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Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

AmiYumi posted:

What about age limits, rather than term limits? Bonus points if it's pegged to the average life expectancy of a black male in their district. :allears:

Possibly unconstitutional (Murgia suggests it would be okay, but Murgia didn't have lawyers paid by Congressmen fighting the law.)

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Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

You know, as long as we're talking about insane ideas to fix Congress, if the problem with the Senate is that large states have diluted representation compared to small states, why don't we just split the large states up? Limit the disparity in population between large and small states to the ratio of largest/smallest when the constitution was signed and redistrict the entire country after each census.

(This is a terrible idea btw, just like increasing the number of representatives, but it's not like "abolish the Senate!" Is more practical or more likely.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Stultus Maximus posted:

This would result in the rural areas of a state being lumped together and then the urban areas split off so that the urban majorities still have their two senators but the rural areas of the country get even more senators. It's a really terrible idea.

Why would you assume it generates more states, rather than fewer? Forming Wyomontanaho also reduces the disparity between largest and smallest states, after all.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Raskolnikov38 posted:

Or it shows that at the peak of Dean's campaign strategy there was still a decent amount of votes to still be wrung out that could have given dems an even bigger victory then and allowed them to hold onto the majority for longer than the two working weeks they did.


Except for nominating a good candidate. Granted that chart is for 2008 where the presidential election skews things but how is nominating candidates people are more enthusiastic for in lower races not something they could do.

No such thing as a free lunch. If your candidate appeals to some slice of that 26% (and let's be clear - a good portion of that is likely to have been "ain't conservative enough for me" people who are never going to vote D) what does that cost you from your existing voters? There's no magic candidate that buys you a chunk of that 26% without costing you elsewhere.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Raskolnikov38 posted:

So by that argument both parties should sit in the middle all the time in order to rack up the most votes and yet we see better results for the GOP when they don't do that and declining returns for the Democrats when they do.

The name of the game is GOTV and having "we're not republicans" as your raison d'être doesn't get the voters fired up.

That's pretty much what they do, though - both parties triangulate towards the center of the electorate from the center of the party when trying to win general elections. When they don't (e.g., Tea Party nominees for Senate races in 2012), they get punished. There are some limits to the "sit in the center" theory because the other party is also triangulating to the center meaning that you can only gain so much by moving in that direction compared to potential losses, but the basic triangulation issue isn't a surprising result, it's Black's median voter theorem from the 50s in action.

You can't GOTV for someone who doesn't want to vote for you.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Samurai Sanders posted:

Why would women be inherently better or worse at chess (or shooting)?

edit: I mean, not counting situations where women historically haven't had access to the best instructors and stuff.

There's slim evidence (but some) that skeletal mechanics make women better at competitive rifle shooting. I think mostly because you brace your arm into your hip for the standing position and women have an easier time doing that.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

The SCOTUS thing isn't technically a decision, it's an order - the Court of Appeals had stayed the district court's order, meaning that the voter ID law could go through; SCOTUS reversed the Court's stay. It's not precedent, there's not really any reasoning given, etc., which is why I say it isn't a decision in the way people think of SCOTUS decisions.

It's still awesome, though.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

FWIW, corporate lawyers lean liberal (like most lawyers, including lawyers at large firms.)

So the whole "debt makes doctors republicans" theory has a gaping hole through it there.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Pohl posted:

Have you ever talked to a corporate lawyer?

<anecdote about friend excised>

Yes. I have definitely talked to a number of the ~200 corporate lawyers I work with. In Washington DC where talking about politics actually does happen in the workplace. The majority are liberal, including on economic issues (on social issues, it's a vast majority). Look! We both have anecdotes on our side!

(I've also looked at donation patterns for lawyers and surveys of self-expressed affiliation based on employment, both of which support my point with real data, unlike your "my friend" story.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

zoux posted:

A paralegal idolizing lawyers :monocle:

Sorry, I'm a lawyer. (I actually idolize our paralegals for making my life much easier.)

I know that people don't like to be contradicted and all, but the data says you are wrong. (A bonus link.) (For obvious reasons, the majority of lawyers who make political donations are from large well-paying law firms; AAJ is the trial lawyers group, the remaining firms on the list are just big firms, almost all of which have large corporate law practices.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Pohl posted:

That is just an awesome link, thanks for throwing it in.

No problem, it's got lots of fun things buried in it.

For example, the top 3 occupations by total given are attorney, retired, and homemaker. These three massively outweigh other professions (for example, homemakers give twice as much as CEOs and executives combined.) But no, of course no one gives money in their parents'/spouses' names to evade contribution caps!

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Edmund Lava posted:

Why is Grimes the #5 recipient of legal lobby money? Who did McConnell piss off?

Lawyers are generally Democrats. So at an (educated) guess, I would say McConnell pissed off Democrats.

(Also, aside from large firms, the trial lawyers lobby donates heavily and tort reform is one of their issues - they are not on the pro side - so I would guess McConnell's efforts there also hurt him.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

RuanGacho posted:

Sorry, I was under the impression that what Obama says matters to Wheeler since as far as I understand he appointed him to the job.

It's not like the FCC even pretends to be non-partisan.

FCC Commissioners are independent term appointees, not subject to arbitrary removal without cause, so there's quite a bit more insulation between presidential desires and commissioner actions. Remember when the Bush White House pressured the EPA to decide the way they wanted them to? Remember the pushback on that? That's exactly the same as presidential efforts to pressure the FCC.

(And as I have said a number of times, Wheeler's telecom lobbying was a long time past when he was appointed.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

DemeaninDemon posted:

There we go! I could make the argument that university IDs don't count as government issue but I know that sort of technicality is horseshit.

Private schools issue student IDs so it's actually pretty legit to argue that student ID isn't government issued.

(Which is irrelevant because voter ID is loving stupid.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

The Warszawa posted:

That's my understanding.

I remember Alpha House being a weekly released thing, actually.

Either way it's the kind of good news I needed today. (On the same page: finding out Butch Otter's ex-wife's name is Gay Simplot, or Gay Otter while they were married. Little things.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Mr Interweb posted:

Possibly dumb question, but are federal judge appointments a particularly big deal? I mean, I presumed they were, but since we have a right-wing Supreme Court, won't they just simply nullify any liberal decisions that the lower courts pass?

Most court decisions aren't reviewed.

Federal judicial appointments are a huge deal.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

ReindeerF posted:

Man, he just cannot stop trolling his daughter. It's amazing.

Anyway, we have Gohmert and he's 10,000,000 times more entertaining than Bachmann because he's not staging it. She was definitely chasing the cameras with her antics, but Louie is for sure just sharing his homespun wisdom that's completely insane. The fact that it's real makes it mean so much more :qq:

She really is as crazy as she comes off - it isn't an act.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

CaptainCarrot posted:

I don't see McConnell getting 60 votes for any of those, particularly since every seat at risk this year with the exception of Colorado and Iowa was vulnerable to defecting on those anyway.

There's often potential defectors in non-vulnerable seats. For example, both MN senators would probably defect on a medical device tax repeal (see: Medtronic), CA senators may be vulnerable on TPP due to tech/entertainment industry issues, etc.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

computer parts posted:

Which federal taxes are on the poor?

Payroll taxes.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

KIM JONG TRILL posted:

The DoJ under Holder/Obama did a ton to fight a lot of that stuff until SCOTUS gutted the VRA.

Zeitgeiust also believes that PPACA is a Republican health care plan, despite the numerous times that's been debunked - his relationship with reality is a little suspect.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Nonsense posted:

The PPACA was a the 90s Republican plan, and that's repeated verbatim, like everywhere, even among liberals. If it's not true, god drat, because that idea is everywhere

I also read it on reddit, whenever it's an obamacare thread, and reddit is basically defacto positions of the internet on things.

It's not true.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Zeitgueist posted:

The argument that it isn't, is what folks have morphed the current defense of it into, in an attempt to support the idea that Dems are the lesser evil, which they are.

The argument goes, essentially, "it's not a 90's Republican plan because it's not literally the same plan and has a number of details changed" which is the same boring type of argument one makes when one says "Republicans and Democrats are not literally the same party."

Both of those things are, of course, true. And the differences in the Dem plan are very important to lots of people, including people I know. My black friends :smuggo: if you will.

What people are actually saying when they say this, for the most part, is that the ACA is, at it's heart, a lovely healthcare law even if it was the best we could do because the American political system blows. Yes it's better than what we had. It would almost have to be. It's still a bad law, and none of us can change that, but squashing criticisms of it from the left does nothing but allow liberals to feel good about themselves, and it's pointless and irritating.

So it's actually incredibly different from the Republican plan in hugely meaningful ways?

I mean, otherwise you might as well say that a progressive plan to "raise income tax rates to where they were in the 90s" and a regressive plan to "raise income tax rates on poor people only to where they were in the 90s" are the same plan because they happen to share a feature.

Glad we agree. Maybe you'll stop misleading people who really don't understand that there are huge differences, such as people who have posted in this thread, by saying they're the same plan in the future.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Actually, yes, both plans don't involve subsidizing private insurance and mandating private insurance. Heritage didn't require actual insurance, it only mandated catastrophic insurance. And it didn't provide a direct subsidy paid to the insurer, it provided year end tax credits.

I mean, even on the thing that you claim is what was taken from Heritage, there are massive, meaningful differences. Maybe you should stop saying its a Republican plan.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Zeitgueist posted:

I've said there are differences but that the plans are similar in broad strokes.

The purpose of such a criticism is to point out that it's a lovely healthcare plan. It may also be the best this country could do at this time, and that's both true and irrelevant.

No, you said:

Zeitgueist posted:

Missing the point. Both sides were going for a GOP healthcare plan from the 90's. Neither side wanted real reform, you're just picking flavors of fake reform.

I.e. 'democrats were advocating for a Republican plan.'

Zeitgueist posted:

Saying they're not exactly the same is arguing against a strawman. Very few folks are saying they are the same.

Other than, you know, people in this thread:

Nonsense posted:

The PPACA was a the 90s Republican plan, and that's repeated verbatim, like everywhere, even among liberals. If it's not true, god drat, because that idea is everywhere

I also read it on reddit, whenever it's an obamacare thread, and reddit is basically defacto positions of the internet on things.

Maybe you were trying to use it in a nuanced fashion. But it's kind of hard to tell against the extensive background ignorance and you owe it to yourself to pay attention to that if you don't want to be misunderstood.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

If I get an end of year tax credit, and I'm poor, I can't actually afford to pay for health insurance during the year so the tax credit doesn't do me much good. I guess some health care plan somewhere would probably have sprung up that happily got paid around tax time - at payday lender rates, of course.

If I get a direct insurer subsidy, that problem does not exist.

Do you see how the two plans are massively different even though they're superficially similar?

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

The Warszawa posted:

Ugh that's loving dumb, tax credits called subsidies drives me up the loving wall. Obviously, this is not a you thing, this is a general language thing.

That said, without going to this well again, there are significant differences between the parties, particularly in judicial appointments, where the effects reverberate for decades and if you don't believe me, ask yourself whether Chief Justice Ginsburg would be the same as Chief Justice Roberts.

Actually, that's still him being a poor reader (or disingenuous). The post talks about subsidies, but only in the context of PPACA - it correctly identifies that as a point of distinction from the tax credits that Heritage offered. The closest it comes is saying Heritage offered "a tax credit to help subsidize it." All uses of subsidy other than that usage refer to PPACA.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

BiggerBoat posted:

I think what they're saying is that 20 - 25 years ago, the fundamental elements of the plan the GOP proposed were the same as those of the ACA but now they're branding it as a big government socialist takeover.

While it makes for a great political sound bite, it's simply not true that the fundamental elements of the plan the GOP proposed were the same as the ACA.

(Unless you define fundamental elements in such a way that it's effectively meaningless, like saying the fundamental elements of a plan to extend Medicare to everyone and a plan to extend Medicare to all people making over a million bucks are the same because both involve an extension of Medicare.)

E: unless you're talking about Chafee's bill, in which case you're right that they are fairly similar, you're just wrong about it being a Republican health care plan because that would imply Republicans supported it.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

BiggerBoat posted:

Are they similar enough that it's disingenuous and hypocritical for Republicans to label the ACA a government takeover and radical far-left idea?

Yes and no - as noted above by Duke Igthorn, to the extent the complaint focuses solely on the individual mandate, it's hypocritical because the mandate is the closest thing in PPACA to anything in the Heritage plan (with the caveat that the Heritage mandate was significantly different in scope and was only a mandate in the sense that you lost access to tax breaks if you didn't participate - there wasn't a tax penalty, not that PPACA's is particularly significant).

To the extent they focus on other aspects, it's not hypocritical - it might still be stupid, but that's different.

quote:

Is it fair to say that the difference between the two is small enough that labeling one as "free market" and the other as "socialism" is bullshit?

No. They're massively different in approach and effect. (It's not what I would call socialism, but it meets the right wing definition, so while it's a bullshit argument it isn't because the difference between the two is small.)

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

BiggerBoat posted:

Except Obama campaigned specifically against Hillary and McCain on this precise issue and it was one of the reasons I voted for him. The fact that he began negotiations with the mandate in place is what (rightly) makes the people who went to bat for him, donating time and money they didn't have, in the midst of a giant economic crash, so loving pissed off. He ran on radical change, won on radical change and then never even tried.

You voted for him because he was against the individual mandate?

What the hell is wrong with you? Seriously. You know that he campaigned against the mandate because he didn't think people should be required to buy health insurance, right? It wasn't a stealth progressive thing - he was to the right of both Hillary and McCain on the topic. Campaign Obama's plan wasn't single payer and he was consistently against it; his plan was more or less PPACA with a public option and without an individual mandate. He changed his mind on the mandate and lost the public option in negotiation to get it through.

People who got pissed off because the mandate was initially in place are dumb because it's fundamentally a good thing to have in place - even single payer effectively has an individual mandate by way of the increased taxes to pay for it, it just happens to be invisible. People upset about losing the public option are at least upset about losing something meaningful, but seriously, you're mad the individual mandate is part of the end product?

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

My Imaginary GF posted:

That's the core of the office politics, I'm thinking.

Well, you're clearly not reading the article with details about the office politics, so at least you're thinking.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

BiggerBoat posted:

One of the reasons, yes.

Answer the second part of the question: what the hell is wrong with you? Why were you against an individual mandate?

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

BiggerBoat posted:

Because I didn't want to be forced to give my money to an insurance company and felt that as long there was an individual mandate, we should have single payer or somewhere else, like a public option or a Medicare buy in, to spend my money on. As long as I was being required to have insurance and spend money, I at least wanted some competition and choice in the matter instead of being automatically required to hand money to the companies that are largely responsible for loving up our healthcare system up in the first place.

That's why. I'm not sure why that angers some people.

Except both Campaign Clinton and Campaign Obama were supportive of a public option, so your complaint above makes no sense as a reason to have voted for Obama - you'd have had an option even with a mandate.

Also, were you against guaranteed issue? (Note that even in a public option system, you still want an individual mandate if you want to keep guaranteed issue and, to a lesser extent, anti-rescission. That's why Obama came around to it, after he got past the cost concerns a previous poster identified, which were the reason he questioned the original mandate in the first place.)

It doesn't anger me - it just makes me question your intelligence.

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Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

Edmund Lava posted:

And if they did how would we know? The entertainment industry is basically a propaganda arm for the military. Not that this is anything new, and it doesn't hurt studios bottom lines.

My point was that any work critical of the military is unlikely to be made, and the military itself does what it can to make sure of that.

It's not like you're forced to accept a military advisor. And plenty of works critical of the military are made, sooooo...

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