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ArbitraryC posted:I like how you went straight for attacking me personally, but i cant say I am a big consumer of fanservice. And you really, truly, can't conceive a universe where creating a precedent for young males to be catered to via tits and rear end might be a problem?
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Jul 7, 2015 20:23
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Powercrazy posted:Should all videogames appeal to all audiences equally? If you can't come up with a perfect solution, clearly the logical option is to not address the problem at all.
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Jul 7, 2015 20:28
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The Snark posted:Subtle, insidious, everywhere. True of racism, not so much the KKK I believe. We can start by calling it what it is. In this thread, ON THIS PAGE, you have examples of people dismissing RE5 as "not really racist", in part because of the lack of understanding of exactly what racism is.
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Jul 7, 2015 20:36
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Powercrazy posted:Actually as I've stated repeatedly, the solution isn't to try to change the games that exist. But to promote the other games that appeal to you or your ideology. There is no need to change Doom or Halo. But hey there was this cool indie game called Gone Home, or give me another example please. Please show me the hordes of people calling for Doom and Halo to be changed.
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Jul 7, 2015 20:38
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OMG JC a Bomb! posted:It seems as though Feminist Frequency was mad about the new Doom trailer because every depiction of spilled blood is a tool of the toxic masculine Phallus-Facist agenda, but that's about all I've seen. Frankly, I kind of found the trailer to be boring, but that's just me. That is a new Doom game. It is not calling for something that already exists to be changed, it is pointing out the problems in a thing that does not yet exist in its final form. Potential consumers influence product development literally all the time. This is not new nor exclusive to feminists and video games.
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Jul 7, 2015 20:50
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OMG JC a Bomb! posted:Nah, I agree. I think the new trailer depicts some dull environments and uses the same animations far too many times, and I don't like the idea of being locked into some dramatic kill-cam thing every ten seconds. McIntosh has every right to criticize it as he sees fit. Hell, I encourage it, since the results are often pretty funny (though I'm not convinced he's ever actively tried to be funny in his life). So we're in agreement, then, that there are no hordes of people trying to force game developers to change games they made 20 years ago.
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Jul 7, 2015 21:00
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OMG JC a Bomb! posted:I'm sure there's some PMRC holdouts who would sign a petition if they were to stumble across one. Nobody that anyone's listening to, anyway. Plom Bar posted:So we're in agreement, then, that there are no hordes of people trying to force game developers to change games they made 20 years ago.
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Jul 7, 2015 21:04
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Like I get that you're just desperate to lay some sick burns on them SJW shitlords and really want me to appreciate that but I'm trying to make a point here.
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Jul 7, 2015 21:04
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Talmonis posted:Worst possible thing? No more violence in video games. Conflict would be resolved in quicktime events that involve talking about our problems to each other. By each other, we mean the quota mandated diversty cast, in which every game would require accurate representation of every minority possible; from indigenous peoples to otherkin. Obviously the current game design teams couldn't possibly do that accurately, so they'd need to be fired in lieu of people who could speak to their particular minority status. Bright colors would be toned down. Any and all possible topics that may offend someone, would require obvious audio and visual based trigger warnings and be heavily panned by the Magisterial Order of Critics for being there in the first place. Things that do not involve Social Issues would not exist. Anything that is deemed "Phallic" would not exist. I want you to imagine a world where the climate of video games is currently exactly as alienating to some people as this hypothetical climate would be to you. Plom Bar fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Jul 7, 2015 |
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Jul 7, 2015 21:34
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Supercar Gautier posted:Fake Gamer Boy spotted. I am so mad that I didn't get to make this joke first.
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Jul 7, 2015 21:52
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Fluo posted:The irony of mccarthyism blacklists. Lucky she isn't in Europe like the Athest+ blockbot was which was forced down by anti blacklist laws. As a leftist like me, I'm surprised when people on the left forget the construction blacklists against trade unionisrs in the 80s and 90s. Or seem to think its good when we do it. What in the blue gently caress are you on about? On what planet is a mass Twitter blocking tool even in any way comparable to a "mccarthyism blacklist"? What the gently caress even is a "mccarthyism blacklist"? quote:This is another point I'd like to make. Randi Harper is someone you don't want to be anywhere near. Ex meth head, pathological liar, $40k owed to irs, runs a paedophile message board and openly admitted to it. Before you say, this has all been known before this little shitfest. It's funny how the infamous 15mins of internet fame all came out the woodwork for this. Even if any of this were true (I'd like to see a source, preferably one more credible than Breitbart, if you please), what the gently caress does any of it have to do with gaming journalism? Randi Harper is many things, but she is not a games journalist, or a journalist at all. Hell, she isn't even an indie dev, or even remotely involved in the gaming industry whatsoever! If GamerGate is about ethics in gaming journalism, then what would any of this matter in even the slightest regard? Fluo posted:Good example, Arthur Chu former nazi, all round idiot. When he was AGG people would fall over themselves defending him. When he switched they brought up the same poo poo people did when he was on their side. Are you aware that Arthur Chu and Ian Miles Cheong are two different people? You are aware that more than one asian man exists, yes?
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Jul 9, 2015 10:30
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Fluo posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZLjm2w8RfE I am loving holding you to task here. What the gently caress is a "mccarthyism blacklist" and what does it have to do with blocking annoying people on Twitter? What is a credible source for Randi Harper operating a pedophilia board? Are you aware that Ian Miles Cheong and Arthur Chu are different people, and that while you contend that they're both nazis, only one of them "flipped sides", and it wasn't the one that you named? And what the gently caress does any of this have to do with ethics in gaming journalism?
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Jul 9, 2015 19:39
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Fluo posted:You could have saved yourself 30 seconds by clicking the video I posted You know the really ironic thing about gullible people is how hard it is to convince them that they're gullible.
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Jul 9, 2015 20:24
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NutritiousSnack posted:I saw it and the other bullshit she posted. From "confusing" the MDE comedy guy saying Wu tried to snipe him to "It totally was a spam thread", to the police politing saying she lied and never reported threats the idea she has any credibility is hilarious. Serf posted:Do you have some evidence that the police actually said she never contacted them?
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Jul 9, 2015 23:29
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This is why no one takes self-proclaimed GamerGate "neutrals" at their word. They repeat every GG party line as gospel, never substantiate any claims made this way, and then immediately fall back on "I make fun of both sides, honest!" when called on their interminable bullshit.
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Jul 9, 2015 23:32
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NutritiousSnack posted:http://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/blog/2015/05/gamergate-in-columbus-threat-reports-initially.html?ana=twt quote:Wu told me her staff had filed a complaint with authorities in Ohio, but it appears it went to the wrong agency. She successfully reached the intake desk at the office of Columbus City Attorney Rick Pfeiffer on Friday and submitted her evidence. You should actually read these things sometimes.
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Jul 9, 2015 23:38
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NutritiousSnack posted:Please prove that all of GG is in a way that excludes feminist groups without a lot weird double standards and arguments relating over pedantic definition of words. GG's genesis is rooted in harassment of women. Literally the very first tweet under the GamerGate hashtag was a video slandering her for false allegations about her sex life. That's where it all began. Any underlying ideology co-opted afterwards does not alter this very fundamental truth about GamerGate's origins. Everyone who jumped on board did so under a banner whose beginnings were "hey, look at this evil female sexhaver, let's get her!"
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Jul 9, 2015 23:46
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NutritiousSnack posted:I did. Her doing so at a much later date doesn't change that fact she lied about contacting police. quote:Law enforcement overall is failing her, Wu said. She’s pleaded with local authorities, the FBI and Department of Homeland Security, but no one has ever been charged. In April, the FBI said it couldn’t use evidence she’d been sending agents for months unless it was transferred to a hard drive. When she did so and mailed it, agents returned it without comment. whoa look at that you're still full of poo poo Her mistake here, if you actually read the article, was naming the wrong party responsible for inaction/lack of response. She absolutely was in contact with authorities far prior to this incident. Your own source confirms this.
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Jul 9, 2015 23:48
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NutritiousSnack posted:She admitted all things in that Internet Aristocrat video, Did she now. I guess the evidence of that is filed right next to the portfolio on Arthur Chu's widely acknowledged nazi activity between 2011 and 2014. quote:Then Quinn did something dumb and tried to stop discussion on it rather than let idiots gossip, which lead GG writing a bunch of conspiracy theories about her involvement in this. Gosh, when you put it that way, GG's origins seem perfectly noble and not at all rooted in irrational hatred!
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Jul 9, 2015 23:59
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NutritiousSnack posted:It's also vastly different from the account you spiel and why GG "neutrals" take GG word as often as yours. Because you'll defend Wu taking an MDE comedy act seriously or lying to police...but telling them later as "truth" Except that wasn't what you accused her of, you claimed she never spoke to police, and the article you cited to support this claim specifically mentions that not only did she go to the police but she also went to the DA's office and the FBI. I'm not defending her lying to police, mostly because she didn't, and the article YOU provided as evidence that she did proves it. But your ego is too damned important to you to even consider that maybe you got a thing wrong that you'll never see this.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:29
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Oops, she didn't go to the DA's office, she went to the Department of Homeland Security. My bad. See that? That's what "owning up to inaccurate poo poo you say" looks like.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:34
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NutritiousSnack posted:I claimed she lied about going forward to the police over her death threats, saying she never did. She didn't. She went months afterward, waiting until the first articles hit mentioning she never contacted the police, after the DA get snippy about her being an idiot. Something Breithart, Popehat, and anyone with two brain cells can see for what it is if they aren't looking at things from a political angle. Okay, but get this: The link you showed definitively proves that she spoke to police, the FBI, and the DHS about the threats. Your claim, that she didn't go to the police, is FALSE, according to YOUR source. O__O posted:I want evidence to back up your claims. Her saying it is not good enough. Please provide copies of the reports and a 3rd party who can legitimate them. If you can't do this you're a lying piece of poo poo who needs to loving kill yourself. Why, just ask my good pal NutritiousSnack, as the link they posted suits this need precisely!
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Jul 10, 2015 00:53
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Maybe you missed this because it was at the bottom of the last page so here it is again, just in case you missed it:Plom Bar posted:
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Jul 10, 2015 00:55
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O__O posted:That source just quotes her; the person he is accusing of being a liar. no it doesn't learn to read also hahahaha of course it ended up on the bottom of that page too
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Jul 10, 2015 01:02
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O__O posted:You're right. It also quotes the DA who says he never heard from her. So then, the claim "Brianna Wu lied to the police" is false, as is "Brianna Wu lied about reporting threats to the police". Maybe if you'd paid more attention in that English 103 class you'd have picked up some reading comprehension.
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Jul 10, 2015 01:12
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O__O posted:No. the DA the man who reports would go to and who has no reason to lie in this situation, said he received no notification of such reports or an open case. So the only person you are gleaning this info from is Brianna Wu the primary source (other than the DA) for the author of the article and also the person who's reputation is in question. The article explicitly says she spoke to local authorities, feds, and DHS. Notice that when describing these events, the language is definitive. It doesn't say "allegedly" or "reportedly" or anything suggesting that this: quote:She’s pleaded with local authorities, the FBI and Department of Homeland Security, but no one has ever been charged. In April, the FBI said it couldn’t use evidence she’d been sending agents for months unless it was transferred to a hard drive. When she did so and mailed it, agents returned it without comment. Learn. To. Read.
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Jul 10, 2015 01:18
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O__O posted:The FBI wouldn't say "we returned a hardrive without any comment." This is all obviously info Wu told the author. Just because the author of an article writes something doesn't make it true. Also, If he spoke to anyone from the mentioned law enforcement branches he would have said "fbi spokesman said..." in order to give the article more legitimacy. You're done. Sit down kid. Do you actually have a law degree? Because you of all people should know that wording in pieces of writing such as this makes all the difference. Why would the author suddenly stop using speculative language for that one paragraph when they were very diligent about its use for the rest of it? And if the article's veracity is impossible to determine, then we're back at square one, which is: "Prove that Brianna Wu lied about reporting abuse to police". Remember, that article was used to support YOUR side. Not mine. The fact that it did exactly the opposite was just a fun little bonus for me.
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Jul 10, 2015 01:31
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That fucker's videos keep showing up in my recommendations if I so much as glance at an episode of PBS Idea Channel. Even after blocking his channel. Ethics in YouTube recommendation algorithms.
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Jul 10, 2015 23:22
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Germstore posted:That's an awfully razor thin distinction. If you're looking for justification to paint Sarkeesian as an Enemy of Art, I suppose it would be.
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Jul 11, 2015 02:31
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Germstore posted:Or perhaps just as a haver-of-bad-opinions. To borrow a catchphrase from today's youth, where is the lie in those tweets?
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Jul 11, 2015 02:34
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Germstore posted:The operative word is 'opinions'. You will notice I have not said her tweets should be banned, just that she should be embarrassed by them Right. And I'm asking you why. Why should she be embarrassed by them? What is so wrong about them, divorced from your belief that she's actively calling for the banning of the trope?
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Jul 11, 2015 02:39
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Like, it's actually a huge leap between "I don't like this thing, here's why" and "no one should ever make this thing because I say so".
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Jul 11, 2015 02:41
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Germstore posted:Wow. How is wanting people to stop doing a thing the same as calling for its ban? Fine. Ignore that last clause, then. What about the opinions expressed in those tweets is so wrong?
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Jul 11, 2015 02:51
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Uncle Wemus posted:Would you remove the camp from drag queens? ....yes, actually.
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Jul 11, 2015 03:02
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Wanderer posted:I wouldn't call Bayonetta misogynistic so much as having weaponized her own sexualization. I take considerable amount of issue with this viewpoint as well, actually. Created things do not have agency outside of their creator's whims. A writer/character designer can create a character that has agency within the universe they inhabit, but at the end of the day the character serves the needs and desires of the creator above all else. "I created this sexy librarian whose superpowers are to turn her hair, that is also her clothes, into hellbeasts to defeat her enemies, so that she literally has to remove her clothing to win fights " is...really reminiscent of the last panel of Kate Beaton's Strong Female Characters comic. She weaponized her sexualization because her creator had such in mind when creating her. And I will postface this by saying that I absolutely adore both games.
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Jul 11, 2015 03:10
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Uncle Wemus posted:That always seemed like such an odd complaint but I'm not sure why. Sure, but let's not kid ourselves into thinking that just because she's not as bad as the worst examples out there that she doesn't also have issues of her own.
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Jul 11, 2015 03:19
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Wanderer posted:It's an interesting critical discussion when you phrase it like that: at what point, if ever, does sexualization/objectification automatically become misogyny? If a creator has deliberately made a character that is attractive, often naked, and constantly performing a blood-spattered burlesque show for the audience, but who is also self-assured, competent, and fearless, with full agency at all times, what does she wind up as? Well, nothing's perfect and nothing ever will be perfect, obviously. I'm just wary of the line of thought that a character "owning their sexuality" means that the objectification suddenly isn't objectification. It smacks of the writers of Power Girl coming up with canonical explanations that the Boob Window is actually symbolic of her struggle with her internal demons and is actually indicative of how deep and complicated she is.
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Jul 11, 2015 03:38
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