Genealogy: Your ancestors sucked too

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Hobbies, Crafts, & Houses > Genealogy: Your ancestors sucked too

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Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

En Ulstein�tt ("An Ulstein Lineage") is a genealogical book & the other book is as you say a novel. Simeon M. Ekornes has written a number of genealogical books and published some articles in respectable periodicals, so he's probably generally trustworthy. Do note however that he was by profession a bank manager.
https://www.nb.no/search?q=simeon%20ekornes (National Library search)

The three medieval letters from Diplomatarium Norvegicum that are mentioned in the book excerpt can be seen here:
1264-??-??: https://www.dokpro.uio.no/perl/middelalder/diplom_vise_tekst.prl?b=9744
1292-06-28: https://www.dokpro.uio.no/perl/middelalder/diplom_vise_tekst.prl?b=9745
1318-03-26: https://www.dokpro.uio.no/perl/middelalder/diplom_vise_tekst.prl?b=9750

The letters are preserved as copies from the 17th century. They support that Thoron was given a farm called Berg in Elvedalen by Haakon IV, that she was the mother of a Thorald Thoraldsson, and in turn grandmother of that man's son Erlend Thoraldsson. Unfortunately, the letters are designated to Thorald and Erlend, so the original letter(s) to Thoron may not exist. Neither her patronymic or byname are mentioned.

Ekornes names other sources for Thoron's husband being Thorald Hvite, a member of Haakon IV's hir� (retinue). One is H�konar saga H�konarsonar, but I'm not sure how to find chapter 297:
https://skaldic.abdn.ac.uk/m.php?p=doconw&i=565
https://skaldic.abdn.ac.uk/m.php?p=text&i=33

It's probably not an unreasonable supposition to name Thoron as an illegitimate daughter of Haakon IV, but I wouldn't say it can ever be more than just that, from the given sources. I'd probably just put a note with the source without making the actual connection in my database, but as I've mentioned before I don't find royal or noble genealogy very interesting so I usually call it a day when I hit one.

Thanks, I was wondering about the source the author was referencing so that is very helpful. Given how my mother gravitates towards these royal connections I'm deeply suspicious but the connection to Thoron seems reasonable.

As to the novel itself, I'm guessing it's probably a bad Mists of Avalon sort of thing, quasi referenced fanfic.

# ¿ Nov 9, 2020 16:28

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# ¿ May 21, 2024 23:22

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

As a series about historical women (referred to as "Daughters of Freyja") written by a woman, they're at least probably not misogynist. Also the first book was supported by the Norwegian Council of Arts after publication, a sign of some literary quality.

But yeah, they shouldn't be read for their historicity.

I didn't note that she got Council support, thanks.

From the author's bio page I'm guessing its antimisogynist, but that read pretty woo woo to me (in translation of course, which will miss nuance)

# ¿ Nov 9, 2020 16:52

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

En Ulstein�tt ("An Ulstein Lineage") is a genealogical book & the other book is as you say a novel. Simeon M. Ekornes has written a number of genealogical books and published some articles in respectable periodicals, so he's probably generally trustworthy. Do note however that he was by profession a bank manager.
https://www.nb.no/search?q=simeon%20ekornes (National Library search)

Just a quick question, this is Norway IP locked, if I used a VPN would it allow me to search within the book or download it outright?

# ¿ Nov 10, 2020 16:33

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

Maybe. I'm not sure. It does say that Norwegian IPs have access, but it also mentions something about licenses for Norwegian universities.

Try Skanditr�den, there are may friendly Norwegians:
https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3480864

So I had been planning to learn to read and speak Swedish, with the understanding that I would also be able to mostly understand spoken Norwegian. Can you also read in either language? (that thread seems to mostly be in Norwegian given all those crossed os)

e. or Danish too I suppose

# ¿ Nov 10, 2020 20:51

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

Yeah I'm Danish but can read all three/four (Norwegian has two written standards that are quite different). That thread is indeed written by us all in our own languages. Misunderstandings are very rare in thread (there are many false friends but we are used to them).

Spoken communication is a bit harder, but if both parties are giving an honest try, it's not bad at all. Many will switch to English though, which is pretty sad tbh.

OK cool! I'll stick with my original plan to learn Swedish since I'm still in contact with family there and have research collaborators at Uppsala. Whereas I never had problems with folks not speaking English there folks tended to loosen up quicker if I tried speaking Swedish first. (Mind, I always try to get some basic spoken language in countries when I visit. its just basic respect.)

I did see while doing some reading last night that there are two different forms of Norwegian--I had no idea. The pronunciation for Norge is pretty different

e.the switching to English thing leads to a classic Montreal situation where two people will have a conversation neither using their mother tongue. I learned my conversational French that way and gave francophones practice with their English.

Bilirubin fucked around with this message at 21:13 on Nov 10, 2020

# ¿ Nov 10, 2020 21:10

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Oracle posted:

Swedish descendant peeps!

arkivdigial.se is offering free access this weekend to all their records! This is awesome, even if you've already found all your records on ancestry or what have you, because arkivdigital's records were scanned in hires and full color, so if there's something you had a hard time reading in the original records its likely it'll be much better here. Go grab your copies or your research while you can.

Sweet!

# ¿ Nov 13, 2020 17:37

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Tomorrow I am the keynote speaker for the 75th Anniversary of a society one of my great grandfathers started. An interest in rocks skipped a few generations but he was a huge spiritual inspiration for me.

# ¿ Feb 12, 2021 18:57

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

Wow thats neat! I guess you don't wanna go into details, but rock on lol and also break a leg

I work for the same employer that my great grandfather and great-great grandfather. That wasn't planned at all. My great grandfather died less than a month before I was born, and we didn't have a great relationship with my grandfather (he was kindof a dick, tbh, but but after he died we discovered more about his personal life that possibly explained why he was difficult to get along with or form attachments to). Anyway, I felt destined for one career, and only late in life did I realize that I wanted something else & I ended up where my ancestors were. In my case I wouldn't say it's genetic�or anything, just coincidence, but it amuses me.

e: also thx for the headsup on newspapers, Oracle!

That's great serendipity!

While I have some Scandi attention: below find a picture of my very distinguished looking great great grandfather, from Gamleby, Sweden (despite the bourgeoise appearance, he was a farm manager). I have had this picture for most of my life, he was a huge figure in my grandfather's life, but I know nothing about the medal and would dearly love to know more. Given the profile and crown I'm guessing it's of the then king (would have been late 19th century when awarded, he was brought to North America by his kids in 1908), which suggests there should be some sort of record somewhere. I've actually seen it in person--came in a nice crushed purple velvet case--but my mother has misplaced it, and the memory it is somewhere in her house. How might I go about learning more?

# ¿ Feb 12, 2021 21:51

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

could it be the Carl XV medal from the 1866 agricultural exhibition?
https://www.aktiesamlaren.se/numismatik/medaljer/medaljer/kungligt.htm (about mid page, search XV and its the second)

But yeah. Serendipity is a good word.

By Jove, I think you've got it! Very much appreciated!

Oracle posted:

You can try to find a Facebook or Reddit group of Swedish military weeaboos and post as sharp and clear of a picture as you can manage. Also try and remember the color of the ribbon, that can be important, as well as the actual color or type of metal (bronze? Silver?)

Bronze on a blue ribbon. But the reverse engravings above trigger my memories correctly.

# ¿ Feb 13, 2021 22:59

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

Oh! Perhaps some of his professional accolades would qualify him?

Honorary Member of the American Association for the Study of Headache 1964
Member of the Research Group on Migraine and Headache of the World Federation of Neurology 1968

Stuff like that.

If he received any sort of financial reward for these awards or grants or the like the Soc would have been necessary to file taxes on it.

Carthag Tuek posted:

Ah ok. yeah, it being board memberships or some other paid position makes sense.

Yeah that.

e;fb :negative:

# ¿ Feb 18, 2021 05:15

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Oracle posted:

So I was today years old when I learned that Sweden has an amazing free online newspaper repository that goes back in some cases to the 1600s.

https://tidningar.kb.se/

Cool, will have to see if I can dig up the story about how my Great great grandfather's father and older brothers fell through the ice in Gamleby sometime in the mid-1800s. Tragic story that.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2021 15:22

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

Came across a burial record from 1705 where the guy has the byname "Tear-Hider", I guess he cried a lot when he thought nobody could see?

Tbf it could also be interpreted as "Tear-Saver" which could be some alchemy thing, though that seems unlikely given he lived in a small fishing hamlet.

e: also FamilySearch removed the help page on how to find your support tickets so I guess that's that.

Tear-Saver, who drinks yours when he needs an esteem boost

# ¿ Jul 17, 2021 01:28

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Carthag Tuek posted:

Sweet, just got some great photos of a chandelier that was donated to a Swedish church in 1692 by a brother of my great-8 grandfather, which has an engraving mentioning my great-9 grandparents. Super fast too, I wrote them last night & got them shortly before lunch!

that is very cool

# ¿ Mar 6, 2022 03:55

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Love it! I would definitely church there.

In the lastest missive from my mother, I have been documented as being a direct descendant of both William of Normandy AND Charlemagne. This on top of her work tying us to Erik Fairhair and bloody Odin and I'm basically giving up on her work past say 10 generations. Its going to take years to clear up this mess.

# ¿ Mar 7, 2022 16:54

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Mother has been working a little more reliably through the Swedish householders rolls, and has been learning a ton. Apparently a large number of our ancestors died in the 1834 cholera outbreak. Even way out in Dalsland. Scary stuff!

# ¿ Apr 28, 2022 23:06

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Sorry thread, been away for a bit

Carthag Tuek posted:

f�rresten, hur m�r det med att l�ra svensk? du m� mycket g�rna s�ga om jag eller kanske andra ifr�n skanditr�den kan hj�lpa med �vers�ttninger osv!

Ah jag missade det h�r. Tack! Sakta men bra.

But most of my time lately has been trying to be less poo poo at chess (impossible of course)

I may have some AD questions for you at some point, very generous offer that!

# ¿ Jul 25, 2022 05:08

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Just saw a post on FB by my cousin in Sweden, the one that reached out to me several years ago and shared pictures of my grandmother with me, which was a huge shock. She "collects" immigrant lineages of her family and frequently hosts them on their return to visit Sweden or will travel abroad to meet lost family elsewhere (including my family in Minnesota). In her recent post she shared that my great great grandfather, Gustof Andersson, constructed this lighthouse in V�stra G�taland. Pretty cool to see it still in such good condition!

https://www.google.com/maps/place/L...43px2?entry=ttu

She and my mom (and many of my cousins from that side of the family) have a classically Dalslander rounded face, the resemblance between them is striking,.

# ¿ Jun 2, 2023 21:36

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

OK a little more if you don't mind.

Someone posted to a family FB group an old article about another of my great great grandparents, this time his settlement in Minnesota from Buskerud, Norway. Here's old Ole

(edit: Man does he ever look like my uncle Jimmy)

https://www.cookcountynews-herald.c...LE2fl7uOLRiJba4

Because my family tend to live so goddamned long, I got to meet old Ole's kid August who is mentioned in the above article as the youngest fisherman in recorded history on Lake Superior, my great grandfather. He taught me to find and shuck clams. His wife was my great grandmother, who I got to know even better since she lived another 10 years after he died (both lived into their mid 90s), and is the lineage from Dalsland my Swedish cousin had been tracking down in her genealogical research.

(Other regions ancestors emigrated from include Kalmar, Blekinge, and J�nk�ping Counties off the top of my head. Covers a fair bit of southern Sweden)

Bilirubin fucked around with this message at 23:25 on Jun 2, 2023

# ¿ Jun 2, 2023 23:15

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Oracle posted:

Hey I�ve got people from J�nk�ping! Like way the hell back in the 1700s or something, but yeah.

I'll have to check how far back our records go, off the top of my head I recall the village of Ingatorp near the Kalmar border into the 19th century but IIRC they got back farther

# ¿ Jun 3, 2023 07:36

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# ¿ May 21, 2024 23:22

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Oracle posted:

Oh almost certainly; once you get back to Sweden their records are a genealogists wet dream: complete, well-written records that go back centuries and traces every time they move and where alongside the usual b/m/d. It�s like the polar opposite of Irish records.

Yes for sure. My mother has been complaining of late how bad the German/Austrian records are, for some strange reason...OTOH my mother has traced our Norway lineage back to Harald Fairhair and Odin so never underestimate wishful thinking on the part of certain researchers.

e. I remembered Harald as Eric, edited to repair

Bilirubin fucked around with this message at 16:31 on Jun 4, 2023

# ¿ Jun 3, 2023 16:36

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Hobbies, Crafts, & Houses > Genealogy: Your ancestors sucked too

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