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ronya posted:"failure... to recognize that condition" is what jumps out at me So many weird assumptions here. Like where'd you get "self medicating" from? LU are refusing to go to ACAS as RMT have requested, so I guess we'll never know if the latter would suddenly do an about turn like you say is 'obvious'.
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Dec 2, 2014 09:44
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Cerv posted:So many weird assumptions here. Like where'd you get "self medicating" from? They went to the talks, it just didn't come to an agreement satisfactory to RMT. The self-medication is speculation on what explanation would be consistent with RMT deciding that even nonbinding arbitration would not be good for their case, whereas LU feels that it can make its stance public. Of note is that the LU statement only says that the employee failed the alcohol breath test; it does not explicitly say that the employee had actually consumed any alcohol. Conclusion: they probably don't have any evidence that the employee actually consumed any alcohol. Conversely, RMT is not publicly maintaining that the test was a false positive - instead it is asserting an unrecognized medical condition. Conclusion: they probably don't have any documentation for that condition that would motivate a reasonable assessment of a false positive, the kind of split-the-difference solution that Acas likes. So it's something tricky, like a fringe diagnosis or self-medication.
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Dec 2, 2014 10:06
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So they sacked him?
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Dec 2, 2014 10:09
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serious gaylord posted:This is the root of it for me. If it was so obviously a massive loving over by TfL then why are they striking when the employment tribunal would sort it out? Yes. This kind of bullshit is what allowed Thatcher to break the unions in the first place.
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Dec 2, 2014 10:40
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The RMT/NUR is no longer in a position where it can go on in public about defending the interests of its members at the expense of the public - where it has a better grip on the government than the public feels it has. It's the reverse - it stages appeals to the public and gauges who would be blamed under disruption more than relying on (now weak) procedural powers, and even Bob Crow never questioned the secret ballot. So you can put Thatcherite era fears aside, I think. In any case the public has now shifted that status onto IMMIGRANTS and/or Brussels.
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Dec 2, 2014 10:52
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EvilGenius posted:So they sacked him? I would imagine being drunk at work is a gross misconduct offence. I know it is at most jobs. Failing a breath test is an indicator of that. This is a very interesting case but ultimately if you don't have a recognisable medical condition that would lead to you having alcohol indicators in your breath I can't see any other outcome. From my brief googling on what could lead to this, almost all of those conditions say that the sufferer should not operate heavy machinery as well.
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Dec 2, 2014 10:59
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Voters back all kinds of things that you'd think a left-wing party would be happy to have as policy. Renationalising the trains, price caps / more regulation on the energy companies, redistribution of wealth and so on. Labour keep going for limp halfway-houses, though, like allowing the public sector to bid on train franchises. Presumably because they don't want to frighten the plutocrats. Do we ever talk about party funding? Cos both Labour and the Tories have almost no members now, which means their only source of income is donations from rich individuals (with a bit of trade union funding for Labour). Which is one reason why a lot of public preferences never make it through into party policy, because it doesn't suit the small number of rich people upon whom the parties depend for their existence.
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Dec 2, 2014 11:00
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Breaking DnA is almost universally an instant sacking in the rail industry, banning of holding safety critical competence and a whole host of other stuff following the Cannon Street Rail Crash. However, it seems that the RMT are arguing that procedure wasn't followed correctly and had been used to target someone unfairly. Not sure how it works in LU but unless he was involved in an incident then they probably had no grounds to test him unless he had previously been pulled for random selection (as would be evidenced via a note to his line manager). Our management were always really sound if you got randomly selected, you were always tipped the wink the night before to not to be in the pub that night. They used to do whole offices and depots during the Railtrack days and people would be climbing out of windows and poo poo to try and not be tested.
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Dec 2, 2014 11:01
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Zephro posted:Voters back all kinds of things that you'd think a left-wing party would be happy to have as policy. Renationalising the trains, price caps / more regulation on the energy companies, redistribution of wealth and so on. Labour keep going for limp halfway-houses, though, like allowing the public sector to bid on train franchises. Presumably because they don't want to frighten the plutocrats. Remember that once upon a time the proposal of high speed rail polled extremely well, too (especially when Heathrow expansion was in the news back in 08-10). Support only began evaporating as principles translated into specifics.
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Dec 2, 2014 11:12
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ronya posted:Remember that once upon a time the proposal of high speed rail polled extremely well, too (especially when Heathrow expansion was in the news back in 08-10). Support only began evaporating as principles translated into specifics.
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Dec 2, 2014 12:06
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Zephro posted:Voters back all kinds of things that you'd think a left-wing party would be happy to have as policy. Renationalising the trains, price caps / more regulation on the energy companies, redistribution of Cos both Labour and the Tories have almost no members now, which means their only source of income is donations from rich individuals (with a bit of trade union funding for Labour). What was it that changed politics from something where you were a card-carrying party member to a numbers game where you check a box every five years or so?
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Dec 2, 2014 12:14
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dadrips posted:Doesn't most of the opposition to HS2 come from the same kind of geriatric NIMBY gently caress that'd oppose things like telegraph poles, pylons and wind turbines already? I daresay that's a demographic that wouldn't be minded to vote for a left-wing party in any case. who knows? Tentatively one might say it is marginally more popular in London. This said, as a plan started by a Labour govt but continued by a Coalition one, it is now attractive for Labour-held London councils to campaign against it, as Camden is doing.
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Dec 2, 2014 12:22
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Guavanaut posted:Why is this? Is everyone members of the smaller parties that can make more idealistic promises or the latest bunch of crypto-fascist shitehawks now? Or does nobody care anymore? embrace of internal party democracy in both Labour and Tory happened in 1993-4 and 1998 respectively this nominally improves the formal powers of individual members as opposed to bloc voters, but since monitoring internal party politics is tedious bullshit it just means that even fewer people have any incentive to care. Let someone else do the caring. And into the breach steps the lobbyist.
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Dec 2, 2014 12:27
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Beaker's talking tough on housebuilding: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/greenpolitics/planning/11267536/State-to-build-new-homes-for-first-time-in-generation.htmlquote:The state will take a direct role in building new homes for the first time in a generation under "radical" plans to build up to 300,000 new homes a year.
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Dec 2, 2014 12:48
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LemonDrizzle posted:Beaker's talking tough on housebuilding: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/greenpolitics/planning/11267536/State-to-build-new-homes-for-first-time-in-generation.html
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Dec 2, 2014 13:22
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Guavanaut posted:Why is this? Is everyone members of the smaller parties that can make more idealistic promises or the latest bunch of crypto-fascist shitehawks now? Or does nobody care anymore? That sounds too superficial and hand-waving to me. Perhaps people got complacent with all the progress that had been made? Whatever the reason, the fact that both of our big political parties are basically hollow shells propped up by the wealthy explains a lot about why things are the way they are.
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Dec 2, 2014 13:25
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Zephro posted:I don't know. People talk about stuff like the rise of consumerism and individualism and, since you could have almost infinite choice when it came to buying a washing machine or a t-shirt, the idea of mass mobilisation in politics (with all the attendant compromises that implies) went out of fashion. Could it be because there was gently caress all to do in the days before the release of the nokia 3310 changed the way we communicated for ever and politics was a reason to leave the house.
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Dec 2, 2014 14:14
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you're right. i misremembered that because there'd been a suggestion of talks on the Monday that didn't happen. quote:The self-medication is speculation on
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Dec 2, 2014 14:23
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The UKMT: drunk (or possibly not) train driver chat.
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Dec 2, 2014 14:32
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Zephro posted:Prediction: this is another paper policy that will never actually happen. hey now less of the unwarranted scepticism he has ordered a study ok?
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Dec 2, 2014 14:32
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This discussion has opened a real Pandora's signal box
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Dec 2, 2014 14:45
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LemonDrizzle posted:hey now less of the unwarranted scepticism he has ordered a study ok? Umiapik posted:The UKMT: drunk
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Dec 2, 2014 14:46
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sebzilla posted:So Ed Balls has said Labour must be "tough on the deficit and tough on the causes of the deficit" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKSllUPbzCI
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Dec 2, 2014 14:51
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Cerv posted:you're right. i misremembered that because there'd been a suggestion of talks on the Monday that didn't happen. ... that's why I went on to provide the bases for that speculation.
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Dec 2, 2014 14:59
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Burqa King posted:Could it be because there was gently caress all to do in the days before the release of the nokia 3310 changed the way we communicated for ever and politics was a reason to leave the house. Stop looking at your loving phone 
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Dec 2, 2014 15:02
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Guavanaut posted:I look forward to it being buried when the results don't match with existing policy. How the gently caress people like Theresa May can brazenly do that with her immigration study without mass outrage I don't know. Is it buried though? Didn't we all hear about it, bitch about it and wasn't it on the news and in the papers? They've just chosen to ignore it, which I guess is their prerogative.
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Dec 2, 2014 15:16
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Umiapik posted:The UKMT: drunk (or possibly not) train driver chat. Schrodinger's drunk train driver
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Dec 2, 2014 15:48
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Regarde Aduck posted:Stop looking at your loving phone Ok. But my posts might not make so much sense :P
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Dec 2, 2014 15:52
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Burqa King posted:Ok. But my posts might not make so much sense :P like they do already oh shiiiit woah #rekt
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Dec 2, 2014 16:04
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LemonDrizzle posted:Beaker's talking tough on housebuilding: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/greenpolitics/planning/11267536/State-to-build-new-homes-for-first-time-in-generation.html The government acting directly to try to fix a major national problem is now considered thinking radically lol.
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Dec 2, 2014 16:23
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So whats up with the new porn laws, UK?
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Dec 2, 2014 16:25
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I find them restrictive and pernicious op
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Dec 2, 2014 16:35
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Probably bad but defending gross pornography isn't a hill I want to die on.
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Dec 2, 2014 16:40
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CommieGIR posted:So whats up with the new porn laws, UK? sorry we're not allowed to talk about it.
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Dec 2, 2014 16:44
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CommieGIR posted:So whats up with the new porn laws, UK? Pleasingly appropriate to my restraint fetish.
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Dec 2, 2014 16:46
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Quote this if filming your sex life suddenly became illegal
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Dec 2, 2014 16:48
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Are My Little Pony Porn and Animes illegal now?
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Dec 2, 2014 16:48
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What new porn laws?
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Dec 2, 2014 16:50
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Still B.A.E posted:What new porn laws? alll porn is illegal and haram
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Dec 2, 2014 16:51
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Phoon posted:The government acting directly to try to fix a major national problem is now considered thinking radically lol. "The message to the house building sector will be simple – if you don't build, we will" is an astonishing attitude, really obviously he doesn't really think like this, he's the goddamn Chief Treasury Secretary, but it's indicative of the attitude that he expects the relevant audience to have
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Dec 2, 2014 16:52
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