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Bates
Jun 15, 2006

Paladinus posted:

Yeah, well, when was the last time the American MoD made a statement in Russian? Checkmate.

They don't have to. Yatzy!

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Bates
Jun 15, 2006

A Typical Goon posted:

The same principle applies to European nukes though. If France/the UK nuked Russian armies in Western Europe there goes London/Paris. That's the whole point of a nuclear deterrent.

This whole thread is getting to Clancey for me anyway. Nobody is getting into a hot war with each other, but if it did happen somehow no one would ever use nukes against a nuclear capable foe. It's just too risky and no one wants to be vaporized over loving Ukraine or whatever Clancey scenario that you're imagining.

It is considered rude to bomb civilian targets in response to attacks on military assets. Generally speaking we don't blow up a random house every time a tank gets blowed up - it is not obvious why we would blow up lots of houses if lots of tanks got exploded. Don't use your military if you don't want it to get bombed.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

Brown Moses posted:

They use it in Charlie Brooker's Newswipe as well.

Graham Phillips is saying he was thrown our of Latvia and has been banned from returning for 3 years, so much for his Baltics trip.

I've tried to figure out who this Graham Philips fella is but his Youtube channel is just videos of random eastern Europe road trip scenery or 2 min. interviews with random people. "Woman in a park says Russia might invade Poland!"

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

A Buttery Pastry posted:

The Pope should excommunicate countries.

He does but the bar is too high for anyone to reach.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006
Preserving bodily integrity is an excellent reason.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

steinrokkan posted:

I didn't say I want population to grow. I said you need to be able to defend your policy against the people who hold that view in order to prevail, or you'll be rolled back the way you currently see in AMerica.

If it's ""for the greater good" then the state should pay people to have children rather than force people to carry unwanted babies to term. Setting up a lottery where people will randomly be assigned community service because we prefer to not pay for the work to be done is arbitrary, unjust and lazy.

edit: vvv I never claimed it was an argument against your position - I'm describing "the defense against the people who hold that view", to use your own words.

Bates fucked around with this message at 01:27 on Apr 3, 2016

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

Arglebargle III posted:

To be fair a bunch of European leaders visited Kiev to show support for the protests and it was a huge PR blunder and gift to the Russians/Donbass Reverse Revanchists. Europe was rhetorically on the side of the Maidan at the very least.

I'm sure opposition parties and NGOs got some funding too. I don't even think it's odious - most major nations use soft power to some extend and it would be really rather silly not to do so.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006
Of course the Netherlands don't want Ukraine to have as close ties to the EU as Algeria, Egypt and Chile. They'd be but a hair's breadth from EU ascension and unleashing the final Slavic horde on our lands.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

steinrokkan posted:

So Russia is providing the NATO with an argument for its strengthening and for integrating Russia's neighbors, conveniently just ahead of a major summit? That's very kind.

Russia actively pursues the foreign policy you'd expect of a small child.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006
Russia would have to take out AA, Radar and Air units in the Baltics if they are going to outright invade. Surely they wouldn't dare do that if that's the same as opening NATO countries to nuclear war.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

steinrokkan posted:

Russia has been waving its dick at NATO for years now, with all the positioning of troops, Ukraine invasions, Crimea, military parades, failed tank unveilings etc.

But if we defend ourselves against invasion Russia might become confused and roast the world in nuclear hellfire :ohdear:

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

A Pale Horse posted:

The question posed to the audience is "Are modern day Jews responsible for the crucifixion of Jesus?"

As you can see the audience is very divided in the matter. :saddowns:

Jews enabled the sacrifice that led to the salvation of humanity and we have been giving them poo poo for it ever since. urgh now we have to go to heaven, loving assholes.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006
Der Spiegel did an interview with a Russian foreign policy advisor. The tldr is that Russia is strong and Europe is betraying their own values (via Muslim immigrants).

There's a lot that just seems nonsensical such as

Karaganov posted:

Many of my colleagues view our European partners with derision and I always warn them not to be cocky and arrogant. Some among the European elite have sought out confrontation with us. As a consequence, we won't help Europe, although we could do so when it comes to the refugee question. A joint closure of borders would be essential. In this regard, the Russians would be 10 times more effective than the Europeans. Instead, you have tried to make a deal with Turkey. That is a disgrace. In the face of our problems with Turkey, we have pursued a clear, hard political line -- with success.
How, exactly, is Russia going to stop Syrians from fleeing through Turkey and to Greece and North Africans from crossing the Med? I guess refugees crossing over the Caucasus through Russia to Europe would be stopped but somehow I doubt there's that many of them.

Beyond that the interview gives off an exuberant kind of "we are winning" vibe. I'm really struggling to see what Russia has really achieved though. In 10 years two important partners of Russia has been practically destroyed. Ukraine is irrevocably lost from Russia's Eurasian project and Ukraine's economy is completely in the shitter. I mean Ukraine mostly trades with Russia - it's not helping Russia to destroy it. Syria is a basket case and Russia undoubtedly help fund its survival and will continue to have to do so for the foreseeable future. Economic growth and the well-being of the Russian people seems to be entirely incidental to the main objective - to enforce their will and be a Great Power! What they aim to achieve with it, what the vision is... I just don't know.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

A Pale Horse posted:

Russia may not be winning exactly but the destabilization of Europe is a good thing for them. Brexit may well be the beginning of the end of the EU, the failed possibly staged coup in Turkey may end up driving Turkey out of NATO and has certainly ended any aspirations of EU membership for them. The migrant crisis and stagnant economy are driving euroskeptic nationalism up and down the continent. There's also the matter of a seemingly endless deluge of terrorist attacks. These are all positives for Russia because they undermine liberalism and unity on the continent so despite their own problems I can see why they'd be optimistic.

The failure of liberalism and the EU isn't really useful for Russia though. It's useful for Putin and his kleptocracy as it eliminates alternatives to it - but it's not actually going to make Russians better off or raise their standard of living. It seems Russia is focused on simply being powerful without really formulating a vision for what to do with that power or an alternative system.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

steinrokkan posted:

The neighbors won't prevent Latvian troops from manoeuvering...

Still, spreading a force of pretty homogenous conscripts over a larger area seems like a recipe for letting a force of crack enemy soldiers to pick them off.

Well it's not necessarily an ideal use of resources to have highly trained and specialized soldiers guarding infrastructure behind the lines either - which you kinda have to do. Like you don't use a SWAT trained police officer to sit around in a Walmart at night. You use a security guard and give him a phone so he can call the police if he can't handle it. Conscripts are probably fine for manning fortified positions while the professional troops can play at maneuver warfare, combined arms and whatnot. You need that professional army though.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006
Pretty sure Trump would fail a Turing test.

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

Nenonen posted:

I wouldn't offend the people who murdered over six million Jews in their Polish death camps if I were you.

So, what's up with that 6 million figure? Why do you hate non-Jews that were murdered in Polish death camps?

Bates
Jun 15, 2006

Wistful of Dollars posted:

I kinda want to be a Mongolian folk hero...

You got some stiff competition but once you're in....

Bates
Jun 15, 2006
In the exceedingly short list of things that may inhibit Trump political custom and decorum is not among them.

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Bates
Jun 15, 2006
edit: wrong thread

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