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Wait, I was under the impression that the path was a clue to the answer to the riddle in room 45, i.e. "Like Atlas, you bear (??) upon your..." refers to the same answer as "What house will all/none live in?". That's not the case? Edit: By the way, speculating on the identity of the guide... I've seen more clues that "the minotaur" might be the answer. In room 23 it's mentioned that it's difficult to look over the guide's shoulder, which could imply he's quite tall. In room 32, the guide muses that "in a very real way we are all of us animals, at least in part." Of course, the minotaur is literally part bull. E: E: Also, we know at least part of the route back; room 28 is a dud, strangely, so the path back starts 23 -> 8 -> ??? and in all likelihood ends with 10 -> 41 -> 1. Hyper Crab Tank fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Nov 26, 2014 |
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Nov 26, 2014 22:55
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Well, the beginning of the book says the answer to the riddle of 45 is hidden on the path. So yeah, I think it IS a clue, Hyper Crab Tank. What Atlas bore on his shoulders was the world, which could certainly be the 'house all live in'.
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Nov 26, 2014 23:31
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Yes, that bit about being animals "at least in part" also struck me as possibly being a reference to the Minotaur.
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Nov 26, 2014 23:44
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nweismuller posted:What Atlas bore on his shoulders was the world, which could certainly be the 'house all live in'. Not the world - Atlas carried the heavens on his back. Specifically, all the celestial spheres (but not the earth).
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Nov 26, 2014 23:47
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Wait, I was under the impression that the path was a clue to the answer to the riddle in room 45, i.e. "Like Atlas, you bear (??) upon your..." refers to the same answer as "What house will all/none live in?". That's not the case? Right. It is a clue/a riddle with the same answer but not THE riddle of the maze
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Nov 27, 2014 00:14
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Not the world - Atlas carried the heavens on his back. Specifically, all the celestial spheres (but not the earth). Yeah for sure, it's a common mistake to understand his burden to have been the world but it definitely wasn't. The heavens couldn't fit for the riddle at the end if it is "the house all will live in", because you didn't really go there when you died. In Greek mythology, you were bound to go to Hades or Tartarus, which were both terrestrial, still, deep inside the earth or far away on it. So, the heavens could fit in this context only for "the house none will live in". So far as the identity of the guide, I like the idea of the minotaur, but Minos himself might also be a good choice. He sent people into the labyrinth often and in some myths, became a judge of souls in Hades. Or Hermes, who was a trickster but also served as a guide to souls into Hades, a psychopomp.
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Nov 27, 2014 00:26
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If we're looking for a word like 'back' or 'shoulders' in room 45, could it not just be that room 45 is where we begin our path back to the beginning on the maze? Although maybe that's too simple. Then again, there's also this (emphasis mine): Grimwit posted:Once you’ve found the shortest path in and out of the Maze, challenge yourself further. Go back and find the riddle hidden in room 45. The answer to that riddle is concealed somewhere on the shortest path.
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Nov 27, 2014 01:38
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If you guys settle on an answer, you'd actually be close enough for the answer the Publishers would accept. Of course, we are after higher things. The final vote is in. We are heading into...  Room 2 …a bright room whose walls were in some disrepair. The floorboards creaked and groaned; the plaster made a gritty sound. They studied the old frescoes for clues but missed the obvious signs. “Are we on the right path?” they asked. Keeping in mind what a relative term “right” is, I assured them they were, indeed, on the right path. As for the “correct” path or the “most appropriate” path…. Well, that might be something else. Full of confidence now they marched out to… Before we can talk about which is the correct door, we have to ask where we are going. There are two correct doors here. In our case, there's no longer a choice. We must follow the flag into victory and into...  Room 12 …a spacious room with a hole in the floor. A ladder led down into the shadows. Outside, leaves shook in the wind. They didn’t like the look of that hole in the floor. “Too dark down there!” they cried. “Who knows what’s at the bottom.” They looked at me again. “Probably a room of some kind,” I volunteered quickly. “But you know what I say about appearances.” It would have been a relief to get outside for a while. They wanted to know if they had been here before…. How could I answer that? “I have the strangest feeling of déjà vu,” said one who, bolder than the rest, led us into… Ah, now this room wants to be important, and it is. "Best take those with you," I said pointing to the corner, "you will need them." What? I can be a guide, too. There is but one room left, my friends and fellow goons. And that room is...  Room 39 …what looked like a combination wine cellar and junk room. Someone had been working here as well. “This is more to my taste,” said one, dusting off some labels. All the bottles turned out to be empty. “I hear someone hammering,” said one. “No, that’s a chopping sound,” said another. None of them heard the faint jingling that came from behind the wall. “I don’t hear anything,” I said loudly and, with as much commotion as possible, hurried them out of the room to… Hmmm... What's that?  Oh, this old thing. Pay it no mind. We have a map now. Speaking of which, let's take a look at the completed maps.    So, that's it. That's the end of my tour, the end of the rooms, and the end of all my clues. But not the end of the Let's Play. No, there's still a mystery here. The general consensus is that you needed time before I put up the solution videos, so I will give you a couple days. More than enough time working at the pace you lot figure things out. On Saturday (Maryland time), I will post the first of Five videos. By the fifth video, I will have explained the answer to the Puzzle. I will warn that the puzzle COULD be answered in just one word. In 1987, Henry Holt and Company gave three people the winnings, but none of them got the full answer that Christopher Manson intended. The Path will lead you to the true answer, which is four or five words long (give or take). Trust in it. Finally, if someone works out what the intended answer to the riddle is, I'll step in and point to my nose, then start posting the Solution Videos. Good luck. You have roughly 72 hours.
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Nov 27, 2014 02:30
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Actually, the Miltonian Lucifer theory is still on the cards. A crown? Well, what's a halo described as? A crown of fire. Lucifer is also commonly depicted as having goat features. He lies, but is proud. His crown, in a very real sense, came from his father, and his common attitude towards humans is that they don't deserve their place as his father's favoured children. Also, the umbrella might not be what he's referring to. He might just be referring to the candle. After all... The last lot realised all too late that they needed it, didn't they? I'm sure I could find other things, but it's 1:30 AM, and I've not been paying as much attention as I should. But yes, it's still very much on the cards.
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Nov 27, 2014 02:34
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Oh hey look at room 39. That's a beautiful nod to The Cask Of Amontillado by Edgar Allen Poe, where a man literally seals a guy who insulted him in the basement of a wine cellar after chaining him up to the wall and leaving him for dead, dying of a heart attack or something as his fate kicked in for him. He's not dead here, it seems... So, let's not follow his fate, shall we?
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Nov 27, 2014 02:39
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... huh. That's interesting. The shortest path I can find is 1 -> 26 -> 30 -> 42 -> 4 -> 29 -> 17 -> 45 -> 23 -> 8 -> 12 -> 39 -> 4 -> 15 -> 37 -> 20 -> 1. Exactly sixteen steps... and all on the upper floor. What, is the lower floor just a distraction?  E: On the topic of letters, I had another thought. Several of the rooms on the way back have letters in them. There's an obvious S in room 8 and I wouldn't be surprised if that weird table is supposed to be a hidden E. There's a big D+U in room 12. There's an R sitting in the lower right of room 39. The "ELL" = L in room 4. There are two more S's back in room 20. Maybe I'm overthinking this poo poo, but "SEDURLSS" is only an H and an O away from being an anagram of "SHOULDERS... S." Okay, so it's actually three letters off and now it sounds kinda stupid. Hyper Crab Tank fucked around with this message at 03:01 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 02:45
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:... huh. That's interesting. The shortest path I can find is 1 -> 26 -> 30 -> 42 -> 4 -> 29 -> 17 -> 45 -> 23 -> 8 -> 12 -> 39 -> 4 -> 15 -> 37 -> 20 -> 1. Exactly sixteen steps... and all on the upper floor. What, is the lower floor just a distraction? Maybe. After all, if we're going to be all metaphorical about it, aren't your ground level, everyday desires and dark, base(ment) desires simply distractions from the pure higher thought required to solve the riddle? 
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Nov 27, 2014 03:03
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Wait a minute, hold the loving phone. Room 12 is almost identical to room 28. What kind of game are you playing here, Manson?   I say almost, because not only are the numbers different, the paintings are subtly different too!
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Nov 27, 2014 03:06
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The "house that none will live in" is possibly the House of God, while the most obvious "house that all will live in" would be the House of the Dead. In fact, if you change your definition of live (resipre vs. dwell) between answers, they -both- give The House of the Dead as a very valid response. I hope we get a lightgun!  "Earth" is another house that all will live in, since we're buried there, and it's a one-word answer.
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Nov 27, 2014 03:17
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You know, people keep saying that room 4's word is incomprehensible. But knowing that Atlas bore heaven on his shoulders, and seeing that room 4 has a ceiling with the sun and stars on it... why not just stick with "Heaven" or "The Heavens" or even "The Sky".
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Nov 27, 2014 03:47
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The Path:              
i81icu812 fucked around with this message at 03:52 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 03:49
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Since we've seen all the rooms and the current interactive version of the game on the internet is garbage, I grabbed Grimwit's scans and made a version of the game in Twine: Here: http://tinyurl.com/MazeBook Let me know if there are any bugs. I just noticed all the umbrellas on the path have different crooks on them. 100 HOGS AGREE fucked around with this message at 05:26 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 05:03
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Wait a minute, hold the loving phone. Room 12 is almost identical to room 28. What kind of game are you playing here, Manson? Thank god some one pointed that out. I don't think I could help myself. The differences in these rooms are my personal rabbit hole with the maze. Having said that, every room has "hints" about what door is the "right" door to take. I use quote marks for a reason. Maze is not fair. Maze requires you to know the future in order to solve most of its riddles. Also I'm going to point out something I caught the first time around, that our resident puzzle solving crab didn't notice. Room 20? One of the S's is Extra. Vexrm fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 05:57
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This may be a false assumption, but I think each room will have exactly two letters to contribute. The majority of the rooms on that shortest path have only 2 letters, or hint at only two letters. Could be wrong, but it seems to me to be the case.
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Nov 27, 2014 06:22
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100 HOGS AGREE posted:Since we've seen all the rooms and the current interactive version of the game on the internet is garbage, I grabbed Grimwit's scans and made a version of the game in Twine: Pretty cool. It's a bit frustrating though, KNOWING there's a secret door to 17 from room 29, but being unable to find your link in order to click to it. Unless you forgot to actually implement the secret passage? Because I'm stumped.
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Nov 27, 2014 06:33
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100 HOGS AGREE posted:Here: http://tinyurl.com/MazeBook Yeah, dude. what Iunnrais said. It's a tricky choice. Without Door 17, the maze is unwinnable. With Door 17, they just see the option for the door without looking at the picture. Huh.
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Nov 27, 2014 09:40
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From reading the Guide's text, I also got the vibe it was a "devil" figure. Perhaps Lucifer himself, as "lucifer" means light-bringer.ViggyNash posted:This may be a false assumption, but I think each room will have exactly two letters to contribute. I also think it is safe to assume 2 letters at least for most rooms. The imagery also seems to reflect symmetry and pairs a lot. Many of the clues/items through the house occur, if not frequently, then at least in pairs. In one room literally having pictures of a pair of scissors, pair of dice, a "pair" of salt/pepper, and an actual pear. Sum Mors fucked around with this message at 09:47 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 09:44
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Grimwit posted:Yeah, dude. what Iunnrais said. I hid the link somewhere in the text on that page. It's a kludge but I couldn't think of anything else.
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Nov 27, 2014 13:59
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100 HOGS AGREE posted:I hid the link somewhere in the text on that page. It's a kludge but I couldn't think of anything else. Any chance you could make the link the doorknob in the image? Or the 17 itself? Javascript may make it possible to do so without having the cursor change when you hover over the image. Because there's no clue in the text, only in the image, so it only makes sense that the solution should remain in the image.
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Nov 27, 2014 14:06
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Iunnrais posted:Any chance you could make the link the doorknob in the image? Or the 17 itself? Javascript may make it possible to do so without having the cursor change when you hover over the image. Because there's no clue in the text, only in the image, so it only makes sense that the solution should remain in the image. There is a small hint in the text about the nature of this puzzle tho.
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Nov 27, 2014 14:13
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Not the world - Atlas carried the heavens on his back. Specifically, all the celestial spheres (but not the earth). That's exactly what's on the ceiling of room 4 - an old depiction of the firmament. So 'the firmament' / 'the heavens' may well fill in the blank in the sentence.
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Nov 27, 2014 15:52
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Here's a download link for the Twine source file I made: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7Q4fy_k69chQ1hMZ0FmbGFqdVk/view?usp=sharing You will also need Twine to open it: http://twinery.org/downloads/twine_1.4.2_win.exe
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Nov 27, 2014 15:56
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Old Grey Guy posted:That's exactly what's on the ceiling of room 4 - an old depiction of the firmament. So 'the firmament' / 'the heavens' may well fill in the blank in the sentence. The main problem I see with that is that it sounds like it hints at a different answer. Like, if the sentence is "Like Atlas, you bear it on your shoulders", then the solution is to figure out what "it" refers to (i.e. "the heavens"). But if the sentence is "Like Atlas, you bear the heavens on your shoulders", then the answer would have to be whatever "you" refers to, and I don't know what else carries the heavens around on its back.
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Nov 27, 2014 15:59
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I looked at the source code for the page. He hid the link in a period. Instead of giving players a list to pick from, you should give them a text box. Alternatively, you can embed a link when clicking on a door with an image map. http://www.w3schools.com/tags/tag_map.asp KillHour fucked around with this message at 16:05 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 16:03
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:The shortest path I can find is 1 -> 26 -> 30 -> 42 -> 4 -> 29 -> 17 -> 45 -> 23 -> 8 -> 12 -> 39 -> 4 -> 15 -> 37 -> 20 -> 1. I can confirm that this is the shortest path. Assuming there aren't any more hidden doors we haven't noticed  I'm going to drop out of the riddle-guessing, though, it's way over my head at this point. I'll just sit back and watch...
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Nov 27, 2014 16:08
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Does twine support bitmaps? Does anything still support bitmaps? edit: woops, I mean Image Maps sector_corrector fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 17:04
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:The main problem I see with that is that it sounds like it hints at a different answer. Like, if the sentence is "Like Atlas, you bear it on your shoulders", then the solution is to figure out what "it" refers to (i.e. "the heavens"). But if the sentence is "Like Atlas, you bear the heavens on your shoulders", then the answer would have to be whatever "you" refers to, and I don't know what else carries the heavens around on its back. Definitely, and given the "what (all/none) will live in" riddle I think it makes more sense for "it" (which I'm still going with because of the sit/lit/hit/fit stuff), and with "the heavens" being the overall answer, since it fits what Atlas carried and a "house that (all/none) will live in" interpretations.
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Nov 27, 2014 23:14
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I also think "it" is most likely since it fits in the sentence and the fit/sit/lit/hit/split reasoning sounds solid to me. But... Grimwit also said the true answer is "four or five" words long. Any ideas on that one? Perhaps we need to get more metaphorical? Like, Atlas literally carries the heavens, but he can also be said to bear responsibility on his shoulders. Like, were he to drop the heavens, the world would be destroyed. "The fate of the world" or something? I'm really just speculating wildly now. There's another part of it, too... if the answer were just "the heavens", why the mention of "you"? The answer needs to be something that both Atlas and "you", i.e. the reader, carries on his shoulders I don't know about you, but I ain't carrying no heavens... e: If we consider the 45 clue some more... a house where no one will live, as in be alive, could be something like a crypt or mausoleum. But I don't think either of those words are the answer. Hyper Crab Tank fucked around with this message at 23:38 on Nov 27, 2014 |
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Nov 27, 2014 23:35
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For Room 4, consider the arrangement of the tools on the table; the candle and the matchbox, the hammer, and the piece of wood. A dotted i, a capital T, and an underline.
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Nov 27, 2014 23:37
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Rudicron posted:For Room 4, consider the arrangement of the tools on the table; the candle and the matchbox, the hammer, and the piece of wood.  ...I do think you're right but I like my convoluted methodology better gat dangit Hyper Crab Tank posted:There's another part of it, too... if the answer were just "the heavens", why the mention of "you"? The answer needs to be something that both Atlas and "you", i.e. the reader, carries on his shoulders I don't know about you, but I ain't carrying no heavens....[/spoiler] I like that. The fate of the world could be a pretty deep understanding of this, since it'd be a tremendous burden and definitely draw comparison to the labor of Atlas, and we definitely don't carry it on our backs. However, it doesn't really fit well with the "house none/all will live in" as much. I feel like we're really close though: 1. Like Atlas, you bear it upon your back: The fate of the world is our burden. 2. We have to choose between two pictures, all and none. 3. The world is a house all will live in. I think everything fits well that way.
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Nov 28, 2014 00:05
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bawbzilla posted:
I like this answer and agree with the solution arrived at, both the overall solution and the split, lit, hit, fit, wordplay. Also, playing around on the twine book really highlights the map's structure. Wandering around the first floor loop is pretty annoying.
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Nov 28, 2014 00:12
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My alarm went off to tell me to update, but there's nothing to update, so I'll just step in and say hi. Sup? On topic, you guys are super close. If I were the publishers, I'd have given you the $10,000 dollar prize by now. I may have read passed it, but have we found all nine letters, yet? Hint For the letters, start with room 23. Hyper Crab Tank posted:Wait a minute, hold the loving phone. Room 12 is almost identical to room 28. What kind of game are you playing here, Manson? I just noticed (because I hadn't before) that the outsides are different, too. Keep up the good work. You have roughly 48 hours.
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Nov 28, 2014 02:07
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Well, 8 is probably S. Apart from the large letter on the wall, there's a sign, a switch, a skittle, a stethoscope, and our view is at a slant. Along the same lines, I think 39 is T. We have a tag, a tree, a bottle that's been turned, a trowel, a times table, thread, a tire, and a toy. There's someone who's been trapped, and there's also this: Grimwit posted:“I hear someone hammering,” said one. Tapping and tinkling, perhaps? 15 could be H - a house, hats, a hare, a heart and heroes. The board on the left, with the bird, the cloud, the moon and the lightning, are all things you could find in the heavens. 20 looks like T - I think this was discussed when we first saw it. Possibly a T and an S (since the S is 'extra')? I think 12 could be D. A picture of a man eating dinner (leaving a duo of bones), a duo of men each holding up two fingers, a ladder leading down, what could be dawn or dusk outside, and of course the obvious deja vu. This is more and more reaching, but 4 could be M? We have a maze, a mallet, matches, and the thing on the left is a mortise - which makes the axe a mortising axe. That leaves 1, 23 and 37, which are all stumping me, apart from the obvious association 23 has with ten (ten commandments, ten window panes, ten fingers on the pair of gloves, a tennis ball) and I guess the doorway in 1 kind of looks like an A?
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Nov 28, 2014 19:46
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As a quick aside, Twine does fully support HTML/CSS, so yes it does support imagemaps. If nobody else does it, and I'm feeling bored later, I might update the twine to do that. Assuming 100 Hogs agree.
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Nov 29, 2014 17:15
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The First solution Video. Time to start unlocking just what the holy heck is go'n on in this crazy place!  
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Nov 30, 2014 02:11
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