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I also had a bit of whiplash at first with names, but I can appreciate a setting that isn't just another derivative, white trash western medieval-based fantasy.
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Jan 6, 2016 07:38
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Darkrenown posted:Sure, the reader can see Kellhus is awful, but everyone in world seems to love him (aside from the Byzantium prince who just seems to hate him because he's so popular) and he's great at everything. Isn't that normal for a mary-sue then? Even Emo-Conan who started out hating him and resisting him falls for him in 2 books or so. Akka gives away his magic-secrets and is still besties with him when he comes back from being tortured and finds him screwing his wife, I didn't get to where Akka sees he's the devil, so it's nice he finally does, but I don't think I'll read any more. Aren't typical Mary Sues loved by the other characters because they're supposedly so inherently benevolent and virtuous, and even written that way by the author? Mary Sues piss me off normally but I find Kelhus tolerable because Bakker writes him as an amoral psycopath. I also personally like the ambiguity of whether Kelhus does something because he's a smart fucker, or because he's off his loving rocker.
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Jan 25, 2016 01:35
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The second trilogy outright makes it plain that a lot of people (of all positions) do not love Kelhus at all. Spoiler about his kids: they're complete monstrosities, that range from mentally unwell to evil as gently caress. Even Kelhus doesn't avoid implications that he's either severely delusional, aligned with the Consult, or even worse.
Corvinus fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Jan 25, 2016 |
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Jan 25, 2016 19:12
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A Wertzone review of The Great Ordeal.quote:Characterisation is, as usual, very strong and Bakker seems to tacitly acknowledge the criticisms he has had in the past with a very limited roster of female characters by increasing the amount of screentime for Serwa, Kellhus's daughter and the most intriguing of the new generation of characters. Mimara's importance also increases dramatically in this volume, as it begins to appear that her Judging Eye may hold the ultimate answer to the questions so many characters hold about the Consult and Kellhus himself. The metaphysics of Earwa which seem to hold - on this world anyway - women as an inferior sex are also better explained and shown to be the fault of men and religious dogma (rather than some kind of deep-seated authorial problem) more explicitly than before. Seems like the last part can't come out fast enough.
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May 30, 2016 07:12
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Collateral posted:Does this series get better? I am halfway through the warrior prophet and the entire book seems to be characters telling other characters how much they absolutely love Kelhus. Like thiiiiiiiiis much. Or crying because other characters are telling them "Nu huh I love Kelhus the mostest." Not every reader realizes that Kelhus is not a good dude. Kelhus gets built up in a Mary Sue-ish way partly as misdirection, and partly to eventually show how super hosed up Dunyain are.
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Jan 18, 2017 23:28
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Collateral posted:I guess this may get answered in later books but the Dunyain don't make a jot of sense. I'm not sure if your post is intentionally obtuse, but the metaphysics of Earwa is: Damnation is literally real, Hell genuinely exists, collective belief is able to shape reality and gods (to limited degrees). The Dunyain are explainable within the setting's rules. Rime posted:It's worth noting that the reader scoffs at Kellhus because we come from an enlightened era where the average reader has probably read about the chemical makeup of star matter and are hardened against manipulation by a lifetime of exposure to advertising and the farce of religious dogma. As such, his methods come across as hammy. Modern understanding of cognition and neurology is not that old. It also strongly contradicts many ancient/classical/medieval beliefs and if you went back in time and told philosophers what we know now, they'd tell you to gently caress off. Corvinus fucked around with this message at 02:12 on Jan 20, 2017 |
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Jan 20, 2017 02:03
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genericnick posted:I'm pretty sure the last part is wrong. Believe doesn't change reality. You're probably right, though I was too vague. The 100 gods didn't always exist and are possibly fragments of the Zero God that took aspects and traits from humans. Then there is the Judging Eye, which shows Mimara the seemly objective fact that females are less than, and subject to, males. I'm assuming this is due to widespread dominance of patriarchal societies, collective belief in male superiority, but I could be wrong.
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Jan 20, 2017 23:08
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Sekenr posted:I only just started reading (now near the end of Warrior-Prophet), initially liked it a lot but what REALLY puts me off is why is everybody so goddamn emotional 100% of the time. There is nearly 0 dialogues when someone isn't hurt by mildly unkind words. Going by HEY GAL's posts in the various iterations of the A/T Military History thread, this is historically realistic.
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Jun 15, 2017 08:25
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Number Ten Cocks posted:So I've only skimmed the final Kellhus parts, but I have questions. While Kellhus is inhumanly competent, he's not infallible. Bakker's AMA confirmed a few things about Kellhus' deficiencies/blind spots and depicting a hyper-competent being that seemingly overcomes all obstacles, only to get unexpectedly shanked (like father, like son), feels thematically appropriate.
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Aug 3, 2017 19:26
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kcroy posted:hey can you link the AMA? https://www.reddit.com/r/Fantasy/comments/6r3hba/unholy_consultation_r_scott_bakker_bares_the_soul/ He's evasive on a lot of answers but some are less so: quote:Q: i get that the gods can't see Kelmomas, but was it possible for Kellhus as a human to unravel the nature of the threat he posed? Given the Yatwer face concealer Sorweel was wearing, it's understandable that Kellhus never understood Sorweel was the WLW and missed the significance of what happened. But was it possible for him to unravel what happened with the other WLW? In other words, did he just never have a chance to figure it out because Kelmomas is outside the outside or can we take it that Kellhus failed because he wasn't looking closely enough at things that were right under his nose. quote:Q: Anyway, here's my barrage of questions: quote:Q: When did Ajokli and Kellhus reach an agreement? Did it ever happen or was Kellhus "ambushed" by Ajokli in the Golden Room (since it is topos it was possible for Ajokli to enter the world). I have a hard time imagining that this was what The Thousandfold Thought was supposed to lead to. If Kellhus made a bargain with Ajokli already at the circumfixion (as some suggest) it seems to me that TTT died with Moenghus and all the plans and The Great Ordeal was really the actions of an avatar of Ajokli, designed to elevate him above all other gods.
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Aug 4, 2017 06:35
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