- Golden Bee
- Dec 24, 2009
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I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
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One thing few people consider with frugality: At a certain point, it's easier to earn more than cut more. There's a limit to how much you can drive, eat or wear, and it's often better to have frank salary discussions and get the raise then than sew up the old umbrella.
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Jul 30, 2015 19:23
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- Adbot
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ADBOT LOVES YOU
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May 7, 2024 13:43
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- Oxxidation
- Jul 22, 2007
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They don't "owe" me anything, but personally, I'm making it one of my life's goals to pass on wealth guidance as well as a decent estate to my children and grandchildren because, well, I care about leaving a legacy and knowing my loved ones have the tools to live a good life long after I'm gone.
FWIW my family are poo poo parents and grandparents, so there's a lot of anger there to begin with. They are perfectly fine placing guilt on me with expectations about taking care of them in old age, because they squandered all their lifetime earnings and never invested their money.
Who do you want to be? The grandpa who drank and smoked and watched TV in your parents living room until he died? Or the grandpa who rolled around like a boss and took you on vacations and paid for your college tuition?
Half your posts are about how every action you take in life is haunted by the specters of your deadbeat family and that's hilarious.
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Jul 30, 2015 19:43
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- Cicero
- Dec 17, 2003
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Jumpjet, melta, jumpjet. Repeat for ten minutes or until victory is assured.
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One thing few people consider with frugality: At a certain point, it's easier to earn more than cut more. There's a limit to how much you can drive, eat or wear, and it's often better to have frank salary discussions and get the raise then than sew up the old umbrella.
Anyway, it's not like you can't do both. It's just easier to talk about frugality on the internet because more of it is shared; a lot of job stuff is career-specific.
edit: also, frugality is directly under your control. At most professional jobs, you can't just decide to up your income immediately whenever you feel like it, by, say, taking on more hours. Especially once you've already been in the career for several years, further significant increases can be complicated or very demanding to get. It's not nearly as simple as calling your cable company and canceling.
Cicero fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Jul 30, 2015
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Jul 30, 2015 21:21
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- froglet
- Nov 12, 2009
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You see, the best way to Stop the Boats is a massive swarm of autonomous armed dogs. Strafing a few boats will stop the rest and save many lives in the long term.
You can't make an Omelet without breaking a few eggs. Vote Greens.
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I still think 'the cheapest dad in Ottawa' story is the best example of this. It's one thing to agree with your spouse to use the air conditioning and heating sparingly and to cycle to work, but another to unilaterally force your will on your loved ones.
OTTAWA — An abusive Ottawa father who ruled his home’s finances with a frugality so extreme that he deprived his family of heat, lights, water and sometimes food, has been convicted in a rare criminal harassment and assault case.
The recently convicted man, who moved from Yemen to Ottawa in 1987 to study computer science, would whip his children with a leather belt if they didn’t follow what he called “sensible practices” — a bizarre set of “micro-managing” house rules that tormented his wife for 24 years, and his children for 18.
A recent court ruling lays out the facts of the case, and details the lengths the man went to to save money.
Court was told his wife feared for her life, and that the children had to sneak showers when their abusive father wasn’t home. Their 52-year-old father would only allow each child to use two litres of water, measured by a container in the shower. One litre for washing, one litre for rinsing.
He was so cheap his family testified he’d replace the few light bulbs they had with 40-watt bulbs to keep the hydro bill down. But he wouldn’t budge on the heat. They stopped asking him for permission to turn up the heat years ago. He’d tell them to layer up.
“We froze in the dark,” his wife testified at an Ontario Superior Court trial presided by Justice Charles Hackland.
Though his children ranged in age from 12 to 22, they all had the same bedtime. It was always lights out right after supper, when some of the older boys complained there wasn’t enough on their plate.
The biggest complaints about the lack of food came in 2011 when, court heard, the family began to rebel against their controlling father. The father denied that he was depriving his family of food, but court heard that the grocery bill was $1,000 less a month once he took over the shopping.
The two eldest sons were allowed to get part-time jobs but were not allowed to access their earnings, which were controlled by their father.
He biked to work and his wife biked to the grocery store. Because they had five kids, it meant she had to bike to the grocery store almost every day because there were only so many bags she could lug at one time.
Her husband didn’t want to buy a car because he wanted to save for a home. He scrutinized his wife’s every purchase.
His daughter testified she led a “lonely existence” in her high school years. Because her family didn’t spend money beyond basic needs, the children were already isolated.
The judge noted that the father was a “remarkable” saver, whose frugality ultimately broke up his family.
Incredibly, the father, the sole bread winner at $90,000 a year, managed to save enough money to buy a $210,000 townhouse in the suburbs with cash.
He never used credit cards and he certainly didn’t have cable. The townhome he bought in 2005 had three bedrooms. The four tall boys slept in one bedroom, his daughter had her own room and he and his wife shared the master bedroom. To stress his non-materialistic ways, he slept on a matt on the floor.
They kept the television in the master bedroom and the father decided what and when the children could watch. Another rule was that nobody could watch television if a member of the family was being disciplined, which ranged from beatings, to whippings to the silent treatment.
The judge noted in his guilty decision, dated Jan. 16, that the man’s wife had to sometimes witness the cruel punishments delivered to her two youngest boys.
The judge said that the man’s wife had endured a marriage, and life, that amounted to being the victim of criminal harassment. Some of her children were also deemed victims of harassment and assault.
The Ottawa man was arrested at his workplace in May 2011. He chose not to spend money on a lawyer and has remained in jail ever since.
“I am satisfied that Mrs. H. was forced to endure a thoroughly lonely and deprived existence for many years leading to the separation. She suffered deprivation in the basic amenities of life like heat and showers, spousal inequality, disrespect and minor physical and significant emotional abuse,” Justice Hackland said.
“She endured the heartache of seeing her children being subjected to the accused’s unfortunate and controlling parenting and his discipline methods of the children, which were abusive and unlawful,” the judge ruled.
The judge noted that the accused’s behaviour threatened his wife’s “physical and emotional integrity.”
The judge also complimented the wife for describing her feelings “eloquently.”
In her own words, here is how she described her life:
“It was Hell and we had to get out.”
“Hopeless … you give up.”
“I used to wait for spring … just surviving … sad and hopeless.”
The man is scheduled to be sentenced at the end of January. It is expected that his pre-sentence jail time will be considered at sentencing.
I think there is a critical difference between being frugal and cheap. I knew a guy who would suggest our social group did rounds at the pub and would mysteriously have to go or be absent for his turn... every single time. Perhaps he did save a few dollars that way, but after a while people wised up and stopped inviting him places. Then he wondered why he had no friends!
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Aug 1, 2015 16:48
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- Pittsburgh Lambic
- Feb 16, 2011
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That sounds like the pro strat for Papers, Please.
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Aug 1, 2015 18:08
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- TLG James
- Jun 5, 2000
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Questing ain't easy
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Every time someone mentions MMM, I read and see if there's any useful information to me.
Here's where I lost him:
Welp. Sorry. I keep my house at 68 and I'll eat the three months of high electric bills to do it.
Too Good With Money: Giving your infants heat stroke.
Yeah, good thing that no one has ever raised a child in history without having AC.
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Aug 3, 2015 03:06
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- Adbot
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ADBOT LOVES YOU
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May 7, 2024 13:43
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- Ghost of Mussolini
- Jun 26, 2011
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68 is 20 Celsius haha Anglo-Saxon chat itt. Of all the things to get angry at Mr. Money Mustache, the fact that he and his family can tolerate a bit of heat is not one of them.
The best bit about deadbeat dad was how on top of everything else, he saved money on getting a lawyer.
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Aug 6, 2015 22:12
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Jul 30, 2015 19:23
