critical too, so be prepared to have lots of questions thrown at you. You don't have to answer any of them, but they'll happen all the same. And they'll inadvertently sabotage your training by trying to say hello do your dog while its working. Overall I think it sounds like you're starting off in the right direction. I would just caution you to really ask yourself if a SD is what you need, as it's something that cannot be taken lightly.
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Sep 19, 2014 19:20
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a life less posted:You may have to ask yourself the tough question of what will happen to your SD prospect if it ends up washing out. Will you rehome? Will you keep it as a pet? Can you afford to keep a pet and another SD prospect? a life less posted:You mention GSDs. They're awesome dogs, but overall I don't think they're particularly well suited to be service dogs. There are of course exceptions to the rule, but the vast majority of GSDs that I have worked with are dog aggressive, human aggressive, fearful, extremely energetic and/or anxious to at least some degree. Shelties are also sort of a mess right now and the majority I know are fearful and serious alarm barkers. Poodles are pretty neat dogs, but pretty goofy and energetic. Doodles are similarly energetic and goofy... only more so. a life less posted:Is your schedule something that can accommodate a dog when it's not traveling to and from work with you? Will you be able to devote time to fulfilling its exercise needs and training beyond service dog stuff? I've been considering this solidly for the past 6 months and will continue to consider it and research it for the next 6 at least before I try and dive into any of this. As I get closer to when I can actually adopt I'll definitely be in contact with the trainers who can help me choose my dog to get advice from them about how I should go about this process. JibbaJabberwocky fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Sep 19, 2014 |
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Sep 19, 2014 19:52
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You didn't answer my question. Why do you need to do have to train the dog yourself? Why don't you get an already trained animal? Also, kinda related: I looked into the law for my state and it's interesting in the sense that you would need a license to train the dogs and have identification as to why you need the dog (Handler's Identity Card). But if you have the card then it would be illegal for anyone to refuse you entry to anywhere on account of your dog or try to separate the two.
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Sep 20, 2014 07:56
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Lord Windy posted:You didn't answer my question. Why do you need to do have to train the dog yourself? Why don't you get an already trained animal? I don't need to, I simply wish to. There are benefits and drawbacks to both owner training and having a dog trained by an organization. It's not really easier to do it one way or the other. I'll see if I can break it down... Pre-trained Dog: Pros -Trained by (hopefully) very experienced individuals -Dogs usually bred specifically for program and chosen specifically -Dogs that 'wash out' never get put with an individual, when you get your dog it should ready to work -Sometimes can be given to person free or at great discount (though for the most part it seems that I'm not 'disabled enough' to qualify, mostly seems like its people with physical disabilities that qualify) Cons -You don't interact with dog until its 2 years old, you miss out on its formative years -The dog is trained with a person with your disability in mind but it might not be as much as a tailored fit as training your own dog -The wait list varies and can be multiple years before you have a dog -Expensive as all hell, sometimes it costs a chunk just to be on the waitlist -You're putting a lot of trust in others to do their job right, you lack control over the whole situation Owner-trained Dog Pros -You get to start with a puppy or young dog (under 1 year) and train it and work with it as it grows up, no waiting until its already an adult -You can tailor fit your dogs tasks and training to fit your specific lifestyle -All the control you could ask for and probably more -Expenses are determined by you, not someone running the accounts for a large business or organization -You can get your dog whenever you want to start the process moving forward, no waitlist unless its you waiting for a puppy to be born at a breeder Cons -A fuckoff ton of work to socialize in particular and even get to the point where your dog is an AKC Good Citizen, trainings not the hardest bit -Unless you have someone help pick a dog for you, its unlikely you'll choose your own good candidate and even they might not choose a good candidate and your dog may wash out -Putting all of the stress on you to make it work -Sometimes people just aren't actually used to training or socializing dogs and encounter troubles here by not knowing what the gently caress they're about -You still can't really start a dog working on a regular basis until it gets closer to 2 years old, you still have to start slowly (though you at least get to be there on the way) For me personally its not as much a cost issue as it is a control issue. I'd prefer to oversee something so momentous myself. I also want to be involved in my dogs life during their first two years. Dogs don't live terribly long and it would be sad to miss out on a year or more of life. I don't plan on going it alone. I'll be taking all of the normal AKC Good Citizen classes in addition to consulting with the trainer who helps me choose my dog. I'm not going to make this a one person process.
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Sep 20, 2014 22:17
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Of the breeds you listed, I think a standard poodle would be the best fit. They're smart, highly sensitive dogs and I know quite a few people who have them as service dogs in multiple capacities. ALL is right in that they do tend to be pretty playful and goofy, but they can definitely focus on work (at least, the right one can). As far as picking a suitable puppy goes, in general it's hard to conclusively determine if a puppy will end up suitable as a service dog or if it will wash out.
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Sep 21, 2014 03:15
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Invalid Octopus posted:Of the breeds you listed, I think a standard poodle would be the best fit. They're smart, highly sensitive dogs and I know quite a few people who have them as service dogs in multiple capacities. ALL is right in that they do tend to be pretty playful and goofy, but they can definitely focus on work (at least, the right one can). As far as picking a suitable puppy goes, in general it's hard to conclusively determine if a puppy will end up suitable as a service dog or if it will wash out. I've had a lot of people help me by narrowing down the breed. I've been warned against GSDs a few times just specifically for psychiatric work since they apparently make great service dogs for people with mobility problems. I may just have to wait until later to have myself a GSD as a pet. So I guess right now I'm focusing the most on Labs since I've been told they do make good PSDs. I do like standard poodles as well so I'm definitely continuing to consider them, however I'm specifically looking for a dog that would be under 60lbs so they could more comfortably sit on the floor of an aircraft. So both Labs and standard poodles would fit into that framework if I found the right dog. If I adopt instead of approaching a breeder, I'll be getting an older dog between 6mo and 1 year of age so I can more easily see how big they'll end up being. Poodles are definitely still on my list.
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Sep 21, 2014 13:50
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| # ? May 17, 2024 07:56 |
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I admit I mostly travel in herding breed circles, but most of the psychiatric service dogs I know are Aussies and Border Collies and herder-type mutts. Another breed to keep an eye on might be Flat Coated Retrievers. They're kind of awesome dogs.
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Sep 21, 2014 15:49
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