League of Legends S6: Time + Money - Items = Game!

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Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

I am legitimately the worst kind of player you want to see on your team in solo q.

# ¿ Nov 4, 2017 06:00

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# ¿ May 17, 2024 13:02

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Primetime posted:

Grasp is pretty awful right now too. Played a few Mundo games with it, and the 2% heal isn't nearly enough to keep up with all the new burst in the game, and the permanent 5 hp per duel stacks super slow so by 30 minutes it was worth ~100 hp.

All in I think the Resolve tree either needs a bump up, or the other trees need a bump down. Its not worth getting ~100 hp late game when the other trees are giving hundreds of damage instead.

On the other hand I played a game of Tahm top vs an Urgot and absolutely bodied him. Resolve feels good.

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 06:45

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Also The Ultimate Hat doesn't work on Udyr at all and that makes me really sad.

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 06:47

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Killed By Death posted:

Sort of? The stacking and damage proc parts are separate, so by late game it does quite a bit.

Damage is pretty comparable to Electrocute if you're sitting in lane. For what it's worth:

Electrocute: 50-220(+0.50 bonus AD, +03 AP), 50-25 sec CD. Electrocute gets ~10 damage per level naturally.

Dark Harvest: 40-80 (+0.25 bonus AD, +0.2 AP) + Souls (4 Souls per Cannon Wave, 6 Souls per kill). No CD (need to kill stuff to charge, charges don't last long until you get tons of stacks). Gets about ~2 damage per level naturally.

As far as early game damage goes, you're probably actually better off in lane with Electrocute since it scales better, and has naturally higher base damage that isn't dependent on you killing specific minions and/or getting kills (which means you're ahead anyways).

P.S. Just crushed a Renekton's dreams with Tahm Kench. The huge chunk of bonus starting HP and Grasp/Overgrowth make him much more formidable in top-lane, and his early game damage is respectable for sure. The inspiration get movespeed towards a dude you slow also means landing a single Tongue Lash can result in a crazy favorable trade for you (you will almost certainly get to W). The abundance of AD heavy comps that still plagues solo-Q also favors him.

Also Magical Boots are great.

Mikujin fucked around with this message at 11:04 on Nov 9, 2017

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 11:01

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

For anyone wanting to give Udyr a whirl, the things-to-take are:

Precision (Primary)
- Lethal Tempo
- Triumph
- Legend: Alacrity/Tenacty (depending on enemy comp)
- Coup de Grace

Sorcery (Secondary) {Option 1}
- Celerity
- Waterwalking

Domination (Secondary) {Option 2}
- Cheap Shot
- Relentless Hunter

Start Machete + Bead, get Tiamat then TF >> Sterakk's more fat stuff. Don't finish a jungle item unless you really want to (probably green). Kill all the dudes.

Personally I like Option 1 secondaries better since you want to be the marauder looking for tons of opportunities to murder enemies (and the synergy if you get into battles in the river is nice). Celerity + your passive + bear stance usually means your opening bops on the head also hurt, so life's great. Second option is ok, too, but I feel like it's less effective overall.

Go forth and shred your enemies.

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 21:45

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

Aftershock seems to be the only good resolve keystone right now, so I worry for any future nerfs to it weakening tanks overall.

Grasp will have +100 health on it by 30 minutes if your lucky, also heavily depends on you having a opponent you can get up close to repeatedly, good luck against teemo.
Guardian is for support and has some nice effects, but can go off on it's own with a long cooldown if you don't avoid standing near or healing your adc until your ready to use it, probably good for chasing down people with a coordinated duo.

I've been routinely able to get ~150 HP out of grasp in 20-30 minute games top-side.

The only thing annoying about it right now is that it tracks total damage done, total HP restored, and HP gained rather than a useful number like how much damage it will deal and how much HP it will restore (in addition to HP gained).

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 22:53

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

Not sure what they were thinking with the "free" boot rune compared to the free stopwatch rune.

With one you get -15 movement speed boots only after 10 minutes with -30 sec for every kill that you can upgrade to not-poo poo boots for 250g instead of 300g.

Or you can take stopwatch and sell it for 120g at 6 minutes and use that to buy actual not-poo poo boots or use it towards a 600g discount on items that nearly everyone has a good use for.

You clearly misread magical boots, since the boots you get have +10 MS (which persists through upgraded boots), and then the 50g discount on upgrade cost. So you save 350g and get a permanent +10 MS boost which is another 120g in stats (which isn't really properly quantified since you can't just buy a second pair of boots for more MS).

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 23:01

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Monathin posted:

last patch gave Udyr 200% bonus(?) AD scaling on Tiger Stance so if he catches you in any way he pops tiger form and you're dead

Incorrect. His Q now scales up to 180% total AD ratio (before it was 160%) while simultaneously increasing his base AD growth to 5 per level (from 3.2). His Q does a little bit more per level, but overall does more because he just has more AD at all levels.

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 23:03

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Monathin posted:

yeah okay that'd be the exact reason why, either way it's EXTREMELY stupid and permabanning Udyr is legit

It's like everyone forgot that Udyr's biggest weakness is any slow. You don't need to ban him if you know how to play anyone with an easy-to-apply slow. He wasn't over-performing before the rune updates, and while I don't know how he's doing afterwards I'd be confidant in saying any perceived increase in performance is due to him having solid base stats and a reliable clear regardless of runes - where a ton of other junglers have more specific jungle strats.

For example, Jungle Ekko just plain doesn't work right now unless you enjoy getting bodied by the enemy jungler forever.

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

Yeah, in my defense they don't say in the description the +10 MS is permanent or that slightly magic boots are the same tier as boots of speed and not a tier below.

Would of been better if it said: at 10 minutes -takedown time, you get boots of speed and a permanent +10 movement on your boots and 50g off your future boot upgrade.

It does in the expanded description, which is not the one you see first, which - I agree - is a dumb thing.

:ninja:

Magical Boots are actually a higher tier boots of speed at all stages, which makes them rad as heck on anyone who can afford to wait to get them (most top laners, some highly mobile junglers who are not reliant on right click movement).

# ¿ Nov 9, 2017 23:44

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Slight update from earlier: get blue smite after Tiamat/Boots. Blue Smite actually triggers the start-up time on Tempo so you can blue smite into stun into tempo-speed tiger punches and absolutely shred people. It's great.

# ¿ Nov 10, 2017 02:56

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

40% CDR Tryndamere + Ultimate Hat owns bones.

# ¿ Nov 10, 2017 07:52

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

I did Domination secondary on Warwick because I'm dumb and bad and Celerity will be nutso with him and his passive instead.

Plus obligatory Ultimate Hat, of course.

P.S. Everyone respects the OG Urfwick.

# ¿ Nov 10, 2017 10:50

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Teikanmi posted:

Klepto Udyr can get 5 points in every skill, letting him get to a quasi-level 20. He also never stops proccing bags of gold and can stay on you and doesn't do so much damage that you die before he gets paid as gently caress from slapping you. poo poo is unreal.

Udyr only ever really gets to level 15 because any points in Phoenix are basically dead because it's a poo poo skill for poo poo players and has been since they cratered it.

# ¿ Nov 11, 2017 05:04

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

When you can never do anything right, re-doing the thing is inevitably going to be bad.

# ¿ Nov 11, 2017 21:42

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

As someone who does not play Kayle, I just thought "Hey why not take Tempo Kayle top" and drat it feels busted. Hit Q, they're slowed forever and tempo winds up, hit E, shred them.

Only gets worse as the game goes on.

# ¿ Nov 12, 2017 02:59

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Methanar posted:

https://plays.tv/video/5a08e84c109605b510/worst-quinn-ive-ever-seen

Just play udyr

Shyvana is pretty nuts right now, too. Press the Attack means every gank/fight is auto->Q enjoy bonus damage on everything else. It's been absolutely ridiculous.

# ¿ Nov 13, 2017 03:28

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Methanar posted:

https://plays.tv/video/5a093d0d36e4ccfae5/just-pick-udyr

Sorry about your opinions

Try rounding things out by selling jungle item for Death's Dance (if game goes to full-build time). If you though you were tanking before you basically become an unkillable terror gated only by how much blue juice you've got left in the tank (it's a pretty big tank).

All the better if you're against a magic damage team and you get to build SV.

E: I ended my last game with like 400+ AD because reasons I don't even know. Death's Dance was the only pure AD item purchased, to boot.

# ¿ Nov 13, 2017 12:21

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Rygar201 posted:

Do Celerity + Transcendence over Waterwalking because as an eloquent poster pointed out:

SSJ_naruto_2003 posted:

transcendence is busted

This is of course assuming you're going Tiger not one of the many terrible Phoenix things.

# ¿ Nov 13, 2017 18:43

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Aerox posted:

Also, can't you not pick both of those at the same time because they're in the same row? I can't get them both to lock in on the rune page.

Waterwalking and Transcendence are in the same row; Celerity is in another row on its own. Hence saying Celerity + one of the other two (with preference to one).

Aerox posted:

Q > E > W > R?

Q > E=? W > R

E max first if you are a jungler who has keen map awareness and/or will be ganking frequently and/or the enemy team doesn't have a lot of low CD slows (e.g. Nunu).

W max first if you're learning Udyr, are not going to be trying to slam people constantly, or if the enemy team can peel you easily (in which case durability > limited mobility).

# ¿ Nov 13, 2017 19:01

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Oops I meant Gathering Storm I'm bad.

E: Blame it on me staying up all night to build this stupid 3-stage amp. Annoying as gently caress.

# ¿ Nov 13, 2017 19:18

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

pahuyuth posted:

So taking Arcane Comet on Karthus is immensely satisfying when you ult and the comet flies across the map and gets the kill for ya.

Anyone know if it prioritizes the closest champion or the lowest health one? My guess is the former.

Assuming it operates like Echoes, it prioritizes the nearest champion to Karthus.

underage at the vape shop posted:

is udyr good now

Yes. He was good prior to the big rune shakedown due to changes to his kit (base AD buff, slight tune up on tiger scaling) and the buff to Sterakk's (which pairs well with Triforce, and item you want to get). Press the Attack makes him a very lethal threat as well, since +16% damage on your fast autos and Tiger DoT (plus friends' damage) is a truckload.

Tempo is REALLY fun on him, but it's impractical and you probably won't really get lots of mileage out of it since Udyr already maims targets in a short enough window that by the time Tempo turns on they're either dead, locked down and soon to be dead, or have popped summoners/peeled you off.

Drone_Fragger posted:

I am still 100% convinced grasp on shen is disgustingly busted, and combining that with ultimate hat and (YOU FUCKIN GUESSED IT BOYO) Transcendance lets you be a monster late with a 80 second ulti cooldown.

Also, mundo pressing E with a grasp proc and doing like 800 damage will never not be funny.

Grasp is good on literally anyone who wants to build tanky and relies on auto-attacking people. I've similarly been singing praises for Tahm Kench since you now get to start the game with a huge chunk of HP (if you start D. Shield you walk into lane with like 890 or something dumb), and he makes good use of Grasp's damage and bonus HP. Against melee lane tops I've been routinely able to get between 150-300 HP out of it, which - damage and healing aside - is like 1-2 Ruby Crystals worth of HP a game for free. Approach Velocity also means that if you get hit by Tongue Lash you are almost certainly going to get Devoured unless you've got good disengage.

# ¿ Nov 14, 2017 02:30

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Count Bleck posted:

This was years ago.

Off to a good start.

Worst because I�m an rear end, not because I�m wrong.

# ¿ Nov 14, 2017 20:00

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

I know Methanar has already been singing the praises I gave Udyr but it can't be stressed enough if you're an aggressive jungler:

Play Udyr.

# ¿ Nov 16, 2017 01:16

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Max Coveri posted:

Or you could get Def Not Udyr which is used by all the cool kids.

Hipsters aren't cool.

# ¿ Nov 16, 2017 10:02

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

RealFoxy posted:

This is going to make it into the next season because they're so slow to patch things out, take advantage of that freelo with Shyvana and Udyr when the next season hits. They've traditionally ignored their balance team and shipped out bad patched for years now.

Usually if it hits the front page of Reddit they'll address things, but I think they're still trying to suck people in right now with a priority on the new essence system that this season is going to be broke as gently caress until around March

e: I knew people personally that worked on the balance team that quit because they were over-worked and nobody listened to them anyway so yah

As much as Methanar and I might want you to think Udyr is freelo, he's not. He does come in the top 10 best-performing junglers right now, but not nearly as highly performing as Rammus/Xin/Shyv who are all tearing it up with at or approaching 55% win rates. That said, the new rune system definitely favors traditional attack speed junglers who kick off fast clears into strong ganks (Udyr/Xin) or who can just power-farm even harder (Shyvana). The inherent buffs to Rammus alongside this, as well as Aftershock, are really pushing him over the top as a go-to jungler as well: he gets insanely strong mid-gank thanks to Aftershock + W, and his clear is actually a bit faster now.

# ¿ Nov 18, 2017 09:47

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

RealFoxy posted:

It isn't really a couple gimmick posters, anyone who is either good at Udyr or good at the Udyr playstyle are dominating right now. There's a reason why all of a sudden Trick2G is going heavy on solo queue again, and it's because split pushers are able to get away with their same bullshit they haven't been able to do for two years now and I guess people have just forgotten how to play against them. Doesn't hurt that there's barely any wrong way to build a split-pusher right now and tank junglers aren't bad either.

This is the short form of �aggressive junglers.�

And yes, that is true. Udyr, Xin, Warwick, and Shyv are all great at doing then 2-buff invade plan. Assuming you get the kill and steal at this juncture, as well, you can turn it into a ton of pressure on the opposing jungle, which translates into a lack of enemy jungle pressure on lanes.

As had always been the case, junglers can and do exert a lot of control on the game.

# ¿ Nov 18, 2017 23:41

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# ¿ May 17, 2024 13:02

Mikujin: May 25, 2010; (also a lightning rod)

Could be a stability issue of some sort, since they just took ranked queues down as well.

# ¿ Nov 18, 2017 23:54

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