Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
Minsky
May 23, 2001

The Moon Monster posted:

Did the Horde goon guild ever set foot into a raid? I'm pretty sure Space Jam did not.

I think towards the end of the guild's life, the few people left organized a big expedition to track down the few world bosses that weren't bugged (including going into Exile territory to kill theirs), and to contest that PVP Contamination world event that had rotating bosses (because at that point the server was horribly outnumbered to Exile which made doing it any other way impossible), so that people could finish their attunements.

I think in the end there were in theory enough warm bodies such that, ignoring composition, we would have been allowed to enter the raid instance, but by then people had burned out and only like 17 out of 20 showed up on the few nights we did try.

I think we sent some people to go raid with a non-goon guild who were in the same situation of almost being able to experience raid content, but I wouldn't know because I quit to go play a non-hardcore MMO without these problems.

The ridiculous attunement taught me nothing about learning to raid. The interrupt armor circlejerk taught me nothing about learning to raid. What taught me about raiding were: patient raid leaders, boss ability overviews, and consistently being able to actually try the raid on multiple difficulties with roughly the same group of people.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Minsky
May 23, 2001

All this new crop of MMOs has combat moving towards Wildstar's, which is to say it's about fewer buttons and pseudo-targeting and dodging. Neverwinter is kind of like it, but I think so is Skyforge and maybe Black Desert based on the streams.

Unfortunately they all have their own issues. I think Neverwinter could be pretty fun in small increments, but it's a Perfect World free-to-play game with fairly repetitive content.

Frankly I think I move about as much in WOW raids as I did in Wildstar dungeons.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

Cao Ni Ma posted:

Saying that they are moving "towards" wildstar is dumb though because this has been happening at the very least since GW2. In reality the rapid consolidation of skill bars has been happening since WoW started cutting back on hybrid talent builds in WoTLK then locking people entirely out of trees and then just consolidating their abilities based on a role preset.

TSO and Neverwinter both had limited skill bars. B&S had a dynamic skillbar that altered based on followups so you never really saw clutter and things moved a whole lot more dynamically. These three came out long before Wildstar. Black Desert is almost entirely action based where most of your abilities come from how long you press the buttons and the directions you press while doing them.

I didn't say it to imply Wildstar invented this style of combat. I said it because he was wondering what MMOs he should play and had previous experience with Wildstar.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

bear is driving! posted:

I see the hate Wildstar gets from goons, so I need to ask: why, exactly, is the game so bad?

I'm a super casual player, just looking for an MMO to fill the time until Heavensward drops and I wanted to try the 10 day trial, but I would like to know why the hate? Is it just for stuff at endgame, or is the game somehow fundamentally flawed?

The leveling was not very fun, and that's about as much you'd be able to experience during your 10-day trial. If you ever played pre-Cataclysm WOW, the leveling feels about equivalent.

I think if you're looking for an MMO to waste a few weeks in until the FFXIV expansion comes out, a better option than Wildstar is to sub to SWTOR for a month for the 12X boost to do the class stories. That costs $15 though (or maybe more if you have to still pay the "box price" nowadays).

Or frankly just play Witcher 3 until then because that game is Pretty Good.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

bear is driving! posted:

I think I'm gonna pick up W3 today for Xbone.

Can anyone recommend a fun, casual MMO to mess with until Heavensward? I see people mention TERA a lot, how's that?

If you have an Xbox One you could also try Neverwinter. The combat is fun on a gamepad, but the downside is that everything else about that game is a bit lame.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

Housing creates another ancillary progression path in the form of decorations. It's another princess to make pretty. There's really nothing wrong with the concept, with the exception that it may not be worth the effort to produce all those art assets for housing furniture, as opposed to some other cosmetic stuff like costumes or mounts, if there's a chance the housing system is only specific to one expansion (which is likely to be the case with Draenor).

I don't think the way WOW did housing necessarily means housing in general is bad. WOW screwed up by having extremely few ways to cosmetically customize your garrison and by making the majority of the non-raiding based activities outside of your garrison extremely boring. The garrison followers were okay as a Facebook minigame, but they could have been much better.

The game also lets you pick one of your followers as bodyguards that follow you around as fake group members SWTOR-style. Instead of the Facebook minigame, I think the bodyguard system is what they should have revolved the whole expansion meta-game around. The basic gameplay loop should have been something like: make all content in the world is 3-man group content and is tiered based on item level; you can choose multiple bodyguards instead of just a single one to form a small 3-man posse; completing world content with your bodyguards (or actual people) grants you rewards that are both cosmetic and material; and you use those rewards in your garrison to craft better gear for your followers which then enables tougher content in the world. That's kinda how I was hoping it would go down when I first read about garrisons and followers, but instead we got Farmville.

Edit: ^ The lack of flight in WoD is irritating but having flight won't make doing the non-raiding content any more fun. Apexis crystal grinds are still boring and stupid whether you can fly to them or not. Archeology probably would get easier, but archeology is boring as hell to start with.

Minsky fucked around with this message at 01:49 on May 26, 2015

Minsky
May 23, 2001

FFXIV is like WOW and therefore it is the second-best MMO out there, after WOW. Parts of Guild Wars 2 are cool too but it's not as good as WOW because I really like raiding and item progression. Wildstar could have been good if they had based it on 2014 WOW instead of 2004 WOW. Basically I like WOW.

But what I really wish is for The Secret World to have been good and taken off.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

Well the problem with TSW was that the UI was poo poo and the game was buggier than Wildstar and (while I'm not an expert) I'm pretty sure the combat mechanics regardless of build were all distilled down to "get 5 combo points and use a finisher".

The world and the quests and the atmosphere were all top tier though.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

I was reading through what f2p accounts were missing and none of it looked too terrible, until I ran into this dealbreaker:

quote:

Cannot invite into or create a Warparty

Minsky
May 23, 2001

Their f2p system sounds mostly harmless.

That said I have zero interest in returning to this game in its current state even for free. I close my eyes I still see a ghost image burned on my retinas of that red zone of the exact same quests every day.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

Manifest Dynasty posted:

I actually liked a lot of the interrupt armor stuff. By higher levels, warriors could do a ton of interrupt, and many things didn't REQUIRE an interrupt to survive, but they would trigger the Moment of Opportunity (extra incoming damage) if you did. My main complaints were needing to run a bunch of add-ons to easily see if this spell was The Bad One and little tuning issues (how long your window was, etc). The basic concept was fine (even "good") in my opinion.

Meanwhile medics had one interrupt on a 30 second cooldown. I remember I wanted to help with DPS on someone's attunement run, and got rejected because of that reason, and I could kind of see their point.

Interrupt armor was a cute idea but I think they were a little too proud of it.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

The "apexis grind" in WoD that most people hate involves basically doing something once per day in a random area, and that something is "kill any 50 monsters and/or click 25 things until your progress bar has filled up". The reward for doing this is 800 apexis crystals which is a generally useless currency, because you either buy gear that is worse than crafted gear or hoard a huge pile of it to purchase a lame mount. Apexis crystals also trickle in from a few other sources related to your garrison, or from grinding even more monsters in those same areas, but what's described above is roughly about it for the primary non-raiding non-garrison mission PVE end-game content.

Any other content is not really specific to Draenor, like pet battle stuff, etc.

So, yeah, in that light I kind of would like daily quests to come back. Even though the bar is pretty low, at least daily quests at least generally were less monotonous, there was usually a rotating set each day, and best of all completing them usually gradually advanced some side story or some other long term goal.

Luckily I don't mind so much because I do like raiding; raiding is the most accessible out of any MMO; and the fights so far have been really interesting with the exception of maybe one that's too long (looking at you Iron Maidens). Maybe FFXIV is just as good too. I'm okay with two games having great raiding and don't really care to argue about it (and this isn't the thread for it), but what I've played of it so far just feels a bit too slow for me personally especially on the healing side. I can easily admit though from watching streams that some of the boss fights shown so far in Heavensward look visually amazing. I wish Blizzard would rip off FFXIV's particle effects already.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

Shadowlyger posted:

You can actually buy useful gear with Apexis now and the game kind of spews them at you from every angle.

Yep I got the apexis weapon. Good thing I'd been hoarding the few apexis crystals I bothered to grind.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

panda clue posted:

https://twitter.com/StephanFrost/status/618168660574650369

We've come full circle. God Bless Wildstar.

the lead designer on Wildstar is now a designer for WoW. you can't make this poo poo up

Great I look forward to the return of attunements as a key feature of the next expansion. You wow casuals asked for content and now you're gonna get it, cupcakes

theultimo posted:

@StephanFrost Grats dude, I'm not surprised that you got picked up by some big studios. You were like the Chris Metzen of Wildstar.

:lol:

Maybe he meant that that guy designed the zones full of ~*~ SPACE CORRUPTION ~*~

Minsky fucked around with this message at 07:01 on Jul 7, 2015

Minsky
May 23, 2001

It's pretty likely they'll finally add that GW2-style wardrobe system in the next expansion (what else is left). I mean I think they've been promising that poo poo since Mists of Pandaria.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

30.5 Days posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hILCb0H1s8

Please watch this 5-man dungeon boss with the sound on. This is wildstar.mpg

If I remember correctly I (and everybody else that wanted to get attuned) "beat" this boss by standing the whole fight on a little ledge near the outer wall that avoided every single mechanic in the fight, which I think is the true wildstar.mpg.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

I think another good candidate for wildstar.mpg is your average Sanctuary of the Swordmaiden silver medal dungeon runthrough video (time limit: 75 minutes), also another requirement to be attuned, that is each at least an hour long.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

The problem is that the fire boss is like halfway into the dungeon which is an easy 30 minutes of time wasted if you wipe on it more then a couple times. There's no way anybody can ever convince me that an hour+ -long dungeon, where you can effectively fail and have to restart the whole thing after halfway through, is a good idea of something fun to do.

Edit: clarified something.

Minsky fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Jul 28, 2015

Minsky
May 23, 2001

I considered checking this out for tonights f2p launch, but then yesterday I pulled up a stream and the first thing I saw was a guy running around that same red daily quest zone and the nauseating memories of several months wasted came right back.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

West Ham Sandwich posted:

I'm obviously in the minority here but I hope they fixed a lot of bad things about this game and it becomes fun because I loved the aesthetics of the end game and hope I can find a raid group/stomach to play it long enough. :unsmith:

It may well be that they have (I mean they've had plenty of time), but the minute I read that bolded part all the cat herding bullshit and attunement spreadsheet came bubbling back. I think I've just been spoiled by wow's flex raiding and wowgoons's signup apps and multiple raid groups.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

Open world pvp was cool and great until the exile population outnumbered us to hell and back and it became a matter of summoning half the guild just to contest the non-bugged world events required for attunement.

Minsky
May 23, 2001

SpaceDrake posted:

I haven't played in ages, and I forget if I deleted my Dom characters or not. My main is still there, though, so w/e

Also the mouselook/aim is actually reasonably slick... except there's still no way to bind abilities to mouse1/mouse2. Rip. So close yet so far still. Wonder if any of rebind mods are still up to date.

Before the servers shat the bed I was watching some random streamer use the mouselook feature and it mapped LMB/RMB to the first two abilities on the bar it seems, if that's what you mean.

Anyways looks like it all went to poo poo pretty fast but at least that's no different from your average mmo launch these days and not particular to Wildstar.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Minsky
May 23, 2001

I logged in this morning to see if my character was still there. It was, and I logged out, but not before getting a random UI error.

One bad MMO is enough for me I think and that's WOW.

  • Locked thread