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Seaside Loafer posted:In the scheme of things not many people probably saw that interview, if she kicks arse in the debate it would be good. It annoys me that that goofy debate might have so much impact. Most people are busy doing other stuff in their lives than watching politics. It is a sad fact that most people will just pick up ideas whole hog from the paper and go "that sounds about right". Can't say I don't empathise though, when we look at the sheer loving mess our politics is and will most likely remain for the next decade or so at minimum it is all too easy to just switch off and decide to do something else.
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Feb 1, 2015 09:18
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Oberleutnant posted:Mincome would only serve to mitigate the worst excesses of capitalism without actually addressing the causes of what makes it a necessity - the capitalist classes being unwilling and/or unable to pay the worker a fair wage due to pressures of the market, and greed and spitefulness. But it does make an excellent transitional demand, since it goes some way to divorcing work from wages. Once you start down that path, you start asking about what work is necessary, undermining the inherent "worth" of work for its own sake... Of course there's plenty of ways that it could be warped into a form of repression I'm sure, as you say it's important it is only a means to an end.
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Feb 1, 2015 09:26
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Renaissance Robot posted:Which is more a problem with Sebzilla's post really, but that's also how I initially interpreted Oberleutnant's mention of liquidation even though he never explicitly mentioned killing anyone, which means I've seen the same "joke" too many times and it's starting to warp my brain. Definitely put those quotes around the word joke there, otherwise people might not realise I was unironically suggesting a policy of turning the capitalist class into a delicious smoothie.
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Feb 1, 2015 11:16
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NOT!
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Feb 1, 2015 11:17
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Renaissance Robot posted:This 20th century Marxist rhetoric is starting to get real fuckin tiresome. Belated congratulations on your 30th birthday.
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Feb 1, 2015 11:19
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Way to take it personally "seb", if that IS your real name 
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Feb 1, 2015 12:09
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I'm sorry but I dont really buy the criticism of Andrew Neil's questioning technique at all, he was exactly as he always is when he's interviewing someone who seems like they dont know what they're talking about. Seriously compare how he interviewed her to a lot of Paxman's interviews they pale in comparison.
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Feb 1, 2015 12:16
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Looks like the Government are going to war again:BBC News posted:All children in England will need to know up to their 12 times table when they leave primary school under plans announced by the education secretary. Nice to see some good old imperial language again. This whole article is just one big 
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Feb 1, 2015 12:18
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Do most children not know their basic times tables by the time they get to secondary education then? Because if so 
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Feb 1, 2015 13:01
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KKKlean Energy posted:That's not a reason not to have it. Would you have been against the minimum wage because "it's just the minimum though lol" and didn't go far enough to reach the desired effect of full communism? Because I rather detest these "all or nothing" political outlooks. I don't think there's a major cognitive dissonance in believing that a Mincome will make a positive difference to the worst off in society, while simultaneously believing it's just a band-aid stuck on a gaping chest wound. It'll (hopefully) stop people from starving, and that's good. But it's giving people just enough so that they're afraid to lose it, without addressing significantly the economic system which demands they are unemployed reserve labour, or employed but not paid a wage on which they can live to begin with. nuzak posted:But it does make an excellent transitional demand, since it goes some way to divorcing work from wages. Once you start down that path, you start asking about what work is necessary, undermining the inherent "worth" of work for its own sake... The Reformation has a lot to answer for.
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Feb 1, 2015 13:03
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Carlyle too - he really sold the Victorians hard on that virtue of work spiel.
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Feb 1, 2015 13:05
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serious gaylord posted:Do most children not know their basic times tables by the time they get to secondary education then? Because if so I never memorised mine, on account of having this thing called a calculator to do arithmetic for me. Being able to do mental arithmetic is useful but not really necessary, considering any serious mathematical work will require a calculator anyway.
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Feb 1, 2015 13:11
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The worst thing about that Bennett interview is people that that ideologically agree with the Green's policies backing away from the party due to her not being to explain them in an aggressive interview, rather than any real disagreement with the policies as such. Basically it's saying that a party with crap ideology and a good PR strategy is better than a party with good ideology and a bad interview. Not to mention the emphasis on a single member, which further buys into the whole political culture that lead to Miliband eating a bacon sandwich being a new story. It's saying that it's better to have a party that can sell lovely policies well than a party that needs to learn to sell good policies better. I'm not so naive as to think that perception and electability isn't important in politics, but it amazes me to see people that as ostensibly interested in social policy to suddenly claim that the interview means that the Greens are a total joke, rather than just keeping it to the reasonable criticism that Bennett needs to step up her TV interview debating technique.
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Feb 1, 2015 13:18
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I think a lot of the people ITT think the Greens are fruit-loops as well. I simply could never vote for greens because they're anti-nukes (in both senses).
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Feb 1, 2015 13:29
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I'd say the lofty status that the Green Party reaches is that of "the least worst party". Not that my vote matters in my area anyway, but theres no way I'm voting for Labour.
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Feb 1, 2015 13:34
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Jose posted:I never really gave it much thought during the interview since it was going so badly, but lol why did they make an Australian the leader of their party? Thats going to tank them even more than if all the TV appearances are as bad as this one. serious gaylord posted:Do most children not know their basic times tables by the time they get to secondary education then? Because if so For example, instead of mindless rote repetition of "one times twelve is twelve, two times twelve is twenty-four" which is only really useful for converting between feet and inches, you teach kids that the twelve times table is just the ten times table plus the two times table. Eight times twelve? Well I know eight times two is sixteen, and I know eight times ten is eighty, so add those together and you get ninety-six. You're now teaching kids about relations between numbers, which works as an intro to basic algebra and number theory. Of course, a significant wedge of the US right wing hate it because it's new and different and Obama thought of it, and kids should go back to rote memorization instead of thinking. It's  to see what is ostensibly the left-wing of the major UK parties agreeing with them.e: Wait no, it was the Tories who want to enforce that backasswardsness, crisis averted. Labour still seem reluctant for any kind of education reform in that area though. Guavanaut fucked around with this message at 13:54 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 13:35
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Gorn Myson posted:Not that my vote matters in my area anyway, but theres no way I'm voting for Labour. Tell me about it. I'd have to start a campaign of genocide to stop my constituency voting Conservative.
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Feb 1, 2015 13:36
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Much as they're a bunch of idiots, considering there isn't really any alternative, I might have to vote labour out of civic duty to try and keep the tories out. I do wish we could actually vote for the policies we like.
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Feb 1, 2015 13:36
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Reading Uni chat, I went in 04 and Big Kev Warwick used to give lectures which consisted of showing videos of himself on the telly. He was a massive cock. There were a vast assortment of loving bumboxes in that department, but doing purist EE I didn't have to deal with too many comp sci fedora freaks. Also, Wessex Hall represent - if you were there 04-07 at any point I probs know you irl!
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Feb 1, 2015 13:48
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OwlFancier posted:I might have to vote labour out of civic duty to try and keep the tories out. Oh man I don't wanna spoil the ending for you...
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Feb 1, 2015 13:49
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Hobo posted:The worst thing about that Bennett interview is people that that ideologically agree with the Green's policies backing away from the party due to her not being to explain them in an aggressive interview, rather than any real disagreement with the policies as such. This misses the point that there are lots of people who are unconvinced by the Greens' policies. Lots of people are sympathetic to their worldview in a very broad sense (inequality bad, climate change bad, being kind good, etc.) but for lots of people there's a suspicion that the Greens are well-intentioned but ultimately flimsy. The Bennett interview definitely feeds that suspicion. It's not just a case of lack of style: the worry is that there's a genuine lack of substance as well. I'm quite involved with some local community projects where I live and because they have a social justice/eco-friendly edge to them, a lot of the people involved have links to the Greens. They're almost universally very nice people, but talking to them about politics does tend to reinforce the 'lack of substance' impression. Lots of pro-homeopathy, anti-nuclear, pro-we would all be happier if everyone lived on organic farming communes!-type stuff. You also often see a lot of bitterness about politics and lots of populist anti-establishment thinking. That's understandable in many cases, and it's obviously not unique to the Greens because it reflects the mood in the country at the moment, but it always makes me cautious. It always boils down to an unrealistic appraisal of the way things actually are and the way politics actually works (lots of conspiracy-type thinking) combined with an unrealistically optimistic view about how easy it would be solve all the country's problems if only we could overthrow the Establishment. The Bennett interview supports the hypothesis that a lot of their proposals haven't been thought through very carefully. Whitefish fucked around with this message at 13:59 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 13:50
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OwlFancier posted:I never memorised mine, on account of having this thing called a calculator to do arithmetic for me. Being able to do mental arithmetic is useful but not really necessary, considering any serious mathematical work will require a calculator anyway. Rote memorization of times tables is as useful in maths as memorizing a poem is in literary analysis. What does anyone gain from being able to recite times tables? Wouldn't it be more fruitful to teach them that maths is a way of solving real-life problems through numbers? Rigged Death Trap fucked around with this message at 14:22 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 14:19
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Whitefish posted:This misses the point that there are lots of people who are unconvinced by the Greens' policies. Lots of people are sympathetic to their worldview in a very broad sense (inequality bad, climate change bad, being kind good, etc.) but for lots of people there's a suspicion that the Greens are well-intentioned but ultimately flimsy. The Bennett interview definitely feeds that suspicion. It's not just a case of lack of style: the worry is that there's a genuine lack of substance as well. I can sympathise with that view, and if that was the state of the party currently, I would have similar concerns, but there has been a massive shift the in the composition of the membership and subsequently policy and strategy. There's still a few lingering policies that are driven by fear and tradition (the anti-nuclear energy stance being the prime example), but that's shifting rapidly. This article goes in the recent history of the Greens and is well worth a read - The history of a political surge.
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Feb 1, 2015 14:23
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Hobo posted:I can sympathise with that view, and if that was the state of the party currently, I would have similar concerns, but there has been a massive shift the in the composition of the membership and subsequently policy and strategy. There's still a few lingering policies that are driven by fear and tradition (the anti-nuclear energy stance being the prime example), but that's shifting rapidly. This article goes in the recent history of the Greens and is well worth a read - The history of a political surge. Thanks, that's an interesting article. I definitely hope the Greens continue on their more serious trajectory. It's good for British politics if they are able to articulate a serious set of alternative policies. They've clearly come a long way in a relatively short time so hopefully that progress with continue. I hope the election result is such that the Greens are able to have some influence over Parliament and the Government. It would be interesting to see now they use that kind of power. It's probably unlikely though, given that they're only going to get a few MPs at most.
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Feb 1, 2015 14:45
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Rigged Death Trap posted:Rote memorization of times tables is as useful in maths as memorizing a poem is in literary analysis. It's often pretty useful! For any situation where you need to do a quick sum in your head, it's handy to just know what eg 8 x 6 is without having to think about it. The "call" for kids to know their times tables is just a bit of headline-grabbing nonsense, though. It's not like anybody's going to disagree and say: "well actually, kids shouldn't have to know these things!"
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Feb 1, 2015 14:58
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Bozza posted:Reading Uni chat, I went in 04 and Big Kev Warwick used to give lectures which consisted of showing videos of himself on the telly. He was a massive cock. This pretty much sums up every view I hear about Kev Warwick as well (04-07 guy here too). Ahh the heady old days. Then we got a VC who looked like Kilroy and it all went down hill.
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Feb 1, 2015 15:46
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Whitefish posted:This misses the point that there are lots of people who are unconvinced by the Greens' policies. Lots of people are sympathetic to their worldview in a very broad sense (inequality bad, climate change bad, being kind good, etc.) but for lots of people there's a suspicion that the Greens are well-intentioned but ultimately flimsy. The Bennett interview definitely feeds that suspicion. It's not just a case of lack of style: the worry is that there's a genuine lack of substance as well. I agree with your critique but even when the Greens do have generally good ideas rather than intentions they run into the Serious Person problem. The general sense of crisis we face has been warped into a common knowledge "fact" that sadly large chunks of society have to be screwed over. As we saw with SYRIZA one of the key lines of attack was that yes it all sounds very nice but sadly basic decency just isn't realistic. This means that parties like the Greens get reflexively dismissed by members of the public because they're even trying to propose positive policies, "good intentions" aren't enough. On the other hand bad intentions are taken as granted when it comes to proposed policies. A tax raise for the rich can be dismissed out of hand by right wingers because they'd just move away or find another loophole or whatever. Good thing won't work/nasty thing will work get far less scrutiny than good thing will work.
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Feb 1, 2015 16:53
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Just seen this retarded poo poo in my local shopping precinct lmao: Apparently its there because no fucker is retarded enough to call or talk to the filth, so they made this like a year ago, so they made a cofee shop where there's a pig hanging around once a week to listen to your problems. I never go into the precinct because I don't even get home from work till about 7pm but looool I live in a gaping goatse shithole.
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Feb 1, 2015 16:55
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Should have called it Cops of Coffee. What a tragic waste of a pun 
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Feb 1, 2015 16:58
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Umiapik posted:It's often pretty useful! For any situation where you need to do a quick sum in your head, it's handy to just know what eg 8 x 6 is without having to think about it. The call is for them to be tested on them, not just to learn them. I would rather have kids who know 1-5 and 7 times tables but haven't quite got the shortcuts to the rest down yet, than kids who can parrot out all the way up to 12x12 but don't grasp arithmetic well enough to start working with indices yet. This just feels like a way to write kids off before they even become teenagers, which used to be so much easier when we still had the 11+.
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Feb 1, 2015 17:01
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Renaissance Robot posted:Should have called it Cops of Coffee. What a tragic waste of a pun Grounds for A Rest
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Feb 1, 2015 17:42
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For real tho how am I going to enjoy my (presumably instant) coffee with the filth hanging around in the room. I might have to take a Tuesday off work just to see what this poo poo is about/ Renaissance Robot posted:Should have called it Cops of Coffee. What a tragic waste of a pun KKKlean Energy posted:Grounds for A Rest lmbo
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Feb 1, 2015 17:44
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Natalie Bennet is doing an AMA on Reddit right now: http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2uez88/i_am_natalie_bennett_leader_of_the_green_party_of/ The current top question is about their nuke policy.
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Feb 1, 2015 17:45
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Crashbee posted:Natalie Bennet is doing an AMA on Reddit right now: http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2uez88/i_am_natalie_bennett_leader_of_the_green_party_of/ I'm expecting a car crash, and thus far it appears that they are meeting my expectations. 
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Feb 1, 2015 18:07
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Delusibeta posted:I'm expecting a car crash, and thus far it appears that they are meeting my expectations. I don't see how - she's only answered two questions thus far, and both replies have been pretty reasonable. In fact there's also discussion that a notable section of the Greens wants their nuclear policy changed, which means it's one of the best things I've seen from them in awhile, because their position on science issues like that is my big sticking point with them, as it is with many others.
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Feb 1, 2015 18:10
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Umiapik posted:It's often pretty useful! For any situation where you need to do a quick sum in your head, it's handy to just know what eg 8 x 6 is without having to think about it. I know but it's more important to learn how maths works instead of a do this and this result comes up. The 'why' is much more important than the result. In fact that's true of all subjects. I don't know. Maybe I have an overly romanticized view of what schools should be in the pursuit of knowledge. (slight beer talk: Guinness Dublin porter is rank.)
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Feb 1, 2015 18:33
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Delusibeta posted:I'm expecting a car crash, and thus far it appears that they are meeting my expectations. Eh, the highlight so far has been the Lib Dem clevering off about how a focus on issues facing female prisoners is sexist and then having it pointed out to them a Lib Dem MoJ minister has said the same thing.
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Feb 1, 2015 18:40
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ReV VAdAUL posted:Eh, the highlight so far has been the Lib Dem clevering off about how a focus on issues facing female prisoners is sexist and then having it pointed out to them a Lib Dem MoJ minister has said the same thing. I saw that issue come up, reddit never disappoints.
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Feb 1, 2015 18:49
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Rigged Death Trap posted:I know but it's more important to learn how maths works instead of a do this and this result comes up. Changing that back to memorizing lists of kings is ridiculous.
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Feb 1, 2015 18:50
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Rigged Death Trap posted:(slight beer talk: Guinness Dublin porter is rank.) All Guinness is rank.
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Feb 1, 2015 18:53
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