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Thumbtacks posted:They didn't say it to be assholes, they just literally did not have the technology to restore individual characters, so they would have had to rollback entire servers to restore them. I'm vaguely surprised they didn't just do that. I question whether Carbine had the power to rollback servers, because of the infinite money glitch. Oh yeah, you could earn infinite money in Wildstar for a while. You had a personal little housing plot (that was actually legitimately cool and encouraged a lot of creativity and had people make some goddamn amazing little areas), in said housing area you could install things like a little mining deposit or a garden or a thing that handed out free stat food. I believe it was the last one that was the problem as it never ran out. You could just vendor the food infinitely, get unlimited money, buy shittons of CREDD, and play the game for free. Carbine never rolled this back or changed it. They removed the food dispenser from the game until they could fix it (Wildstar's code is hideous overwrought and fixing small things is nearly impossible by all accounts), suspended a few people for a couple of days, and then had the rest promise to be good. The end result is that the economy of Wildstar was basically a joke. Not like it wasn't before. Let's see, is it time to dump a litany of reasons why Wildstar failed? I've been here for the two previous threads, I remember them. Let's start with Amps. Amps are sort of like Talents in pre-MoP WoW, you got points from leveling up and you could spend them on certain buffs and abilities. The problem is that Wildstar was smitten with the early and bad MMO idea that just getting things by leveling up isn't hardcore enough, so many Amps (including the really good ones) were world drops including a number of incredibly powerful and vital ones. The one that I always remember is Trigger Fingers. Trigger Fingers was a ridiculously good Amp for Spellslingers that basically meant their Auto-attack lowered the cooldown on all their ability cooldowns. It was so useful that even Healing specced Spellslingers wanted it, so to balance it out better Carbine decided to halve its effectiveness for reducing healing cooldowns. The problem is they hosed up hideously. You see the cooldowns thing worked as intended, auto-attack reduced attack/utility cooldown by .5 seconds and healing by .25 seconds a use, but they messed up the UI so it appeared the other way around. For two weeks to a month Trigger Fingers made Attack skills go off cooldown BEFORE the UI said they did and healing skills AFTER the UI said they would, and if you used an attack CD before the UI thought it was ready it would go off but the UI would basically give up and say it was now permanently on cooldown and not tick down. Thanks to Carbine's wonderful programming for as much as a month the premiere attack AMP was rendered almost unusable. The best part? This was a bug that was known about on the PTRs. Oh and speaking of the PTRs? Carbine did them amazingly. People who copied their characters over to the PTRs would sometimes find that changes to their character on the Testing servers would actually transfer onto the live servers. Pity the poor people who decided to sell their inventories or go around test the new things. Also the PTRs were useless for actually doing Public Tests, 99.9% of the time if a bug was found, known about, and reported on the PTR absolutely nothing would be done about it and it might (emphasis on might) be fixed a month or so down the line after it was on the main servers. Let's see... Itemization was a joke. I don't know if it's still this way but for the 2 months I played straight attack power trumped absolutely everything else. The best crafted weapon you could make wasn't one of the level 50 Epics from the epic crafting progression track, it was a level 49 Blue with all the crafting modifiers put straight into attack. If you had a max attack level 49 the next time you'd get a weapon better than that would be in the tip-topmost raid. Oh god the raids. For starters the reason why "Clientside issue that wipes your raid attunement progress" was such an rear end in a top hat move was because getting attuned was an insanely tedious pile of bullcrap. No seriously Look at this poo poo mountain. As the graphic points out getting a silver medal meant you had to beat a dungeon or adventure in a tight time limit while doing everything. You basically couldn't wipe because you'd miss the time limit, and the bosses were stupidly over-complicated, and the dungeons as a whole were tedious slogs. The world boss bit was also fun because a number of people had their progress on world bosses randomly wiped (they responded by just giving everyone who was on that step credit while they finally decided to use achievements to mark process). Also Carbine did eventually reduce the Dungeon/Adventure requirements to only getting bronze thereby removing the time limit, but this was in the middle of Wildstar's deafening crash. Also if you got into the raids it was a whole 'nother level of bullshit. When Wildstar was being pushed they said that they thought Datascape, their premiere 40-man raid, was going to be so hard that no one would be able to beat it for 6 months. They were correct because they cheated. Datascape shipped with a majority of the content literally impossible. This was not a secret, Timetraveler, the lead raid designer was open with a number of top raiding guilds about what bosses were beatable and which he had made impossible. Worse yet Carbine frequently changed their minds and often overtuned bosses substantially on weekly resets, it was pathetically common that a raiding group would return to a boss they had breezed by in a previous week to find the mechanics totally different (and often literally impossible). More than a few raid groups just quit after the third or fourth time this happened. Carbine actually once nerfed a specific accessory because it let people meet the DPS threshold to kill a boss before they were allowed to. Besides that though the bosses were generally pretty lame as well, most just spammed AoEs and did a single mechanic every 30 or so seconds that you had to get right or wipe. The big final boss of Genetic Archives, their initial 20-person raid was almost literally just The Lurker Below from Serpentshrine Caverns. Oh and when they reduced Datascape from a 40-person to a 20-person raid they kept the bosses tuned for 40 people, so they were initially all impossible again. This was another thing known about on the PTR as well. Oh and when Carbine finally finally finally hit their 6 month deadline and let people beat Datascape? What did Timetraveler say? Timetraveler, the lead developer who had overseen this idiotic timetable and had admitted to being responsible for making his babies impossible to beat? Timetraveler, the man who deliberately had made the bosses impossible and was only now deigning to make the final raid boss possible posted a mocking image macro suggesting that the world's first raiders were scrubs because they had to wait for the bosses to be nerfed. Those folks at Carbine are a class act. There were also Warplots. No one has seen Warplots. And there were a whole litany of other problems besides. Things like gathering tools having various levels of quality but no differences in effects, or having the only solo content being 3 daily zones (two of which were just the starter zones again), or the broken UI with things like a /who menu that did not work ever, or the flagrantly teleporting bots, or how there was basically only one cool zone (RIP Farside, you were too good for Wildstar), or the tower defense daily where no one defended, the complete lack of a tutorial about the rune system, or the way you had to tap Shift until your fingers fell off to get anywhere fast, or any other design flaws. I wish Wildstar hadn't sucked, I liked hoverboards and double jumps and the flow of the combat. I liked the aesthetic and I enjoyed the goofy tone. I have fond memories of how someone wrote a plug-in that actually let you use the SA Smilies in the game's chat. I thought the adventures (except Malgrave Trail, gently caress that) were cool. The shiphand missions were all sorts of awesome. Wildstar had some cool things and some good stuff in it, but sadly those points of light don't countermand the tidal wave of poo poo that was the rest of the MMO. Omnicrom fucked around with this message at 21:40 on Apr 17, 2015 |
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Apr 17, 2015 21:30
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Carecat posted:Maybe a wow clone works better if you don't clone wow from the burning crusade era. I think you may be underestimating how far back Carbine pulls nostalgia from. Wildstar is built on Nostalgia for Vanilla WoW and Planes of Power era Everquest.
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Apr 18, 2015 18:53
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Pesterchum posted:Here's the other relevant screenshot. I want to remind people that the person who posted that image macro? And the person in this screencap? That person is the lead raid designer. This is a person who I stress again was completely open about the fact he had deliberately made bosses impossible. Stormgale posted:I think it was because they found a way to boost their DPS in a pseudo exploity way so he threw a tantrum No, that was well previous to the world's first and it wasn't really an exploit either. There was an accessory in Wildstar with an active effect that sliced off a decent chunk of your targets armor, and a guild managed to clear an impossible DPS check by loading up on said accessory and using it repeatedly to meet the damage requirements. I want to keep reiterating that I mean absolutely no hyperbole when I say impossible, Timetraveller, AKA the jackhole who posted that macro on Reddit was open with this guild and told them that the boss they killed wasn't supposed to be mortal for at least another month. Unsurprisingly that particular accessory was smacked by a nerfbat quite fast, it was actually patched much more quickly than many other balance issues or design flaws.
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Apr 20, 2015 06:01
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It's worth mentioning that one reason interrupting mobs with concerted armor breaking was important is that if you managed to land that interrupt the mob was not only stunned but took 50% bonus damage for about 5-8 seconds. This isn't necessarily a bad idea for a more action-oriented MMO, the problem was that dungeons had set their enemy HP built around the assumption your party would be doing flawless interrupt rotation, IE they had about 50-75% more HP than was necessary and were rendered more or less just big obnoxious sacks of HP. If you actually were going for Silver on a dungeon there's a reason people did every trick, skip, and jump they could to avoid trash packs. There were also plenty of bosses that demanded you do flawless interrupt rotations or you weren't hardcore and were to be purged and say goodbye to your Silver medal. Basically "Landing an interrupt is bonus damage and that's cool" is a good idea, "Landing an interrupt is bonus damage and that's MANDATORY" is Wildstar. Can I also say again that the entire attunement grind was a hideous idea? For people who worship at the altar of Vanilla WoW Carbine doesn't remember it all that well (though I can't say that's really a surprise). The reason we even call the act of getting permission to enter a raid "Attunement" is because of the old quest "Attunement to the Core" which you did to get a shortcut into Molten Core in WoW. The actual requirements for that original attunement? Walk to the entrance of Molten Core Proper, fetch a little crystal, and you're done. That very first attunement was definitely the easiest, but the fact is that old WoW attunements were things you could actually reasonably do. The Onyxia and Karazhan entrance quests were long chains that required dungeon runs yes, but they were things you could readily knock out in an afternoon with your guildies to get up to speed. The massive attunement web of BC was a hilarious artifact of bad old design trends, but on the other hand the majority of it was just "Go do dungeons while you're getting gear and rep and badges". Even then there's a reason that WoW dropped all attunements wholesale in Wrath of the Lich King, you don't actually NEED some big long stupid time sink to separate the raiders from the casuals, the actual raids do quite a good job of it on their own.
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Apr 21, 2015 23:17
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Bauxite posted:Yeah, uh, the problem with attunements wasn't ever how hard or easy they were. It was that it was a bunch of terrible lovely busywork chores that didn't get you anything except access to content. Yep, this is why Attunement went away in WoW, because no matter how palatable pointlessly jumping through hoops, is it's still pointlessly jumping through hoops. I could see a short, simple breadcrumb quests to lead into a raid but nothing like Wildstar infographic of failure. Attunements in Wildstar are nothing but cargo cult nonsense: Carbine never learned that you don't need some sort of tedious busywork to separate the HARDCORE RAID DUDES from the casuals, actual good raid bosses do that quite well. But then again Wildstar didn't have those either, it's funny he was brought up a little bit ago because the final boss of Genetic Archives, the initial 20-person raid was basically just Lurker Below.
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Apr 25, 2015 08:33
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Anoia posted:If you missed the "shut up, it's beta, it'll get better" phase of wildstar goons, check out the skyforge thread. It's about the same. Not really. Skyforge is full of people putting out objection's about the people managing that game, the combat of that game, the grind of that game, and the paid features of that game. It's basically the opposite of Wildstar.
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Apr 28, 2015 18:18
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Normal Adult Human posted:The skyforge thread is full of insane people trying to pretend they arent getting sucked into the most p2w game since the last time those developers released a mmorpg. I'm not sure we're reading the same thread anymore.
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Apr 28, 2015 23:03
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SirPhoebos posted:For those who haven't played Wildstar, what's the deal with 'cupcakes'? Mayostard posted:When you level up, you get a cheesy rock explosion with an announcer that says something to the effect of "Oh, yeah! You just levelled up, cupcake!" That was one of the level up lines. Wildstar had a pile of ridiculously excessive level up lines, complete with fireworks and pyrotechnics. If the game hadn't sucked as hardcore as it wanted to be the level up ceremony, and the cupcake moniker, would probably be accepted as merely an eccentric turn of the game's style. "Cupcake" was Wildstar's semi-jokey, semi-taunty, altogether-regretable-in-hindsight nickname for its players. Just like the level up lines the repeated use of "Cupcake" simply reminds us of how Wildstars passion to be Leet and hardcore destroyed it. You could see it in the trailers, they had the general tone "You think you're hardcore cupcake? Well you're just a cupcake unless you play Wildstar and prove it, cupcake!" Schubalts posted:Yes, it's true. The dev team didn't know about warplots until they were brought up as a feature in an interview. It was the president or CEO of Carbine, or someone similarly high up. To clarify a little according to an interview the Dev Team knew about plans for Warplots but as far as they knew Warplots were still at the idea stage and they hadn't been finalized or given the greenlight for release. It wasn't until the president gave a press release hyping up the ultra awesome hardcore vanilla Wowtastrophe that were the Warplots that the programming team actually learned that this thing they had been brainstorming was apparently a finalized product that would ship shortly after the final release of the game. As has been mentioned before Carbine was very poorly managed.
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May 1, 2015 01:14
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Thumbtacks posted:I don't remember hearing about this. Could you elaborate? Timetraveler, the lead raid designer posted the following in the Wildstar subreddit after a guild finally managed to clear their 40-man raid after 6 months.  That image link leads to this  For the interest of clarity to understand why this guy is beyond a complete shitfucker let it be known that the reason it took 6 months to clear it was that it took 6 months for Timetraveler and the rest of Carbine to make it beatable. Quite a lot of raiders quit Wildstar in disgust and frustration when bosses where given totally different mechanics and heavy buffs (usually to the point of being impossible) on weekly resets with absolutely no warning and announcement. Timetraveler is mocking and deriding people who stuck with the game for 6 months because they needed "nerfs" to beat the because over and over he made his precious raid baby literally impossible.
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May 15, 2015 22:35
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RottenK posted:i know that this is true but it's still hard to believe that you're not joking Because like everything Wildstar related Carbine had a good idea and then buried it under a landslide of poo poo. The idea of having a Sprint gauge to be used as a resource isn't a bad one in an MMO that puts a lot of emphasis on action combat and movement, the idea that you have a limited sprint which can be used to avoid attacks or get into position isn't a bad one. The problem is that with movement speed as low as it was the only way to move around quickly was to sprint and the only way to sprint for long periods of time was to continuously switch it on and off and the only way to do that is to give yourself a repetitive motion injury.
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May 17, 2015 07:53
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Byolante posted:Maybe they have fixed aoes but last time I played something like cragdad was loving obviously hosed. It was even worse around ARR launch though. I had absolutely no trouble dodging all sorts of bullshit aoes in wow but cragdad was impossible to dodge the aoes unless I was moving as he started turning, not when the tell displayed on my screen. For what it's worth Titan's Weight of the Land is widely scorned for being a twitchy bastard move. There's really nothing in the game quite as unforgiving as Titan, having cleared all the way through Turn 13 there's literally not other AOE I've seen that's been as unforgiving and cheap. I've honestly had a lot more trouble with regards to getting clipped by AoEs in World of Warcraft as well, I've always found it way easier to dodge in FF14. I concede that Retainers are clunky, but where I'm sitting it's never been godawful. Horrible Tree Menu implies it's something more than "Choose retainer, choose sell, choose item". That's a little clunky but that's all it is. As for the rest of what you're saying sorry, I think it's down to taste. I'm sorry the game wasn't for you, I really enjoyed FF14 and I do hope you find an MMO that agrees with you someday.
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May 25, 2015 16:56
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Byolante posted:I didn't ever say FF14 was a bad game overall if it helps. I was just saying that its not a universally awesome experience that people seem to claim a lot. I think if they changed inventory to match how it works in wow, let you que for dungeons while you have your chocobo out, not lock instances behind story quests and let everyone have a house then it would be a better mmo than wow. I still wouldn't play it because I am done with mmos but its a real shame that some of the game is so bad because the rest is so good. Ah that does clear things up. Well if you're tired of MMOs then don't let me or anyone else stop you, play what you want how you want to. With luck maybe there will be a new up and comer if you change your mind and come back to the genre.
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May 25, 2015 19:22
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sword_man.gif posted:there's nothing to do at max level but raid or play facebook games More or less. Flying is merely a symptom of the problem, and that problem is that WoW is an understaffed game with a dreadful dearth of current content. Raiders tell me that the Raids out right now are some of the best in the game's history, but they also tell me that they have no reason to log on anymore EXCEPT to raid. As this thread has proven an MMO who can only provide raiding content is on the way out, at least Blizzard is rattling on about cupcakes and talking about how HARDCORE they are.
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May 26, 2015 22:33
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Like I said before if Wildstar wasn't a steaming bucket of piss those ridiculous "OH YEAH EXTREME BONESAW IS READY CUPCAKE!" videos and their announcer announcer would have been a quirky and mildly divisive part of the game. Unfortunately as it is its actually it's a giant steaming tower of failure.
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Jun 4, 2015 02:05
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Unguided posted:It was already possible before the expansion. No it wasn't, the ability to ignore level syncs and go into a level 15 dungeon as a level 50 or 60 was added in 3.0. Of course that bit of content is added for everyone and not just for expansion havers.
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Aug 23, 2015 03:27
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Philonius posted:Oh hey, 90 new posts in the Wildstar thread. Someone must have mentioned FFXIV again. At this rate I think it'll be a couple more days of venting in the Safe-Place-to-Hate-FF14(TM) before people start talking about Wildstar again. Either that or Carbine can save us from this inevitable bit of the Wildstar thread cycle by posting something fantastically stupid, but since they seem to have dumped all the F2P conversion info already I figure we won't have that out available to us. Maybe if we're lucky that person who talked about Chodes can come back and rave about how good Wildstar is.
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Aug 23, 2015 07:33
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