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Just so people know, there are very contested Democratic Senate primaries in MD and PA, and the PA one could be very important in whether Toomey lises in November.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:00
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axeil posted:Nah probably not. Bernie's a petulant baby and nothing would satisfy him. Wanting a candidate that isn't unduly influenced by campaign donations and actually has the wellbeing of the American population at large in mind is being a 'petulant baby'
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Apr 26, 2016 16:01
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TyrantWD posted:She can become even more hawkish on foreign policy than she already is, push for more tax cuts, the need to reform entitlements to "save" them, and "comprehensive energy reform/energy independence". She could do a lot of things, but she probably won't have to, given that the Republican party is having a pretty wild meltdown at the moment. The one thing she probably won't do is move further left.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:02
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Skyl3lazer posted:Wanting a candidate that isn't unduly influenced by campaign donations and actually has the wellbeing of the American population at large is being a 'petulant baby' No, it's called being an idiotic teenager who doesn't understand how reality works.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:02
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Skyl3lazer posted:Wanting a candidate that isn't unduly influenced by campaign donations and actually has the wellbeing of the American population at large in mind is being a 'petulant baby' When campaign donations are necessary to win national, state, and local elections, they are absolutely essential and running a principled loser campaign won't help anyone. The goal is to reform the system afterwards.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:04
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i heard hillary will become hopelessly addicted to the money flow coming in that she will completely flip flop over her primary campaign promise despite the fact that it would alienate a large amount of voters who actually turn out because money is all powerful, you see. that's why jeb! is beating trump in every state
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Apr 26, 2016 16:06
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Skyl3lazer posted:Wanting a candidate that isn't unduly influenced by campaign donations and actually has the wellbeing of the American population at large in mind is being a 'petulant baby' Citation needed. Prove how Clinton's donations actually caused her to change policy positions. All the donations in the world don't mean jack in terms of "corruption" if the candidate doesn't actually change positions based on it. Deteriorata posted:No, it's called being an idiotic teenager who doesn't understand how reality works. Also this. So many Bernouts have no clue how the political system works and get really mad when reality doesn't align with their fantasies. See: people getting furious that they didn't follow the instructions and got Republican ballots instead of Dem ones, people getting mad that independents don't get to vote in the Dem primary (despite it being well-publicized), etc.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:06
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after all of the memes posted on the subforum of the subforum of the something awful forums, thre's no way bernie sanders can lose this election
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Apr 26, 2016 16:06
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ElrondHubbard posted:They basically did. It's not their fault Bernie didn't bother to cultivate relationships with fellow congressmen during his decades in office, decided to throw together a campaign at the last minute, and tried to wing it. What does that say about hillary that she has been a high profile member of America's elite for several decades and built huge support networks within the establishment and she's still being trailed by less than 300 pledged delegates by the "last minute, wing it, no friends in high places, not-a-real-democrat" campaign?
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Apr 26, 2016 16:07
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Goetta posted:Nice meltdown There's probably some really great analogy to be made about the noble yet fruitless struggle of Cincy to join the Big 12 and Bernie Sanders' attempt to change Democratic politics. Democratic progressives are stuck in The American of political movements
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Apr 26, 2016 16:07
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logikv9 posted:i heard hillary will become hopelessly addicted to the money flow coming in that she will completely flip flop over her primary campaign promise despite the fact that it would alienate a large amount of voters who actually turn out all I know is that I HATE THAT EVIL BITCH. Also my dad used to listen to a lot of conservative talk radio when I was growing up, no idea how that could be related though
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Apr 26, 2016 16:08
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Dr_0ctag0n posted:What does that say about hillary that she has been a high profile member of America's elite for several decades and built huge support networks within the establishment and she's still being trailed by less than 300 pledged delegates by the "last minute, wing it, no friends in high places, not-a-real-democrat" campaign? In a two-candidate race with nearly all states doling out delegates proportionately, a 300 delegate lead at this point is huge. The primary contest is not close in the least.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:08
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Democrazy posted:There's probably some really great analogy to be made about the noble yet fruitless struggle of Cincy to join the Big 12 and Bernie Sanders' attempt to change Democratic politics. There is always next year....
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Apr 26, 2016 16:08
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Dr_0ctag0n posted:What does that say about hillary that she has been a high profile member of America's elite for several decades and built huge support networks within the establishment and she's still being trailed by less than 300 pledged delegates by the "last minute, wing it, no friends in high places, not-a-real-democrat" campaign? She has a larger lead than Obama ever had over her in 08 and most primaries aren't like 2004 so I'd feel pretty good actually! She crushed Bernie.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:09
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Polo-Rican posted:after all of the memes posted on the subforum of the subforum of the something awful forums, thre's no way bernie sanders can lose this election s4p users blamed the subreddit moderators for not allowing meme posts and therefore losing the election
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Apr 26, 2016 16:10
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axeil posted:Also this. So many Bernouts have no clue how the political system works and get really mad when reality doesn't align with their fantasies. Remember that in California the third largest party is the "American Independence Party" because people thought it was how you registered as an Independent. (Though tbf that is a misleading name)
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Apr 26, 2016 16:11
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Deteriorata posted:No, it's called being an idiotic teenager who doesn't understand how reality works. Having spent all spring eating its fill of leaves, here we see the mid-life Democrat as it enters chrysalis and begins its incredible transformation to a noble Republican
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Apr 26, 2016 16:13
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ElrondHubbard posted:She could do a lot of things, but she probably won't have to, given that the Republican party is having a pretty wild meltdown at the moment. It depends on how close the race is looking. Had Bernie run this campaign differently, and made it clear that he is a huge asset to the party even if he is not the nominee, the establishment would be a lot more receptive to adopting and fully committing to parts of his platform. Instead he took this hostile approach of "pick me or my people will walk' and in exchange he is going to get nothing. There will be some token gestures, but he is not going to get the Hillary or the establishment to fight for anything that they weren't already planning to do. He could have changed the party drastically and threw that opportunity away.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:13
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ElrondHubbard posted:She could do a lot of things, but she probably won't have to, given that the Republican party is having a pretty wild meltdown at the moment. Yeah. She is being handed the general election on a silver platter. If Trump gets the nomination, tons of moderates won't vote for her. If he gets rat hosed out of it, the GOP will fissure. She doesn't have to move at all and she won't.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:14
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Goetta posted:Having spent all spring eating its fill of leaves, here we see the mid-life Democrat as it enters chrysalis and begins its incredible transformation to a noble Republican Lmao no that's not how it happens they start out their lifecycle as sanderistas
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Apr 26, 2016 16:15
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TyrantWD posted:It depends on how close the race is looking. Also worth noting that "What they were already planning to fight for" is a categorical issue, not an issue that depends on intensity. In other words, "Fighting for a higher minimum wage" is a categorical issue. "Fighting for $15/hr instead of $12/hr" is an intensity issue. The issues with actual categorical difference (like a single payer system) aren't being adopted by the Democrats at large. In some cases, a categorical issue is being adopted but not the one Bernie was fighting for. For example, Bernie wants free college tuition. Hillary wants a system where all of your college costs (tuition & fees, housing, food, etc) are easily paid for with a 10hr/week job. Same basic problem that needs to be fought, massively different solution.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:15
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logikv9 posted:i heard hillary will become hopelessly addicted to the money flow coming in that she will completely flip flop over her primary campaign promise despite the fact that it would alienate a large amount of voters who actually turn out Just like Bill did with the welfare reform bills, nafta, and tough on crime laws? He had the support of labor unions and promised to help them only to turn around and gently caress them over with nafta which they all opposed. He also relied heavily on southern African American votes and then signed laws that specifically harmed those same minority communities disproportionately. Hillary has said wealth inequality is a major problem this campaign and yet she makes $250k an hour to give a bunch of bankers a nice pat on the back for trading fraudulent securities and toxic assets.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:16
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Goetta posted:Having spent all spring eating its fill of leaves, here we see the mid-life Democrat as it enters chrysalis and begins its incredible transformation to a noble Republican Actually, my political views haven't changed a bit since I was about 20. If anything, I'm more liberal now than I was then. Keep trying, though. Eventually you'll figure out how to stop projecting onto other people.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:17
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Dr_0ctag0n posted:He also relied heavily on southern African American votes and then signed laws that specifically harmed those same minority communities disproportionately. With their consent.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:18
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TyrantWD posted:It depends on how close the race is looking. Well ultimately, a lot of primaries are contentious and reveal the cleavages that exist within both parties. There's a lot of ugly contests that end up with both sides coming together, and Sanders can still make amends, and as long as both sides will let bygones be bygones, he can still have significant influence over the party platform.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:18
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Deteriorata posted:In a two-candidate race with nearly all states doling out delegates proportionately, a 300 delegate lead at this point is huge. The primary contest is not close in the least. 
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Apr 26, 2016 16:20
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Deteriorata posted:Actually, my political views haven't changed a bit since I was about 20. If anything, I'm more liberal now than I was then. I wonder if a young wolfowitz ever accused older dems of abandoning liberal values
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Apr 26, 2016 16:21
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Goetta posted:Having spent all spring eating its fill of leaves, here we see the mid-life Democrat as it enters chrysalis and begins its incredible transformation to a noble Republican
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Apr 26, 2016 16:24
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The Bernie thread seems particularly salty today.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:25
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Just to save us all time, go back to the Bernie thread now and complain about how terrible this thread is.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:25
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But seriously for all the hand-wringing about how 'those teenage bernouts just don't get REALITY' shouldn't our goal be to have that idealized political system? It's like teasing someone because they want something good in life, when everyone knows that life is poo poo and death is certain.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:27
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Skyl3lazer posted:But seriously for all the hand-wringing about how 'those teenage bernouts just don't get REALITY' shouldn't our goal be to have that idealized political system? I don't really want a system where a President can implement (or take away ) my healthcare with a pen stroke.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:28
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Dr_0ctag0n posted:Just like Bill did with the welfare reform bills, nafta, and tough on crime laws? If you're referring to the crime bill, that had the support of the congressional black caucus, and was well intended but ended up being abused for really bad reasons. Oh, yeah - Bernie voted for that bill too.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:30
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Patter Song posted:Just so people know, there are very contested Democratic Senate primaries in MD and PA, and the PA one could be very important in whether Toomey lises in November. Yes, it was rewarding to vote for Fetterman.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:30
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A 55/45 electoral split is a blowout.. However, the difference in delegates allocated ends up not being that big. In New York, Hillary won by 16 points yet netted only +30 delegates. Her leading by 300 delegates at this point means she's been kicking Bernie's rear end really hard for a long time. It's not even slightly close.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:30
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Umm he's not wrong? Lets say we get to California (475 delegates) with Sanders behind by 300 delegates. He would need to win 388 delegates to her 87 in that race to come out with a net +1. That's 81.6% of the vote... A 300 delegate lead in a proportional race is enormous.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:31
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Skyl3lazer posted:But seriously for all the hand-wringing about how 'those teenage bernouts just don't get REALITY' shouldn't our goal be to have that idealized political system? it's not a helpful mindset because we dont live in a system where problems can be solved by clapping our hands and wishing hard enough if you want change, you have to know how to implement it
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Apr 26, 2016 16:33
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computer parts posted:I don't really want a system where a President can implement (or take away ) my healthcare with a pen stroke. It isn't about executive power (and you know it isn't), it's about having A) A primary system where the merit of a candidate wins elections, rather than a huge corporate machine and B) Once elected, a candidate can actually execute their agenda if it's something that the people-at-large support. That's all people are hoping for. Instead we're given a hundred articles per week about how 'Bernie bros' are just white upper middle class teenagers who just don't get that Hillary is inevitable, and even if he did get elected nothing would get done because of republican obstructionism (unlike Hillary, who will be able to pass all of her reasonable reforms day one).
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Apr 26, 2016 16:33
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Dr_0ctag0n posted:Just like Bill did with the welfare reform bills, nafta, and tough on crime laws? i heard hillary will also pass a flat tax and call for english to be the official language of the US
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Apr 26, 2016 16:33
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ElrondHubbard posted:They basically did. It's not their fault Bernie didn't bother to cultivate relationships with fellow congressmen during his decades in office, decided to throw together a campaign at the last minute, and tried to wing it. I think he had realistic expectations in the beginning but saw that he underestimated his support. Then he reached a bit too far and became desperate when he ultimately saw he would fall short of the nomination.
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Apr 26, 2016 16:35
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