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So I finished the story last night and I have been mulling over it for all of today. I still need to get all my thoughts in order but it really ended up being disappointing. You can't fault the gameplay, although permanently losing Quiet and the limited number of Subsistence missions are both really fuckimg lame. The story is basically a mess, though. I can dig the twist, kinda. I dislike it because it's aping MGS2's infinitely more interesting discussion of the player/character relationship but it could still have worked if they did more with it. As it is, the game dumps it on you really clumsily ("SURPRISE, now play through the railroaded prologue again so you can get frustrated and also see the entirety of the real Big Boss' role in the story) and it.... doesn't matter. It doesn't add anything to the game except to cheapen the entire experience. This game was touted as the fall of Big Boss as he becomes the tyrannical nuclear warlord from MG1 and MG2 but it's not. Because the focus is on Venom, Big Boss' transformation either happened off screen or has yet to happen. The game ends basically in the same place as Peace Walker, with Big Boss creating Outer Heaven (but for totally real this time, guys) again. With this in mind, I'll echo others and ask if this story even needed to be told. Not even Venom is monstrous. He doesn't even do anything evil in this game (relatively speaking, he kills and abducts people and is a warmongerer by virtue of his profession). The only monsters in this story are Skull Face and loving Huey of all people. Even Miller seems more overtly malevolent than Venom. I've seen people pointing out that Big Boss manipulating Venom like he did is proof of his villainy but I'm not sure if the game supports that interpretation since Venom is cool with being turned into Big Boss (side note: I made my avatar a white guy but loving lol if you made your guy one of the big burly black dudes with tattoos on their faces and got to see the characters perform the reverseof the race-reassignment surgery from Tropic Thunder) and they don't really explore the interesting conflict that would arise from having your identity taken from you beyond the implications of the mirror smash. The weird thing is that Venom is basically the same as Skull Face in that his life and face were stripped away so you'd think the conclusion almost writes itself. Surely, the thematic endpoint of the game about revenge is Venom trying to take revenge on Big Boss, becoming the Skull Face to Big Boss' Zero. That would've been a cool loving ending. But any ending would be better because we didn't even get one. Quiet's story ends and the second credits play and then the Truth happens and that's it. That should've marked the beginning of Chapter 3, which should've dealt with Eli and also shown more of the real Big Boss. You could've had a nice interplay between Eli and Venom, as they were both molded into Big Boss against their will. gently caress it, have them team up to kill Big Boss and you get to play as Big Boss to take them down. In short, I don't think the story lived up to the hype of being the last Metal Gear game, nor do I think it adequetely closed the loop. Earlier in the thread someone mentioned that the conflict between Big Boss and Zero/the Patriots, which is central to the modern story, is completely absent and they're completely right. We got some really weak explanations toward explaining things like Miller being in Foxhound and hating Big Boss but it seemed like the story almost conciously avoided addressing what seem to be some of the big questions in the series in favour of an independent story about The trailers (all of which are amazing) are basically better than the actual story in the game. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 15:08 on Sep 6, 2015 |
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Sep 6, 2015 15:01
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Panzeh posted:The game does get way harder- cameras with guns show up, guards start shooting fultons(though you get the fulton portal that just trivializes things), guards call the alarm when they see sleeping brethren later on and carry better weapons and more rockets. Speaking of cameras, one thing that struck me was how rare surveillance cameras were. I think they only show up in actual missions and, because they're only in bases, I think I saw less than five throughout the entire game.
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Sep 6, 2015 16:57
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lovely Wizard posted:Wait, so was the story reason for Quiet not using the sterilize the user but make the parasite a female poo poo treatment from the wolbachia explained? I'm keeping Quiet alive by keeping her buddy rank low (and will use the butterfly emblem when needed), so I'm not sure if there's a reason where it's explained. Code Talker says she avoided the treatment because she still maintains a desire for vengeance against Venom that she kinda maybe wants to act on possibly. It's not a good justification.
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Sep 6, 2015 17:29
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Even in the original mission, I could never get the supply drop strategy to work. She always moved out of the way. For extreme, I just spawned a tank and hosed her up from the confines of my steel sanctuary.
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Sep 7, 2015 06:45
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I miss Quiet so goddamn much whenever a loving gunship shows up. No more grenade ricochet is turning each encounter into a slog. Gunships have ridiculously high health to the point where it takes twelve (TWELVE!) shots from my partially upgraded Killer Bee to take one down, which I don't make a habit if carrying around because of the cost and because it negatively impacts your stealth.
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Sep 7, 2015 18:01
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Grizzled Patriarch posted:
Never needed launchers until endgame because they don't fit my playstyle. which is primarily non-lethal. For all the side ops, I either stole the tanks and armoured vehicles or used C4. For Sahelanthropus, I used the killer bee in moderation and the nearby tanks and armoured vehicles to destroy it without much difficulty. It's only choppers that really screwed me up because there's no way to take them down but to destroy them (that I know of, I don't think you can kill the pilot). However, as I said, Quiet's grenade ricochet saw me through most encounters but now she's gone and some of the later side ops introduce choppers that are ungodly powerful (specifically, 108 was the one that took twelve missiles and a fair share of spray from my assault rifle). I'll keep an eye for the other launcher though. I think I'm going to need it.
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Sep 7, 2015 20:29
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How the hell you are people at the end of the game without upgrading your rocket launchers / trying new ones? Did you just rush through the story without ever dipping into the entire development aspect of the game?
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Funky Valentine posted:Good thing I had the foresight to name my avatar Jack. I named mine John, which still looks ridiculous on a passport since there was no last name. The annoying thing is, if you put two names, it would screw up the message written on the back of the photograph where Big Boss is like "Dear [NAME]. You're Pretty Good, Love Vic Boss" because it makes it laughably impersonal as if Big Boss gives one to every single MSF member and just switches the name around.
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Sep 7, 2015 23:46
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Ekusukariba posted:The only dlc I want is Quiet back dlc I want a Chapter 3 DLC, Quiet returns DLC (not a story thing, that was wrapped up about as well as you could possibly expect it to be, just give me back her as a buddy), and an Outer Heaven epilogue. If the end of Truth that is meant to be Venom languishing before a mirror as Solid Snake wrecks his poo poo, show it in more depth. Or just put Venom in the same room as Big Boss so Venom can be justified as a character and we can start to address some of that Skull Face transformation that was hinted at but never amounted to anything. This is of course all fantasy because there won't be any story DLC because, unless it is just restoring cut content, I find it difficult to believe they could bring Keifer back . I will gladly be proven wrong.
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Sep 8, 2015 04:44
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DaveKap posted:I'm confused. What is the monologue? I can't tell if you're kidding but Snake's scar was a fake. It was a jigsaw that he could use to escape if he ever got captured. He uses it to escape from jail after being tortured by Strangelove (if you didn't nab her keycard in the QTE).
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Sep 8, 2015 05:04
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I really like the language component of the story and, although parasites did just become proto-nanomachines, sacrificing the vocal cord parasites would mean getting rid of the Quarantine section and the Kikongo puzzle, which was excellent and made me feel very smart when I figured out even if it wasn't that hard (and also that having to manually go through your guys and pick out all of the Kikongo speakers was pretty annoying), so I'd object to their exclusion. As for the Man on Fire, I liked it but it would have been better if, rather than being the actual angry revenant of Volgin, Big Boss saw visions and fought iterations of many of his former comrades and villains. That's what I expected from the trailers and I think it would be really interesting because they say that Venom will have hallucinations but it doesn't come up all that much, outside of Paz and the brief appearance of Skull Face's ghost - sorry - phantom. Their demonic appearances can be attributed to the fact that Venom had memories of them implanted in his psyche, so they're distorted by the freaky hypnosis that he underwent and the piece of metal sticking out his brain. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 06:11 on Sep 8, 2015 |
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Sep 8, 2015 05:57
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Hm, so if you beat Mission 40 (the extreme version of the Quiet boss battle) and bring her back to Mother Base, she shows up back in your brig but isn't in her cell on the Medical Platform and you can't select her as a buddy. gently caress, if only you could replay every Side Ops. I'd just replay that psuedo-mission where Ocelot's like "she's a weird plant woman, you should be her buddy" again and I bet that would retrigger her buddy status. On the subject, it's bullshit that you can't replay every Side Ops, especially the yellow ones, and can only select the few the game decides you get to replay. I've beaten all the Side Ops, so unless there's some other method of making them available again, it looks like you're limited to only playing 23 of them. 23 out of 157. 7 of which are those lovely target practice missions on Mother Base.
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Sep 8, 2015 11:05
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Nakar posted:The best part about MGS5 cutscenes is they do Skull Face's WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!? line at the end of Mission 30 and then immediately at the start of Mission 31, because they knew you wanted to see that again. In a similar vein, I loving love that one of the few flashbacks to GZ was "THEY PLAYED US LIKE A drat FIDDLE!".
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Sep 8, 2015 20:50
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Yeah, Huey executing Skull Face and then raising his arms in triumph while he screams "REVENGE!" is great for showcasing how meaningless and ridiculous it is. Although the really cool part where Venom and Miller are replaced with GZ era Big Boss and Miller selves loses its poignancy considering the ending twist.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:57
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DasKuend posted:Serious question (im just not gud at engrish), is it just my imagination or is kojima (in case he made that game) a somewhat disgusting women debasing weirdo. how he portraits women compared to men in his games and then also the children in ttp It's your imagination.
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Sep 8, 2015 23:32
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OhGreatAGinger posted:Okay, so last time I asked this I tried to be funny and it didn't really work out, and like, everybody got mad at me and this one guy, like, said I was a retard, which kinda hurt my feelings, because, you know, I do have a bachelor's degree, and I don't like to think that they gave to me out of sympathy or anything, I mean, you know, I think I'm a pretty okay guy when it comes to thinking and stuff, and then he compared MGSV to Citizen Kane or something, I don't know, I was out jogging... - Cipher revived the parasite by genetically engineering a descendant of the original parasite to restore it to life. - Yes, Venom is the Big Boss in MG1. The Medic was only introduced in Ground Zeroes, but functionally he is supposed to be one of guys you recruit in Peace Walker. - In the unfinished Chapter 51, Sahelanthropus was recovered by Diamond Dogs. It's resemblance to REX can be chalked up to Otacon unwittingly copying its design from when he piloted it as a kid, or Liquid influencing REX's deisgn, or who knows. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Sep 9, 2015 |
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Sep 9, 2015 01:56
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Kojima just posted this. 9/11. I want to believe.
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Sep 10, 2015 02:34
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Oxxidation posted:The desperation here is reminding of Indoctrination Theory all over again. On the subject though, the fan backlash from Mass Effect 3's ending was strong enough to get Bioware to offer a free DLC that greatly improved the ending, not by changing it but by adding to it, so there's precedent that if the controversy surrounding MGSV grows enough we may see so. Not likely, given the particular companies involved but you never know. Grizzled Patriarch posted:And apparently someone already traced the source back to an audio design company in Sweden Joakim "Venom" Mogren is preparing to rebel against his memetic clone. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 06:08 on Sep 10, 2015 |
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Sep 10, 2015 06:06
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Ocelot like the rain too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87YXRvfMDlM
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Sep 11, 2015 01:09
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Nakar posted:How are you even supposed to do 45's "extract all vehicles" objective legit? If you're visible they just shoot you to death and they're on sand dunes so it's impossible to have any cover, and they come in from out of bounds so you can't really get behind them. I got the S rank just spamming missiles at them and used Stealth Camo for the extractions but that can't be the way they meant for you to do it. Is there some way to force drivers out of vehicles I'm unaware of? I tried gas mines and electromagnetic mines and the former does nothing while the latter just stops the vehicle, the guy manning it doesn't get out and can even still spot you. The answer is a combination of memorizing the order and location the vehicles appear in and being really loving creative with cover (that is, memorize all of the necessary obstacles and terrain that can block attacks and try to use the vehicle you're trying to extract as cover from the other vehicles as you attach the fulton). On the my first playthrough I had to extract all of them because I straight up didn't have the adequate firepower to actually destroy any of the tanks. I don't want to say how long it took or how many times I died, but I have a really good idea about the spawn patterns and the little ridges and hills that can provide temporary cover while out in the open. I've since learned, following the loving nightmare that was my first playthrough, that using the Parasite Suit's armour function makes things a lot easier (though not easy by any stretch of the imagination). Despite what the description says , it doesn't affect your rank (only the camo function does, mist and armour are both fine). At the Parasite armour's max level, the vehicles' machine gun chews through it pretty quickly but it will give you enough defense to run straight at a vehicle and extract it, so long as you're minimizing the amount you're being hit (that is, don't let multiple vehicles fire at you at once and be quick). It can even tank rockets, though it will knock you down. Resupplies for it are constantly dropped as long as you're using your rocket ammo to murder the infantry that accompany the vehicles, so keep an eye out for where they are and blow them up when you have a free moment. Quiet can handle the rest. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 09:49 on Sep 11, 2015 |
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Sep 11, 2015 09:46
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Sex Tragedy posted:Some theorize big boss is giving venom the same kind of mission to die that the boss got. Then venom decides to give snake the bad intel from the other frequency. The best interpretation of the ending that I saw is that Big Boss is giving Venom the order that he needs to die and Venom decides that he'll do it but his final gently caress you to Big Boss will be to reveal himself to Solid Snake, who only sees Big Boss (despite the shrapnel horn and the robot arm and the too-youthful appearance [?]), linking Big Boss to the Outer Heaven Uprising and forcing him to go underground. I like it the interpretation but I'm not sure it can be defended. Shame we didn't get any of that in the game. I maintain that the game should have had Venom trying to take revenge on Big Boss and that the twist, which works but isn't used effectively in my opinion, should have been used to allow the player to channel their frustration and betrayal at being lied to into hating Big Boss the character. However, because the game just ends immediately after The Truth and there is very little catharsis to be had, people just channeled their frustration and betrayal into hating the game itself.
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Sep 11, 2015 10:21
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Moartoast posted:This is probably not the case, since by all accounts it seems established that Venom really does look like Big Boss to everyone, and only those who know about his life before the surgery know he's not BB. I mean that, if the ending cutscene is supposed to take place in 1995, Venom still looks like his 1984 self rather than what Big Boss should look like in his 60s (trenchcoat, grey hair, etc.) Perhaps chalk it up to the failing of plastic surgery but it's still weird that he hasn't aged at all (and that Solid Snake was still able to confuse the two despite the fact that Venom, at that point, must look completely different to Big Boss).
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Sep 11, 2015 10:58
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Imagine if the address on Big Boss' new passport said Silent Hill. Now that would be a sequel hook.
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Sep 11, 2015 11:17
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I think the actual track that plays during the ending, including the mirror punch, is this one: https://youtu.be/83jWwQfK-f8?t=1h51m47s The mirror punch theme begins around 01:55:00. According to the video, it is called "Fortress" but that may not be right because other songs are listed out of order in the description. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Sep 11, 2015 |
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Sep 11, 2015 19:43
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Intel&Sebastian posted:Speaking of which i only just now discovered i can sell materials. I hit a GMP hard cieling at like 50 mil or something? I just remember a lot pf 0's after 5 and a spending spree. 5 million is the maximum amount of GMP you can have. By end game, you can pretty much coast around that figure by selling your useless resources (Biological Material, Common Metal), which maxes out at 200,000.
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Sep 11, 2015 23:11
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Grizzled Patriarch posted:Like, what the hell do you think a nation of soldiers with no loyalty to any country or ideology are going to be doing all day, exactly? Pooyan.
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Sep 12, 2015 01:06
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Watch Big Boss start a loving war.
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Sep 12, 2015 01:19
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I might be misremembering but wasn't Huey gung-ho about ZEKE having a nuke in PW? Also, I cannot believe that ZEKE wasn't recovered at some point during the game. They went through the effort to recover the broken, gibbering Peace Walker pod by draining Lake Nicaragua but left the fully intact and presumably preserved ZEKE on the sea floor? What a shame. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 04:26 on Sep 12, 2015 |
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Sep 12, 2015 04:23
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Intel&Sebastian posted:I love how zero knocks over what sounds like 20 chairs or tables in the zero/skull face tape. Exclusive footage of Zero.
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Sep 12, 2015 06:11
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ShineDog posted:Also i want the series to close out with the kind of mad explosion of fanservice and madness 4 did. The plot was horrid, but I expect that from mgs. More than that though it was a send off, an actual goodbye to characters I'm invested in for some mad reason. Jesus we even saw meryles horrible wedding. I think that the fact that we know that all of the major characters die and that we know when and how kind of prevents the same kind of montage of endings as MGS4. Big Boss dies, Zero dies, Miller dies, Ocelot dies, Huey dies, Eli dies, Mantis dies. The only one whose fate is unknown is Codetalker but who cares about him.
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Sep 12, 2015 08:12
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Yeah, although I'd clarify and elaborate on each one, Discendo Vox's list all ring true for this game.
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Sep 12, 2015 08:34
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One thing I don't think the game did enough of was illustrating that the whole world was, in fact, after Big Boss. Outside of the one jet sent by Cipher and Mosquito's invasion of Mother Base, Venom was able to build Diamond Dogs without any oppositon and I never got the feeling that they were under constant threat from everyone. It was very much an informed threat, not one that felt serious or at all detrimental after the hopsital prologue. Considering how important it is to motivating Venom's creation in the first place, it seems like it's important to show that Big Boss was being targeted by everyone. The Sovies, the PFs, even the Man on Fire only attacked Venom when he was all up in their poo poo. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 21:49 on Sep 12, 2015 |
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Sep 12, 2015 21:46
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The FOB invasions are chalked up to attacks from rival PFs though. They're after Diamond Dogs, not Big Boss specifically.
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Sep 12, 2015 22:11
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ImpAtom posted:That isn't what they said at all. XOF didn't secretly complete the mission. They cleaned up afterwards. That was their point, they were a quiet support team. I have it on good authority that Skull Face personally delivered the Croc Cap for Snake to find.
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Sep 12, 2015 22:13
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Sep 13, 2015 00:57
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lovely Wizard posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2E17aKPp_o "A Nice White Male". What are those names, the dev team? Also, Venom and Diamond Dogs are so benevolent that they achieved total nuclear disarmament. They are truly the moral vanguards that we should all aspire towards. ZenVulgarity posted:Snake sitting there like a loving chump and not saying a god drat word during Skull Face's monologue was loving stupid Venom says literally one line to Skull Face in the entire game and that's "There were three. Where's the other?" Based on his taciturnity, I think its canon that Venom must hav just played with his iDroid for the duration of the car ride, paying only half his attention while he spent money on clothes and toys for his army.
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Sep 13, 2015 04:40
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ImpAtom posted:Yeah, I'm not accepting "this random contextless cutscene someone dug out of the game files which directly contradicts every other game in the series" as canon, sorry. Neither should you because you don't even have the minimal context of Episode 51 for it. I'm like 90% sure in the original MSX games, nuclear weapons were disposed of for the most part (although the Cold War continued), which is why Outer Heaven and Zanzibar Land were such crises because they were effectively the only nuclear powers. Ordinarily, I would say ignore everything but the biggest story beats of the original games but MGSV went through such effort to maintain the connections to first two games (what with Big Boss' phantom, Miller being in FOXHOUND, Madnar joining Diamong Dogs, etc) and now with this cutscene, I don't think you can say it contradicts every other game in the series. By MGS1 nukes were back of course, but there may well have been a period of (near-total) nuclear disarmament in the Metal Gear canon.
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Sep 13, 2015 07:25
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Nuclear weapons taken from disposal sites, according to the intro of MG2.
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Sep 13, 2015 07:29
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Full Battle Rattle posted:Now that I've watched that trailer again, you can see how they blind him. It's kind of subtle. Minorkos posted:what trailer
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Sep 13, 2015 17:56
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:FOX.... Briefly, my emblem was FOX DIE and it happened to coincide with Eli's arrival to Mother Base, which worked out really well because there's a moment when Eli takes a long hard look at your emblem and I like to imagine he got a weird sense of Deja Vu.
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Sep 13, 2015 18:40
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Christopher Randolph definitely rose to the occasion. Replaying Hellbound, you can definitely hear the unctuous edge in Huey's voice as he tries to redirect blame and insist that he's still on Venom's side. "One for all and all for one!" You can tell he's just making it up as he goes along.
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Sep 13, 2015 19:14
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