Dragon Ballz megathread: French Goku

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Who is the man?? This poll is closed.
Goku	202	7.09%
Vegeta	279	9.79%
Krillin	208	7.30%
Piccolo or his nameks	212	7.44%
Gohan or Cool Gohan	135	4.74%
Yamcha	90	3.16%
Tien	120	4.21%
Muten Roshi	89	3.12%
Tao Pai Pai	71	2.49%
Frieza	69	2.42%
Cell or an android	86	3.02%
Buu	62	2.18%
Hercule "Mark" Satan	327	11.48%
Videl	90	3.16%
Bulma	104	3.65%
Yajirobe	99	3.47%
Ginyu or other Frieza squad guy	68	2.39%
King kai or another kai	53	1.86%
Chi-Chi	83	2.91%
Goten	43	1.51%
Trunks or Cool Trunks	112	3.93%
Bardock	48	1.68%
Other villain of DB,Z, or GT(please post about it!)	41	1.44%
Uub	42	1.47%
Oolong	90	3.16%
Zamasu	26	0.91%
Total:	1326 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Aurora posted:

Head Chala is better than Rock the Dragon

It's about nostalgia damnit.

# ¿ Sep 16, 2015 07:20

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# ¿ May 4, 2024 13:17

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Guys let's not let our opinions about Piccolo's awesome cape divide us.

# ¿ Dec 8, 2015 15:55

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

reignofevil posted:

I have recently started to want to see a world where Vegeta becomes stronger than Goku and so he re-dedicates his life to being smarter than Gohan.

"I'm going to DEFEAT YOU!... Kakarot's.... Son."

I think the funny part is that Vegeta's always been shown to be pretty smart, I could totally see him going blow for blow against Gohan in academics.

# ¿ Dec 9, 2015 23:49

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

projecthalaxy posted:

Exactly. So if Real Frieza gets to do a thing, why shouldn't Fake Frieza?

Because Fake Freeza wasn't in the manga.

# ¿ Dec 10, 2015 16:56

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

HD DAD posted:

I forgot just how good the episode where Gohan just obliterates all the Cell Jrs is. Especially in the Japanese version where there's almost next to no music as he zips around being loving terrifying.

Word. Gohan going SS2 is definitely the highlight of the entire series for me.

# ¿ Dec 22, 2015 02:00

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Man there's a lot of people itt that need to rewatch original DBZ and not Kai.

# ¿ Dec 29, 2015 01:22

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

I think most people (who didn't grow up with Goku's JP voice) can agree that Goku's granny voice is really weird and really doesn't fit. Like I can understand the nostalgia factor playing in and stuff, but drat.

# ¿ Dec 29, 2015 09:35

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

It kind of amazes me that people think "Goku is a bad dad" is some kind of joke the internet collectively agreed on at some point when it's a loving plot point when Gohan fights Cell.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 01:06

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Namtab posted:

but then he turns out to have been right

I mean he was right in thinking Gohan could pound the bug man. He didn't understand what was holding Gohan back and what issues he was having at all though. He need Piccolo to help him with that. That's why Goku was presented as being wrong in the show.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 01:40

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Again, the "joke" that Goku is a bad dad and Piccolo is better at being a dad isn't a joke at all, it's literally what's said in the Gohan vs Cell fight. That's how it's presented. That's what happened. Goku didn't get his son at all, other people had to help Gohan unlock his power because Goku was helpless in understanding what his son was going through.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 01:42

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Burkion posted:

Hell didn't they have to retcon in the excuse that Goku saw a glimpse of SSJ2 when they were training to make Goku seem less like a dickhead for throwing Gohan to the wolves?

I mean that isn't really a retcon (unless that wasn't in the manga, I don't actually remember). That's just what happened.

Let's not get overzealous in pointing out Goku's flaws.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 01:48

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Burkion posted:

I know it didn't happen in the actual training session. We saw it, in the anime at least, after Goku's already having Gohan fight Cell. I always assumed it was an anime only thing, though if it was in the manga fair point.

I mean yeah but just because something isn't revealed until later doesn't mean that it's a retcon. It's also a technique for building suspense and mystery. See, every time a group of characters come up with a plan and it isn't revealed until the plan has already started.

That said...

Pureauthor posted:

Goku glimpsing SSJ2 in the RoSaT is indeed anime only.

You learn something new every day.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 01:54

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Namtab posted:

Anime only doesn't strictly mean non-canon

I mean yeah, it's more a curiosity that takes second place to Piccolo ragging on Goku for not understanding the first thing about his son.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 01:59

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kild posted:

yeah its hosed up goku lets his son fight the guy that his son wanted to fight the whole time he spent in the time chamber and was stronger than

That isn't what I said. Strawmanning just reflects poorly on you.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 06:03

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

CharlestheHammer posted:

Yeah but eventually they will understand that Goku is a bad dad.

I mean it's not even about whether or not Goku is, objectively, a bad father (as that would be an argument that could go up in flames very fast), it's that the story calls him out on not understanding his son at all, and other characters have to bail him out of it. One is a really long ugly argument about what makes a good father or not (which everyone has an emotional opinion on), and the other is a thing that happens in the story.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 06:35

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kild posted:

They call him a bad father / not understanding gohan when he literally spent a year with Gohan and all Gohan could talk about was how he wasn't gonna be useless anymore standing on the sidelines and wanted to kill cell himself.

So in your scenario where Goku did understand Gohan, why was the problem resolved by 16's head being thrown at Gohan and 16 giving a speech?

EDIT: That last bit was unnecessary, I'm really just trying to impress man, this is part of the canon here I hope this argument goes to die.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 07:02 on Dec 31, 2015

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 06:59

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kild posted:

Because Toriyama is a bad writer? He wanted tension and threw away the previous characterization to achieve it? Same reason Gohan can't even catch an earring.

Who cares if Toriyama is a bad writer ot not. All of this seems like it's desperately trying to ignore the conclusive fact that Goku was called on not understanding his son and by proxy, some bad parenting in the Cell Saga. I don't see why. Arguing with facts is a waste of everyone's time.

Kild posted:

He only gave him icecream and themeparks because he physicall assaulted him out of anger.

I'd say Vegita is definitely a worse parent.

Piccolo depends on how you count that initial training session where he transitioned from being an rear end in a top hat to trying to be a good guy.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 08:55

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kild posted:

Just because he was called out on it doesn't mean its true.

Literally all you have to do is read the reaction panel/reaction shots when all that happens but I think I'm done. I literally just decided to comment on this for once because I thought I could inject some sense into this.

Covok posted:

If Beerus and Champa did the fusion dance, what would that be called?

There is nothing pretty that can come out of this.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 09:27

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Namtab posted:

But can you do better

I mean assuming we get some kyframing lectures with applicable shots we're getting something constructive out of this.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 09:32

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Covok posted:

How could you tell if they failed the fusion? If they came out fat, they'd look like Champa. If they came out too skinny, they'd look like Beerus.

I meant in terms of the name, obviously Beerus and his fusions can only ever be the most elegant man in the multiverse.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 09:52

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Onmi posted:

I posit that Goku is in fact Akira Toriyama, and thus hates Gohan.

Shut the gently caress up about bloodpacts!

... Nah that's actually a good post and I think gets across what Kild and I were arguing about without the unnecessary aggression.

Again, not even gonna try to get into whether or not Goku is objectively a bad dad.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 10:29 on Dec 31, 2015

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 10:26

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kild posted:

Who was being aggressive tho?

Let's just say on my part.

# ¿ Dec 31, 2015 10:36

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Covok posted:

I know everyone was talking about the SU song, I thought the P is for Priceless song at the end was a great "out-of-nowhere" joke/character establishment scene.

"E is for eccentric, just listen to my song."

I half-expected it to be silent like the Imperfect transformation and this was so much better.

Perfect Cell is gonna be a lot of fun for the next 9 episodes.

# ¿ Jan 1, 2016 07:14

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kild posted:

They were suppose to be doing 1 episode a month since the beginning of this year IIRC. So yeah if they actually do the schedule they said it'll be done by end of 2016.

https://twitter.com/KaiserNeko/status/682645237118988292

So yeah this got cemented as a New Years resolution. And we all know how well those are kept.

# ¿ Jan 1, 2016 07:53

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Covok posted:

Well, the originally did Dead Zone as their first, ever abridged Dragonball show, but it was rough. Like, was in need of redoing rough.

The funny thing is, back then, they adamantly refused to do an abridged series of the actual show. Boy, did they change their minds.

They've come a really long way since old Dead Zone and World's Strongest.

# ¿ Jan 1, 2016 23:06

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Covok posted:

Yeah, it's pretty woefully unfunny if you look it up nowadays. Like, it used to be all "internet humor", but they've learned real humor since then.

There's some jokes I can imagine them rehashing in World's Strongest (with much better execution)... Okay I can only think of "all the people stronger than Roshi," but there's gotta be 1 or 2 others.

# ¿ Jan 1, 2016 23:32

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Manatee Cannon posted:

I'm fine with gohan not fighting since that is what he always wanted, but it's a bummer that he sucks so hard every time he tries. even when he shouldn't, like with how his fight with super buu ended

Yeah I'd personally like if Gohan was at least competent when he fought. Helps reinforce the underlying theme of "just because you're good at something doesn't mean you have to like it."

Which also helps the theme of "loving what you do helps" (Goku). Man, really would be stronger. Ah well.

# ¿ Jan 2, 2016 00:03

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Blaze Dragon posted:

If you ask me, it makes more sense than Goku, who has always shown an attachment to freedom. He always sticks to training one person at a time (Gohan, then Uub) and has them live by his rules and not otherwise for it, so I can't imagine him actually teaching more people, or living in a secluded island doing nothing.

In the hypothetical scenario where Krillin has to train a new manga protagonist, I imagine Goku's the one he sends the kid to after the protag has to stop a new world ending threat.

This setup works eerily well.

# ¿ Jan 8, 2016 07:39

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Burkion posted:

It's the most self defeating attack in history.

Look man your point still stands perfectly with the Spirit Bomb defeating a grand total of 1 villain at the very end, you don't have to fudge facts to make this point. And no, I'm not gonna count Omega Shenron. gently caress GT.

In that context, it's especially hilarious how Toei used it to finish just about every fight.

# ¿ Jan 9, 2016 13:16

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

A Steampunk Gent posted:

The Spirit Bomb does gently caress Vegeta up super bad too. Granted it doesn't kill him but it completely wipes him out and leaves him vulnerable enough that Krillin was going to finish him, that's got to count for a half or something

I mean the Spirit Bomb does things to a degree, but it's not the all-powerful finisher Toei made it out to be.

Speaking of, I love the Vegeta fight a lot. It's such a good "we are literally pulling out all the stops to finish this guy and we barely scrape by," filled with teamwork and momentum switches all over the place. It's probably the best constructed fight in DB, although other fights end up better just because of emotional resonance and intensity (Goku vs Freeza, Gohan vs Cell). Goku vs (chuckle) Junior is worthy of a strong mention for being a fantastic end to the original DB and the best constructed 1v1 fight.

# ¿ Jan 9, 2016 13:28

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Elfgames posted:

I just think Chi-Chi got all her tiger mom out with gohan, you're always way less strict on the second kid.

She got her super successful scholar son who's married to a pretty, well-respected and overall fantastic wife, who also happens to be the Strongest In The Universe (kinda, not really). Goten can afford to be a fuckup.

# ¿ Jan 12, 2016 18:21

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Covok posted:

In the end, humans will become so powerful and feared not even the gods of destruction could stand up to their combined might.

Unfortunately, considering that DB kinda shows that numbers don't mean squat compared to your fighting ability, I don't think this part of the plan will work.

Everything but that is aces though.

# ¿ Jan 14, 2016 06:52

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

RickVoid posted:

Honestly, describing Dragonball Z reads like someone's terrible fan-fiction follow-up.

"So in my story it turns out that Goku isn't actually human or a monkey-boy/god or something, he's actually a SPACE ALIEN! And so are Piccolo and Kami, and the Dragonballs are just something that their people can make! Also Goku and Chi Chi have a son despite Goku being an Alien, and their son is super strong and special! And then Goku's brother shows up, and his name is Radish and he tells Goku that his real name is Carrot, and they come from the planet Vegetable because LOL! And then he tells Goku that he was sent to Earth to kill everyone there so that the Vegetable Aliens can sell the planet, but he hit his head when he was little and that made him forget and also is why he's kind of retarded. Piccolo and Goku team up to fight him and then Piccolo kills them both!" Etc, etc, etc.

What I'm hearing about Revenge of F/Battle of the Gods/Super is not making things any better. Which is sad because Jako the Galactic Patrolman (sans the Bardock retcon at the end), shows that Toriyama can still do neat and interesting stories.

"So after winning a tournament Goku has to fight the devil but then the devil spits out an egg and he's really an alien but in order to fight the baby alien he has to be trained by the devil alien's good side."

This is really just Toriyama's writing style, it seems. I agree with Charles

CharlestheHammer posted:

There really isn't enough difference between Dragonball and Z to call one better.

It's an arbitrary split in a continuous story.

# ¿ Jan 18, 2016 08:32

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Pureauthor posted:

I would like to remind you all that this whole shebang started as a severely truncated retelling of Journey to the West

I was actually trying to think at what point DB might seem like "fanfiction" and it probably is right after this point. Toriyama had just cleared his major overarching story arc and then had to come up something, and thus the rest of the series is pretty unconnected sudden story lines held together by an overarching theme based around martial arts.

# ¿ Jan 18, 2016 09:41

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kild posted:

He joins Panties and runs into Tea dressed as Mao Zedong. After finding Invincible Old Man he accepts a marriage proposal from Boobies.

Bulma isn't Panties she's Bloomers get your Toriyama puns right.

I'm about to get owned by another "Japan got a loanword wrong" thing, aren't I?

# ¿ Jan 18, 2016 09:46

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

bobjr posted:

Are you making GBS threads me Buu?

Buu is canonically less educated than Goku. That's actually kind of incredible.

# ¿ Jan 29, 2016 05:44

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Rodyle posted:

Actually thinking about it I wouldn't cut any of them, the buildup with them each chiming in justified all of them.

I would definitely cut the KKK's intro in half though, too long, too on the nose.

Yeah the problem probably isn't the quantity of call outs, it's the length. I would say make it snappier, but in this case all I'd expect is shave off some so it's not a 5 minute joke.

# ¿ Feb 3, 2016 05:27

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Mordaedil posted:

People here just think of their own dads.

Yeah I guess that's the thing, I can easily imagine someone with an actually abusive father looking at the "bad dad" stuff that gets thrown around and get annoyed.

At the same time, that person should probably learn eventually that there's layers and levels because people aren't gonna stop pointing out some of the bad parenting Goku does.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Feb 3, 2016

# ¿ Feb 3, 2016 19:56

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

visceril posted:

Strongest Z-fighter: Gohan*

Did Gohan even abuse senzu beans all that much when he trained. I'm recalling that's mostly on Goku.

# ¿ Feb 5, 2016 07:10

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# ¿ May 4, 2024 13:17

Twiddy: May 17, 2008; To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

"Sorry you won your case in a court of law, but our machines still took you down because they're dumb. No hard feelings, right?"

*I don't actually remember if the case was won in a court of law or if they and youtube came to an understanding, but it kind of amounts to the same thing when pointing out how trash the automated feature is.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 08:40 on Feb 24, 2016

# ¿ Feb 24, 2016 08:37

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