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DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Edit: Never mind.

Content: I thought it was kinda incongruous that Q was actually affected by his depression monster talking about how he was going to have early Alzheimers and a foot face when he clearly remembers already living to an old age without getting it.

Also I love that Elliot calls the fairies the "big bads."

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 10:22 on Feb 17, 2018

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DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



NowonSA posted:

I like that both times this season they leaned into an in-universe device or reason for our perspective to switch between characters Penny was the cause of it, and both times we Saw brief snippets of Eliot in peril in a suitably crazy situation, either fleeing from cannibals or on trial before a marsupial judge.

It's also really stood out to me how much stuff happens between episodes and the audience is just trusted to know what's up. We don't see Penny put himself in a book and get sent to the underworld, it's just poof he's there at the start. After Penny's death we don't see them working out how they're going to stay in touch with him, it's just wham singing fish with the key hung under it. We don't see them putting little number tags on the keys, but there they are. I'm sure I'm missing glaring examples, and I've felt like it's been going on since the start of the show, but those are the ones that jump out at me.

For my taste a little bit too much takes place off-screen, but I wish more shows would follow the Magicians' lead and give characters more agency to further their various goals or even make minor changes to their situations between episodes.

I wasn't expecting the latest faerie development but I totally should have, I just didn't pick up on the clues for whatever reason. It totally makes sense for humans to go after magic by any means necessary, and I have to think snorting magic cocaine is a direct callout to how magicians are addicted to magic and it's just like a drug to many of them. We've seen them be suicidal without it, left with a purposeless life like the Dean, and our main characters are doing all kinds of crazy stuff to bring it back despite ample evidence that it's done way more harm than good.
So much this. Shows that treat their audience like intelligent humans are few and far between. The fact Magicians manages to pull this off is a miracle.

So, hey, how has nobody literally used the phrase "fairy dust" yet? Because as soon as I realized it was ground up fairies (I honestly didn't think to figure it out so it hit me as soon as I saw the fairy's leg was chopped off) I laughed my rear end off. Here's this gruesome scene and I'm laughing because this show's cocaine analogy is... cocaine. Should've known from the start because that's the most on-the-nose clue ever.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Okay I'm confused by three things and thank you to whoever clarifies for me.

- "Okay, the 'not' thing is kinda arch." What does this expression mean?

- Who is it running this test that the joy-junkie was referring to? Or do we just not know yet?

- "Really?" Wait, why is Alice slamming this book into Q's hands? Was his stare at her after she picked up the book a "hey, please give us the book because we can't trust you" stare? Because even for him that was way subtler than usual and I didn't understand it at all until I started skimming this thread just now.

And just for fun, I'm curious if the book's replacement of the letter 's' with 'f' is just a weird old-timey thing (which wouldn't make sense because it still says "seven keys" in the title) or somehow a clue for the next key quest.
Also, side-note, I really disliked how awfully dubbed that singing was. Penny was best singer though.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



I really can't get enough of Fog cursing.

So... this is the second time a character has said some phrase that makes me think I really am officially "too old" because I didn't recognize it and google's got nothing. What the gently caress is "act out" supposed to mean?

Also this episode was so loving good.

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 21:59 on Mar 22, 2018

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



SLOSifl posted:

edit: I jumped in here because the “previously on” made no sense. I’m only halfway through on DVR but alt-Josh just mentioned werewolves. Did they seriously give us an alternative timeline previously-on and if so that is drat good.
I just read this and you reminded me... when the "previously on" played and it was loving all over the rest of the series I was like "how the gently caress is all of this going to be related?" They did such an amazing job of bringing back so many little bits from the series. It makes me wonder: If an episode in the 3+ season of any show requires that much of a spread of "previously on," is it more likely to be an amazing episode?

Also, Q being The Beast was pretty much the best Q. I wish we could've gotten more of that. At least then his hairstyle makes sense.

XboxPants posted:

That's how I had been picturing it, too, but this episode makes me think that it's much worse than that. Some people die? On a cosmic scale, that's a blip, even if the beast killed every human on the planet, which he certainly didn't seem to have any interest in. Hey, natural disasters happen, evil destructive gods exist. The universe would keep going without us.

But 23 was more hosed up than some dead magicians. The entire library was empty, what the hell? And magic is gone, but this time no one even knows why and the quest chain to fix it is broken beyond any conceivable chance of repair. Oh, and by the way, this was all done by the guy that should be fixing things. He's gone full dark side. Even with the beast and Q dead, that universe is gonna take a long rear end time to recover.
This definitely makes me wonder what constitutes the "end" of a timeline. Why is it that Jane Chatwin's death in the timeline we're following means the time cycling is over? Did she somehow not die in all these other ones? Or perhaps she was alive long enough to cast the spell? I also completely forgot/missed the part where anyone was able to remember previous timelines outside of Jane herself since Fog talks about remembering them... but wait, if he remembers, doesn't that mean she hasn't cast the spell yet and is thus alive? Or does Fog remember what happens in the timeline after she casts the spell until he dies? Why does he remember and nobody else?

Yeah, okay, I'm now convinced they actually messed up somewhere in there. Good thing I don't care enough to complain but... yeah, timeline fuckery is hard to keep straight.

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 05:01 on Mar 23, 2018

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Finally watched the latest episode. The very first song in the show, the one that gets cut short... I really wish there was a long version of it. There's something about it that's hooked me hard and it'd make an amazing song on the level of Justice tracks.

Also this show is still loving amazing. How are they pulling this poo poo off? I genuinely felt happy for everyone who got everything and genuinely felt sad for those who lost things. Yeah, even Tick. I'll never figure out how they got me so freakin' invested.

Aexo posted:

Is "the tower at the end of the world" or whatever a nod to the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy?

Am I just making connections that aren't there and reading too deeply into things?
I assumed the reason "the restaurant at the end of the universe" is a joke is because it's just a restaurant and not something grand but I'm not really big on literature so gently caress if I know how original "at the end of the universe" was prior to Hitchhiker's Guide.

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 11:50 on Apr 1, 2018

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



They did mention some stuff about the normal world falling apart and it's entirely possible they even had Penny mention "we had the apocalypse and your world is more messed up" as a way of saying that it's happening because magic failed. It's not Mr Robot levels of messed up, though, so it definitely just feels like bringing back magic is more for selfish reasons than anything else.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



I'm completely lost on this "Janet" thing. Is it a book spoiler to explain it?

I find it kinda nuts how negatively people are reacting to the end of this season. It's like none of you were around for the end of Season 1 or Season 2 when some twist of fate completely fucks everything up. This is par for the course and I'm surprised to find myself as the only person expecting it. You had super-late-game "library wants to use this siphon thing" that the rest of the cast waves off to the point a couple of them don't even remember what it's called. You have the super-late-game "btw there's a monster in the castle and by all means it cannot escape because even the gods can't handle it" in tandem with Calypso mentioning the keys were made "for a time when humans would save the gods" like... how does it not all scream "hey, we're setting up for season 4 so prepare for things to go south at the end here." If anything, realizing that Julia's god powers were given to her specifically so she could spend them making a second set of keys seemed like genius writing to me. I always love well thought out seasons of television that let their characters get to a brink then pull them back in through smart writing. To be honest, I didn't trust that woman who took Julia away and, if anything, was surprised she didn't end up being a surprise bad guy... though I could see it maybe happening next season in a sort of stilted lover kind of way.

Anyway, I will agree that they better kill the amnesia bullshit in under 5 episodes during season 4 or it's gonna be a stinker. That said, nobody expected a season without magic to be as good as Season 3 ended up so I'm willing to give the writers the benefit of the doubt. Good luck!

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Nihonniboku posted:

You answered your own question.
Except I didn't. The thing is, the amnesia ending is still a good ending. The only bad part about it is the expectation that it will somehow make the beginning of Season 4 bad. We haven't seen the beginning of Season 4, so we don't know if it's bad. The ending of Season 3, though, is good. Take into account what I said after that (benefit of the doubt because we though beginning of Season 2 would be bad) and, well, we have no reason to expect the beginning of Season 4 to be bad. Hell, take into account how fun alternate universe characters were and, if anything, the start of Season 4 should be amazing.

So... my actual conclusion is that the ending of Season 3 is really good and Season 4 should be amazing.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Spanish Matlock posted:

Oh poo poo, I forgot that Julia's friend from the alternate universe is still out there, sans mindwipe.
poo poo I forgot that and the fact they couldn't wipe Penny-40. Which means Penny-40 and Whatsherface could team up. The ultimate rear end in a top hat duo.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



I really don't like it when any show has a character who "lives forever" and comments on living forever in a very "it's not all it's cracked up to be" or "it's a curse, not a blessing" kind of way that they hold over normal mortals... and then another character who has the same affliction (vampire, god, whatever) manages to die in a simple way. Like say.. a vampire in a TV show who had a dilemma about biting someone to make them immortal, does it, and then kills them by putting them into direct sunlight. Like, okay, so direct sunlight actually does fully kill you... so why are you talking about living forever like it's something you don't want to do anymore? Go jump in the sun, dumbass.

Although it seems like The Magicians hasn't fallen into this hole yet, they did make it a point that the Librarian never leaves the library and yet we see her at Brakebills talking to Fogg. I can only imagine how much she hated doing that.

Also if Gods are supposed to make worlds... why was Fillory built on top of an already existing world? I'd like to get an answer to this via some sort of God hierarchy chart that explains who Ember and Umber's parents were, who gets to turn the magic on and off, and if Julia was gonna have to co-opt a failed world to make her new one off of. Honestly it still doesn't make sense considering Umber (or Ember? I forget which was which) had Cuba at the ready.

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 09:54 on Apr 9, 2018

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



I forget if they ever explained how dad got magic cancer but if they didn't, I'm sure they'll give him the cancer back next season and have it be some crazy twist who gave it to him and why they're still allowed magic despite the rationing.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



But if magic being turned off - for a specific subset of the universe - means cancer gets turned off, then what does siphoned magic - for a specific subset of the universe - equal? It's... a weird one.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



I'm catching up on the latest season and just hit this and laughed so hard I had to take a screenshot and post for my own posterity.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Finally finished the season. I honestly thought it wrapped up so tightly (as compared to other seasons) that it was the series finale. I cried like a baby. I hated that they went full musical but it just made me cry more so I guess mission accomplished.

So funny how there are so many shows where the jokey suggestion is "I wish they'd just kill off the main character and keep going" (Expanse, Orville, Discovery) and in this one they actually did it and the actor even said they're leaving the show... and they did this just as you came to like him because he stopped being such a poo poo. loving props to that actor for nailing it.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Boris Galerkin posted:

For some reason I thought last season’s ending was the series ending. Was this ever the case or am I just remembering wrong?
I didn't know the show was being renewed when I watched the last episode and it super felt like a series finale so no, you're probably not remembering wrong. The episode, despite leaving a few hints behind as to what the new season could be about, did very much carry the vibe of closing the book on the series.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Loucks posted:

I imagine it felt final to those who need a white dude to identify with.

Not an attack on anyone here necessarily. Those ones will out themselves eventually.
This is a turn in terms of "opinions I've heard about Magicians." Why so dark?

Macdeo Lurjtux posted:

Unless the entire season was shot and wrapped before S4 started airing it wasn’t the case. They announced the renewal before the first episode even aired.
The separation in our line of discussion comes from what is fact vs what the vibe of the episode was. I understand the fact that they were always going to have another season. However, in the heat of the moments of the final episode, if you didn't know that fact then it's easy to construe it as an ending with a few "new beginnings" for everyone involved that could end up leading to a new season but didn't have to. Like, say... if SyFy decided to drop the show despite how popular it was. Y'know... like that other super popular original they had... The Expanse?

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Nihonniboku posted:

Thankfully, the issues with The Expanse don't exist with The Magicians. With the Expanse, SyFy only had first run rights in the US. They didn't have syndication or global distribution rights. They would only make money on advertising the first time around. As it's a very expensive show, it (sadly) made sense for them to cancel it.

Thankfully, none of that is true for The Magicians. Plus, The Magicians is cheaper, so they make a lot more money on that show.
Yeah, I knew about The Expanse's cancellation details but didn't bother to look up (if it's even public) what deal SyFy has with The Magicians, so I have no way of knowing what deal SyFy does have with it. Really, the deal with The Expanse was so weird (sorta like Sony's deal with Marvel about Spiderman) I kinda just don't trust anything to stick around if it's good. Something Firefly fans dealt with a long time ago but as a non-fan of that show, I didn't.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



I just finished Episode 6 and needed to make this for y'all.
https://i.imgur.com/mScz7H9.gifv

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 05:34 on Feb 26, 2020

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Almost caught up! Enjoy this gif!
https://i.imgur.com/VqcY5hm.mp4
Edit:
So I'm caught up. Two things.
1: Is Q's acquiring of that important page anywhere in this show or just a this-season magically appearing macguffin?
2: NEVER LOOK AWAY FROM THE BODY! I mean, come on, they make so many references to other pop culture hits, how do they make this one major mistake?!

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Feb 28, 2020

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Lupus Rufus posted:

obviously to grow the world seed they need to play sburb
:ssh:
And #3: Why can't they just tell Josh they swapped bodies after the spell is over?
And #4: There was so very little post-quest Julia it kinda felt like they cut a scene where she breathes a sigh of relief and goes home. Kinda makes it more obvious the episode would end the way it did.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Khanstant posted:

Also interesting to know Julia is pregnant IRL. I was wondering if that was the case.
Same. As soon as the show mentioned it I thought "oh, I bet she's pregnant in real life" so glad to get confirmation. It definitely seems like something the writers would not have done if they weren't nudged towards it by outside forces. I have no doubt they can handle it well, they've done so drat good with this whole series. I actually look forward to seeing where they go with it, considering most shows don't seem to land the whole "pregnancy as entertainment" thing.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Sloth Life posted:

As sad as it is, I'm really hopeful that many of the cast have bright futures ahead. I am looking forward to seeing where they end up and wishing them well x
Yeah, I'm going to closely follow where the show creators and actors all spread out to. I kinda hope Hale and Summer try to get gigs as a pair, even though that's a major rarity in the business. Their chemistry is just too loving perfect.

Edit: Yeah I actually thought that the S4 finale was the series finale. The little loose threads they left were decent as a "life goes on" sort of thing which I suspect this season will also have.

DaveKap fucked around with this message at 01:23 on Mar 4, 2020

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



muscles like this! posted:

You would have hoped that after the whole thing with Josh two years ago (or however long it was in show time) that they would have learned their lesson in disregarding the feelings of other members of their group.
Yeah it felt kinda stupid they all decided to be shitheels to her all at once in just this episode. Once I realized what was going on I was like "didn't you already do this? twice?" Probably the weirdest/laziest misstep I've seen in the whole series but at least it's isolated to a single episode. I like that their explanation is "if you wanna be treated like a main character, you gotta make main character decisions" though. Decent payoff.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Glad I wasn't alone in thinking it was weak musically but strong everything-else. I honestly thought the usual auto-tuning necessary for the non-singers in the crew would bother me like it did in the first musical episode but instead it was actually purely the fact that the dubbing was really, incredibly poor.

Zelda is loving perfect and her reaction to Elliot talking about the 8th grade is perfect.

https://i.imgur.com/L9sdLoc.gifv

Also I'm in love with Marina. I wish this show could last forever but I'm glad we got as many seasons as we did. Plus, let's face it, this pandemic poo poo probably would've canned the show anyway.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



I thought last season's ending was the series finale. It could have been and I would've been alright with it.

This season's finale? Definitely better as a series finale. I shed a tear when Margo pushed the button. I'll miss you, Magicians; you were a drat loving good show. If we could never get the Wynn Duffy spin-off for Justified, maybe we'll get some kind of spin-off for this with, at least, the same writers.

SO! Now that it's over, I have one question that has been stuck in my head since season... 3? Old Alice. Who the gently caress was that. Why the gently caress was she there. What the gently caress happened?

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DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



After sleeping on it, I do have some issues with the final episode.

Nihonniboku posted:

Also, while I'm glad Eliot got someone in the end, I feel like it was kind of forced in there. It kind of came out of nowhere for me.
This isn't one of them, however, because I kinda got the sense the way Charles was acting toward Elliot that this might be where things lead. I was quite happy with it. Even Hymen walking away then rushing up the stairs at the end made me go "awww.." before laughing hysterically.

I don't know how much of this episode got produced before or after they knew the show was ending. Between the weird way the "we couldn't buy more extras" undead horde entered the scene, the way The Beast just happened to enter The Library exactly where the gang were, and the fact The Beast died to... a pillar falling on him, I get the feeling they knew as they made it but were given too strict of a budget of both time and money.

I read someone suggesting the series was originally supposed to end at the point where the gang summoning the new world disappeared, as a cliffhanger, with the rest of the episode (8 minutes apparently) being tacked on once they realized they were cancelled. I take issue with this idea because after how well the last season ended, I wouldn't expect this series to stoop to cliffhanger endings anymore.

All that said, I still think it was a decent series finale. Especially if you compare it to some series finales that had been planned from the start. Legion, Mr. Robot, and GoT finales were big let downs for me. At least I feel some closure with this one and at least it seems like everyone's getting some well earned chill time.

Imagine a Dean Fogg spin-off that just cycles through a different year of class every season. I could probably come up with a few more good ones but I don't think I can bear the pain knowing that it's all over.

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