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MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
From looking at the manga Cioccolata probably replaced Fugo's fight. As their stands have similar basic concepts.

MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Dec 21, 2018

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MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Hitlersaurus Christ posted:

I haven’t read PHF. What are the differences between the backstories here and there? And since I forget 90% of this fight, what scenes were in the original manga?

The differences from looking it up are that Fugo was close to his grandmother and when she passed away he was unable to attend her funeral because of his studies. The professor he attacked insulted his grandmother. Afterwards he did go to prison and met Bucciarati there. However after joining Bucciarati he also became one of Diavolo's assassins and preformed many missions for him, keeping them a secret from the team cause he felt Bucciarati would not condone them.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

RatHat posted:

Wasn't the soul swap thing the ability of Silver Chariot Requiem?

It was.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

fractalairduct posted:

crossposting from the anime thread


Baby Face is like, two fights away

Baby face is a good if creepy fight.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Arist posted:

Also its defeat is kinda weird because it's a rare example of a (non-Bound) Stand being defeated by something other than another Stand. Like, it just gets blown up.

It is a quasi bound stand. The Baby Face Homunculus is a physical being that can be seen by anyone.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Arist posted:

It's Risotto sitting in a room with a dude from Passione asking him to hack something to track the boss I guess? Something like that. Anyway, Risotto makes nails appear in his hands and warns him that if he doesn't shut up he'll do it to his eye next. Then he does it.

Also, man, Baby Face's defeat doesn't really make sense.

It makes a decent amount of sense. Babyface ripped GE's hand off trapping it inside itself, however the hand was actually a decoy being the motorcycle which turned back inside him, then exploded.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

halleys comet posted:

been thinking about Star Finger and all the times that jotaro could have instantly killed kira or pucci with Star Finger but chose not to out of good sportsmanship.

When could he have?

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

tiistai posted:

The anime had a short new scene at the end with Diavolo and a sort of a teaser of King Crimson's powers

Which I guess confirms he can directly interact with stuff in the erased time

Good to see that it's still as confusing as ever

No it doesn't. It just shows him vanishing after dropping his robe or whatever.

multijoe posted:

But then why does Narancia's ice cream melt along with all the other time related mishaps during Bruno vs King Crimson? If they were on auto-pilot he'd just have a licked ice cream without memory of eating it.

Because they can't perceive anything during the erased time. If he was distracted, into doing something else, he would not eat the Ice Cream and would not be able to perceive it melting.

It's the same as when he is killed. Narancia is thrown on the fence, and time is skipped. Because they did not know about him getting tossed on the fence, and wrre not going to do anything about that before the skipped time, they did not do anything about it despite the fact their skipped selves would have noticed it.

MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 20:10 on Feb 15, 2019

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
The reason the bullets passed through Diavolo is because he can't affect anything in the skipped time, but at the same time, nothing can affect him.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

CJ posted:

So he turns into a ghost when he is time skipping?

Yeah basically.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
With Narancia I assumed he just tossed him while no one was looking then skipped time, so Narancia would be impaled and bleed out without anyone seeing him.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Momomo posted:

I assume King Crimson has a large range for a stand but not the entire world. Otherwise everyone would have already experienced his stand whenever he used it before. It's not like The World where the entire world has to stop or otherwise it would make no sense.

Yeah I assume the range is pretty big, but not the whole world. I forget did the gang notice being affected by it during the Risotto fight. Cause if not, it's range appears to less then Areosmith.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
We honestly have a lot of extra time.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Electric Phantasm posted:

Did they skip the part where KC is just lounging on the stairs or is that coming next week?

Next week.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
He also appears to be in no mood to edit it out, which is annoying.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

overmind2000 posted:

We don't spend enough time with Diavolo to understand why he has to remain in control of Passione instead of moving to farm in Sardinia where he can disguise himself as Doppio and spend all day telling cows how superior to them he is.

Because he wants to avoid all the Lows of life and solely get the highs. Being the eternal anonymous king of his appears to give him the most satisfaction.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Funky Valentine posted:

Thinking on it, I'm kind of surprised that Diavolo didn't ice Fugo as a loose end.

The fact that Fugo did not get on the boat with them means he did not betray him. Even when Bruno did deviate from the plan Diavolo still gave him a chance to walk away. He does not seem the sort to just throw away useful pawns unless they clearly go against him.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Expect My Mom posted:

lol that this is what the next episode opens with immediately after the gang becomes wanted fugitives and abandoned one of their friends



I love that they become concerned with the wine stain Narancia caused, instead of the fact they beat him half to death.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
I consider Doppio to be an extension of Diavolo. So I am largely pretty fond of him.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
I would just take the Who Shot Johnny as an inconsistency, like the very first appearance of King Crimson.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Silver2195 posted:

I remember reading a detailed explanation somewhere of how Who Shot Johnny makes sense with how D4C is supposed to work. It's complicated and requires some really lucky timing on Valentine's part, IIRC, but I can roll with it.

Bruno seeing himself makes sense as Diavolo lending him Epitaph to confuse him. I don't pretend to have a clear sense of how Diavolo does and doesn't interact with things during the skipped time, though.

The thing with Diavolo I mean is when he takes Trish out of the Elevator without Bruno seeing. After that, everything is pretty consistent.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
There is a fairly good chance we did not meet the entirety of Diavolo's Elite Guard.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

RatHat posted:

I was going to complain that the Anime is making it way too obvious that Doppio is the boss but I just checked the first chapter Doppio was in and it's almost explicitly said. I wish he would've remained more of a mystery until the reveal.


She only caught a glimpse of him, that's not enough reason to kill even for him.

Doppio has not shown up yet in the anime.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
Yeah Diavolo did not bring many members of his guard into the picture. He did not have them go after them to Sardinia because he did not trust his guard enough to send them there, so went himself. And he brought in Cioccolata and Secco cause they were close to Rome and he really wanted Buccerati's gang dead.

Squalo and Tizano were just the members in Venice at the time, and Carne was presumably close to the Airport.

MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 02:43 on Apr 10, 2019

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
Diavolo also appears to have some control over Doppio's memory, and emotions. He went from knowing about Risotto and his goals, to having no idea, then enraged when the jig was up.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

ChaseSP posted:

I think Doppio is just kinda of an idiot, or atleast outright has a terrible memory. I doubt Diavolo would remove memories of looking for Risotto given how even he is cautious of him due to not knowing any of his abilities.

It appeared to be deliberate, so Doppio would not give himself away to Risotto. He even said who is that when he saw Risotto, despite earlier having recognized him.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
Hey Diavolo sorta at least lived in the end.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Exercu posted:

There's also this:

Kiddo was not just bleeding, he was drained

That's pretty creepy Diavolo just straight up vampiring someone.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
Also it pretty much acts consistently from now on. I like King Crimson and Diavolo and found the anime has made me more fond of them.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

multijoe posted:

I don't think this is an entirely fair portrayal of peoples misgivings with with King Crimson. Stands with definied and somewhat consistent power have been important in JoJo because that is where Araki's smartest writing and most staisfying conclusions come from: Hayato tricking Kira into revealing his own name and nullfying Bites The Dust, Jolyne turning herself into a mobius strip to avoid being imploded, Weather Report saturating the air with oxygen to turn Pucci's time accelation against him, Johnny using the unloaded revolver to reveal Valentine's planned betrayal, they all come from the Stands involved having previously established rules which can be exploited and defeated, they're still thematically appropriate Stands for their users but tying into the themes of the story and doing something which actually makes sense with rules governing its use isn't an either/or proposition.

And the weakness of this writing directly leads into the infamously bad ending, both the protagonist and the antagonist have extremely open ended Stands that can do pretty much whatever Araki's wants for any given scene so the entire battle has to hinge on them just fighting over who gets to control the item that gives them the very last word in doing whatever the gently caress they want. There's absolutely no space for clever reversals or galaxy brain exploits of Diavolo's Stand because it seems to work differently in nearly every scene its in and there's never anything that could used as a vulnerability or a shortcoming for the gang to use against it.

I seriously don't see how King Crimson is galaxy brained or get a sense it works differently in every scene.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
Someone used the word trope to describe something.

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MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you

Johnny Joestar posted:

yeah, basically. i don't remember if there's any overlap, but i do remember that oasis splits off to hound after bruno pretty exclusively while the others deal with moldboy.

Secco's initial job is to knock the good guys down so they they molded to death, I forgot how he eventually separated from Cioccolata

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